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Author Topic: Need help with TOAD math!  (Read 267 times)

jymbee

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Need help with TOAD math!
« on: September 04, 2018, 08:54:27 PM »
I posted earlier about my search for a TOAD and after countless searches I'm back to thinking that for a number of reasons,  towing our Honda Odyssey is the best option.

Still wanting to feel comfortable that the weight considerations work for safety' sake.

Here's the specs for our Fleetwood Bounder Class A with 5 speed transmission:
GCWR: 26,000
GVWR: 22,000
Front GAWR: 8,000
Rear GAWR: 15,000
Hitch Rating: 5,000
Tongue Weight: 500

When I had the coach weighed at a certified weigh station-- fully equipped and ready to travel with full gas tank, water half full and the two main passengers it came in at 20,700 pounds.

I'm going to weigh the Odyssey tomorrow with all center seats out, low gas tank and no cargo. From what I'm finding that should be around 4,300 pounds.

Am I correct in figuring that the coach loaded at 20,700 pounds amounts to 1,300 pounds under the GVWR? And, that subtracting this 20,700 weight from the GCWR of 26,000 leaves a margin of 5,300 pounds for a TOAD? Would that be considered an acceptable safety margin, or would it be pushing it?

Hopefully this makes sense as it seems I've spent a LOT more time researching TOADs than I did when buying the coach!  :-\




muskoka guy

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Re: Need help with TOAD math!
« Reply #1 on: September 04, 2018, 10:13:45 PM »
One would think if you dont exceed the gross combined weight, and dont exceed the hitch rating, you should be fine. Running anything at maximum is not ideal, but they put rating on things for a reason. As long as you are under them, you are within the legal towing weights. Your transmission might think otherwise after a few mountain passes.

garyb1st

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Re: Need help with TOAD math!
« Reply #2 on: September 04, 2018, 10:20:18 PM »
The numbers sound right to me.  Our set up is similar and we're between 25,500 and 26,000 gross combined when we travel.  I'd prefer to have a greater margin but there's not much we can do.  Our toad weighs 4,600 lbs.

Suggest you weigh the Honda so there's no question.  Also, I'd keep the Honda fuel tank pretty full.  Hate to have an emergency and not be able to use the toad to get us to wherever we need to be. 

Other things that will effect weight are the base plate for the Honda, the tow bar and related equipment, and the auxiliary braking system.   

Good luck.
Gary B1st

2005 Pace Arrow 35G
2016 Jeep Wrangler


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Gary RV_Wizard

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Re: Need help with TOAD math!
« Reply #3 on: September 05, 2018, 09:05:11 AM »
Your math is fine.  Given the scaled weights, the limiting factor is the 5000 lb hitch rating.  If the Odyssey comes in under that, it should be ok.

As a reminder, I assume your research has covered the fact that Honda has never actually approved of 4-down towing an Odyssey. People have successfully done so (I'm not sure about recent models) using the informal procedure Honda described for Accords and such back in the day, but you are assuming the risk yourself.
Gary
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Gary Brinck
Summers: Black Mountain, NC
Home: Ocala National Forest, FL

grashley

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Re: Need help with TOAD math!
« Reply #4 on: September 05, 2018, 07:40:05 PM »
Your math is fine.  Given the scaled weights, the limiting factor is the 5000 lb hitch rating.  If the Odyssey comes in under that, it should be ok.

As a reminder, I assume your research has covered the fact that Honda has never actually approved of 4-down towing an Odyssey. People have successfully done so (I'm not sure about recent models) using the informal procedure Honda described for Accords and such back in the day, but you are assuming the risk yourself.
I agree the math is good.

Take very careful note of Gary's last paragraph!!  Not all cars can be towed 4 down without risking transmission damage or destruction or other bad outcomes!
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It's not a dumb question if you do not know the answer.

jymbee

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Re: Need help with TOAD math!
« Reply #5 on: September 06, 2018, 11:44:49 AM »
As a reminder, I assume your research has covered the fact that Honda has never actually approved of 4-down towing an Odyssey. People have successfully done so (I'm not sure about recent models) using the informal procedure Honda described for Accords and such back in the day, but you are assuming the risk yourself.

Good point and quite right. I've gone from thinking that there was "no way" as per Honda, to tow 4 down-- to understanding that it was indeed possible if specific procedures were followed. Primarily based on direct input from a number of Odyssey owners who have been towing for years.

jymbee

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Re: Need help with TOAD math!
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2018, 08:16:01 PM »
Your math is fine.  Given the scaled weights, the limiting factor is the 5000 lb hitch rating.  If the Odyssey comes in under that, it should be ok.

Some of the other potential TOADs we looked at came in at around 3,500 +/- pounds. Our Ody is 4,300 and I'm wondering how much difference towing the lighter vehicles would be compared to the Ody? Obviously 7-800 pounds is not a small difference and "lighter is better" with respect to performance, but do you think overall handling would be dramatically different between the two options? Got a good estimate for installing a Blue Ox system on the van and trying to talk myself into going for it rather than all the hassle of finding/equipping a new vehicle.  :D

Gary RV_Wizard

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Re: Need help with TOAD math!
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2018, 08:38:11 AM »
It's not going to affect the coach handling at all - the toad just comes along. It will affect the fuel mileage some, cause a larger, heavier vehicle has more "drag", e.g. tire friction and wind resistance.  Probably not much difference, though, and I wouldn't buy a different vehicle solely for that reason.
Gary
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Gary Brinck
Summers: Black Mountain, NC
Home: Ocala National Forest, FL

jymbee

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Re: Need help with TOAD math!
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2018, 08:15:40 PM »
It's not going to affect the coach handling at all - the toad just comes along. It will affect the fuel mileage some, cause a larger, heavier vehicle has more "drag", e.g. tire friction and wind resistance.  Probably not much difference, though, and I wouldn't buy a different vehicle solely for that reason.

Thanks much Gary. The only other possibility now is a used Chevy Equinox that we're going to look at this weekend which could replace my wife's Subaru which can't be towed. But I'm leaning toward sticking with the van given all the hassle that comes with a new purchase.