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Author Topic: Micro-Air EasyStart 364 runs A/C off Honda EU2000i or Sunforce 2500 inverter  (Read 418 times)

Frank B

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Amazing!  This product does live up to its advertising.  Those that boondock, TAKE NOTE!


https://www.microair.net/products/easystart-364-3-ton-single-phase-soft-starter-for-air-conditioners?variant=30176048267


I ordered it direct from Micro-Air and had it shipped to Canada.  UPS dinged me another $90 for 'brokerage fees' (it came in duty free).  If you have to ship cross-border, see if you can get it done via regular postal service.


In any case, it works just fine!  I have run our 1350 btu Coleman Mach A/C from the Honda in eco mode, as well as from our 'cheapie' Sunforce 2500 watt pure sine wave inverter.


The Honda would almost start the A/C on its own, but our A/C does not have the soft start capacitor installed, so the Honda breaker would pop first.  Now it starts and runs just fine with the Honda spooling up from eco mode with no problem.  And, while the Honda is working to run the A/C, it is far from being maxed out.  Absolutely no need for two generators in parallel, and no need for a heavier 3Kw unit.


Now THAT I expected, as all the videos and info on the web supported it.  What I did NOT EXPECT was to be able to run the A/C off our Sunforce 2500 watt inverter. 


Last time I tried it, the breaker on the Sunforce tripped within a few microseconds of turning on the A/C.  Now the compressor spools up without a whimper or any apparent strain on anything.  Voltage on our 6 GC-2's drops under that load, and unassisted, it would drain the batteries in short order.  However, we have a fairly oversized solar array that can supply 50 amps in decent sunlight, which should almost halve the load on the battery bank itself.


I have no idea how long that inverter could continue to run the A/C, as I am sure that heat buildup would overcome it inside the area where it is currently mounted.  I never intended it to be used that heavily when we bought it several years ago, so I never installed it for 'maximum performance'.  However, I am very impressed that will run the A/C at all!


$300 US is not cheap for the Micro-Air EasyStart, but it is cheaper than a second generator, and it DOES work.


Installation was not hard, and I did it myself.  However, the one thing that tripped me up was that ONE of the wires on the EasyStart must be wired in series with the compressor.  The other 3 are wired parallel. It took me a while to realize that (though in retrospect, it should be obvious).  Even the video on the Micro-Air site does not (in my mind) make that abundantly clear.  That video has lots on the benefits of the device, but the wiring portion is 'sped up' and you have to pay close attention.  The wiring diagram that they pack with the device also shows the correct wiring, but it is a 'detail' to note that the running winding wire from the compressor (ordinarily connected to one side of the run capacitor) has to be REMOVED from that capacitor and connected in series with the brown wire on the EasyStart.  Once I realized that, the rest was pretty simple.


So, there you have it!  I consider it a great investment.  Not that we use the A/C that much, as we seldom travel in the Summer, and it seldom gets hot enough in Dec-Mar in SoCal or Southern Arizona where we snowbird to need the A/C anyway.  But, it is nice to know that I CAN now if I want to.


Frank.
Linux:  Free, open, elegant.
06 GMC 3500 Duramax crew/long pulling 2010 Arctic Fox 30U with 1700 lb Reese Titan Class 5.
1.2 kw solar

solarman

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I have used the Hyper Engineering unit on many installs, both single
and three phase. these have been around a lot longer than the microair device,
they are typically supplied as oem to emerson and others.
they are nearly $80 US less than the microair ( $229 retail ) and work just fine.
I fitted one on my current and previous rv's. I have a Honda EU2000i btw.
also they allow my a/c to run from the inverter comfortably

http://www.hypereng.com/single_phase.html

« Last Edit: July 18, 2018, 05:05:21 PM by solarman »
ORV 24RKS 960 Watts solar
48V LFP, 2000W inverter/charger
Ram 2500 CTD

Frank B

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Solarman:


It is my understanding that the hyper engineering device is a first-generation unit. The inventor sold the rights to that unit to them, and they continue to manufacture and sell it. The inventor has since moved on to micro air. It is claimed that the newer micro air units are more advanced. Not sure if that is true or not, but this one works for me.


I am really pumped that I can run the air conditioner just off of the battery bank and solar! I probably won't ever do it, as I do have the Honda generator which is designed to take that sort of load all day. However, knowing that I can is personally satisfying. :-)
Linux:  Free, open, elegant.
06 GMC 3500 Duramax crew/long pulling 2010 Arctic Fox 30U with 1700 lb Reese Titan Class 5.
1.2 kw solar

solarman

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  • Posts: 125
Solarman:


It is my understanding that the hyper engineering device is a first-generation unit. The inventor sold the rights to that unit to them, and they continue to manufacture and sell it. The inventor has since moved on to micro air. It is claimed that the newer micro air units are more advanced. Not sure if that is true or not, but this one works for me.


