Quality, quality, quality

I am now a couple of months into researching before we purchase our first TT, and what an education I'm getting!  But the one thing that really stands out, is that no matter what brand I turn to, quality control is a big issue.  I understand how if I were to drive my house up and down hills and over bumpy roads, it would probably develop problems too.  But I'm finding reviews from people who have spent $70,000 and more on a new product, and it starts falling apart within the first year.  I'm pretty handy and mechanically inclined, and not really all that picky.  But I'm a little amazed by the shear number of horror stories I have found online.  And not just ridiculously poor quality control, but horrible customer service after the sale.  My wife and I are bound and determined to carry through with our little retirement adventure, but it's all getting a little spooky! 

Another good reason to only buy a good USED rig, maybe 3 or 4 years old.  Whatever problems that needed factory correction were handled by the previous owner . . .

We're coming to the same conclusion, Bugford. Seems like all you read about are motorhomes that are falling apart at the slightest touch. And yet, people do this all the time. That's the part I'm focusing on, along with looking for nearby classes that teach basic RV repair. We won't be buying new, but I have yet to find the sweet spot for RVs that aren't a financial nightmare, if online stories are to be believed. It's discouraging, but, like you, we're going forward with it just the same.

Optimistic Paranoid said:

Another good reason to only buy a good USED rig, maybe 3 or 4 years old.  Whatever problems that needed factory correction were handled by the previous owner . . .

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X2!
The last several RV's I've purchased have all been used and I couldn't be happier.

I could be wrong but from what I have seen airstreams or similar might be the way to go.

Ive done collision work a little over 30 years, I worked at one point for a new dealer and I was paid to do the graphics on 100K plus motorhomes, I worked with ( and had lots of hands on ) the guys that would do warranty work or dealer add ons, one thing that amazed me was the quality or lack thereoff in the motorhomes.

Same with Bentley/rolls royce with their bicycle chain window regulators, it seems the more asked the cheaper manufactured.

Id agree with buy used

Your observations are correct.  Build quality and customer service are clearly substandard for most of the industry.

The design and engineering are generally ok, but the implementation is poor.

IMHO, the clear solution is to buy late model used.  Let somebody else get all of that pesky sloppy build quality fixed for you.  Buy the camper that is ready to be camped in, not ready for another shop visit!!  Save some money for souvenirs!

There are a couple areas where the engineering can be a bit questionable.  Axle capacity and tire size / load capacity are barely adequate, because it saves money vs. a bit of extra capacity.

My impression is that travel trailers, in particular, are built as entry-level products meant to be used for vacations and short trips.  As such, they don't have the things like good insulation and dual-pane windows that are found in higher-end motorhomes.  They're built to entice young families to enter the RV market and are priced to be affordable.  I haven't followed trailers all that much because they don't appeal to us, but after years of reading discussions on the RV Forum I believe this is a correct assessment.  By keeping the products at the low end of pricing they can't afford to do much after the sale.  Of course, the fact that they already have your money means the buyer has no leverage to make corrections, hence poor customer service.

Here's one example of product non-quality.  Years ago we were in British Columbia and toured a lumber mill that made vertical pieces for travel trailer structure.  Whereas a stick-and-brick house might have 2 x 4 size boards vertically, these were half size, about 2 x 2.  We were somewhat surprised to see such small boards because we know how much travel trailers get jostled going down the road.  They didn't look very substantial, but of course weight is a big consideration so it's not practical to use more hefty parts.  It might pay to visit a factory before you buy so you can see construction of the products.

ArdraF

Remember that very few people without problems ever post. With our new purchases (a few TTs and a motorhome), we have had one significant problem (TT brakes) and it was fixed at the dealer before we left the lot. Have their been some other problems? Yes, but nothing significant. I also note I just bought a new construction home in the mid-Upper price range for my area. I have problems with it too, one quite significant that is still in the process of being corrected after 3 months. We have also purchased used TTs and re-owned homes. None were without problems, though depreciation on the used TTs was obviously less. Also note there is a huge variation in quality in both towables and motorhomes. The last wo TTs (Casita and Outdoor RV) and the motorhome (Tiffin) were buys for quality, and the price paid reflected that.

Remember that bad news is ?news? and the good is seldom reported.

Remember, when the rig is going down the road, it's like a mini-earthquake.  Even a quality rig begins to shake stuff loose.

Of course there is the issue of super cheap components too.

We bought used and have just started using ours....HOWEVER the problems I have found with ours have been quality issues from the manufacture.

Misaligned wood joints
Incorrect type screws used to fasten access panels
Incorrect battery installed
Loose banding on Formica counter and table.
The square rear bumper is designed to hold the hoses to dump the Black/Gray tanks is to narrow to fit the hose.

I have no complaints about the previous owner's "wear and tear" They either didn't use it much or took very good care of it.

