Gfci trouble

Hi, I'm Kim, new here thanks for the add....having major electrical problems we have lived in our 1999 Esprit Kit travel trailer for nearly 3 years but just a few days ago the gfci (which controls every outlet) has been tripping, even after we replaced it. We have also used an outlet tester and all seems fine. Today I've spent hours trying to pin point the problem, no single plug seems to be the problem nor appliance through process of elimination...still tripping to the point that gfci quit resetting, will replace again but what on earth is causing it?  Even unplugged fridge at one point...converter?  We are at a loss and now heating to death, it was staying in shorter and shorter amounts of time before giving out completely. Now we are trying to replace breakers and I'm not sure that even affects anything. Please help. Thank you!!!

I'm adding that the tripping starts when it's the hottest part of the day and quits later in the cooler evenings...no a/c on

Have you had rain recently? If you have, check your outside receptacles. They may have gotten some moisture in there. It's very common for that to happen.

No, dry as ever here, but as we speak we are replacing it anyway...fingers crossed. Thanks for the reply!!

Replacing the GFCI [again] should not be necessary. It won't reset if it has no power, so check that first. Replacing breakers is irrelevant unless the GFCI is part of the breaker.  It sounds as though you don't know what makes a GFCI trip, so you might spend some time learning a bit. This may help:
http://www.naturalhandyman.com/iip/infelectrical/infgfi.html
https://www.safeelectricity.org/information-center/library-of-articles/55-home-safety/317-ground-fault-circuit-interrupters-gfcis

Ground faults can be elusive and you have to approach the problem with a systematic process of elimination. Temporarily disconnect parts of the circuit downstream from the GFCI itself and see if the fault is eliminated. Try to start in the middle of the circuit so that you can isolate the fault to one half or the other. Then do one outlet or connection at a time in the half that has the fault.

A few questions:
1. Is the GFCI part of the breaker for that circuit, or part of an outlet receptacle?
2. Is the converter/charger hardwired or plugged to an outlet? Or maybe built into the load center power panel?
3. When you say the GFCI won't reset, do you mean it immediately trips again, or that pushing the reset button has no result at all?

Is this the GFCI inside the camper or one outside that the camper is plugged into?
If outside it may be too much load.

Gary RV_Wizard said:

Replacing the GFCI [again] should not be necessary. It won't reset if it has no power, so check that first. Replacing breakers is irrelevant unless the GFCI is part of the breaker.  It sounds as though you don't know what makes a GFCI trip, so you might spend some time learning a bit. This may help:
http://www.naturalhandyman.com/iip/infelectrical/infgfi.html
https://www.safeelectricity.org/information-center/library-of-articles/55-home-safety/317-ground-fault-circuit-interrupters-gfcis

Ground faults can be elusive and you have to approach the problem with a systematic process of elimination. Temporarily disconnect parts of the circuit downstream from the GFCI itself and see if the fault is eliminated. Try to start in the middle of the circuit so that you can isolate the fault to one half or the other. Then do one outlet or connection at a time in the half that has the fault.

A few questions:
1. Is the GFCI part of the breaker for that circuit, or part of an outlet receptacle?
2. Is the converter/charger hardwired or plugged to an outlet? Or maybe built into the load center power panel?
3. When you say the GFCI won't reset, do you mean it immediately trips again, or that pushing the reset button has no result at all?

Click to expand...

Thanks for the reply and the article, I admit I only know from what I'm reading online. Answers to you questions...
1. Gfci is an outlet in kitchen controlling all other outlets....also has its own breaker.
2. Converter is plugged to outlet but also has a long series of wires going to breaker box and outdoor battery so I'm not sure.
3. Gfci would immediately trip again until finally not resetting for about 2 hours.


Here's an update on what we did since last post....replaced outdoor outlet since many said it could've shorted due to weather (even though it's been dry)...but we did this in the cooler evening temps so when it worked I was sceptical until I see it working today in the heat....yep, gets around 90 degrees and it tripped again today, so far will not rest again. Can heat really make it worse? This cannot be my imagination, we make break down and get electrician but was hoping for an idea if it's an easy fix. Stumped


Edit: Moderator moved misplaced end-quote tag

Gary RV_Wizard said:

Ground faults can be elusive and you have to approach the problem with a systematic process of elimination. Temporarily disconnect parts of the circuit downstream from the GFCI itself and see if the fault is eliminated. Try to start in the middle of the circuit so that you can isolate the fault to one half or the other. Then do one outlet or connection at a time in the half that has the fault.

Click to expand...

Kheren, Gary's suggestion here is (as usual) a very good one.  If you're able to make a list of all the things that don't work with the GFCI off, that would be a good start. 

