1/2 ton towable 5th wheel

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steveblonde said:
Just wondering what your reservations are driving a 3/4 or 1 ton truck are as a daily driver? Fuel ecomony is only slightly worse than a 1/2 ton not much and the ride is really quite nice. Before you say no go test drive a couple you might be suprised. Ive driven trucks as a daily driver for years, its just now that i picked up my little escape as a daily driver because it was dirt cheap as i got a smokin deal i couldn't pass up
We have a 3/4 ton diesel truck, and it is a very comfortable vehicle. Mileage isn?t great, but it isn?t dreadful. The key to being comfortable in our truck is to lower the rear tire pressure to 60 pounds. It is still safe, but the ride is oh so much more comfortable than the 80 pounds needed for towing. The disadvantage of the truck is in urban areas. We have had parking garages we don?t fit into, and it is a bear to park in a parallel parking spot in a city. I don?t have any problems in suburban areas. That being said, we will be selling the truck (and trailer) when the motorhome is built. For a toad we have a Grand Cherokee Trailhawk that is an easy ride.
 
The F-250 we had rode very nice. Had snowplow option, so heavy springs in front, and overload springs in back too. As above, gas mileage wasn't great, but tolerable. It actually got better gas mileage than the 2001 Ram 4x4 with a 5.9 that I gave one of our sons. It has 3.55 rears. The eldest son has a same generation Ram 4x4 with oversize tires and 4.88's. Single digit MPG. Needless to say, they generally take their 2016 Ram hemi 8 speed whenever they go anywhere unless he's gonna play around in the mud a bit.
 
Here are the specs for the highest rated 2017 Ram 1500 -
5.7L Engine
A6 65RFE transmission
3.92 rear gears
15,950 GCWR
10,640 "max trailer weight"

The sheet also shows a payload capacity of 1,700 lbs.

The OP mentioned concern about stress on the engine, transmission, etc. with a fifth wheel but in reality, those stresses will all be the same as towing an equivalently weighted travel trailer. The only area of difference is the pin weight.

In my opinion, a "half ton" class truck can (and often do) handle small fifth wheel trailers safely. Aside from possibly needing to add air bags, a half ton towing a fifth wheel if probably safer than a half ton towing the same size bumper pull trailer.
 
We have a F250 Super Duty with V10 to tow our fiver does a good job. However I do not use for a daily driver because it is just to big for the parking spaces and getting into parking garages. The ride is not the problem for me rides great with the lower non towing tire pressure just to big to park and also for some drive trues.
 
For those who say the 3/4 and 1 ton pick up are "just a little more", your definition of "little" differs from mine. In general the cost factor to step up one grade is about $3000.00. If you add a diesel engine tack on another $10,000.00. That number comes from the local car dealer when I asked him about trading up from my F-150.

Now take your new upgraded truck to the dealer for oil changes, tires, shocks or any service work. LTs vs. P tires, more oil, just about more heavy duty everything.

Next add to that the wife already thinks your F-150 rides like an old stage coach and thinks she needs deck hands to cast off the mooring ropes every time she backs out of the driveway or the Wal-Mart parking lot and you begin to understand some of the issues with the F-150 that turns our two car garage into a one car garage, unless you want to exit out the passenger side. 

There is absolutely no doubt that you need big to pull big and fortunately my wife thinks our 25 ft. trailer is just the right size. However upgrading to a larger truck is more than "a little more expensive".  You pay for the increase power and convenience, there is no free lunch.   
 
I agree with RGP. My reservations about getting a 3/4 or 1 ton is the regular maintainance and added cost of everything heavy duty. We plan on one good 3 or 4 month road trip then mostly sticking around the northeast . The added capacity of the heavy truck would be lost in the normal driving that it would be subject to most of the time. Truth be known, I've been driving my Ford Ranger for 237000 miles now and really prefer the smaller trucks.
I spent 10 years working the oil fields in the northern Rockies and have a good number of miles under my belt in 1 tons and 3/4tons and a few 1/2 tons thrown in. 1 ton trucks do ride pretty well and the fuel mileage isn't terrible . 
I was hoping to hear from some folks that have actually pulled a fifth wheel for some substantial miles to get are real world perspective on how the truck handled the truck ruts, the steep grades both up and down , does the tranny cooler keep up with the added load , did you seem to go through rear axle bearings etc. So far there has been some great feedback but mostly just opinions.
I can't seem to make the load numbers work in favor of the 1/2 ton . I've really been on the fence on this.We fell in love with the Dutchman and would really like to go that way but don't want a 5000 mile white knuckle stress bomb.
 
