Pairing a Honda 2000i with Predator 2000

So doing some research on generators and trying to save some cash. I understand there is two different manufactures here. MY questions is Harbour freight has a nice little parallel kit with the banana plugs. I here the issue is both generators being on different wave lengths.

Can I run the Predator with the Honda with the predator parallel kit? Can I use just the parallel kit, as it is well built, actusally much better than Honda one.

I have the companion Honda already and know I don't need the kit but What are the risks?

Not different wave lengths, but the electrical sine waves need to be in sync to parallel safely. I don't know how the Predator does its sync-up, but chances are it isn't compatible with the Honda method.

Both Honda and Predator simply parallel the inverter outputs to sync together.  They even use similar shielded banana plugs to tie the output from each generator to the combined outlet.  The first generator to start puts voltage across the second generator's output, then when the second one is started it syncs itself to the first.  So from that standpoint there's no difference between the Honda and Preditor.

Of more concern is the voltage coming out of each generator, the two have to precisely track each other as a load is added or, like two mismatched batteries, the one with the higher voltage will wind up doing most of the work.

I have no idea of how the Honda and Preditor voltage vs. current curves compare to each other, but since they're designed and built by different companies, there's a good chance they aren't identical.

Whether they're close enough to be usable, all you can do is try it.  Since these are both inverter generators and both are designed to sync to voltage applied to their output terminals, either they will work together, sharing the load equally between them, or they won't.  If they don't coexist, all that will happen is one generator will pick up most of the load while the other one loafs.  Worst case, the harder working generator will overload and shut down before the second one has a chance to pick up part of the load.

Don't try syncing either of these with a conventional generator or you'll get lots of noise and smoke.  Both generators have to be designed for plug and play synchronous operation to have a hope of working together.

Before someone knitpicks, you can parallel two conventional generators, but it's tricky and takes specialized equipment and skill to do it properly.  Do it wrong, and it will destroy both generators.

Lou Schneider said:

but it's tricky and takes specialized equipment and skill to do it properly.  Do it wrong, and it will destroy both generators.

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One of my jobs onboard submarines was parallelling 64kw, 400hz motor/generators. Not pretty when done wrong!

kdbgoat said:

One of my jobs onboard submarines was parallelling 64kw, 400hz motor/generators. Not pretty when done wrong!

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Yep I did that too. Luckily got it too wrong.

I'll yield to Lou's judgment cause he knows more about that stuff than I do. I just wonder if the sync interface is 100% the same, since two seemingly identical systems designed by two different engineers are rarely compatible in all the details. Hopefully this is an exception to that.

Gary RVer Emeritus said:

I'll yield to Lou's judgment cause he knows more about that stuff than I do. I just wonder if the sync interface is 100% the same, since two seemingly identical systems designed by two different engineers are rarely compatible in all the details. Hopefully this is an exception to that.

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That's what I was trying to say in my usual long-winded fashion.  The interfaces are compatible (120 VAC applied across the inverter's output) so you won't hurt anything if you connect them together.

The problem is whether or not the two generators will match up to each other and share the load.  For example, you can't sync a Honda to a Yamaha because the Honda's voltage starts out slightly high (128 volts) and goes down as you add more load, while the Yamaha's voltage stays closer to 120 volts.

You won't damage either generator, but they won't play nice together.

So if I try this what are the warning signs something is going wrong or about to go wrong? What advice can I do from a prepare standpoint?

I was thinking about trying it and seeing if it works. Its the same banana plugs and there is a ground hookup for both.

I attached pics of the two side by side and the kit. Note the banana plus match both units

Up date to my own thread. The Parallel cable works perfect for the Honda. Even though I have the Honda companion and it has the 30A plug I don't need another adapter with the harbor freight parallel cable. Banana plugs fit perfect. I think its better quality than the Honda parallel cable they sell. Have not hooked a Predator up to Honda.. But very close.

I'm confused. You says it works perfectly, but you haven't actually hooked the Predator in parallel with the Honda yet?  How do you know it works?

