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If I am being held at gunpoint, the last thing I want is some yahoo with a gun coming to "rescue" my wallet. He's more likely to get me killed than "save" me. 

For some people having a gun is like a kid with their teddy bear, it makes them feel safer. That's fine. But the evidence is that the person who wins a gun fight is usually the one who finds good cover, not the one who is the better shot.  Instead of imagining yourself shooting at someone who is threatening you, imagine yourself taking fire from someone who sees you as a threat. 

That assumes they really ARE a threat. On TV, the music tells you who is the good guy and the good guy usually wins. In real life, the difference between a good guy with a gun and a a bad guy with a gun is not so obvious and the bad guy usually has the advantage since he doesn't care. The result is that the good guy rarely wins.
 
Matching response to the threat is the most important and some people do not have that capability. They might let things escalate to a point where someone gets killed.
For example I have a firearm but I also have Bear Spray and WASP killer. My response will be in tune with the threat. The Bear Spray and Wasp killer are with us whenever we are out of the rig.  I will not shoot someone or Bear Spray them in the middle of the night should they be stealing lets say a camp chair. Let them have it. Some people would shoot. If you are trying to break in the threat gets escalated and if I have time I will discharge the Bear Spray otherwise I will protect myself with more force.
 
RossWilliams said:
If I am being held at gunpoint, the last thing I want is some yahoo with a gun coming to "rescue" my wallet. He's more likely to get me killed than "save" me. 

For some people having a gun is like a kid with their teddy bear, it makes them feel safer. That's fine. But the evidence is that the person who wins a gun fight is usually the one who finds good cover, not the one who is the better shot.  Instead of imagining yourself shooting at someone who is threatening you, imagine yourself taking fire from someone who sees you as a threat. 

That assumes they really ARE a threat. On TV, the music tells you who is the good guy and the good guy usually wins. In real life, the difference between a good guy with a gun and a a bad guy with a gun is not so obvious and the bad guy usually has the advantage since he doesn't care. The result is that the good guy rarely wins.
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There is absolutely no truth in that highlighted statement you made.  It happens quite frequently, it just doesn't get or make the headlines.  There are reasons for those stories NOT making the news, but I'm not going there as I will not be the one that turns this discussion into a political football.
 
". . . imagine yourself taking fire from someone who sees you as a threat."  --Sad to say the number of us who do not have to "imagine" that is growing rapidly.
 
darsben said:
Matching response to the threat is the most important and some people do not have that capability. They might let things escalate to a point where someone gets killed.
For example I have a firearm but I also have Bear Spray and WASP killer. My response will be in tune with the threat. The Bear Spray and Wasp killer are with us whenever we are out of the rig.  I will not shoot someone or Bear Spray them in the middle of the night should they be stealing lets say a camp chair. Let them have it. Some people would shoot. If you are trying to break in the threat gets escalated and if I have time I will discharge the Bear Spray otherwise I will protect myself with more force.
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Owning and carrying a weapon brings an incredible amount of responsibility to the table.  Every permit class tries to emphasize that.  A weapon should NEVER be drawn unless there is an immenent threat to your life or the life of your loved ones....or the threat of severe bodily injury.  Someone stealing your property outside your house/camper/barn/whatever DOES NOT fulfill the justification for using a weapon. 
 
xrated said:
Owning and carrying a weapon brings an incredible amount of responsibility to the table.  Every permit class tries to emphasize that.  A weapon should NEVER be drawn unless there is an immenent threat to your life or the life of your loved ones....or the threat of severe bodily injury.  Someone stealing your property outside your house/camper/barn/whatever DOES NOT fulfill the justification for using a weapon.
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By let themm have it I meant let them take the stuff. Hope no one misunderstood
 
My family has never owned guns.  Still, I have thought of buying one from time to time.  The last time I read an article written by an expert.  Didn't save the article but it opened my eyes to a number of things. 

Number one is the actual act of shooting someone.  According to the author, it's not the same as going to the range and shooting a target.  It's not even close.  And in some cases, even if you hit the perp, he may not go down.  And if he doesn't, and keeps coming, he may take your gun, assuming he isn't armed himself, and shoot you. 

Number two is the choice of weapon.  Not all guns will get the job done.  The caliber of the weapon will be one of the deciding factors.  Don't fully appreciate that but recall it had to do with control of the weapon.  Apparently some have quite a kick. 

I'm not against gun ownership.  It's a personal decision and hope we always have the right.  I just hope that those who do own a weapon, but do not have law enforcement, military or related background, do not think owning a weapon for target practice or hunting qualifies themselves to engage in situations when alternatives are available. 

In any event, I'll hope to continue enjoying the good life, RVing whenever, wherever, for many more moons. 
 
darsben said:
By let themm have it I meant let them take the stuff. Hope no one misunderstood
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I understood exactly what you are talking about and my post was to basically confirm what you stated.  Unfortunately some folks that take the carry class just simply do not let that part soak in....the part about imminent danger of death or serious bodily injury.
 
garyb1st said:
My family has never owned guns.  Still, I have thought of buying one from time to time.  The last time I read an article written by an expert.  Didn't save the article but it opened my eyes to a number of things. 

Number one is the actual act of shooting someone.  According to the author, it's not the same as going to the range and shooting a target.  It's not even close.  And in some cases, even if you hit the perp, he may not go down.  And if he doesn't, and keeps coming, he may take your gun, assuming he isn't armed himself, and shoot you. 

Number two is the choice of weapon.  Not all guns will get the job done.  The caliber of the weapon will be one of the deciding factors.  Don't fully appreciate that but recall it had to do with control of the weapon.  Apparently some have quite a kick. 