rcwitt said:
I agree with RGP. My reservations about getting a 3/4 or 1 ton is the regular maintainance and added cost of everything heavy duty. We plan on one good 3 or 4 month road trip then mostly sticking around the northeast . The added capacity of the heavy truck would be lost in the normal driving that it would be subject to most of the time. Truth be known, I've been driving my Ford Ranger for 237000 miles now and really prefer the smaller trucks.
I spent 10 years working the oil fields in the northern Rockies and have a good number of miles under my belt in 1 tons and 3/4tons and a few 1/2 tons thrown in. 1 ton trucks do ride pretty well and the fuel mileage isn't terrible . 
I was hoping to hear from some folks that have actually pulled a fifth wheel for some substantial miles to get are real world perspective on how the truck handled the truck ruts, the steep grades both up and down , does the tranny cooler keep up with the added load , did you seem to go through rear axle bearings etc. So far there has been some great feedback but mostly just opinions.
I can't seem to make the load numbers work in favor of the 1/2 ton . I've really been on the fence on this.We fell in love with the Dutchman and would really like to go that way but don't want a 5000 mile white knuckle stress bomb.

i live  in Alberta and owned trucks from the time i was 18 im now 55 my ex wife drove a 1/2 ton and my fiance drives my dually and 40 ft 5er ive owned trailers all my life and my dad build Scamper and Skipper in the 70,s and we do about 15000 kms a year towing

how may i help you please be specific im not that smart lol
 
rcwitt said:
So far there has been some great feedback but mostly just opinions.
I can't seem to make the load numbers work in favor of the 1/2 ton .

That's why you haven't gotten the answers you were hoping for... there is not a large percentage of FW owners that are using 1/2 tons, and for legitimate mathematical reasons as you have read (and calculated yourself).
 
The FACTS are that a small 6500 dry wt FW will weigh 8,000 lbs loaded to camp.  That's 1600 lbs pin wt.  Now add 200 lb FW hitch, a couple 150 lb passengers and 100 lbs of other cargo, and you need 2200 lbs of Payload to haul it.  VERY FEW ? ton pickups have a payload anywhere near that number.

Now, the salesman will use that 6500 lb dry wt, and 1200 lb pin wt, ignore the weight of the hitch, passengers or other cargo, and lie and say you have plenty of truck with a 1600 lb payload.
 
The trailer salesperson says no problem towing it with a 1/2 ton truck.
  What the sales person should have said there are 1/2 ton truck out here that can safely tow a 8800 gvwr 5th wheel trailer. Not all 1/2 ton trucks have the same GVWR or rawr specs.

Of course the new or used F150HD comes with a 7850-8200 gvwr depending on year models. More importantly it come with a 4800 rawr which is good for up to around 2300-2500 lbs in the bed depending on selections. You can get the 3.5 EB v6 engine or the very stout 5.0 v8 engine.

The '00 to '06 GM 1500HD 8600 gvwr with 6000 rawr 6.0 engine/4L80e tranny 4.10 gears good for 3k lb plus payloads .

Mid '00 1500 Dodge Mega Cabs with 8510 gvwr and 6000 rwar  very good 5.7 hemi  3.92 gears.

1/2 ton GM trucks with the NHT max tow package has a 7600 gvwr and 4300 rawr can have 2k plus payloads with 3.73 gears 8 or 10 speed trannies 6.2 engine at 420 hp and 460 torque.
So sure there are some 1/2 ton trucks can safely pull a 8800 gvwr 5th wheel trailer and safely carry its pin weight.
Will yours and other std duty 1/2 ton truck safely tow a 8800  lb 5th wheel trailer....no.

WE have 5th wheel trailer out here that safely fits your 1/2 ton truck  tow and load carrying specs......but they are small.
 
If the math doesn't work for THAT trailer, find another trailer where the math works.

I have been going through this exercise for the past couple of years.
I just bought a 2016 F150 with 3.5 Ecoboost that is rated to tow 10,600 on the receiver and GCWR of 15,600. My GVWR is 6,900. Payload is 2,078 pounds. This is NOT the max towing package.