All banana plugs are compatible as far as physical fit, so that by itself doesn't prove much. 

Just the plugs.. so far. Step one.

I would be afraid of a three word outcome when you hooked them up.

(1)ZOT!!!!!        (2)  Oh.      (3)  ____!

Old Racer said:

I would be afraid of a three word outcome when you hooked them up.

(1)ZOT!!!!!        (2)  Oh.      (3)  ____!

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That's what insurance is for ;D

So did it work when you powered up? I want to do this too.

Ok so I feel it?s time this thread deserves a answer. Can a Honda 2000 be Paired with a Predator 2000 using the Harbor Freight parallel kit? The answer is ?yes? although it?s a marriage with a few compromises.

I needed more wattage to power my 15,000 btu air conditioner on my camper and it has proven to be a good test. As expected the Honda?s extra 8 volts makes the Honda Pull the bulk of the load regardless of which generator is started first. The first drawback is the Predator is slower at responding to a load change then the Honda. (this is noticeably even when running the Predator alone) When the AC kicks on the Honda immediately ramps up to meet the load while the Predator won?t ramp up till the Honda is overloaded. This in turn overloads the Predator leaving you with no AC and two overloaded generators. What I?ve learned is the Predator has to have the Eco throttle turned off in order to start the AC. The supply voltage is extremely stable with or without a load. Unfortunately the fuel saving feature of the Predator is not able to be used. I do have good power to run the AC and enough reserve to run a 1200 watt microwave with the AC on.

Hope this helps some people. I?ll update should I have any negative issues.

AgTech4020

You could try adding extra wire between the Honda and the combining point, taking advantage of wire loss to make the voltage more equal between the two generators.  75 ft. of thin, 16 gauge extension cord would be a good place to start, losing about 10 volts at the Honda's maximum rated output of 18 amps.

The Honda will still do most of the work under a light load, but making the voltage more equal at higher power should let the Preditor pick up more of a heavy load without overloading the Honda.

I?ve been playing with the generators today and have discovered that if I don?t leave the eco throttle off on the Predator I get some rpm oscillation between the two. Basically the rpm?s seesaw back and forth on the two generators a small amount. Voltage seemed consistent but as soon as I turn the eco throttle off on the Predator the seesawing goes away and the Honda runs steady. I can leave the eco throttle turned on at all times with the Honda.

I believe the suggestion to add wire to lower the voltage from the Honda is a good one and may be worth a try. If I find the time and an extension cord to sacrifice I may give that a try.

Thanks,
AgTech4020

I know this is an old thread.  But I was searching for something and it came up. 

Can anyone tell me what the output voltage is on the parallel ports on the Honda?  And confirm that is DC?  All I see up there is that there is an 8 volt difference, but the actual voltages are not mentioned.

Thanks!

Welcome to The RV Forum!

The parallel ports on both the Honda and Preditor are connected directly across the 120 VAC coming from their inverters, just like the duplex plugs, and each generator can supply it's full rated power through those ports.  The paralleling kit just connects both sets to a common outlet.

The advantage of using the parallel ports instead of making a wye cord that plugs into each generator's duplex outlet is the banana plugs that go into the parallel ports have an insulating sleeve covering the bare prongs so there's less of a shock hazard if they become unplugged, as they'll still be live with voltage from the other generator.

The way the paralleling works is the first generator that's started becomes the frequency master and places 120 volts across the output of the second generator.  The second generator sees this voltage and automatically syncs it's output to it when it's started.

The 8 volts mentioned above is the difference between the AC voltages coming out of each generator, i.e. the Honda may put out 120 volts while the Predator puts out 112 volts.  I'm not sure if these are the actual voltages but you get the idea ... with more output voltage the Honda takes more of the load than the Preditor..

Thanks!!  There goes my idea..... 

My idea was to build a small, high current Lipo battery bank that would provide a bit of surge backup for starting up small AC units, etc.  I thought that the units paralleled their DC sides together because I figured doing the AC sides would cause problems with phase sync, but you explained how that is taken care of.

Thanks for the good info!

Steve