Two other things:
1. You might try interrupting the circuit between the GFCI and the first outlet/appliance it feeds, and then trying to reset the GFCI.  That will tell you if the problem is with the GFCI itself.
2. You probably already know this, but 120V is dangerous.  Unplug your shore power before disconnecting any wires to plugs/appliances, make sure they're secure so they don't short out, plug back in, and test the GFCI.

Finally, because the GFCI always trips, I doubt this is the problem -  but electric heating elements can be working fine and still trip GFCIs.  So you might try turning off your water heater and fridge at the same time and seeing what happens with the GFCI.

Gfci still will not reset since last post, so I have zero electricity to test anything. I may have ruined that new switch too since it's been reset about 100 times since yesterday. It controls everything except microwave, over head lights & stereo which are on battery. However, yesterday I did check each outlet one by one with only one thing plugged in at a time (different items in case it was a particular appliance) each time eventually blew the gfci.
I have since unplugged the converter from its outlet hoping to check that but again I can't until gfci resets eventually. Also yesterday both hot water heater and fridge were off (fridge switched to gas) but not unplugged, does that matter?
I'm reading that converters can overheat so I'm hoping to see if unplugging it helps, of course I have no clue if that even makes sense. Thanks to everyone for helping. Willing to try anything.

And now clouds are rolling in and getting cooler....gfci has reset and so far so good (5 minutes as of now)This is a complete mind blowing phenomenon!

Ok nope, still tripping but does reset. I've done one breaker at a time and all of them make it trip, even just with main breaker and gfci breaker only.

How many circuits are on that GFCI??, you said earlier that you had NO electricity because it blows. (Normally there should be no more than about 6 other non-GFCI outlets). Is that GFCI built into a breaker by any chance??

That GFCI should be supplied by only one 15-20 amp breaker. Any others, on or off, should not affect it in any way.

Alfa38User said:

How many circuits are on that GFCI??, you said earlier that you had NO electricity because it blows. (Normally there should be no more than about 6 other non-GFCI outlets). It makes no sense that more than one breaker on should make it trip as it should be supplied by a given 15-20 amp single breaker only.

Click to expand...

There are 6 breakers,
1. Main
2. Open
3. Micro
4. Refer-conver
5. Gfi
6. Ac

All outlets are on the gfci so when it flips I have nothing except what is on battery (overhead lights etc)
And yes obviously I had to keep on main breaker and gfci breaker to test it but even just those 2 make it trip.
Also unplugging converter did nothing. So now I'm all plugged backed in as normal and I just reset it every time it trips, 3-5 minutes in between, until the husband comes home with a different plan.

Still makes little sense, breakers 3,4,6 should still be supplying their circuits. (2 is a spare, nothing on it?). You did mention ALL the other outlets are on 5. You have to be sure nothing is plugged into these outlets and then start splitting the outlets off as was suggested by Gary above. (Don't forget to check for any outlets down below in the storage area). The outlets typically protected by a GFCI are the bathroom counters, kitchen counters, the patio (outside) however in your case there could easily be several more. Any appliance with an electric heating element, (Fridge or water heater) can be a suspect too but you can probably run them on propane and see if that helps.

(My trailer also has the Breaker/GFCI arrangement.)

The other breakers and their connected circuits have nothing to do with the GFCI breaker so I suspect the main power source may be misbehaving. What are you plugged into for power? If the outside power fails (Main) then the GFCI breaker GFCI will not reset, nor would any of the other breakers have any power.

Alfa38User said:

Still makes little sense, breakers 3,4,6 should still be supplying their circuits. (2 is a spare, nothing on it?). You did mention ALL the other outlets are on 5. You have to be sure nothing is plugged into these outlets and then start splitting the outlets off as was suggested by Gary above. The circuits typically protected by a GFCI are the bathroom counters, kitchen counters, the patio (outside) however in your case there could easily be several more. (My trailer also has the Breaker/GFCI arrangement.)

The other breakers and their connected circuits have nothing to do with the GFCI breaker so I suspect the main power source is misbehaving. If the outside power fails (Main) then the GFCI breaker GFCI will not reset, nor would any of the other breakers have any power. What are you plugged into for power?

Click to expand...

Yes, sorry 3,4, & 6 did work but yes that all other outlets are on the gfci ...also I did (I think?) yesterday test each one....well I unplugged everything in the trailer except one thing on about 3 different outlets not every single one (I'll do that next)  however, again temperature is cooler now and I cannot get anything to trip it. So frustrating. As far as what am I hooked up to for power??? I'll ask the husband when he comes home as I have no clue other than it's a 3 prong plug into park electric lol, also nothing has changed in the 2 years we have been here, so I'm guessing a short somewhere.

Thanks again!!

