need advise on water damage in 1993 Class C Coachman Santara -

Hi I am new to the forum and have never owned an RV. We are looking to purchase one since 3 of our sons attend college in california and we live in NH. We can't afford to visit because cost of lodging is prohibitive. We also have to travel a lot for medical procedures (for our adult disabled son), that aren't available in our state, requiring us to drive long distances daily for periods of time when he needs treatment. We have the opportunity to buy a 1993 Class c Coachman Santara for $3200. There are significant areas of water damage from leaks that were reportedly fixed ( owner had reprtedly patched ). The worst area of course is the overhead bunk area with the outside seam areas having obvious areas of open seams, rippled walls, where caulk and patches failed. It had rained last 3 days and the overhead mattress bed area is wet and lifting mattress shows patches of mold on the vinyl side of mattress. The inside walls of the over head and also the wall and large window area by couch / dining area (which is on drivers side) is still actively leaking.. walls are spongy and particle board is rotted. When the gentleman tried to show me how the shaded came down the entire unit fell out because the particle board was wet and fell apart. there are a couple of other areas where there is old water damage ( rippling walls and peeled wall paper)  but the walls were dry. My problem is my family has health issues due to exposure to toxic mold years ago that damaged our immune systems so we can't tolerate leaks or mold.
The seller says we won't find any RV's under $10K without leaks and that this would be an easy fix. Other than the leaks and water damage the RV is in good shape for the age. It has 49K miles, drives well with no apparent oil leaks and the undercarriage looks in good shape considering the age. He purchased new tires a year ago. There may be a slight exhaust leak but it was not apparent during the 90 minutes it ran while we were there.  Only other problem ( we know of)  is the hot water tank hadn't been winterized and split so we'd have to replace that unit but I have found those on ebay for $250 and it looks like an easy change out.
  SO my question is, would it be worth purchasing for the price of $3200? Is it worth it to to have to repair and replace the rotted areas inside (overhead cabin), left wall above and all around the large window by dining area, and bedroom wall (shower wall leak needs caulking). We are not handy enough to do these fixes ourselves and we don't have more than $800 cash to spend on repairs..but I have $1000 worth of work owed me by a carpenter (we barter). The seller told us the leaks could be "easily fixed" with a can of some kind of liquid seal that could be poured and spread over the top of the RV , caulking the inside shower stall, around windows, and applying some double sided seam sealer for RV's. My thoughts are that this would be too risky a purchase but the seller thinks otherwise. I am skeptical, but there aren't too many other affordable options for us. What is your advise?

 

The seller is telling you all this because he knows you no nothing about repairing a RV with this much damage. The mold is the critical area whereas you've had health issue problems before with mold.  If it was me, I would run as fast as I could the other way. $800.00 will never take care of these issues.  You've got $4000.00 to spend towards a RV. Hopefully you can find one in much better shape than this money pit. Just doing a quick search, came up with this one on Craigslist in NH:

https://nh.craigslist.org/rvs/6100428805.html

Thank you Renee..Thats what I felt but needed confirmation from someone RV savvy. Just to clarify, though I'm sure it makes no diff in this case.... the amount we have to invest beyond the $3200 is $800 cash plus the $1000 worth of work that a contractor friend owes us. so $1800 total.

Read my previous post. I made a change by adding a RV.
Where are you located in NH?  I'm Farmington next to Rochester.

Renee, thanks again.. But lol, the RV you posted is the exact RV we looked at. The seller had it listed originally for $4000. but hen told us after we said we needed time to research the leaks and water damage repairs, he said he'd take $3200.  Just before we went to see it last night in Salem NH (we live in nearby Sandown, NH) I noticed the post had been removed, I assumed because the seller told us he had several prospective buyers. But when we went to see the RV I mentioned the post had been taken down. He said he didn't remove it but it was probably flagged because he had a ton of inquiries and he didn't have time to respond. I see this link you provided is his that he has reposted this morning, and listed it now for $3700. I notice he still did not mention the significant leaks but just said it "needs TCL inside and out". He also mentions he didn't appreciate our wasting 3 hours of his time showing it to us.. that's strange because we were ready to leave after an hour when we saw all the rot, saying we'd research repair costs and options and get back to him. I certainly will not be now,  knowing he is clearly not being transparent or up front about the severity of the leaks and damage. I wish people would just be up front an honest. that would save everyone time.

