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Author Topic: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity  (Read 1723 times)

2016-f-250

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Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« on: December 08, 2016, 05:11:12 AM »
Hey folks , I know this may be frowned upon by some of you but hear me out here. I'm just looking to get suggestions and opinions on my specific situation.

The wife and I are looking at trading our 26' 5w for something with more space to accommodate the family. We're only seasonal campers but we have a 2 year old boy , a 100lb doberman and a second child on the way.

We're looking at a 2011 keystone 36' 5w with bunks. The only issue is at 9500lbs the hitch weight is at 1800lbs. Which almost brings me to the 2000lbs cargo rating on my 2016 f250 6.7 diesel lariat.

My wife and I did some calculations and we ran the number. Running minimal weight we would be at about 2600lbs. Although maybe manageable by some  ... I'd love to hear what you guys think. Finding a light 5w to accommodate a family is hard ... especially when you're looking at second hand  with a specific floor plan requiring bunk beds.

I should probably add that I am still within the two limit capacity , only the cargo limit is breached
« Last Edit: December 08, 2016, 07:14:11 AM by 2016-f-250 »
2016 f-250 lariat 6.7 diesel
2004 Fleetwood fifth wheel looking to upgrade to newer and bigger

JW of Opechee Shores

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #1 on: December 08, 2016, 07:26:48 AM »
I am sure that a lot of members of the weight Police will chime in but I wouldn't go out and look for a new truck or settle for a lesser 5er. You definitely pushing it but if you add air bags and are not travelling across the country, good luck and enjoy the lifestyle.
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kdbgoat

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #2 on: December 08, 2016, 08:03:54 AM »
Is that 9500# dry weight or the fiver's GVWR?
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2016 Leprechaun 319DS

Alfa38User

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #3 on: December 08, 2016, 08:10:11 AM »
Where did you get the 9500 lb weight or the hitch weight (20%) you showed?? If these were a published figure, they lie... The hitch weight of a 5th wheel should be between 20-25% of the LOADED trailer weight. Most here would use the GVWR of the trailer to provide a margin of safety when the actual loaded weight is unknown. The yellow tag on the doorpost will tell you what CCC YOUR truck is rated for as it left the manufacturer. Subtract from this number stuff like the dog,the kids, the wife etc. to arrive at a better CCC capacity for your truck so that you know by how much you may or may not be overloaded! But, if you have already done this to arrive at your numbers, simply ignore this post!!
« Last Edit: December 08, 2016, 08:15:16 AM by Alfa38User »
Stu
Montréal, Canada 🍁
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vinceherman

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #4 on: December 08, 2016, 08:13:54 AM »
Is that 9500# dry weight or the fiver's GVWR?

Keystone lists the 2011 QBS bunkhouse model as having a dry weight of just under 9465.  Just guessing on the model though.
Vince, Marion(dw), Rachel(mil) and Dublin(pup).
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Gary RV_Wizard

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #5 on: December 08, 2016, 09:10:13 AM »
The F250 is a robust truck, so it can probably handle the towing fine, even overloaded (that's what the tow capacity is telling you).  I think, though, that 2600+ lbs on a 2000 lb rated cargo capacity is going to beat up the truck suspension badly, and probably ride poorly enough to beat up the passengers too. Further more, you are almost surely exceeding the rear axle load rating and probably the rear tire load rating as well.  If you said you would run just 100-150 lbs heavy, maybe it's ok for occasional use, but 600 lbs isn't small change. And calculated weights are notorious for coming in low. "Stuff" always weighs a lot more than expected.

If that 9500 lbs is the trailer dry weight (which seems more likely), you aren't even in the ball park. You need a truck with a much higher payload (some F250 configurations can go to 3000 lbs).
« Last Edit: December 08, 2016, 09:12:13 AM by Gary RV Roamer »
Gary
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2016-f-250

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #6 on: December 08, 2016, 09:43:12 AM »
Where did you get the 9500 lb weight or the hitch weight (20%) you showed?? If these were a published figure, they lie... The hitch weight of a 5th wheel should be between 20-25% of the LOADED trailer weight. Most here would use the GVWR of the trailer to provide a margin of safety when the actual loaded weight is unknown. The yellow tag on the doorpost will tell you what CCC YOUR truck is rated for as it left the manufacturer. Subtract from this number stuff like the dog,the kids, the wife etc. to arrive at a better CCC capacity for your truck so that you know by how much you may or may not be overloaded! But, if you have already done this to arrive at your numbers, simply ignore this post!!

Listed weight of 9565lbs dry and listed hitch weight of 1800lbs from rv net. I believe they are the specs from keystone. I'll try to add the link.
2016 f-250 lariat 6.7 diesel
2004 Fleetwood fifth wheel looking to upgrade to newer and bigger

2016-f-250

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2016, 09:45:38 AM »
Keystone lists the 2011 QBS bunkhouse model as having a dry weight of just under 9465.  Just guessing on the model though.

