Hi All, first time posting on this forum so thanks in advance for the feedback. My family of five have been camping in a pop-up for the last few years and looking to upgrade. I have a 2016 Suburban with the Max Trailering Package...maximum haul of 8000 lbs, brake controller, etc. I?m looking at a Jayco Whitehawk 24MBH which is 29 feet and has a dry weight of 5600 lbs. I know that even fully loaded I?ll be below the 8000, but not by a lot and I?m concerned about the safety of hauling something this big. I live in VA so a lot of the camping we do is in the mountains. Anyone have thoughts on this or similar experience with a Suburban and similar sized TT?
Towing w/ Chevy Suburban
- Thread starter cbarkson
- Start date
The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an RV or an interest in RVing!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
Oldgator73
Well-known member
What is the GVWR for the TT? How many people will be in the Suburban and how much stuff will you pack? With a 5600lb UVW your ?stuff? margined is about 1600lbs. That?s using a 20% safety margin for your max tow rating for truck. The tongue weight for 7200lbs is about 865 #. If you are close to your max then you could very well be too heavy since you want to have a buffer for safety purposes. Remember, just because it will pull it does not mean you should. Will it go down the flat road with no trucks passing you and no deer darting out from the bushes? Will your truck be able to stop 7200lbs pushing you, on a 6% grade?
Nomadb1
Well-known member
Don't do it man! :-[ Read some of the weight police' posts on figuring out loading/ tongue weight. I can tell you from my experience with the Yukon and my 4300#(Scaled) trailer I would not dare pull anything much heavier with the 5.3l. especially in mountains. I go up the passes here around 3000 rpm @35mph tops. If I push too hard the oil heats up, pressure drops off and I sit till everything cools down. In addition my family of 5 and 2 scrappy dogs adds quite a bit of cargo weight to the truck when added to the 880# of trailer tongue weight puts me over the limit of the rear axle's capacity - all of which can be found on the door post of the truck. There's a lot more that plays into what you can pull then just "I can tow X# and the trailer weighs Y" Sure you can push the limits but when your 2 week trip starts with something important busted - or worse - it can make for a sucky vacation - or even just showing up at your mountain get away stressed after being passed by 50 Semi's honking at you. I would suggest a smaller lighter trailer or a more capable tow rig.
Gods Country
Well-known member
What you are not considering (and many do not) is you are carrying about 12% of the trailers loaded weight, plus all five passengers, and all cargo in the vehicle (hitch, tools, dealer added options, etc). You need to check your vehicles payload capacity. On a 2017 it should be a yellow sticker on the drivers side door. Exceeding that weight makes the towing capacity irrelevant. IMO approaching 85% or more of that capacity is likely going to make for an uncomfortable experience. I'm willing to bet the the trailer will be at least 7,000# loaded. So that's at least 840# off your payload without any additional weight.
My guess is you will be over, but you need to check for yourself.
My guess is you will be over, but you need to check for yourself.
Gods Country
Well-known member
Your tongue weight may be 10%. But it's likely more. That is a minimum tongue weight required for safe towing, so naturally the trailer brochures post everything at 10%. When you load your trailer it will be higher than 10%.
12% is a safer margin of error when calculating which trailer to purchase without knowing precisely the tongue weight of your particular trailer loaded to your liking. It could be higher, or lower. 12% is down the middle.
12% is a safer margin of error when calculating which trailer to purchase without knowing precisely the tongue weight of your particular trailer loaded to your liking. It could be higher, or lower. 12% is down the middle.
Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
All good advice above. A base Suburban can move 8000 lbs, but factory options typically reduce that a bit, and so does the weight of passengers and gear carried in the Suburban. And then there is the Burb's payload (cargo capacity to consider. Read what the sticker on the door frame says for max cargo load and then deduct for passengers the big WD hitch you will need, and the trailer tongue weight (10-15% of the loaded trailer weight). I suspect you are going to come up short or right on the hairy edge.
That 700 lb tongue weight is just a wild-ass guess for the brochure. It needs to be at least 10% of the loaded trailer weight, so at a full 7200 lbs the tongue weight will be 720 or more. More is better, cause the trailer is more stable (less tendency to sway).
Even if the numbers above work out, the performance and handling may be less than satisfying. A Suburban is a very capable vehicle, but still has it limits. It may handle the load with out breaking, but that is no guarantee you and the family will enjoy driving with it.
Do the weight arithmetic and don't cheat yourself and your family.
That 700 lb tongue weight is just a wild-ass guess for the brochure. It needs to be at least 10% of the loaded trailer weight, so at a full 7200 lbs the tongue weight will be 720 or more. More is better, cause the trailer is more stable (less tendency to sway).
Even if the numbers above work out, the performance and handling may be less than satisfying. A Suburban is a very capable vehicle, but still has it limits. It may handle the load with out breaking, but that is no guarantee you and the family will enjoy driving with it.
Do the weight arithmetic and don't cheat yourself and your family.
grashley
Well-known member
There are a few different weights that must be met for safe towing.
GCWR is the combined weight of the 'Burb, TT, and everything in them. If you cross a scale with all passengers and cargo, the total must not exceed GCWR.
GVWR for the TT and TT, separately. The fully loaded 'Burb including all passengers, cargo, WD hitch and TT tongue wt must not exceed the Payload per the Yellow Placard. The weight of the empty truck plus the Yellow placard payload should equal the truck GVWR. The weight of the TT, not hitched to the truck must not exceed the TT GVWR. NOTE: These two weights may exceed the truck GCWR because the TT hitch weight is included in both weights, thus included twice.
