receptacles

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I only use commercial outlet strips for light duty loads like multiple USB chargers, etc. For heavier loads, I make my own multi-outlet boxes sized for the job.
 
Back stab, SCD, whatever you want to call it, still isn't as good as a properly installed with around a screw in my opinion. I'm an industrial electrician by trade, and screws vibrating loose from vibration doesn't wash with me. There's millions of screws with conductors wrapped around them on machinery around the world, and failures from screws loosening up are far and few in between. I trust a conductor installed under a screw to carry a load, than incidental contact from being punched down in a receptacle.
 
well i believe this post started with me asking about no box in the wall,,,  lol ,,,  i am a licensed electricain  for  30 years and i guess i am just not used to the  fact that all devices  must be in a box,, now if the back of the rv receps are UL listed for this use that is cool i understand ,,,  i do have  12 wire running to them , and to use the receps that have the usb ports on them i will have to  use a box ,,  That video i saw on them was very interesting and i have to admit i have never seen them before ,,, but the again i have never worked on an  RV  before,, learn something new  all the time ,,,
 
The Carlon box I linked to earlier would be fine for installing outlets with USB ports. Another option would be to just plug multi-taps with USB ports into the existing outlets.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B01M4LSSP8
 
i am a licensed electricain  for  30 years and i guess i am just not used to the  fact that all devices  must be in a box

LOL! It's my perspective that more than a few licensed electricians have led rather sheltered lives, perhaps doing new residential construction almost exclusively.  They know residential wiring well, and what is needed to get through a local inspection, but probably have forgotten - or never seen - other methods and types of wiring.  Residential reflects only a modest part of the whole NEC, but one could have an entire career without ever dabbling in those other chapters. Even mobile home construction often gets into areas that folks accustomed to site-built rarely see.

We also see their handiwork here too often when they try to install RV shore power outlets, all too frequently mistaking the 30A/120v RV outlet for the similar-looking 220v outlet and creating some very nice spark displays.  You would think a pro would be smart enough to check when installing something unfamiliar...

In any case, use the shallow old-work box that Dutch suggested and the problem is solved.

 
I know what you mean about the sheltered life thing, but I'm quite the opposite. If you dropped me off at a bare framed house with a pile of Romex and receptacles, I wouldn't know where to begin. Drop me off at a manufacturing plant, chemical plant, etc., and I'll hit the ground runnin,' at those types of places. I used to do pretty good at the networking end of it, but technology has passed me by since riding a desk the last 9 years in an unrelated field. There are many different facets when talking about being an electrician. Unfortunately, there are many that really don't have a clue as to how electricity works, and couldn't troubleshoot anything past a blown lightbulb.
 
IMHO some here are being a bit harsh on those in the electrical field. Just like any other profession there are those that are good, mediocre, and those that really suck. Most of my family were electricians. Both my father and uncle were exterior electricians (linemen), my bother was an interior electrician and I was a Class B operator (truck driver on a line crew). We all worked out of Local 756 in Daytona Beach, FL. There are those that mainly do commercial work and those that spend the majority of their time on residential. We did highline, distribution and underground work. My father and uncle couldn't wire a house if their life depended on it. But they could shimmy up a 110 foot pole and stay up there all day. My brother could wire a house but couldn't put on a pair of hooks and climb a pole if HIS life depended on it. So maybe we shouldn't lump all into what our ideal of someone in a profession should know. Nobody is all knowing.
 
Exactly my point. I have a lot of respect for linemen. One mistake and done. I've helped build and installed poles, but leave the actual wiring to those that know what they are doing.
 
IMHO some here are being a bit harsh on those in the electrical field. Just like any other profession there are those that are good, mediocre, and those that really suck.

No doubt you are right.  I think, though, that there is a tendency to consider anyone who uses the title of "electrician" to be all-knowing in the mysteries of electricity.  The people who hire them, or quote them in forums such as this, and often of the electricians themselves, believe they have unlimited knowledge of the subject.  There is also some notion that the "electrician" has had extensive formal training and has passed some rigorous skill test, but that is generally not true.  Many states license electrical contractors, but leave the training & skills of the employees up to him and on-the-job training is the usual. The workers learn what they need to know to do their usual jobs and typically the boss or a lead tech handles any problems.  Merely working in the field of electricity does not necessarily confer knowledge of all things electrical, and often the person has little skill or knowledge outside of his usual tasks. In some areas the professional electricians are unionized and the IBEW has a formal apprentice-journeyman-master training programs, but you don't have to be trained in 120v power wiring to be a union member. You could be a burglar alarm installer or work on power transmission lines (linemen) or handle cable tv coax. They are all "electricians".  I hasten to add that this is no different than many other trades, e.g. cook/chef, plumber, auto mechanic, or RV tech.

In my experience the folks who term themselves industrial electricians have a broader knowledge of electrical matters than residential workers, but as kdbgoat says, that doesn't mean they know all there is to know about wiring houses, barns or RV.
 
It should be common sense (or since sense is not so common, uncommon sense) that when someone says they are (insert profession) that person is usually not trained in every aspect of the profession. RE: medical doctor, veterinarian, nurse, attorney, plumber (might know residential plumbing but are they proficient in backflow prevention), roofer (might know commercial roofing but not residential roofing), etc,etc.
 
