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Author Topic: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?  (Read 356 times)

Frank B

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Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« on: August 06, 2017, 05:59:32 PM »
We are snowbirds, and like to be in Arizona and SoCal in the winter.  It is not usually hot down there then, but there is the odd day.  We also boondock as much as possible, and while I just added 1.2 kw of solar to my rig, even that will not keep the batteries up during the day if I run the a/c.

So, several questions in order of desirability:

1) Is there ANY way to get a single Honda eu200i to run a 1500 watt Coleman / Mach 13,500 btu a/c by itself?  It SHOULD, were it not for the start current, as the Honda is rated at 1600 watts continuous.  Will a 'hard start' kit on the a/c allow this?  Can I hold the overload breaker on the Honda down until the compressor starts?  Can I manually speed up the generator engine just before closing the a/c circuit, giving it a 'run' at the startup load?

Failing that:

2) I have a 2500 watt Sunforce pure sine inverter in our unit which should run the a/c if I can supply enough DC power.  I have 6 GC-2's in my battery bank, and can, on a good day, generate close to 50 amps from the solar.  However, the a/c is going to cause the inverter to consume about 120 amps at 12 volts.  What if I 'turbocharge' the input by adding  a 60 or 100 amp external battery charger to the battery bank and power that from  the Honda?  Net drain on the batteries should be about zero.

3)  Finally, shall I just give up, sell the Honda, and buy a cheap 3K generator instead for the very rare time that I will need to run the a/c?  With the solar that I have, there will never again be a need for me to plug in OTHER than to run the a/c.  And, I can always put a noisier generator way out in the field well away from the trailer if needed.

Thoughts?

Frank.

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captsteve

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #1 on: August 06, 2017, 08:56:55 PM »
You may be over thinking this a little bit. To clarify, I have "heard" of some people having luck running 1 a/c on a honda 2000. Test it out and see if it works for you or not. A soft start capacitor should help a little.

If it doesn't work as well as you like there is the option of the piggyback kit for the honda where you can hook 2 together and run them in parallel. (Another Option)

As far as your battery question, I will leave that to others with more knowledge but I personally like to keep my batteries for use as intended.
Capt Steve has the Conn, Trina navigator ( Admiral )
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Frank B

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #2 on: August 06, 2017, 10:27:22 PM »
captsteve:

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You may be over thinking this a little bit.

Yeah, big time.  ;-)

I tried running the AC off the Honda alone.  It comes close, but the overload trips on the Honda just before the compressor gets up to speed.

Didn't even get that far with the 2500 watt Sunforce inverter.  Ran about 2 seconds before the overload tripped.

If I decide we even need the a/c in the winter in Arizona, then a 3 kw genset is going to be the easiest.  Hondas are quite popular, and I may be able to sell our slightly used one  for close to what it would cost me for a 3100 watt Champion model 100387 from Costco.  However, we seldom use the a/c anyway, even when plugged in to shore power.

As you say, I am overthinking this.

Frank.
Linux:  Free, open, elegant.
06 GMC 3500 Duramax crew/long pulling 2010 Arctic Fox 30U with 1700 lb Reese Titan Class 5.
1.2 kw solar

captsteve

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #3 on: August 06, 2017, 11:24:01 PM »
Just for giggles, I would pop in a soft start and try again. it may well make the difference you need to get it over the hump. Cheap enough to do and will cure you of what ails you. (curiosity)

In the end the 3k might be the best option and then you have the insurance against a sweaty night that you seek.
Capt Steve has the Conn, Trina navigator ( Admiral )
2004 American Revolution 40c (aka Fat Girl) **Sold**
2017 Ram 1500 (Future Toad)
Piper Archer II  (Where the RV money goes)

kdbgoat

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I know you believe you understand what you think I said,
But I am not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant


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captsteve

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2017, 06:13:26 AM »
Any soft start capacitor would do the same
Capt Steve has the Conn, Trina navigator ( Admiral )
2004 American Revolution 40c (aka Fat Girl) **Sold**
2017 Ram 1500 (Future Toad)
Piper Archer II  (Where the RV money goes)

kdbgoat

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2017, 06:28:10 AM »
Read the story, he tried a soft start cap first, and didn't do what he wanted.
I know you believe you understand what you think I said,
But I am not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant


2016 Leprechaun 319DS

captsteve

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2017, 06:43:41 AM »
Sorry, Nothing against you and it is an interesting post but anything referred to as magic or miracle sounds like hokum to me. The math does not change no matter what magic capacitor you put on it. If the issue is starting amps, any Cap will help that. If as in the post you mentioned the issue is constant draw, the magic boxes limit power to the unit causing an undervoltage condition which will in the not so long term burn up the unit.

There have been many items similar to this marketed over the years for many uses, one that comes to mind was for your home fridge, did it save power and make your fridge run quieter, yes. Right before it burned up the compressor due to undervoltage.
Capt Steve has the Conn, Trina navigator ( Admiral )
2004 American Revolution 40c (aka Fat Girl) **Sold**
2017 Ram 1500 (Future Toad)
Piper Archer II  (Where the RV money goes)

kdbgoat

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2017, 06:59:12 AM »
Here at the plant where I work, we use a few soft start units on some of the equipment. Mostly on old screw conveyors that have to start up under load. Soft starts are not new technology and they do work. If we didn't use soft starts on those conveyors, they would trip the breaker on the buckets every time they tried to start.
I know you believe you understand what you think I said,
But I am not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant


2016 Leprechaun 319DS

captsteve

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2017, 07:04:20 AM »
Here at the plant where I work, we use a few soft start units on some of the equipment. Mostly on old screw conveyors that have to start up under load. Soft starts are not new technology and they do work. If we didn't use soft starts on those conveyors, they would trip the breaker on the buckets every time they tried to start.
I guess you mis-read my post. To clarifiy Yes, soft starts work for start up. just not for extended run.
Capt Steve has the Conn, Trina navigator ( Admiral )
2004 American Revolution 40c (aka Fat Girl) **Sold**
2017 Ram 1500 (Future Toad)
Piper Archer II  (Where the RV money goes)

SargeW

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #10 on: August 07, 2017, 07:31:52 AM »
I like the idea better of the second Honda 2000 with the parallel hookup. Quieter than the 3000, easier to move around, and now you have 4000 watts to use if necessary.  Just my .02
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lynnmor

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #11 on: August 07, 2017, 08:11:37 AM »
I like the idea better of the second Honda 2000 with the parallel hookup. Quieter than the 3000, easier to move around, and now you have 4000 watts to use if necessary.  Just my .02

Just want to add my two pennies as well.

Frank B

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #12 on: August 07, 2017, 08:42:55 AM »
kbdgoat:

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Ran across this Friday:

https://forums.goodsamclub.com/index.cfm/fuseaction/thread/tid/29378915.cfm

Worth a look.  My a/c comes close to starting with the 2K Honda as it is.  Probably wouldn't take much to make it successful.

The thread you linked me to continues with a lot of back and forth as to efficacy.  I know that current draw goes up with ambient temperature, but we are not looking to run it off a single 2K generator in 100+ temperatures.  And I don't expect it to run in eco mode either.  Just want it to run the odd day when I might want it.

While the original poster of that thread you linked me to talks of the device doing some 'magic', I suspect he is just using that term to describe  what he doesn't have the technical ability to explain.  Would not a higher capacity capacitor have a greater effect than a low capacity one?  Would not the effect have something to do with the number of micro Farads in the capacitor used? (Too many years since I was taught about this in high school electronics class.)  IIRC, any start capacitor is used to phase shift the current going to the induction motor to give it a 'flip' in the right direction to get it going, and short of an inefficient 'shaded pole' induction motor, pretty much all induction motors require some sort of start capacitor to get them going.

Anyway, it may be worth a look.

Thanks.
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Gary RV_Wizard

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #13 on: August 07, 2017, 09:26:07 AM »
Some (many?) a/c units already have a start capacitor, so check before you go too far down that road. The Supco a/c start cap is a popular and inexpensive model if you need one. Ebay, Amazon, etc. have them for specific a/c models.

I think "turbo charging" might work. I've done something similar with running a convection oven off the inverter when we had only 15A shore power. My charger was 90A, feeding a 330 AH battery bank.

Your a/c  inverter overload problem may be wiring as much as anything. When the a/c kicks on and the inverter amp load hits 100+, you need big thick wires and really solid connections to carry the amp load. Otherwise, the voltage drops below the inverters threshold (typically 10.5v or 11.0v) and it shuts down. The "turbo-charge" method might be enough to keep the voltage up, if the charger itself doesn't overload as well.

Which Sunforce model do you have? Is the 2000W peak or sustained?  If you have the 1000W (2000 peak), its probably not enough to run the a/c anyway, either sustained or peak. The a/c start load will peak around 2500 (or more) and inverters typically trip very fast, so even a 1/60th of a second is enough to overload it.
Gary
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BruceinFL

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2017, 03:26:14 PM »
Bruce A.
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geofisher

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2017, 08:40:57 PM »
Besides the AC are there other 120v loads. The converter that is likely providing 12v power and charging the batteries. It could be taking a significant amount of the available AC power.

Gary RV_Wizard

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #16 on: August 08, 2017, 08:18:46 AM »
Quote
The converter that is likely providing 12v power and charging the batteries.

Hopefully not the case when running from the inverter!
Gary
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Summers: Black Mountain, NC
Home: Ocala National Forest, FL

Old Blevins

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #17 on: August 08, 2017, 03:55:38 PM »
My A/C will run off my Honda i-2000 -  barely, and only on "low".  But I have to leave eco mode off and if I forget and leave my fridge on "auto" instead of propane, there's no chance. So if your fridge was running when you tried it, you might double-check that.
Jim
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Frank B

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Re: Run A/C from Honda eu2000i with 'turbo boost'?
« Reply #18 on: August 10, 2017, 04:32:36 PM »
Gary:

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Which Sunforce model do you have? Is the 2000W peak or sustained?

It is the 2500 watt unit.  2000 sustained, and supposedly about 4Kw peak.  But that peak must be for just a fraction of a second.  :-)  The error message on the display translates as 'direct short' on the 120 v side.  A simple reset gets it going again with no problem. It just won't support that kind of load on the AC side, regardless of what the 'specs' say.

BruceInFL:

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Did you check out this one: https://www.microair.net/collections/easystart-soft-starters

At $300, I can sell the Honda and buy a larger generator.   ;D

Old Blevins:

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if I forget and leave my fridge on "auto" instead of propane, there's no chance.

OK, tried that.  Fridge on propane, eco mode off, converter unplugged and hot water tank off.  Close, but no cigar.   :(   It seems to run for about 10 seconds with the generator flat out, but then the overload trips.

Thanks, all, but it seems that with our unit, if I want the air that bad when boondocking, I'll have to get a 3 Kw generator.

Frank.



Linux:  Free, open, elegant.
06 GMC 3500 Duramax crew/long pulling 2010 Arctic Fox 30U with 1700 lb Reese Titan Class 5.
1.2 kw solar

 

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