One other way to do the calculation is to start with the Max Tow rating, which is for a base model truck with few options, two 150# passengers and a full fuel tank. From the Max Tow, subtract the weight of all passengers in excess of 300#, the weight of all cargo and anything else in the truck, and the weight of the WD hitch. That is the REAL Max Tow for your truck.
That TT will likely exceed every one of these numbers once you are packed, ready to travel. And this leaves no safety factor, either. CAN it be done? Yes. People do it every weekend. SHOULD you do it? I certainly would not put MY family at risk in that type of situation!
GCWR is the combined weight of the 'Burb, TT, and everything in them. If you cross a scale with all passengers and cargo, the total must not exceed GCWR.
GVWR for the TT and TT, separately. The fully loaded 'Burb including all passengers, cargo, WD hitch and TT tongue wt must not exceed the Payload per the Yellow Placard. The weight of the empty truck plus the Yellow placard payload should equal the truck GVWR. The weight of the TT, not hitched to the truck must not exceed the TT GVWR. NOTE: These two weights may exceed the truck GCWR because the TT hitch weight is included in both weights, thus included twice.
One other way to do the calculation is to start with the Max Tow rating, which is for a base model truck with few options, two 150# passengers and a full fuel tank. From the Max Tow, subtract the weight of all passengers in excess of 300#, the weight of all cargo and anything else in the truck, and the weight of the WD hitch. That is the REAL Max Tow for your truck.
That TT will likely exceed every one of these numbers once you are packed, ready to travel. And this leaves no safety factor, either. CAN it be done? Yes. People do it every weekend. SHOULD you do it? I certainly would not put MY family at risk in that type of situation!
Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
Struggling over the mountains is an engine & tranny question, not the weight capacity of the truck or SUV. You can get a pick-up configured to carry a lot of weight and with a large or small engine and a rear axle geared for power or fuel economy.
For the size trailers you are talking about, an F150/1500 configured for weight carrying and towing should be plenty sufficient. However, you have to look beyyond the simple model designation and see what the combination of body, suspension, engine, rear axle etc yields for cargo carrying (payload) and tow rating. The range is quire broad.
For the size trailers you are talking about, an F150/1500 configured for weight carrying and towing should be plenty sufficient. However, you have to look beyyond the simple model designation and see what the combination of body, suspension, engine, rear axle etc yields for cargo carrying (payload) and tow rating. The range is quire broad.
grashley
Well-known member
My suggestion is this. Add together the weight of all the passengers you would expect to be in the truck, all of the "stuff" they require to travel (car seats, I Pads, snacks, etc.), all cargo, tools, firewood and toys carried in the bed, 80# for a WD hitch and 12% of the proposed trailer GVWR as best estimate of hitch wt. This is the weight you expect the truck to carry, so you need a payload to meet or exceed this number.
When you go truck shopping, the FIRST thing you do is open the driver door and look at the yellow placard on the latch post. If the "Max weight of passengers and cargo" is not larger than the payload you need, close the door and keep looking!
Payload is simply the truck GVWR minus the weight of the empty truck. A truck with options to beef up the suspension and tires will increase the GVWR and thus Payload. Options which increase the weight of the truck, like a bigger cab and higher trim level, will reduce Payload. I am more familiar with Ford options, but their Max Payload package would be a mandatory option on a F150 to get the payload you want. Finding a truck on the lot with that option may be tough, but do not let any salesman talk you out of what you know you need!!!!!
When you go truck shopping, the FIRST thing you do is open the driver door and look at the yellow placard on the latch post. If the "Max weight of passengers and cargo" is not larger than the payload you need, close the door and keep looking!
Payload is simply the truck GVWR minus the weight of the empty truck. A truck with options to beef up the suspension and tires will increase the GVWR and thus Payload. Options which increase the weight of the truck, like a bigger cab and higher trim level, will reduce Payload. I am more familiar with Ford options, but their Max Payload package would be a mandatory option on a F150 to get the payload you want. Finding a truck on the lot with that option may be tough, but do not let any salesman talk you out of what you know you need!!!!!
scottydl
Site Team
I tow our 32' trailer (35' with the tongue) with a Suburban, but it's a 3/4 ton (rare) that has towing capacities considerably beefier than the standard off-the-lot 1/2 ton version.
Aside from the pulling capacity and payload, an additional aspect of towing a long travel trailer is the effect of winds and passing traffic, usually semi trucks. These trailers are like giant sails, and on a windy day they'll blow you all over the road (think "tail wagging the dog") if your tow vehicle is not capable enough to handle the sway. That's where you'd experience the white-knuckle driving.
Along with the biggest-available engine and transmission on my Burb, it also has heavy duty suspension and brakes to help out. And I have supplement air bags installed on the rear, to assist more with leveling, ride quality, and mitigate side-to-side impact. Pickup trucks are the same, when it comes to 3/4 ton over 1/2 ton. I don't know that you automatically need a 3/4 ton for a 29' trailer, but the mountain towing is the extra factor here.
Aside from the pulling capacity and payload, an additional aspect of towing a long travel trailer is the effect of winds and passing traffic, usually semi trucks. These trailers are like giant sails, and on a windy day they'll blow you all over the road (think "tail wagging the dog") if your tow vehicle is not capable enough to handle the sway. That's where you'd experience the white-knuckle driving.
Along with the biggest-available engine and transmission on my Burb, it also has heavy duty suspension and brakes to help out. And I have supplement air bags installed on the rear, to assist more with leveling, ride quality, and mitigate side-to-side impact. Pickup trucks are the same, when it comes to 3/4 ton over 1/2 ton. I don't know that you automatically need a 3/4 ton for a 29' trailer, but the mountain towing is the extra factor here.