If I towed that 8,000 pound 5er I have 50 pounds to spare, and that include passengers, cargo and the trailer hitch. That is payload, no where near my towing capacity. I could still tow my 2,300 boat (full tank of gas) behind the 5er, and the hole package leaves me 50 pounds to spare on the GCWR.
The most important real number you need to know is the weight of your truck with a full tank of gas and you in it. Published truck weights may or may not include options and/or factor in a driver (150 pounds).

My actual truck weight with me, full tank of gas, and my two Shih-Tzu's is 4,800 pounds (curb weight).

There is a 5er out there your truck CAN pull. Happy hunting. My challenge isn't weight, it's length.

 
Hanr3 said:
If the math doesn't work for THAT trailer, find another trailer where the math works.

I have been going through this exercise for the past couple of years.
I just bought a 2016 F150 with 3.5 Ecoboost that is rated to tow 10,600 on the receiver and GCWR of 15,600. My GVWR is 6,900. Payload is 2,078 pounds. This is NOT the max towing package.

If I towed that 8,000 pound 5er I have 50 pounds to spare, and that include passengers, cargo and the trailer hitch. That is payload, no where near my towing capacity. I could still tow my 2,300 boat (full tank of gas) behind the 5er, and the hole package leaves me 50 pounds to spare on the GCWR.
The most important real number you need to know is the weight of your truck with a full tank of gas and you in it. Published truck weights may or may not include options and/or factor in a driver (150 pounds).

My actual truck weight with me, full tank of gas, and my two Shih-Tzu's is 4,800 pounds (curb weight).

There is a 5er out there your truck CAN pull. Happy hunting. My challenge isn't weight, it's length.


an 8000 lbs 5er at 20% pin is 1600lbs - plus 200 for the hitch is 1800lbs so your saying you, plus passengers, and cargo  are less than 228 lbs you said your pay is 2078  in total  WOW my 3 dogs weight more than that 228lbs lol (3 boxers at 80lbs ea) !!!!!! throw in a tonneau cover 50lbs wood 100lbs spare tire 60 lbs tools 40lbs tool box 40lbs

repectfully Hanr3 you need to redo your thinking you cannot pull an 8000lbs 5er plus a 2300lbs boat behind that little 150 sorry thats 10300lbs and i will bet that your cargo cap with that load is way over your 2078
 
You guys come on here and post all this cargo and pets and people you take camping with you and then say we can't use this vehicle or that vehicle to tow our RV's. I can only tell you our experience. We don't take a lot heavy stuff with us. The only time we take firewood is if we are camping local because we aren't allowed to move wood from state to state. We don't take 150 pounds in dogs (don't take dogs at all). We don't travel with full tanks of water. Everyone packs differently. I've heard folks on here ask why someone would buy a trailer with x weight capacity and not use it all. Because that is the trailer we like and we don't carry as much stuff as you do. I am looking at purchasing a new TT. I look at the dry weight and the fully loaded weight and the floor plan. They are all important to me. Some will say to disregard the dry weight. I don't. I use that as a starting point. And I am not going to run down to the scales every time I go camping. Not going to happen. I know what my truck can safely tow and I can estimate how much my stuff weighs.
 
Oldgator73 said:
You guys come on here and post all this cargo and pets and people you take camping with you and then say we can't use this vehicle or that vehicle to tow our RV's. I can only tell you our experience. We don't take a lot heavy stuff with us. The only time we take firewood is if we are camping local because we aren't allowed to move wood from state to state. We don't take 150 pounds in dogs (don't take dogs at all). We don't travel with full tanks of water. Everyone packs differently. I've heard folks on here ask why someone would buy a trailer with x weight capacity and not use it all. Because that is the trailer we like and we don't carry as much stuff as you do. I am looking at purchasing a new TT. I look at the dry weight and the fully loaded weight and the floor plan. They are all important to me. Some will say to disregard the dry weight. I don't. I use that as a starting point. And I am not going to run down to the scales every time I go camping. Not going to happen. I know what my truck can safely tow and I can estimate how much my stuff weighs.