I am really pumped that I can run the air conditioner just off of the battery bank and solar! I probably won't ever do it, as I do have the Honda generator which is designed to take that sort of load all day. However, knowing that I can is personally satisfying. :-)

I don't know the history on them,  I do know there is a limited number of "small" single phase commercial units that are affordable and that's one I found many years ago.  The large industrial units I normally deal with are north of $600 and not economical for an RV.

as long as it works then that's all that really matters..

ORV 24RKS 960 Watts solar
48V LFP, 2000W inverter/charger
Ram 2500 CTD

whiteva

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    • Nibbler the traveling squirrel
My Honda 2000i and microair have performed flawlessly for several years. I do change the oil after 48 (ish) hours of continuous operation on week long trips. Mobile 1 10w30 is my choice of oil.
 It is fun to watch folks walk by seeing the quiet Honda and almost always look on the roof to see if the AC is running. Florida weather is usually very hot however "little Red" just keeps going like the energizer bunny. Even has it's own dog house for bad weather. 
2008 Winnie 29TR, Class C
Me: RETIRED: Aerobatic flight instructor, RE Broker, EE,-
DW, Nan, works Finance for RV dealer. Travel short distances pulling 77' MGB on dolly.
 If not in the RV we are on the Sea Ray, with Boudreaux the dog-Nibbler the squirrel  & Shadeaux the black cat.

Sun2Retire

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whiteva, did you make the 30A receptacle adapter thatís mounted on the generator?
Scott
Fulltiming in a 2005 Newmar Dutch Star 3810, Spartan, Cat C7 350
Eezrv TPMS, 970W Solar, Tri-Metric Battery monitor
2002 Dodge RAM 1500 Quad Cab toad
Stowmaster towbar & Brakemaster toad braking system

whiteva

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  • Posts: 347
    • Nibbler the traveling squirrel
Yes, it is a simple DIY: Two male plugs that have screws to attach the cover (The plugs are screwed directly using longer screws through
to the  gray box). A grey electric box and a 30 amp socket from Home Depot. Use a hole saw for the box cover and socket. use a spare 110 electrical socket for aligning the 110 plugs correctly. Wire both plugs to the 30 amp connector. Although best practices says not to use two wires on a single screw I have found it works just fine on the large lugs of the 30 amp socket.

The problem with attempting to push so many amps using a single 110 plug is negated by doubling up the effective size of the connectors. No problem with terminals heating up from the AC load by using both connectors. No modifications to the generator are necessary.

Several years of operation has shown this gadget to solve the issues very inexpensively. 
« Last Edit: July 21, 2018, 08:43:10 PM by whiteva »
2008 Winnie 29TR, Class C
Me: RETIRED: Aerobatic flight instructor, RE Broker, EE,-
DW, Nan, works Finance for RV dealer. Travel short distances pulling 77' MGB on dolly.
 If not in the RV we are on the Sea Ray, with Boudreaux the dog-Nibbler the squirrel  & Shadeaux the black cat.

Sun2Retire

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The problem with attempting to push so many amps using a single 110 plug is negated by doubling up the effective size of the connectors. No problem with terminals heating up from the AC load by using both connectors. No modifications to the generator are necessary.

I'm coming from years of onboard gennies, so just to confirm what I think you said, electrically one could use just one of the genny recepacles and dogbone to a 30A plug, but you're doing this not because it's required electrically, but just to spread the load - correctamundo?
Scott
Fulltiming in a 2005 Newmar Dutch Star 3810, Spartan, Cat C7 350
Eezrv TPMS, 970W Solar, Tri-Metric Battery monitor
2002 Dodge RAM 1500 Quad Cab toad
Stowmaster towbar & Brakemaster toad braking system

whiteva

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  • Posts: 347
    • Nibbler the traveling squirrel
Spread the load is correct. Theoretically you could use the same setup on a 20 amp household circuit. Keep in mind that I lighten the load on the Honda by running gas on the fridge and water heater.
2008 Winnie 29TR, Class C
Me: RETIRED: Aerobatic flight instructor, RE Broker, EE,-
DW, Nan, works Finance for RV dealer. Travel short distances pulling 77' MGB on dolly.
 If not in the RV we are on the Sea Ray, with Boudreaux the dog-Nibbler the squirrel  & Shadeaux the black cat.

Sun2Retire

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Very slick to be able to get away with one little genny. YouTube is flooded with people demo-ing how it works, and a couple are having no trouble with 15K ACs.
Scott
Fulltiming in a 2005 Newmar Dutch Star 3810, Spartan, Cat C7 350
Eezrv TPMS, 970W Solar, Tri-Metric Battery monitor
2002 Dodge RAM 1500 Quad Cab toad
Stowmaster towbar & Brakemaster toad braking system

Frank B

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  • Posts: 990
Spread the load is correct. Theoretically you could use the same setup on a 20 amp household circuit. Keep in mind that I lighten the load on the Honda by running gas on the fridge and water heater.