Just tripped again so now I'm unplugging everything except a fan to test each outlet that I didn't yesterday. Problem is...sometimes it trips in 3 seconds others in over an hour so I'm not sure how I'll know.
I should note that it's random, not when I use something or plug something in, everything just is normal until it's not at different times but always ONLY in the heat of the day. I guess I should be lucky to have electricity when I'm trying to sleep

Kim, you mentioned in your first post you were "heating to death" with the failure.  I took that to mean that your air conditioner wasn't working.  Is that right?  Because the breaker layout you've described shows the air conditioner is on a different circuit than the gfci.  If all your 120 V circuits are out when you're having this maddening, intermittent problem, I don't see how it could be the gfci. So can you be a little more clear about what is not working?  You said later, "It controls everything except microwave, over head lights & stereo".  Can you clarify?  Because if you're losing your air conditioning when the gfci is popping, this is a whole different problem.

Old Blevins said:

Kim, you mentioned in your first post you were "heating to death" with the failure.  I took that to mean that your air conditioner wasn't working.  Is that right?  Because the breaker layout you've described shows the air conditioner is on a different circuit than the gfci.  If all your 120 V circuits are out when you're having this maddening, intermittent problem, I don't see how it could be the gfci. So can you be a little more clear about what is not working?  You said later, "It controls everything except microwave, over head lights & stereo".  Can you clarify?  Because if you're losing your air conditioning when the gfci is popping, this is a whole different problem.

Click to expand...

You're right I said that and I apologize, I should've been clearer -a/c does work but I try my hardest to not use it, without my fan I was "heating to death" lol...so yes all other circuits continue to work except any and all wall outlets since all are on gfci Does that clarify? I'm sorry my lingo and facts may be off as this is our first problem and I'm still somewhat new. It's been a few hours now and no more trips (but again it's cool out now) We have an electrician friend coming tonight. Fingers crossed.

My next step was going to be unplugging fridge and the water heater, I've heard they can short even if switched off? Worth a try?

Though some makers do put the fridge and water heater on teh GFCI, they shoudl be on independent breakers. Not on the GFCI.. (However as I said some put 'em there)

If the GFCI will not reset then it is not getting power.  Or if it resets and immed trips then the problem exists.

I would also check all the screws in the power distribution panel. (unplug first) to make sure they are tight.. I've found many RVers have a few screws loose. these are the screws I'm talking about.

John From Detroit said:

Though some makers do put the fridge and water heater on teh GFCI, they shoudl be on independent breakers. Not on the GFCI.. (However as I said some put 'em there)

If the GFCI will not reset then it is not getting power.  Or if it resets and immed trips then the problem exists.

I would also check all the screws in the power distribution panel. (unplug first) to make sure they are tight.. I've found many RVers have a few screws loose. these are the screws I'm talking about.

Click to expand...

Obviously I too have a few loose screws, I've already mentioned the fridge isn't on the gfci so what I said made zero sense. Lol. Electrician is coming today but last night he told my husband to swap the gfi outlet with a normal one to see if that helps or if now the breaker will flip....again we will see later in the heat of the day if this works...then go from there.

The fridge is usually plugged into an outlet in the back of the fridge (look in the outside access for that outlet). But your circuit layout seemed to say it was on C/B 4 and not the GFCI C/B (5). The water heater (if electric) is not usually plugged in but is run from a C/B, through a switch and then to the water heater but you did not specify that one on your list. You could have a propane only unit as well.

The thing to confirm when in failure mode is that all the other stuff on C/B 3,4,6 either remain working or not. IE the microwave works,  the ac continues to work, the refer continues to work on electricity. If not, suspect either the main C/B (30 amp), the campground power supply or the cord/plugs are acting up. (You can quickly check the cord for excess heat on either end by just touching the plugs while everything is still working. They should not be HOT.) The electrician's suggestion should be a last resort but is otherwise good!!

OK, let's narrow this down. None of the appliances on the other breakers have anything to do with the GFCI on #5. Forget the fridge, converter, microwave and a/c - they are NOT involved. You can also forget the wiring between the #5 breaker and the first GFCI outlet. Not involved becasue the GFCI doesn't detect anything about that part of the circuit.

Electrical overloads (too many amps) do NOT cause a GFCI to trip. Forget about too many things plugged in or turned on.

Since warmer temperatures aggravate the problem, I see two possibilities:
1. Heat causes expansion, so something is expanding enough to pinch a wire or touch an exposed wire. This may have been happening for years until it finally chafed enough to wear through insulation
2. Something wired into that circuit has a thermostat and activates when it gets warmer.


Unplug anything that is plugged into the GFCI-protected outlets. If it still trips, then the problem is in the wiring for those outlets. If not, it was something plugged into them.


Re the electrician advice: Swapping the GFCI for a normal one will of course eliminate the fault detection (tripping). Duh! If there is no GFCI, it can't trip, right?  Maybe he meant to exchange (move) the GFCI with the receptacle in another outlet box, to see if the problem is still present further downstream? It's one way to do that process of elimination I mentioned previously.