You could spend triple that $3200 to get that motorhome in livable condition. I personally would not even consider it. We had a class C with water damage, and it cost us thousands to repair. Then ended up selling it below market value just to get rid of it.


Bill

billwild said:

You could spend triple that $3200 to get that motorhome in livable condition. I personally would not even consider it. We had a class C with water damage, and it cost us thousands to repair. Then ended up selling it below market value just to get rid of it.
Bill

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As Bill shared with his experience, with an all-in budget of $4000 with no reserve for repair, I don't think you'll find a Class C that either doesn't have similar issues requiring thousand of dollars to rectify, and/or, simply because of age, requires tires and/or batteries which could set you back almost $1000. Then what if you find out the fridge doesn't work? $1-2000  to fix or replace. Or the charger/converter quits (several hundred). Needs brakes? Could easily spend $1000 of you needed new drums/rotors. I could go on.

I did a quick search nationwide on both RV Trader and PPL for a Class C with a max price of $4000, there are none on PPL and only four on RV Trader - there simply aren't any vehicles in that price range for anyone other than someone who had a fair amount of extra cash, and a lot of knowledge to do the work themselves. Can you find one one Craig's List? Maybe, but you won't be happy.

I truly am not trying to rain on your parade, and I understand what your goals are, but I fear this plan could wipe out the cash that you do have at the moment, leaving you with an old, broken RV you can't sell, or that you unload for half of what you bought it for.

Sounds like he wasted three hours of your time! 

Having learned the hard way of similar issues on my first RV 25 years ago, what I would suggest you do is 3 things in the following order:

Lace up shoes
Run
Don't look back

With the amount of travel you need to do, and the need for reliability to meet those needs, you could spend the asking cost of that old rig just keeping it usable if anything went wrong. That plus the repairs needed, insurance, etc. ,  I would not think it was a bargain as a gift.

We see this sort of thing all the time - somebody with a low, low budget and no repair skills wants to buy an old & dilapidated RV and expects somehow to save money on living and travel.  Ain't gonna happen.  First of all, it's an old vehicle plus an old house with old appliances.  Second, motorhomes get terrible fuel mileage. Third, staying in campgrounds, even shabby ones, is far from inexpensive. Fourth, RV dealer repair service is extremely expensive, well over $100/hour, and parts are pricey as well.

Pugapooh said:

Sounds like he wasted three hours of your time!

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RUN..!!!

I think that you are kidding yourself that you can get this into livable shape and have no further issues. 

I posted my 31ft long Coachman Santara last year for $10000 and was overwhelmed with cash buyers.  This was sold in less than 24 hours. I am convinced that the person who I sold it to was buying this to live in it full time.  I say this because any RV that is in reasonably good shape, like mine was, and is $10,000 or less will have many buyers competing to own it. One that is not in good shape will cost you the same by the time you fix it up.

Joel

If someone said to me it was an easy fix, I would wonder why they hadn't fixed it before selling as surely it would be in their interest to do so and to stop further damage. I would see what your very best budget would be and see what else you can find. Good luck, sounds like you have a lot to contend with.

jackiemac said:

If someone said to me it was an easy fix, I would wonder why they hadn't fixed it before selling as surely it would be in their interest to do so and to stop further damage. I would see what your very best budget would be and see what else you can find. Good luck, sounds like you have a lot to contend with.

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I always wonder the same thing!  If it was a easy fix,why didn't the owner do it?