Agreed in part my trailer weights 16800 lbs - 17200 lbs when loaded with 100 gall of water 30 gall of fuel and enough food and booze and gear for 3 weeks my truck is always loaded with wood thats kiln dried and cut to 16 inch lengths of 2x4s ( i get free long story ) and my dogs go everywhere with me Jack Daniel and Penny 80lbs each ive scaled my trailer 3 times in 3 years with 3 diff trucks mostly just for laughs as the scale is free and usaully enroute to somewhere

Ive never looked at empty weights cause i dont pull empty and im not worried about full weights because i have enough truck to pull whatever im going to pull - if your that concerned with the weights then chances are your too close to the trucks limits and youve just taken all the fun out of your adventure - PERIOD.

 
If I cannot take the stuff I want, like my dog, camp gear, screened bug house etc, or I cannot use my TT to haul the water, food and other items it was designed to hold; I may as well go back to my canoe and tent camping days.

I bought my TT so I can use all it features; it is my obligation to supply the tow vehicle that will do the job, or pay for the increased wear and tear.

What annoying is the Salesperson who misleads the customer.
 
RGP said:
If I cannot take the stuff I want, like my dog, camp gear, screened bug house etc, or I cannot use my TT to haul the water, food and other items it was designed to hold; I may as well go back to my canoe and tent camping days.

I bought my TT so I can use all it features; it is my obligation to supply the tow vehicle that will do the job, or pay for the increased wear and tear.

What annoying is the Salesperson who misleads the customer.

Good for you. But if you would have comprehended my post you would understand I was saying it does not matter what you do. As long as you are happy with your trailer and tow vehicle and I am happy with mine, that is all that matters. We don't use the toilet and shower when at a place where we can use theirs. That's just us. I've gotten snarky comments when I've posted this in the past. The only time I care about what others are doing is if I think it's a great idea that I can use. And by the way, we also take the stuff we want. If I forget something we either do without or find a store and buy it.
 
grashley said:
The FACTS are that a small 6500 dry wt FW will weigh 8,000 lbs loaded to camp.  That's 1600 lbs pin wt.  Now add 200 lb FW hitch, a couple 150 lb passengers and 100 lbs of other cargo, and you need 2200 lbs of Payload to haul it.  VERY FEW ? ton pickups have a payload anywhere near that number.

Now, the salesman will use that 6500 lb dry wt, and 1200 lb pin wt, ignore the weight of the hitch, passengers or other cargo, and lie and say you have plenty of truck with a 1600 lb payload.

A F-150 with the HDPP (Heavy Duty Pay Package) have the payload of approximately 2400lbs plus in Crew Cab 4x4 XLT, LB configuration.
 
currinh said:
You might consider an Escape 5.0TA. It has an empty weight 3885lb and a GVWR of 5500lb. Don't know if your pickup can handle it or not, don't know enough to say. But it is a nice, small, light 5W. It's a lot smaller than what you think of when you say 5W, but it's a lot lighter also.

We have a 19' trailer from them and are quite pleased.

FYI

I've seen a few 5th wheels like this...even smaller and look to be half ton towable....but the few I've noticed over the years look to be older.  It seems that there was a period of time a while back when perhaps they were more popular.

I think that when most people nowadays picture a 5th wheel, they imagine these monsters that are bigger than my first house was...hence a lot of these answers here.

Even still, if it were me towing even a moderately sized TT very much that was 'technically' within the capacity of a half ton, even a bumper pull, I'd probably go for a 3/4 ton or more.... Assuming even these smaller TT's push the upper range.  I've towed a big goose neck that were on the upper range of an F-250, then pulled it with a dully 1-ton.  Hands down a better and safer experience.
 
Wood said:
A F-150 with the HDPP (Heavy Duty Pay Package) have the payload of approximately 2400lbs plus in Crew Cab 4x4 XLT, LB configuration.
is it possible YES ABSOLUTLEY but try to find one and its only an XLT the more options you pile on the truck the lower the payload,add a tonneau cover thepay drops 50lbs add a tooldbox the pay drops add leather heated seats the pay drops rear defrost the pay drops etc etc  most dealers wont order one like that because they dont make any money off them but is it possible yes  without a doubt but the last F150 i looked at at a dealership in the showroom has a payload of 1300lbs which is funny because at the car show last weekend in the Ford booth they had 2 F150s both had payloads pn about that same number 1300lbs
 
I haven't yet seen anything in this discussion that is fundamentally at at odds. Yes, there are a few half-ton truck configurations that can tow a modest sized 5W or one lightly loaded. If you make all the right choices, it works.  But you can never assume it works just because a brochure (truck or trailer) or salesman says so.
 
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