Out of three motorhomes, the used one gave us the most trouble and expense. One new one had a few problems, most minor (A/C had bad card, but wasn't that way when we picked it up), and the other new one had a window shade and a knob problem.

Both my rigs were old and built back when they cared about what they built.

I've had good luck.

So far we've been happy with our new Alpine. (Knock on wood?) Been in it 4 months full-timing by the way, and only issue to date was with the Furrion oven. (Defective thermocouple which we fixed ourselves.) The key is if you are experienced at RVing already, and fairly savvy, most issues you are better off fixing yourself. If you are not that savvy, going slightly and gently used is probably better.

guess I will toss in my .02's worth . I agree, buy used, for one ?, like said ^^, most problems will already been fixed. two: as always, soon as you drive/pull off the lot ?, there went 3k-4k in value !. as for problems with any of them ?, well..they ALL will have problems..some just faster than others. then you get the used deals with '' it hasn't leaked '' -'' ran great when we parked it '' ?!. well..i'll be first to admit, I got taken for the '' no leaks ''. this might be another thread come spring ?, not sure yet ??. bottom line : unless your paying top dollar ? ( even these have problems ! ), most TT, MH will have trouble down the road !. why ?, simple..manufactures today build them as fast as they can !, fast to them means more to sell, they don't care one bit if it has problems then ?, they will let dealerships deal with it later..after all..they got 10 more units to get out the door in a short time !..lol. there is a video or two on youtube, shows some places building a TT from start to finish, this is just a few hours !!, you will be shocked to sit there and watch how fast they put them together !!..lol.

Optimistic Paranoid said:

Another good reason to only buy a good USED rig, maybe 3 or 4 years old.  Whatever problems that needed factory correction were handled by the previous owner . . .

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Agree^^^^ We had been shopping for a decent fiver to fulltime in. We bought one 6 years old, got a pretty decent trailer, and paid 25-30% of what a new one costs.

  There are “very” few, quality constructed Rv’s produced today.  Research diligently, and buy an older unit, from a proven brand.... from “yesterday”! For true quality.....it will likely mean buying a unit in excess of 5 years old!  This will be a “double” win for you.....the original owner takes the “very large” monetary depreciation and you get a time tested, proven unit!

Having asked the question before, this probably won't be received well, but what's a "proven brand", Memtb?

I'll duck and cover while that one is mulled over.

Susan, most of the common brands are "proven," one way or another. But you must keep in mind that although Beaver, Monaco, Newmar and others are commonly thought of as decent brands (some say excellent), the actual "quality" of some brands varies from time to time, with many of those brands having a bad year or range of years, perhaps even more than one bad range, so you'd need a range of years to go with the brand recommendation. And, as I think you're aware, not all used rigs of that specific brand (or even model) will match that quality.

For example most folks here will agree that Beaver is a fairly high end, quality brand, but the Beaver I had (I bought it used), though there was little evidence of it in the showroom, had been poorly maintained and/or abused, as I found out when hydraulics started leaking, onboard air compressor went bad, and a number of other costly things happened over the years I had it. Most of this wasn't apparent while living in it (other than the hydraulic drips), but became apparent on the road after having it for a while (I won't go into details here). Still, there were several things (peeling veneer, for example) that became noticeable after a couple of years. Yet it was a beautiful, elegant rig, comfortable with lots of amenities that I miss in my "lesser" Newmar Ventana, whether it was the solid wood cabinets, the air leveling, the heavy, smoothly operating pocket doors, or the electronic lighting and awning controls.

From what I've read, even a Newell or Prevost (really high end stuff) can and will  have problems, new or used. So the best you can really get from a brand/model is the quality of the design and materials, but little about quality of the actual build work or problems you might encounter. And you can, to a large degree, determine this for yourself from the original MSRP for the rig (often available in NADA book or dealer listings), relative to other brands/models for that year. You might also note that that MSRP can often also be indicative of relative maintenance costs.

So perhaps in your desire to hear what are "proven brands*" you could explain what it is that you expect this "recommendation" to provide. To me, branding of RVs is kind of (but not completely) like Chevy, Hundai or Mercedes -- one is higher priced (and higher maintenance costs) with lots of fancy stuff, but the others still can provide a quality experience for the owners.


* Perhaps you've noticed that most of us seem to be reluctant to say a brand is proven is simply because (as we've all alluded to or stated above) too often that expectation has turned out to be a false comfort. The RV world is different from what you've experienced and expected before in other fields.

I didn't expect anything, I was just responding to the comment, "Research diligently, and buy an older unit, from a proven brand". It would seem there is no such thing.

Senator said:

Remember, when the rig is going down the road, it's like a mini-earthquake.  Even a quality rig begins to shake stuff loose.

Of course there is the issue of super cheap components too.

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it's way more than a mini...it's a continual 8.5 quake that lasts for thousands of miles.

just for fun try riding in a trailer going down, you will think the world is ending.