Thank you all so much for your honesty and for giving me a reality check . I decided to wait realizing I needed to study up, budget up and I have done both. I am now looking at 2 different class C's in the $8K range. Both are 1994 fords with around 46K miles. Both have new tires, brakes and have been regularly serviced.
  One is a Dutchman and the other a Winnebago and both owners are retired grandparents who have maintained the coaches well and have all service records. However, they aren't original owners and while prior owners did cross country driving , both coaches have been used for more for local camping by the current owners.
  The Dutchman: it has a generator that starts but won't stay running. It has only 200 hours. Is this a common problem for generators with low hours (that are seldom used) in older coaches? Is it an easy fix or is it likely it'd have to be replaced? If so, is it more cost effective to purchase a portable generator rather than repairing or replacing the Onan?  That's the only problem with the Dutchman . The interior is immaculate and I prefer the floor plan over the Winne's and it also has a full bath tub where the winne does not.
    The Winnebago: it's interior has seen more active use  (they have teenage grandkids) but is still in great shape. It also has 2 high end back up cameras and 2 LCD TV's, which is a big plus for me. However, it has no generator at all. So the fridge doesn't work while driving. The owner said she has no need for it since she camps at campgrounds that an hour or two away. She said generators cost  "a couple hundred" dollars (I thought they'd be more), but also mentioned some kind of box that makes it so the appliances run off the coach batteries. She mentioned having them on her prior 2 RV's.
    So my question is, what are your thoughts about generators? Since I intend to be driving cross country, need at least the fridge and microwave to work while driving and/or without always having access to plug in electricity and water. What is the box she's referring to and would that be a viable option ?
      Thanks in advance for your advise!  I'll try pasting in the links to both in case that helps with your input.
Dutchman :
http://nh.craigslist.org/rvs/6211090183.html

Winnebago:
https://boston.craigslist.org/nos/rvs/d/1994-ford-winnebago-campermi/6250080281.html

The fridge should work without the generator but the air conditioner and microwave won't (the usual rv fridge can run on propane and 12 Vdc battery). The appliances that require 115Vac must have it if they draw more than a few Amps of current. She may have had an inverter in her previous rigs that provided limited ac, but that is suited for things like tv or charging batteries.

A generator that has seen little use often has a gummed up carburetor that requires replacement ($400+-). Other problems are certainly possible as well. I'd strongly recommend that you have anything you are seriously considering inspected by a competent technician (see if he won't let you observe).

Ernie

Appliances, TVs, and generators can be repaired, removed, replaced, and upgraded much easier than floorplans can be changed!

I assume that the fridge in the Winnie is a residential fridge that only runs on AC?  Some people do prefer those as they do work better.  I know the absorption fridges that run on LP or AC don't work as well as a fridge, but I love the fact that I don't have to have a giant inverter, shore power, or a constant generator to keep my beer coldish.  (And I guess my milk and eggs and stuff too, but let's keep our priorities straight, shall we?)  If you think you'll be doing a significant amount of boondocking or dry camping you're going to have to decide how you're going to generate AC power.  If you're only concerned about what's going on while you're rolling down the road, then it doesn't matter as much.

If it will start while you hold down the button but then shut itself off when you release it, that means that one of the on-board monitoring checks is failing.  It is designed to ignore all that stuff while you're on the button, but if it isn't producing AC voltage, if the oil level is low, if it's over-temp, or if the control board itself is just fuzzed up, it will shut itself down.  Given the low hours (you're supposed to run these bad boys at load for 2 hours a month, minimum), my guess is that the slip rings need attention.  I've not personally dealt with that issue myself, but I understand that there's a $25 tool for sale on the Internet that makes that a fairly quick and easy DIY repair.  Replacing the circuit board isn't difficult either, but they can be a little pricey.

The other way of generating AC power is through the use of an inverter which is the box she's talking about.  These range in price mostly depending on the amount of wattage that they put out.  A mini fridge is probably around 30-40 watts, so totally do-able on an inverter as long as you have enough battery capacity.  You can get a device called a Kill-A-Watt that will plug in between your outlet and your whatever else and it will tell you what the power draw is -- this is very helpful because while it might pull 30 watts under normal usage, compressor start-up might have a momentary higher draw that you'll need to account for.  From there, you'll get into calculations around how much reserve capacity is in the house batteries and how many other things you want to power on AC.  A microwave, for example, could add another 1500 watts.  If we assume that you have enough battery capacity to make that work and you don't need to upgrade that system, you're probably in to an inverter for about $500 (2500 watt sine-wave inverter plus mounting and hookup) if you DIY.  That's a guess, though, and probably on the high side.  Next question, though, is if you want to also be able to run your roof-top A/C.  The dash A/C (if it works) can keep the front seat passengers cool, but anyone in the back is going to get a bit warm on those hot summer days going down the road.

