Is VanLife Ruining Camping?

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We need more places like Slab City. A place for those that want to live an alternative life style. The permanent residents have figured out ways to live with no on site services and they are not a burden to society.  We've spent time there associating with other snow birds and the permanent residents and would return if not for the meth makers and dealers that have taken over.

Richard
 
rls7201 said:
We need more places like Slab City. A place for those that want to live an alternative life style. The permanent residents have figured out ways to live with no on site services and they are not a burden to society.  We've spent time there associating with other snow birds and the permanent residents and would return if not for the meth makers and dealers that have taken over.

Richard
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The problem is what you said in your last sentence. The drug addicts and dealers seem to take over any spot that is identified as good for alternative lifestyles or just folks down on their luck.
 
UTTransplant said:
The problem is what you said in your last sentence. The drug addicts and dealers seem to take over any spot that is identified as good for alternative lifestyles or just folks down on their luck.
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It?s going to get worse before it gets better. and it will become increasingly difficult to get away from these groups. I think the further one gets from services (stores, water, fuel, Walmart, etc) the more likely one will still be able to get away from it all and take advantage of our public lands. The UK has been dealing with gypsy caravaners for some time.
 
Oldgator73 said:
I know RA collects fees for cancellations and changes. I do not have a problem with the cancellation fee. I have a problem with paying the change fee. As far as any fees being returned to the park or not, I don?t care. I realize there is a few minutes work involved with changing a reservation. My contention is neither the park nor RA are LOSING any money when a change vs a cancellation is processed. I fat fingered the sentence about commissions and piece work. Meant to say RA was not paid on commission or piece work. Now, having said all that, I have shown up at a park and asked to move sites and the change was granted at no cost to me.
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RA doesn't lose any money on a cancellation since they don't refund the original reservation fee. A site change on RA's system is handled as a cancellation of the original site plus a re-book of the new site, but they still only collect the change fee. I understand you don't like the change fee, but there is an expense incurred on RA's part to process the change. That a park system is willing to make in person changes at no cost to you is irrelevant, since RA does not process that change and incurs no extra costs.

I'm starting to feel like we're beating a dead horse here, so I'm bowing out now...
 
NY_Dutch said:
RA doesn't lose any money on a cancellation since they don't refund the original reservation fee. A site change on RA's system is handled as a cancellation of the original site plus a re-book of the new site, but they still only collect the change fee. I understand you don't like the change fee, but there is an expense incurred on RA's part to process the change. That a park system is willing to make in person changes at no cost to you is irrelevant, since RA does not process that change and incurs no extra costs.

I'm starting to feel like we're beating a dead horse here, so I'm bowing out now...
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Bye Felecia!
 
rls7201 said:
We need more places like Slab City. A place for those that want to live an alternative life style. The permanent residents have figured out ways to live with no on site services and they are not a burden to society.  We've spent time there associating with other snow birds and the permanent residents and would return if not for the meth makers and dealers that have taken over.
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Having been to Slab City just a few months ago I will say that I saw no evidence of drug manufacturing at all. Drug use is another thing. Do you have any evidence, police reports etc., to support your allegations? It's easy to marginalize people.
RichH

Richard
 
Sun2Retire said:
It?s going to get worse before it gets better. and it will become increasingly difficult to get away from these groups. I think the further one gets from services (stores, water, fuel, Walmart, etc) the more likely one will still be able to get away from it all and take advantage of our public lands. The UK has been dealing with gypsy caravaners for some time.
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Part of the problem is that we are running out of "away from it all"  The US population has went up by nearly 1/3 since 1980, and almost doubled since 1960.  Sure a lot of that has been growth in the major cities, but even in so called fly over country the population has grown tremendously.  Wyoming our least populous state for example has went from 290,000 in 1950 to 568,000 in 2010.  (and estimated to be 573,000 in 2018)
 
Not sure if the article is talking about people who live in a Van out of desperation or people who are living in Vans as an alternative life style.  Regardless, I don't see either as a problem or threat to our ability to enjoy the lifestyle.  From my perspective, it's more likely we'll see an end of life event caused by another Yellowstone explosion (we're overdue you know), than running out of space to park the RV.  Seriously if you think we're running out of space, come out West.  Wyoming was mentioned as an area with a rapidly growing population.  Wyoming has about 6 people per square mile.  By comparison, California has about 244 people per square mile.  Now the City of Los Angeles has more than 7700 people per square mile.  So finding a spot in the City of Los Angeles is a bit harder than the rest of the state which has 163,000 square miles.  Seriously there's so much land out here it's hard to understand why anyone would think RVing is going to suffer because a few folks are traveling in Sprinter Vans. 
 
Gary my point about "the away from it all", is proportionately just how much more crowded those western states are now than they were just 20 or 30 years ago.  Not that Wyoming should be confused with any of the 26 or so cities in the US with a higher population than the state of Wyoming. Go just about anywhere in the south or western US and see towns that had a gas station and couple of motels 20 or 30 years ago that now have a Wal-Mart super center, a dozen motels, and the highway department is starting to build a bypass loop.
 
The urbanization of America. It has been happening for decades. According to the 2010 census 80.7% of the U.S. is considered urban. Broken down by region:
Northeast-85%
Midwest-75.9%
South-75.8%
West-89.8%
Washington DC is the most urban at 100% while Vermont is the least with 38.9%. Someone mentioned Wyoming which sits at 64.8%.
I?m happy when we go camping and the neighbors are 50 or so feet away on either side.
 
The article mentioned Sedona.  Others mentioned affordable housing.  I drive an hour to get to work.  Others can drive if need be.  Squatting on recreational public use land isn't right.  Although I haven't seen it first hand I imagine a large contingent of vans will have some who are not dumping waste (black, gray, trash) properly.  Recreational users have trouble finding available space or they see space that starts to look like a run down, blighted shanty town.  That's not what our public lands are for. 
 
Isaac, don't disagree.  The California population has almost doubled since I move here in the mid-1970's.  But my guess is 90 - 95% of the growth is in the three main population areas, Los Angeles, the San Francisco Bay and San Diego.  And RVing in those areas can be challenging and pricey.  But once you're outside those densely populated areas, it can be pretty nice and there's a lot of low cost camping.  Example, BLM campground off CA 395 near Lone Pine, no hookups but toilets, running water and a dump station.  Cost $5.00 a day.  The geezer rate $2.50.  And we've never been unable to find a spot.  Of course, we don't do much camping during the summer.  To many vacationers. 
 
garyb1st said:
Squatters?  Having a hard time getting there.  This is Public Land and by definition it's use and enjoyment is for all.
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but by definition, isn't it for the use by all for the purposes of recreation, education, and for preserving natural environments?  It's not set aside so that I can go build a house there....
 
blw2 said:
but by definition, isn't it for the use by all for the purposes of recreation, education, and for preserving natural environments?  It's not set aside so that I can go build a house there....
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Who is building that house? Do you have any questions that you would like to add to the new application for camping on Federal land? Should there be an income test? How about a permanent address? Wait, that might eliminate full timers. Would age requirements be a good standard? All silly, right? How about all citizens get to access their public lands without judgement, complaints or being accused of things only assumed to be happening like dumping tanks illegally? The straw men are very busy in this thread.
RichH
 
Settled peoples generally hate and fear nomadic peoples. This goes way back, to the days of the Scythians and such.
 
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