Small Grand Design 5th Wheel with Ram 1500 V8 Hemi w/air bags?

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Joined
Mar 16, 2018
Posts
8
Location
Texas
Hello all, we are new here. Previously, we owned a 16 ft Starcraft TT and a 31 ft Class C Thor Freedom Elite for weekending.

My husband had just (in 2017) bought a new 2017 Ram 1500 5.7 Hemi (Lonestar edition) with tow package and an axle ratio of 3.9. We had planned on having this truck for several years until he retired from the Air Force and then upgrade to a diesel 3500 with perhaps an Arctic Fox 5th wheel with fantastic storage capacity to full time in. Well in comes Murphy, and my husband had a mini stroke (no deficits) in December with 21 years toward his retirement. He had a cardiac cath procedure to close a hole in his heart last week and is doing well. Now he has a high chance of being medically retired some time this year. So now we are trying to figure out what to do and still want to full time, but now already have a smaller truck than we planned at this point. The truck is already paid off.

We are unsure of full-timing in a TT with 2 teenage daughters, nor do we really like TT in general except for perhaps the Minnie Plus. We really like Grand Design and finally got the change to check out their 5th wheels today and were told that only the Reflection 28BH https://www.granddesignrv.com/showroom/2018/fifth-wheel/reflection/floorplans/28bh (which we really liked) is small enough for our 1500, but we would need to install air bags (quoted $800) to give the truck more leeway on towing capacity for safety.  We do not plan to be dry camping much at all since we will be new to full-timing, so we won't have the need to travel with full tanks.

Ram towing capacity: 10,300, with Air bags: around 13,000.

Reflection 28BH:  Storage capacity 2,100.
UVW: 8895 lbs
GVWR: 10995 lbs

We also looked at a Grand Design TT that was the same layout as the 5th wheel. The 2800BH with a hitch weight of 575 and total capacity GVWR 7,500.

The Winnebago Minnie Plus has a capacity of 8,800. https://winnebagoind.com/products/travel-trailer/2017/minnie-plus/specifications

We know to buy the bigger truck before you buy the 5th wheel, but now in our situation we already have this one and are trying to figure out how to use what we have and then in maybe 5 years we will upgrade. We really don't want to have to go and already trade the 1500 in for another truck, but if we have to then we will consider it. My husband's father and mother 'n law part time in an Arctic Fox 5th wheel and GMC diesel 3500, so we will be getting their advice too.
 
I am no expert at all, but on fifth wheels the pin weight is what is important. The payload capacity is going to get you way before your towing capacity on your current tow vehicle. I did a quick look at yours on line and payload capacity for your truck is a hair under 1600 pounds. It will be overloaded as soon as you hook up it. Sorry for the news, I?ve been through this myself and had to get rid of a year old truck for a bigger one. Ouch!
 
Thanks for the comment. I looked and the hitch weight for the Grand Design and it is 1545. So then the air bags are irrelevant; that is what we needed to know.
 
Looks like our options are to either get a bigger truck or go with something like the Minnie Plus or Grand Design TT.  Much to think about.
 
I pull my 2017 Reflection 28BH with a 2010 Ford F350. There is no way I would try to pull it with a half-ton truck. I haven?t weighed it loaded but intend to. Not sure where Grand Design gets that low hitch weight. Twenty percent of the weight goes on the hitch. That figures out to 2200 pounds at gross weight. I can definitely feel the trailer behind me.
 
JustKeepMoving said:
We will definely learn more about hitch weights.

You are at the right place for guidance. Best not to rely on any salesman, they have a known reputation of not being informed or not caring.  Some (most) will tell you whatever they need to for a sale.
 
I'm a big fan of Ram 1500s, and really enjoyed the ones I've owned. Air bags don't not increase towing or payload capacities, they just help handle loads better. Two things a tow vehicle must do is tow the weight and carry the weight.. As stated before, the fiver empty will overload your 1500. Know how to tell if a salesman is lying? His lips are moving. They will state the unloaded weight, tell you not to worry about the GVWR of the fiver or trailer. No one goes camping with an empty trailer. You must also subtract the weight of the passengers (you're got four), and the weight of the hitch, plus whatever else is added in/on the truck since it left the factory. You will need a bigger truck for a fiver regardless of what any salesman tells you. There should be a national law holding salesmen liable when they knowingly let a customer leave the lot with more trailer than what their truck can handle.

Ok, I'm getting hungry. Got any popcorn left Jeff?
 
All but two of the RV sales folks I have ever worked with were either totally stupid or deliberately lied about payload. They will always tell you that your tow vehicle will pull whatever you are interested in. That being said, tow rating has no bearing on a fifth wheel. Your bed payload capacity is what matters, and you don?t have enough in a 1/2 ton truck. The number of 5era that can be towed with even a 3/4 ton is small; most need a 1 ton.

Your choice of a big truck and a 5th wheel, current truck and a small-ish trailer suitable for four, or start looking at motorhomes, especially those with bunk beds. Best of luck, and thank your husband for his service.
 
Just the Facts!

First, welcome to the Forum!  Thanks for asking.

