Joezeppy
Well-known member
Correct - all kinds of space on top. Yes I agree that it sounds as if as the ball is being pulled up there is inward pressure on the ball bearings which may be unlocking the top key.Rene T said:
Andersen Hitch Issue - Has Anybody Had This Happen ?
- Thread starter eddytimeddy
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Rene T
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Joezeppy said:
If that is really what's happening, that's scary. How many fifth wheel towers are out there with this type of Reese ball set up with the Anderson hitch and don't know how much danger they're in.
John From Detroit
Well-known member
Not having that type of hitch and not seeing many I've never seen that. But I have seen ball bearings come out of other types of "Quick Connect" adapters.
What i have seen with a 5th Wheel to Gooseneck adapter is bent all to pretzel effect.
Now if I were deisgning that type of converter I would design the "neck" as a triangle. sort of like this
___
!/
That way a sudden stop. Well triangles tend to liek to stay triangles
What happened to the one I saw
His wife was in front of him and of course he was tailgating. (Most drivers do) so when something happned that caused her. to spike the brakes HE spiked his brakes as well
The result was a hitch like this
__
\ Not good at all.
What i have seen with a 5th Wheel to Gooseneck adapter is bent all to pretzel effect.
Now if I were deisgning that type of converter I would design the "neck" as a triangle. sort of like this
___
!/
That way a sudden stop. Well triangles tend to liek to stay triangles
What happened to the one I saw
His wife was in front of him and of course he was tailgating. (Most drivers do) so when something happned that caused her. to spike the brakes HE spiked his brakes as well
The result was a hitch like this
__
\ Not good at all.
Back2PA
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Rene T said:
As a future fiver owner unfamiliar with "towers" and various "Reese ball setups" and wanting a lightweight easily removable hitch, plus looking at used trucks some of which already have a gooseneck ball, this makes me very uneasy about the Anderson.
Rene T
Site Team
If this indeed what's happening, there is a easy fix. What I would do is when installing the Anderson hitch sleeve over the ball, I would remove the bolt which gets torqued pulling up on the ball. Then take a depth reading from the top of the sleeve down to the top of the ball/key. Then install a bolt that length minus 1/8". The end of the bolt would prevent the key on top of the ball from opening. You could fine tweek the length of the bolt by shimming with flat washers.
Note: The grade of the replacement bolt has to be the same grade that Anderson supplied. It could be a grade 3, 5 or maybe even a grade 8 bolt.
Note: The grade of the replacement bolt has to be the same grade that Anderson supplied. It could be a grade 3, 5 or maybe even a grade 8 bolt.
Joezeppy
Well-known member
Definitely something to think about while you are shopping, Scott. When I was researching gooseneck setups back in 2015/2016 most had a lever in the wheel well which slid a pin all the way through the ball - no way it's coming out. There were others with, IMHO, less secure locks. Granted, they are designed for downward pressure only so the Andersen brings a unique exposure to the table.Back2PA said:
Joezeppy
Well-known member
Eddy and Gordon - I just thought of a way to test the mechanism on the Reese ball. If you used a C-clamp putting one foot on each ball bearing and tightened it, you could see if it's possible to push them in and if it will pop the top lock. This would also work with a bench vice. I certainly would not want you to damage the mechanism, though, so I'm not sure if you'd be willing to try this or not.
Back2PA
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Joezeppy said:
Yup. I realize there are many satisfied users of this product but it feels makeshift to me. This issue combined with the twisting issue some of had has me currently leaning away from this hitch solution, especially considering I understand there are other solutions which are lightweight but more conventional in design.
Rene T
Site Team
Back2PA said:
Scott, have you looked at the PullRite hitch?
http://pullrite.com/products/superlite-series
After looking at it again, you may have the same issue.
Joezeppy
Well-known member
Back2PA said:
I agree with your hesitation, Scott. By "unique exposure" I actually meant the way it pulls up on the ball so it's exerting a force that may not play well with some gooseneck ball designs. I'm still a fan and will push the merits of the Andersen's hitch design but recent posts and a personal encounter I had with a user who had twisting have definitely shown me some limitations of this hitch. It works for me - I am 100% happy with it - but it's not a perfect match for everyone for sure.
Back2PA
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Rene T said:
No Rene I haven't yet seriously studied the options. Will get more serious in the next couple weeks but for now I'm doing some light shopping for the truck (used), most of which have no FW hitch, some have a gooseneck ball and some have a "standard" FW hitch. So until I buy the truck, don't really know what I need yet. At this stage, I'm leaning towards old school tried and true rail mounted FW hitch, the lightest version available. I need to be able to remove and replace without assistance.
