1995 Dynasty 300HP $25K

Hello to the forum. There is a lot of good info on here and I appreciate it.

I am looking at a 1995 Monaco Dynasty 40'. 300 cummins, 6 speed Allison, 132,000 miles. The flooring has all been upgraded with wood. Exterior stripes have been repainted. It looks very good inside and out. Tires are good and engine has been serviced. I don't know about any service records. This coach has no slides. We want something dependable to take long trips like from Texas to anywhere

If you have any thoughts on this please let me know. I would love to hear from others traveling in 20 year old coaches. We currently have a 5th wheel and want to move to a motorhome.

Thanks,

About the only thing that can be reliably said about a 30+ year old coach is that you have to inspect the condition carefully, both mechanical condition and the house systems and body integrity. A well-maintained older coach should be excellent, but "well-maintained' is a huge caveat.

The rest is all about how well it suits your livability wants & needs. Focus on that - you spend a lot more time living in it than driving.

Is the coach at a dealer or a private seller?

Tires that are good looking don't mean much - you need to check the date code, 7 years is what many think is old age and due to be replaced.

Do you ever intend on towing a vehicle?  IMO the 300hp is a little low to tow unless your only on flat lands.

Long Trips - even with just 2 people it will feel small after a short time without any slides.

Other then those if it has been taken care of, the mileage wouldn't concern me - that means it was used.
Unless those miles were put on in the first 10 years and it sat for the next ten - if that was the case I would pass.

Is this your 1st MH?

It is many times suggested if your new to this - Pay for an expert to look it over, as they will know what to look for other then a pretty face.

25K is a gentle way to get your feet wet on a Coach. You might consider it a learning experience for your next coach. We drive a 22 year old 33' class A gas coach, with no slides and have lived in it for up to 4 months at a time. Some couples may not be able to stand each other in a 45' coach with 4 slides, for more that a week end. We like each other.

Richard

The Dynasty of that era is a great coach providing it has been well taken care of.  Like Gary mentioned there will be more to investigate but on a well maintained coach it should still provide many years and miles of service.  With 132k miles on that engine as long as it has been serviced regularly and maintained there should still be a lot of life left in it.  As for being the 300HP version, that coach will weigh quite a bit less than many of the newer ones.  Before condemning the coach based on the HP, look at the power to weight ratio, that is more important than merely ruling out a 300HP engine. 

Our old 1991 Beaver had a 300HP CAT engine weighing around 29k pounds and it did pretty good, especially considering the fact that it only had an Allison 4-speed transmission.  I was also towing a 8500 pound enclosed trailer around most of the western U.S. racing and it would cruise down the highway at 65-67 MPH excellent.  The steep grades did drop speeds a bit more than some but we would just fall in line with the semi trucks.

At only $25k if the coach is in good shape and all checks out it would be a good way of getting a solidly built coach to see how you like it.  As for slides, yes they make it nicer for extended stays but being a wide body coach it shouldn't feel too awfully cramped depending on the floorplan.  Our 1991 Beaver had no slides and felt pretty roomy inside but we had also come from a 30' gasser that was not a wide body coach.

Mike.

300 hp should be sufficient for a coach of that era, when many were 230-250 hp.  As Mike says, look at weight/horsepower ratio, not absolute Hp.  The rule of thumb is that you want than about 100 lb/Hp or less. That's not quick, but it is entirely adequate.

zmotorsports said:

Our old 1991 Beaver had a 300HP CAT engine weighing around 29k pounds and it did pretty good, especially considering the fact that it only had an Allison 4-speed transmission.  I was also towing a 8500 pound enclosed trailer around most of the western U.S. racing and it would cruise down the highway at 65-67 MPH excellent.  The steep grades did drop speeds a bit more than some but we would just fall in line with the semi trucks.
Mike.

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I've wondered about the Hp weight ratio of the older coaches.  Mike, do you know the dry weight of your 1991 Beaver?  Some of the brochures I've looked at indicate these older coaches were pretty light.  Couldn't find anything on the 1991's but a 1995 40' Patriot has a dry weight of 23,700.  The GVWR is 29,410 which leaves a cargo carrying capacity of something less than 6,000.  So if the coach was not loaded to the limit, a significant amount of capacity would be left for the toad. 

Couldn't find anything on the 1995 Dynasty but the NADA pricing of the two (Dynasty and Patriot) are close.  My guess is the base weight on these high end coaches is pretty close.  If so, the Dynasty would probably handle a decent amount of cargo and a toad quite well with its 300 Hp Cummins. 

garyb1st said:

I've wondered about the Hp weight ratio of the older coaches.  Mike, do you know the dry weight of your 1991 Beaver?  Some of the brochures I've looked at indicate these older coaches were pretty light.  Couldn't find anything on the 1991's but a 1995 40' Patriot has a dry weight of 23,700.  The GVWR is 29,410 which leaves a cargo carrying capacity of something less than 6,000.  So if the coach was not loaded to the limit, a significant amount of capacity would be left for the toad. 

Couldn't find anything on the 1995 Dynasty but the NADA pricing of the two (Dynasty and Patriot) are close.  My guess is the base weight on these high end coaches is pretty close.  If so, the Dynasty would probably handle a decent amount of cargo and a toad quite well with its 300 Hp Cummins.