Very slick idea! 


Theoretically, a single 15 amp plug should handle the load just fine. In practice, however, even 'heavy duty' 15 amp plugs often overheat when running the A/C on a hot day.  I have melted two 30 amp to 15 amp adapters trying to run the air conditioner off a household plug on the side of our house.


And thanks, Sun2Retire for catching that adapter in the picture. I went right by and missed that.


I got to make me one of those!   :)
Linux:  Free, open, elegant.
06 GMC 3500 Duramax crew/long pulling 2010 Arctic Fox 30U with 1700 lb Reese Titan Class 5.
1.2 kw solar

Sun2Retire

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And whiteva I see you're using an aux fuel tank would be interested in your setup there, along with run time at full load. (All manufacturer stated run times are at half or even quarter load.)
Scott
Fulltiming in a 2005 Newmar Dutch Star 3810, Spartan, Cat C7 350
Eezrv TPMS, 970W Solar, Tri-Metric Battery monitor
2002 Dodge RAM 1500 Quad Cab toad
Stowmaster towbar & Brakemaster toad braking system

whiteva

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  • Posts: 347
    • Nibbler the traveling squirrel
And whiteva I see you're using an aux fuel tank would be interested in your setup there, along with run time at full load. (All manufacturer stated run times are at half or even quarter load.)

The extended tank mod is easy on the 2000i because the Honda has a fuel pump to supply gas to the carb.  I purchased a gas cap for the Honda then removed the on off leaver from the gas cap leaving an nice hole in the cap. Using Walmart # 554002928 SeaSense OMC/Johnson/Evinrude, Male Tank Connector was threaded into the gas cap. At first I was using a gas tank from my old boat however it was very old and started leaking. Also the hose was long, stiff and the hose pump in the middle was not necessary so after a scotch and cigar I thought why not use what I have here in the barn! 5 gallon tank, copper tube to the bottom and leftover gas line to the Seachoice 20571 Mercury 3/8 inch Engine Fitting from the old hose.

As the generator uses fuel, a vacuum pulls in fuel from the second tank until it is empty then it will use the fuel onboard the generator. When the secondary tank is low you can just disconnect and refill ( don't forget to loosen the gas cap so it can draw air while using the onboard fuel).

I am still amazed how "little red" can be in idle (eco mode on) until the AC comes on. First the blower starts up causing the generator to rev to full power and 2 seconds later the AC compressor will kick in, then approx 2 seconds later "little red" will go from full power to approx 75% power saving fuel. Smart little booger isn't it?
 
Most of our boondocking is in the Florida "hotter than hell" summers so fuel consumption can be rather high. My findings are "little red" will run 24 hours on 3.5 to 4 gallons of gas. compared to the noisy Onan that will run 24 hours on approx 10 to 14 gallons. Keep in mind the Onan is also running the fridge, microwave ETC.

We have camped for 5 days using the Honda almost continuously,  I say almost because after 48 hours of run time I drain the oil and replace with new Mobil 1 - 30w and restart.  The oil change is easy and clean so it takes less than 10 minutes to give better protection.  I also use the hour meter from E-bay for number of hours used. 9 bucks, two screws and one wire. Been in use for two years now.
« Last Edit: July 22, 2018, 08:48:13 AM by whiteva »
2008 Winnie 29TR, Class C
Me: RETIRED: Aerobatic flight instructor, RE Broker, EE,-
DW, Nan, works Finance for RV dealer. Travel short distances pulling 77' MGB on dolly.
 If not in the RV we are on the Sea Ray, with Boudreaux the dog-Nibbler the squirrel  & Shadeaux the black cat.

Sun2Retire

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The extended tank mod is easy on the 2000i because the Honda has a fuel pump to supply gas to the carb. 

My preference would be to go with one of Honda's competitors at 50% of the price. Do you know if others use a fuel pump also which would allow your type of aux fuel arrangement?
Scott
Fulltiming in a 2005 Newmar Dutch Star 3810, Spartan, Cat C7 350
Eezrv TPMS, 970W Solar, Tri-Metric Battery monitor
2002 Dodge RAM 1500 Quad Cab toad
Stowmaster towbar & Brakemaster toad braking system

whiteva

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  • Posts: 347
    • Nibbler the traveling squirrel
I am not sure of other generators that use a fuel pump,  however raise the aux tank above the generator and allow fuel to siphon.

cheers 
2008 Winnie 29TR, Class C
Me: RETIRED: Aerobatic flight instructor, RE Broker, EE,-
DW, Nan, works Finance for RV dealer. Travel short distances pulling 77' MGB on dolly.
 If not in the RV we are on the Sea Ray, with Boudreaux the dog-Nibbler the squirrel  & Shadeaux the black cat.

garyb1st

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  • Posts: 2512
Great information.  Thanks for sharing. 
Gary B1st

2005 Pace Arrow 35G
2016 Jeep Wrangler