I'm not against gun ownership.  It's a personal decision and hope we always have the right.  I just hope that those who do own a weapon, but do not have law enforcement, military or related background, do not think owning a weapon for target practice or hunting qualifies themselves to engage in situations when alternatives are available. 

In any event, I'll hope to continue enjoying the good life, RVing whenever, wherever, for many more moons.
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There are many factors involved in using a weapon for self defense.  First and foremost, you always do whatever is possible to avoid the confrontation.  Secondly, you must be of the mindset that you are ready, willing, capable, and able to draw your weapon and shoot it to defend your life and or the lives of your loved ones.  If you do not have the mental fortitude to do that, you are wasting your time and possibly putting yourself and your family at an even higher risk.  The debate over Caliber size, revolver vs. semi auto, concealed carry vs. open carry, is like an oil thread debate....which oil is best for my <<<fill in the blank>>>.  The most effective weapon is the one that you can shoot with accuracy, consistency, and reliably.  Those factors are dependant in part on the gun and the ammo and also on YOU.  Don't expect to be proficient if you never practice with the gun AND the ammo that you carry in that gun.  A high level of situational awareness is always something that everyone should practice.  That, in and of itself will serve to keep you away from a dangerous situation many times.  It also serves to help keep you prepared and ready in case there really isn't a way to avoid a confrontation that may have lethal consequences.  As I stated earlier, there is a huge responsibility in all of this, and you can choose to educate yourself, train regularly, and be prepared....or you can be the person with a permit that probably really shouldn't have one.
 
darsben said:
How many times has this happened to you that you had to help a fellow human being with your weapon?
BTW I have a firearm in my rig as well
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  Glad you asked! Only once, for someone else. My ex wife used her handgun to stop an assault!  In neither case was a shot fired... but the problem was quickly resolved. There are tens of thousands of times  per year that similar situations are resolved....but “do not” make the 10 o’clock news!

  I have three close friends (four if you count the wife of one), that did not (not armed) have the ability to defend themselves. Two + the wife were “quite” elderly folks. The other,  a good friend that I was in Boy Scout’s with, that was going to a Christian Seminary to become a minister!
 
"Owning and carrying a weapon brings an incredible amount of responsibility to the table."

Actually no. All it takes is the money to buy one.  Most people have no responsible reason to carry one. The world isn't that dangerous, they have just been watching too much TV.
 
Ive never carried a gun, and as an adult, have never been in the situation where having a gun would have been helpful. Im pretty sure I would not be able to shoot anyone even if I did have one.

I do have a dog. Most bad guys will avoid dogs, just because they are so unpredictable. Plus I can cuddle with my dog and he keeps my feet warm. Guns dont do that.
 
cadee2c said:
Ive never carried a gun, and as an adult, have never been in the situation where having a gun would have been helpful. Im pretty sure I would not be able to shoot anyone even if I did have one.

I do have a dog. Most bad guys will avoid dogs, just because they are so unpredictable. Plus I can cuddle with my dog and he keeps my feet warm. Guns dont do that.
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Fire a few rounds through 'em and they will.  :)
 
xrated said:
There are many factors involved in using a weapon for self defense.  First and foremost, you always do whatever is possible to avoid the confrontation.  Secondly, you must be of the mindset that you are ready, willing, capable, and able to draw your weapon and shoot it to defend your life and or the lives of your loved ones.  If you do not have the mental fortitude to do that, you are wasting your time and possibly putting yourself and your family at an even higher risk.  The debate over Caliber size, revolver vs. semi auto, concealed carry vs. open carry, is like an oil thread debate....which oil is best for my <<<fill in the blank>>>.  The most effective weapon is the one that you can shoot with accuracy, consistency, and reliably.  Those factors are dependant in part on the gun and the ammo and also on YOU.  Don't expect to be proficient if you never practice with the gun AND the ammo that you carry in that gun.  A high level of situational awareness is always something that everyone should practice.  That, in and of itself will serve to keep you away from a dangerous situation many times.  It also serves to help keep you prepared and ready in case there really isn't a way to avoid a confrontation that may have lethal consequences.  As I stated earlier, there is a huge responsibility in all of this, and you can choose to educate yourself, train regularly, and be prepared....or you can be the person with a permit that probably really shouldn't have one.
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My son and I just completed the CC class here in IL. There were at least two in the class that should NOT have been there, by the questions asked. During a break, we were out side , I made the comment so the one guy could hear me, I'm NOT taking this class to be a hero. I took the class to be able to carry in my vehicle, LEGAL. I'll pick up Florida after I get mine here and that will get me most of the states I'll be traveling in. We have had a rise in home break ins and car jackings on the elderly lately here. I have restrained from even going out after dark. There was a home invasion about 1 mile from my home about a moth ago. The lady was in her uper 80s, and they damed near killed her. The perp was 27 years old. It's a shame what society has become. Never thought that I'd live long enough to see this. 
 
Since we're all in an RV or at home, I'm reminded of a friend who I asked about buying a handgun "for protection" (at home). His first response was "if you miss, you might shoot your neighbor". I didn't buy a handgun, but have shot one at a range.

My DW & I took safety classes years ago before buying a hunting rifle. Having used the rifle very little outside a range, it sat idle for a number of years. I finally decided to sell it when we had a very curious grandson visit regularly. We have no room for a gun safe, and I would not have been able to live with myself if curiosity resulted in a serious accident. I suppose I could have bought a trigger lock, but ...

I used the proceeds to buy a Sage fly fishing rod that I'd always lusted after.

In 30 years of RVing we haven't found ourselves in situations where I'd want to draw and shoot a weapon.
 
It?s like an epindectomy - you don?t need one ?til you do.
 
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