Thank you for your service and prayers for the health issues.

Towing Capacity is 10,300 lbs; 13,000 lbs. with air bags.  These numbers are notoriously optimistic.  The fine print says deduct for the weight of all options.  They only allow 2 passengers @ 150 lbs, and NO CARGO in their calculations.

Do air bags change the truck GVWR and Payload?  I seriously doubt it!!

The loaded, ready to travel FW will weigh 11,000 lbs or more.  That is a PIN WT of 2200 lbs.  You are already well above the truck payload.  Now add the weight of all passengers and cargo in the truck.  (Payload does not include any passengers).  This is an absolute non starter, especially for full timing!

The truck you need will have a yellow placard on the driver door latch pillar that states the max load it can carry.  That number MUST BE LARGER  than the total of Pin Wt ( 20% of GVWR), 200# for a FW hitch, wt of all passengers, cargo and anything else carried in the truck.

Since you plan to full time with 2 teens, you need all the space you can get!  That camper, if purchased, will be traded for a bigger one within 6 months!!

 
Hi, just to play pile on, I'll make a comment about the Ram 1500. Although the stats say a tad under 1600 for payload, I'll give you my truck's payload. I have a regular cab 2x4 Tradesman (means that is doesn't have a bunch of options). My payload is listed as 1595-it's probably one of the lightest 1500s Ram makes (meaning the highest payload). So, there you go, if your truck is a extra cab or double cab, it will lower the payload, if you have 4x4 it will lower the payload, and your Lonestar edition will lower your payload. And of course, that's not including you, your husband or your two kids.
 
  I might also suggest if you stick with the idea of a fifth wheel to check out the floor plans of some toy haulers. Ours, and many others, have bunks in the back that raise up to ceiling level when not being used, giving you a lot of nice space back there when you are grilling out, or just sit inside with the back ramp down enjoying the view. Many newer ones have an option that uses the ramp as a deck. Pretty sweet setup.
 
Sorry to burst bubbles but Air Bags DO NOT CHANGE PAYLOAD AT ALL. payload on that truck if you look at the drivers side door decal is about 1300 lbs and you should not be pulling ANY 5er with it period. The truck wasnt and isnt designed for a 5er
 
kdbgoat said:
Ok, I'm getting hungry. Got any popcorn left Jeff?
Mr. Goat.
The corn is long gone however....
Once company awakes, I'll make another batch. Goes great with western omelettes and Zing Zang if you know what I mean!
Happy St. Patrick's Day!
To the OP....I told you these guys (universal term for both genders) are good. Safety for your family and ours is top priority.
Welcome to the Forum. Keep the questions coming!
Jeff
 
Sorry about your hubby and wishing you the best.  Been active duty for 27 years AF and 3 to go and only good thing I can say is it takes Big AF months to do MEB and he is over 20 so retirement is a give me. 

Personally would not tow over 8.5K with a 1/2 ton, TT or 5r.  Your second choice is better.  End of the day, its your call and but be smart about it.  Using suspension upgrades dont necessary increase weight capacity of tow vechicle. 

Bought a 29RES HT 5r on a Sunday to tow with my '15 F150 3.5. (all numbers worked).  Monday my girlfriend bought me a '17 F250 6.7.  Reran numbers, called my camper sales lady because we didnt pick up new camper and upgraded to 344MKS Cougar. 

Bottom line is there are true HT towable 5rs.  Trailer magazine just did article on GD might wanna check out.

Be VERY selective of who you listen to on this site.  Some believe if you are over your weight, your dog will die, get HIV, oceans will evaporate and aliens will steal your camper. 

Dave
IYAAYAS
 
Presidentialsupporter said:
Sorry about your hubby and wishing you the best.  Been active duty for 27 years AF and 3 to go and only good thing I can say is it takes Big AF months to do MEB and he is over 20 so retirement is a give me. 

Personally would not tow over 8.5K with a 1/2 ton, TT or 5r.  Your second choice is better.  End of the day, its your call and but be smart about it.  Using suspension upgrades dont necessary increase weight capacity of tow vechicle. 

Bought a 29RES HT 5r on a Sunday to tow with my '15 F150 3.5. (all numbers worked).  Monday my girlfriend bought me a '17 F250 6.7.  Reran numbers, called my camper sales lady because we didnt pick up new camper and upgraded to 344MKS Cougar. 

Bottom line is there are true HT towable 5rs.  Trailer magazine just did article on GD might wanna check out.

Be VERY selective of who you listen to on this site.  Some believe if you are over your weight, your dog will die, get HIV, oceans will evaporate and aliens will steal your camper. 

Dave
IYAAYAS



I have never seen a 1/2 towable 5er they say you can but its not simple and they are playing with words - typical 5er has a pin of about 1300lbs a typical 1/2 has a cargo cap of 1300 lbs so it doable right? WRONG WRONG And  WRONG
1st nobody tows empty
2nd you forgot to add the hitch and passengers 200 for the hitch and ??? For the passengers - guess what your already over by at least 400 lbs now add 1000lbs worth of gear to the trailer now add 600lbs of water shall i keep going ?
 
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