I should of specified , sorry it's a 2010 keystone outback Sydney edition model 329 fbh
2016 f-250 lariat 6.7 diesel
2004 Fleetwood fifth wheel looking to upgrade to newer and bigger

xrated

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #8 on: December 08, 2016, 09:48:13 AM »
The thing that would REALLY concern me would be if you were involved in an accident, AND overloaded like that.  To me, the possibilities might include.....
1.  Would your insurance cover the truck and or the trailer (remember, you knowingly traveled overloaded)
2.  Legal concerns if there was a serious injury or even a fatality involving the other driver.  This could include some monstrous lawsuits and the possibility of losing everything you own.
3.  Criminal charges???  Willful neglect for knowingly doing this?

I honestly don't know if any of that could happen realistically, but those things kept me from buying a fiver recently and instead, purchased a very nice Toy Hauler tag along that doesn't expose me to any overloaded towing situations with possible insurance and legal ramifications.
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2016-f-250

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #9 on: December 08, 2016, 09:54:30 AM »
The thing that would REALLY concern me would be if you were involved in an accident, AND overloaded like that.  To me, the possibilities might include.....
1.  Would your insurance cover the truck and or the trailer (remember, you knowingly traveled overloaded)
2.  Legal concerns if there was a serious injury or even a fatality involving the other driver.  This could include some monstrous lawsuits and the possibility of losing everything you own.
3.  Criminal charges???  Willful neglect for knowingly doing this?

I honestly don't know if any of that could happen realistically, but those things kept me from buying a fiver recently and instead, purchased a very nice Toy Hauler tag along that doesn't expose me to any overloaded towing situations with possible insurance and legal ramifications.

Maybe unprobable but still possible.l will contact ford to see if there  are any upgrades to safely and legally increase cargo load cap.
2016 f-250 lariat 6.7 diesel
2004 Fleetwood fifth wheel looking to upgrade to newer and bigger

BIG JOE

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #10 on: December 08, 2016, 10:29:29 AM »
l will contact ford to see if there  are any upgrades to safely and legally increase cargo load cap.

I don't think FORD will give you any [definitive answers] when it comes to any capacity modifications.

Numbers on stickers and in manuals can be deceiving. You might try asking the seller if you can hook it up and go get it all weighed. On a Cat Scale. Get some REAL numbers.. and go from there ??

Joe
Joe

Tow an 016 29RS "Reflection" 5r w/Trailair pin box...with a 2012 Ford DRW, F-350, 4x4, Loaded de-Blinged Lariat CC, 6.7 Diesel.. Wife & I, Beck & Sheeka the Dogs.. And as of 5-17.. Lizzie, the Kitten in Training.

Alfa38User

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #11 on: December 08, 2016, 10:30:07 AM »
There are none, what you see, you have. COA by Ford. (Cover your A..)
Stu
Montréal, Canada 🍁
Snowbird, Naples Florida
Alfa Gold 38 (2000) 5ver (parked!)

"Of course I talk to myself, sometimes I need expert advise!!!"

2016-f-250

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #12 on: December 08, 2016, 10:48:12 AM »
Thanks guys , I hate to say this but I think I'm going to pass and try to find something a bit more lighter
2016 f-250 lariat 6.7 diesel
2004 Fleetwood fifth wheel looking to upgrade to newer and bigger

kdbgoat

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #13 on: December 08, 2016, 01:11:43 PM »
What configuration is your truck? IE: regular cab, supercab, crew cab? What gear ratio do you have in the rear(s)? 2 or 4wd?

Looking at the trailer specs, it has a GVWR of 11,960#. I can safely pull that with my 2015 F-250 XLT crewcab gasser. The pin weight is right close to my limit though. Maybe your losing payload compared to mine because of the weight of the diesel.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2016, 01:15:25 PM by kdbgoat »
I know you believe you understand what you think I said,
But I am not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant


2016 Leprechaun 319DS

2016-f-250

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #14 on: December 08, 2016, 02:11:05 PM »
What configuration is your truck? IE: regular cab, supercab, crew cab? What gear ratio do you have in the rear(s)? 2 or 4wd?

Looking at the trailer specs, it has a GVWR of 11,960#. I can safely pull that with my 2015 F-250 XLT crewcab gasser. The pin weight is right close to my limit though. Maybe your losing payload compared to mine because of the weight of the diesel.
  My GVWR is 9900 , I'm losing from lariat options and the 6.7 diesel ... and 4wd.
« Last Edit: December 08, 2016, 02:16:03 PM by 2016-f-250 »
2016 f-250 lariat 6.7 diesel
2004 Fleetwood fifth wheel looking to upgrade to newer and bigger

kdbgoat

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #15 on: December 08, 2016, 02:36:12 PM »
yep, unfortunately, that does hurt.
I know you believe you understand what you think I said,
But I am not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant


2016 Leprechaun 319DS

2016-f-250

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #16 on: December 08, 2016, 05:21:22 PM »
yep, unfortunately, that does hurt.