When you talk about "Licensed Eelectricians"

In another thread about a converter I ask the Original poster if he was sure he wired the 120 volt side properly.. You see. I once had Central Air installed in a house. and when we went to charge the system it popped uses fast as we could install them.

Alas the licensed electreciain had hooked the BLACK (hot) Wire to the GREEN (Ground) screw.


In many other threads some RVer with as 30 amp Rig hired a processional licensed electrician to wire up his TT-30 outlet.. WRONG and blew all the electronics in the RV.

Was loking for an electrical part. Stopped into an electrical supply....  An electrician there was about to wire a TT-30 Wrong.. Thankfully he found out the proper way FIRST. (From me).
 
I certainly enjoy reading the answers the self-proclaimed electricians give. It's usually pretty easy to tell what they've done in their life.
Most of the time, I just sit back and shake my head. :D
 
My advice on this thread: LISTEN TO GARY!  Yes, I meant  to shout. You simply cannot compare RV wiring to residential wiring. A RV goes through a 2-8 hour long "earthquake" every time it moves. Houses on the other hand, rarely move. I I was born and raised in Ca for 50 years. We know how the ground moves in Ca. 

This is simply a matter of "thinking outside of the box".  RV manufactures have been using this technology for decades. Why? Because it works. Is there a better way? Maybe.  But for hundreds of thousands of RV's rolling around, this seems to be working pretty well.

If you want to upgrade your RV to steel boxes, receptacles, and housing codes, by all means go for it. If you are not that motivated, than don't lose sleep over it. Just take the RV out and enjoy the ride.
 
Marty, if you talk to the RV company bean counters, I bet you'd find that they use SCD's because they're lower cost overall than conventional residential boxes and devices. The time and labor savings alone is likely to be pretty substantial. That was the reason the manufactured housing (mobile home) folks used them right up until HUD changed the rules and they were required to meet standard residential building codes.
 
NY_Dutch said:
Marty, if you talk to the RV company bean counters, I bet you'd find that they use SCD's because they're lower cost overall than conventional residential boxes and devices. The time and labor savings alone is likely to be pretty substantial. That was the reason the manufactured housing (mobile home) folks used them right up until HUD changed the rules and they were required to meet standard residential building codes.


I know for a fact Clayton Homes still uses them. I service/work on them. If I'm troubleshooting an electrical issue in one (of the homes), I change the recep out with a real box & recep, or switch, whichever the case may be.
 
malexander said:
I know for a fact Clayton Homes still uses them. I service/work on them. If I'm troubleshooting an electrical issue in one (of the homes), I change the recep out with a real box & recep, or switch, whichever the case may be.

That's interesting, Marshall. The newer units I've seen all had conventional residential wiring and devices. I was told it was required to meet the area building codes. I don't recall the manufacturers though.
 
The newer units I've seen all had conventional residential wiring and devices. I was told it was required to meet the area building codes.

The manufactured [aka mobile] home national building codes have been substantially upgraded in the last 20 or so years, but I don't think that is part of it.  Besides,  SCD's are allowed in the NEC, which is incorporated in both the site and manufactured home codes as the residential electrical standard.  To the best of my knowledge, there is no difference in the national electrical codes for manufactured vs site built.  Or RVs, for that matter. However, some cities and most states put their own "English" on the national codes, so it's possible that change was required locally.  For example, Chicago has some unique electrical wrinkles, and South Florida has a higher wind resistance standard for both manufactured and site built homes.  If you are building for those markets, you have to meet the local code.

Most of the manufactured home code changes are for physical structure, primarily the roof, and energy efficiency (insulation, including thicker walls).  One of the side benefits of thicker exterior wall construction is that there is less motivation to use shallow outlets and that is one of the major benefits of SCDs.
 
Gary RV_Wizard said:
  However, some cities and most states put their own "English" on the national codes, so it's possible that change was required locally.  For example, Chicago has some unique electrical wrinkles, and South Florida has a higher wind resistance standard for both manufactured and site built homes. 

No SCDs in Chicago, but then there no Romex or plastic boxes. All metal conduit. This includes many of the suburbs that adopt Chicago's code.
 
Gary RV_Wizard said:
However, some cities and most states put their own "English" on the national codes, so it's possible that change was required locally.

When I got the permit to build our former mountaintop home years ago, the county code enforcement officer gave me a 100 or so page addendum to the NEC and state building codes. I don't recall if SCD's were mentioned, but at least 25 pages were related to NEC changes. All of the changes were more restrictive of course...
 
NY_Dutch said:
That's interesting, Marshall. The newer units I've seen all had conventional residential wiring and devices. I was told it was required to meet the area building codes. I don't recall the manufacturers though.


Clayton uses the SCDs, Solitaire and Fleetwood use "nail-up" boxes, Palm Harbor Homes uses the "old-work" cut-in boxes with real switches and receps. These are the ones I'm positive about. I just took a CEU for electrical contractor last month, I took my plumbing & mechanical contractor (master is some parts) in November.
 

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