Back2PA
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Rene, had a quick look at this product and, while interesting and a unique "solution", it seems like an upside down version of the Anderson (although it may not have the vertical torque issue).Rene T said:
Joezeppy
Well-known member
PullRite does offer a rail-mounted version of the SuperLight: http://pullrite.com/products/superlite-series/isr-series-superlite-four-point-4p-rail-mounted-fifth-wheel-hitchBack2PA said:
Andersen started with a rail-mounted version (steel, not aluminum) but I believe they have discontinued it.
Rene T
Site Team
Joezeppy said:
Near as I can make out Joe, it's still available.
https://andersenhitches.com/Products/3200--ultimate-5th-wheel-connection-rail-version.aspx
Back2PA
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Rene T said:
So as I look at that, there is an adapter that mounts to the kingpin to torn it into a ball receiver, and the rail mounted pyramid with ball. Attach the pyramid, drop the trailer on the ball and all forces are down (as opposed to applying upforce to a gooseneck ball), with no chance of twisting in the bed. And the pyramid is lightweight. Are there any advantages/disadvantages/potential issues with using a ball vs. a standard kingpin with fifth wheel hitch plate?
Joezeppy
Well-known member
Rene T said:
You're right Rene! I remembered wrong (happens more and more these days.
) They used to have a steel version of the gooseneck mount which is no longer available. Makes sense that they would keep a rail mounted version since rails are probably still the most common mounting method for conventional 5th wheel hitches.
Joezeppy
Well-known member
Back2PA said:
Right, Scott. This version of the hitch eliminates both current problems being discussed.
Most people say The primary advantage of the ball over a traditional hitch is more articulation over uneven ground. I have heard some say that this is NOT an advantage since you could more easily damage the bed rails (even the higher end traditional hitches only have a few degrees of side-to-side movement). And while I have never used a traditional hitch, I find the ride ultra-smooth while many 5th wheel owners complain of "chucking" and other unwanted movement. I cannot make an actual comparison, though. Some say a disadvantage is a smaller contact area - just the ball vs. the entire flat surfaces of a traditional hook up.
There is also one state (according to Andersen...IA, I think) that requires chains on ALL ball mounts.
Back2PA
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Wouldn't that assume that the supposed advantage of the traditional hitch would be based upon the kingpin/plate not allowing rotational movement thereby 'protecting' the bed rails? If so, that would mean as one approached the rotational limit, significant strain would be induced on the front of the fiver as the truck attempted to twist it but instead one of the TV rear wheels would become lighter. Seems like I'd rather hit the bed (obviously I'd stop and say "you dummy") rather than put the load on the hitch and trailer. Just thinking out loudJoezeppy said:
Is that because there is some 'slop' in the traditional setup and none in the Anderson ball?Joezeppy said:
I note that Andserson states the ball is "no lube". Is that because there is some type of anti-friction (e.g., Teflon) plate in the receiver, or just because Anderson doesn't think it's necessary? I'm a "grease the ball" guy on traditional hitches, I wouldn't be happy having a tight, metal-to-metal contact carrying perhaps 2500-3000 pounds running without lube.Joezeppy said:
Joezeppy said:
I presume by this comment that chains are not required with a standard 5W hitch? Which if true would be interesting, as there is the "bed saver" gizmo to 'catch' the fifth wheel if it comes unlatched, which means many people have pulled away with the fiver not latched (or latches have problems?)
Joezeppy
Well-known member
Yes, the physics of the process would suggest that once the side tilt maximum is reached, all components would be strained.Back2PA said:
Yes, from what I've heard/read, there is often some slop between the jaws and the kingpin which is what causes the chucking.Back2PA said:
Back2PA said:
Yes, there is some type of plastic/Teflon/urethane material in the adapter block that sits on the ball. In 3 years I have not noticed any wear on the ball or up inside the adapter block.
Correct, chains are not required for 5th wheel hitches. They are only required on ball-mount hitches (I'm not sure about pintle hooks but I think they are required here, too). From what I understand, it's because the traditional 5th wheel connection is deemed "more secure". Keep in mind that a breakaway cable is required for any attachment method. The bed saver device you mention is more of a failsafe for right after hookup rather than during motion but if a 5th wheel hitch failed, it could come in handy here as well.Back2PA said:
eddytimeddy
Member
Rene T said:
So I spoke to Reese. They very clearly stated their elite gooseneck balls are not to be used with a constant upward force.