Makes a grown man want to cry
2016 f-250 lariat 6.7 diesel
2004 Fleetwood fifth wheel looking to upgrade to newer and bigger

grashley

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #17 on: December 08, 2016, 05:30:42 PM »
You have a GREAT truck, but not for towing a FW.

The FW will be closer to 12,000# when loaded for camping, so expect a pin wt of around 2400#.  Add 200# for the FW hitch.  Add 400# or more for you, your wife, kids and dog.  Add a couple hundred pounds for car seats, diaper bag, snacks and toys.  This 3200# load is well above F250 weight capacity and well into F350 SRW territory.

Sorry.

If you have 2000# payload, then subtract 200# hitch, 400# passengers and 200# misc.  This leaves 1200# of payload, or a 6,000# LOADED FW. 
Have you considered a bumper pull TT?  This 1200# payload will handle a 10,000# GVWR TT effortlessly. (10% - 12% tongue wt with TT) With a lighter WD hitch compared to a FW hitch, you can safely handle a 12,000# - 13,000# GVWR trailer.   This may meet your needs.
Preacher Gordon
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2016-f-250

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #18 on: December 08, 2016, 07:35:17 PM »
thanks for the input fellers , seems like the wife and i will have some looking to do. either a lighter fifth wheel or a TT. At least we have something to occupy us for the winter now. Let the searching begin.

cheers

shayne
2016 f-250 lariat 6.7 diesel
2004 Fleetwood fifth wheel looking to upgrade to newer and bigger

outofhere2

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #19 on: December 09, 2016, 08:45:17 AM »
With a truck like what you have, you will find that your options in travel trailers will be wide open.  Don't forget that on YouTube there is a walk around video for just about every trailer out there. We love our 2006 jayco 29 foot bunkhouse. It has a GVW rating of 7500lb. Well with in you class and with a 6.7 diesel you won't even know its there
2008 F150
2006 Jayco jay flight 29bhs

Oldelevatorman

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #20 on: December 11, 2016, 12:32:43 AM »
If your over your payload you're  putting yourself and everyone else on the road at risk. Don't know why someone would say it's ok. And no you can't do anything to increase the payload!
Jim & Linda Kelly
2016 Wind River 270CISW
2015 F-350 Dually 14k GVWR 5660 payload
Want to fulltime again sometime in 2017

2016-f-250

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #21 on: December 11, 2016, 05:08:32 AM »
If your over your payload you're  putting yourself and everyone else on the road at risk. Don't know why someone would say it's ok. And no you can't do anything to increase the payload!

No doubt, we'll nothing sensible and within budget anyways. Hydroboost brakes , an overload spring, a 2" rear block and larger diameter rear axles with a finer spline would... but I'd be better off cutting my losses on a trade for all those items on a new or second hand 350



« Last Edit: December 11, 2016, 05:14:55 AM by 2016-f-250 »
2016 f-250 lariat 6.7 diesel
2004 Fleetwood fifth wheel looking to upgrade to newer and bigger

steveblonde

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #22 on: December 11, 2016, 07:19:13 AM »
If your over your payload you're  putting yourself and everyone else on the road at risk. Don't know why someone would say it's ok. And no you can't do anything to increase the payload!

ANY truck can be re-certified and have the payload increased its done all the time - IE with a GM 2500 converted to a 3500 its just the spring pack, or when someone puts a flat deck on a chassis depending on the flat deck size payload will change  - the issue is the the re-certification costs as it must go to a certified engineer which may cost as much as $1500 cdn plus parts and labour

However just adding springs or airbags etc does NOT increase payload as per the door decal - that is set at factory and unless re-certified by a qualified engineer that decal is gospel
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longhaul

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Re: Cargo limit reached but within tow capacity
« Reply #23 on: December 11, 2016, 09:08:17 PM »
No doubt, we'll nothing sensible and within budget anyways. Hydroboost brakes , an overload spring, a 2" rear block and larger diameter rear axles with a finer spline would... but I'd be better off cutting my losses on a trade for all those items on a new or second hand 350

 Your F250 is the same truck as the F350 SRW depending on model and cab selections and options. Ford gives the F250 6.7 a 10k gvwr with 6100 rawr. If your F250 has the optional heavy service package it has the same front and rear suspension package as a F350 srw truck.
 Any how.... many F250 can weigh 3000 lb on the rear axle which leaves 3100 lb for a safe payload.
 Check out some of the Ford diesel websites for their input on how to upgrade the trucks rear suspension for more load carrying ability and still stay within Fords rawr specs.
 Truck camper forums are another source to find how to safely upgrade a truck for more load carrying ability.
 RAWR = tires/wheels/rear spring packs/brakes/etc.

 Use this from fleet Ford that shows the same as or differences in mechanical specs for the 250/350 truck line. https://www.fleet.ford.com/truckbbas/topics/techspec.html

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