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Gary, my 91 Beaver was pretty heavy.  Travel ready it weighed right @ 29k.  It was on the Gillig bus chassis as well and was available in two HP versions, a 250HP and a 300HP version.  There were also a few more gearing options available on some of the earlier rigs as well so keep that in mind when/if looking.  Gearing will make a big difference between two otherwise identical coaches.

Mike.

Mike, do you know the dry weight of your 1991 Beaver?

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Gary, I'm curious: Why "dry" weight? My coaches have always been above that before I put anything in them. Ready to roll weight is generally better to work with.

Thanks for the replies. The coach is at a business in Houston that sells pre owned motorhomes. They add wood floors, new tires, and ensure everything works.

As one of you said, I am thinking it may be a way to try out a motorhome without a huge investment. I guess my main concern would be some sort of major engine/transmission repair. But I understand that the drivetrain is intended for a lot of miles.

Thanks,
Doug

Larry, I have two concerns.  First, if I buy another gasser, and can't find one with a 24,000 chassis, I will likely be over the GCWR when pulling my Jeep.  It's heavy and the only way I won't exceed the GCWR on a typical 22,000 chassis is if I travel with minimal cargo.  I'd like to take more stuff.  I expect the pulling power of most newer gassers will be adequate to get up the hill.  However, that may not be the situation with an older gasser or diesel.  That's the second thing.  I don't like stressing the motorhome on hills.  I do it regularly with my 275 Hp Ford and sometimes can't maintain 25-30 MPH on grades.  Makes me uncomfortable watching the Tack increase to over 4,000 RPMs.  So while the 100 Lbs per 1 Hp doesn't work well with my 275 Hp Aerbus pulling my Coach and Jeep with a combined weight of less than 23,000 lbs, I'll chalk up the poor performance to the transmission.  If I buy a diesel I want to make sure both cargo carrying capacity and power are up to the task.  With the Patriot I mentioned, the difference between 30,000 lbs  (Hp times 100), and dry weight is more than 6,300 lbs.  So I can pull my Jeep, carry almost 2,000 lbs of stuff and still be within the guideline.  When looking at Mike's old Beaver, he either take 6,300 lbs of stuff or his Beaver has a much heavier dry weight.  I suspect the latter.  Maybe the difference was Gillig vs Magnum chassis. 

OK, you're calculating CCC - makes sense, but those numbers are usually available for each coach, too. Thanks.

At 100 lbs/hp your hill climbing speeds are still likely to be modest, but the diesel will run at only 1500-2200 rpms to do it. The Cummins B engine (5.9L) runs toward the higher end of that range, but the C and L engines are toward the lower end.  The 8.9L ISL engine in my previous coach produced it full torque & Hp at 1600 rpms.

Transmission is very important - a six speed does a much better job of delivering power to the wheels effectively versus a 4 speed. Even the 5-speed used in the early W22 gas chassis performed noticeably better on grades than the 4 speed used on the P-series chassis.

Gary [ RVer Emeritus] said:

At 100 lbs/hp your hill climbing speeds are still likely to be modest, but the diesel will run at only 1500-2200 rpms to do it. The Cummins B engine (5.9L) runs toward the higher end of that range, but the C and L engines are toward the lower end.  The 8.9L ISL engine in my previous coach produced it full torque & Hp at 1600 rpms.

Transmission is very important - a six speed does a much better job of delivering power to the wheels effectively versus a 4 speed. Even the 5-speed used in the early W22 gas chassis performed noticeably better on grades than the 4 speed used on the P-series chassis.

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Gary mentions it here and I guess I forgot to mention it.  Many older diesel coaches only had 4-speed Allison transmission (a few even had 5-speeds) but in our old 1991 Beaver although it was heavy if it would have had the six-speed Allison it would have done better than with the four and to be honest, I was fairly happy with it even with the four speed trans.  We had the coach for 7 years and it was ALWAYS towing, either our 5k pound Jeep or our 8500 pound enclosed trailer.  We put 65k miles on it driving the western U.S. and never felt like we wouldn't get up a grade.  That being said, HP is king but even the lesser HP coaches will get you to your destination.

I will also admit that there were some grades/passes that I flat avoided with our previous coach yet once we purchased our 2003 Dynasty there really hasn't been an area we have avoided.  We have been over hwy 550 to Silverton, Teton Pass out of Jackson Hole, WY and Burgess Junction (hwy 14) between Sheridan and Cody with all of our coaches and they all made it, just some a bit more faster paced than others.

Back to the OP's Dynasty that he is looking at, yes these engines are designed to cover a lot of miles but that is providing they have been well maintained and not abused.  All of our coaches have had miles on them and used and I had done a thorough job of investigating the chassis/drivetrain as I feel that is the most expensive part if something were to go wrong.  Most other items are pretty common "house" items or cosmetic and can  be addressed as needed, but the foundation should be given as much attention to inspect as needed.  Also keep in mind, NOTHING is trouble free, not even new ones so just expect to have some things need replacing or attention.

Good luck, as there are still a LOT of great older coaches out there that have been well taken care of and need good homes/owners.  You may have just found one.

Mike.