A decent used generator that was built to be permanently installed in an RV is going to run you around 500-800.  If the coach isn't already set up for that, you've got some work involved -- input and output of course, wiring up a start switch and hour meter inside, perhaps even putting in the reinforcements to mount the thing in the first place.  I can't see it really being worth it.  You could get a smaller and less expensive stand-alone portable gen-set and strap it down to one of those hitch-mount cargo shelves.

If it were me, I would be looking at the Dutchman.  The genset is probably fixable for not a whole boatload of money and even if it's not, replacing it with a used unit for $800 wouldn't be as difficult as trying to add one to a coach that wasn't already set up for one.  The TVs are probably A/C only in the Winnie, so the same problem the fridge and microwave have.  I just put a pretty decent LCD TV in my coach earlier this year and I got a unit that works on AC or DC and has a DVD player and a couple HDMI inputs.  No inverter or generator needed and it wasn't very expensive or hard to mount.  Backup cameras are not very expensive and aren't too tough to mount.  I've installed backup and side-view cameras on conversion vans, RVs, and box trucks and it takes a little bit of planning, but once you've found your power source and a good place to mount things, the rest is cheap and easy.  My class A has a camera that cost me a total of about $50-$75 to install and I can back that thing up to a trailer and put the ball precisely under the coupler on the first shot every time.  That's high quality enough for me.

One other thing to remember about buying an old coach (and I have an old coach and fully encourage other people to own old coaches, just as long as you understand this caveat!):  You need to have the willingness to do one of two things:  (A) Spend a bunch of money to pay people to fix things for you or (B) Spend a smaller bunch of money and become a mechanic/electrician/appliance repair man/plumber/carpenter/roofer/HVAC tech.  You're dealing with a whole bunch of things that are 23 years old and have spent their lives bouncing down the road.  Entropy is a real thing and it will catch up to you eventually, so you're going to need to be fairly handy or it will eat you out of house and home quickly.  You'll want to keep some basic tools with you at all times (Harbor Freight has a pretty nice tool kit for about $30 with a coupon that has been invaluable for me, plus one of those free multimeters, and a contact-less thermometer) and I'd print out as much service information as you can and keep it in the coach so you have things like wiring diagrams and model numbers.  And at the first sign of water stop, do not pass go, do not collect two hundred dollars, and whatever you do, keep your grubby mitts of anything that has silicone in it but get up there and start sealing things.  Get Eternabond, DAP clear elastomeric sealant, lap compound, whatever.  If you can keep the water out, everything else will work itself out.

Try to go with the one with the genset since you like it best. Take it to get a pre buy inspection done and that will tell you what it will take to get the gen running as well as any other issue you may not have found.

A good inspection can run a few hundred but is money well spent and some mobile techs will apply at least part of the fee toward needed repairs if you ask nicely.

Thank you so much, Ernie, WAE, and Capsteve! You all provided very good advise that I will absolutely take and appreciate!
    It sounds like the consensus is that the Dutchman would be the better bet since the lack of generator  in the Winnie could be a costly fix for my needs. Generators are not "a couple hundred" dollars and the inverter boxes , while a good option in some cases may not be in others.
  One other question about the Dutchman ..it has the older style rippled siding as opposed to the newer smooth style siding. Is the difference a functional one, (higher risk for damage , water incursion, leaks etc,)  or is it strictly cosmetic?
    As for a pre sale inspection ... is it something typical that sellers agree to? Also, can a regular mechanic that is RV savvy suffice as opposed to a commercial RV specialist? I understand that the whole point is to identify potential problems that may be costly but it will be tough for me to spend  $200-$300 for multiple inspections (if I end up not buying because of some impending costly issue), then have to do repeats for every coach I look at.
      Thanks again for your thoughtful and detailed replies!
Pam