RV trailer 120 volt 15 amp duplex receptacle question

Prior member · Dec 2, 2018

Can any one direct me to a picture of the rear view wiring of a 120 volt RV shallow (with no box) duplex receptacle.
This is the type where the non-metalic sheathed cable(s) goes right into the receptacle and you can't see the connection screws (if there are any), since the cable is covered.
When I look on line all I can find is the front view which is useless for me.

Jack L

Gary RV_Wizard · Dec 2, 2018

I'm guessing you are talking about the type where the wire is pressed into clamping jaws without removing the insulation. These are called "self-contained devices" (outlets) because they integrate the outlet and the mounting box. Generally the back cover is removed and the Romex (wire type NMB) outer shield is stripped away, leaving the hot & neutral wires with their own inner insulation in place. The black, white and bare copper ground wire are pushed into the channels provided on the outlet and the ridges penetrate the insulation on black & white to make contact. Then replace the back cover .

Here's one with a good photo of the back:
https://www.amazon.com/RV-Designer-S811-Contained-Outlet/dp/B008OJ6XA0
http://www.magicmobilehomesupply.com/Snap_On_Self_Contained_Receptacle_White_p/487.htm

There is even a tool for helping with install, but it probably doesn't work with all brands. This video of the tool helps show how it is wired:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tuo2EFKfJ58

Prior member · Dec 2, 2018

Perfect Gary !
Thanks so much!
I searched for about an hour on line and struck out.

Jack L

mel s · Dec 2, 2018

JackL said:
Can any one direct me to a picture of the rear view wiring of a 120 volt RV shallow (with no box) duplex receptacle.
This is the type where the non-metalic sheathed cable(s) goes right into the receptacle and you can't see the connection screws (if there are any), since the cable is covered.
When I look on line all I can find is the front view which is useless for me.
Jack L

Jack L
See:
https://www.doityourself.com/forum/attachments/electrical-ac-dc/66603d1464378027-manufactured-home-light-switch-replacement-switch.jpg
And:
https://www.mobilehomerepair.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/03/5902-1.jpg

cavie · Dec 2, 2018

PURE JUNK but that's what we are stuck with.

Prior member · Dec 3, 2018

cavie said:
PURE JUNK but that's what we are stuck with.

Why is it "poor junk" ?
As a retired Electrical/instrumentation engineer I think it is pretty clever and well built.
With the lack of space in RV walls, trying to cram several 2/c with ground cables in a shallow box is like trying to cram 10 pounds of potatoes in a five pound bag.

Jack L

SeilerBird · Dec 3, 2018

JackL said:
Why is it "poor junk" ?
As a retired Electrical/instrumentation engineer I think it is pretty clever and well built.
With the lack of space in RV walls, trying to cram several 2/c with ground cables in a shallow box is like trying to cram 10 pounds of potatoes in a five pound bag.

Jack L

It is not pure junk or poor junk either. But like a lot of things that go into making an RV lightweight it is not as robust as the s/b equivalent. Driving a house down the road at 60 mph tends to break and shake up a lot of things that are not engineered to withstand an 8.6 earthquake.

lynnmor · Dec 3, 2018

cavie said:
PURE JUNK but that's what we are stuck with.

I agree, insulation displacement connectors are something that I don't want supplying a heavy load. I was able to replace nearly every one with a real outlet.

cavie · Dec 3, 2018

JackL said:
Why is it "poor junk" ?
As a retired Electrical/instrumentation engineer I think it is pretty clever and well built.
With the lack of space in RV walls, trying to cram several 2/c with ground cables in a shallow box is like trying to cram 10 pounds of potatoes in a five pound bag.

Jack L

The pure Junk statement was refering to the electric system. The RV's are not so much Juck as most of the problems are from Quality control. If they had some of that then we probaly woun't be having this thread.

Clever and well built?? Seriously? As a retired Master Electrician I would expect more for an engineer. If you spent as much time in the field troubleshooting this things as you did behind a desk you would have a whole different outlook. If they are clever and well built, why were a very simular product OUTLAWED in the S/B world 30 years ago? The system was called stablok and Kwick stab. At least the electrician had to strip a 1/4" of insulation off the wire before inserting it into a tang to hold it in place. That was much safer/reliable then what we have in the RV world. This perce the insulation method is not a good system. Causes MANY loose connections and burnt wires. At least the S/B world captured this hazard in an electric box to prevent fires and allowed the breakes/fuses to do thier job.

Gary RV_Wizard · Dec 3, 2018

Yet the Self-Contained Devices remain acceptable under the NEC, even though many local codes prohibit them in fixed residential & commercial buildings. And the same codes allow them in mobile homes and RVs. Double-standard, or just a concession to the reality of certain types of construction?

Gary RV_Wizard · Dec 3, 2018

Not all RV electrical systems are poorly designed or installed. High end models are wired & plumbed to much higher standards and the differences are obvious to anyone with electrical or plumbing experience. A lot of crap gets built in deference to the public's desire for cheap products.

Prior member · Dec 3, 2018

cavie said:
The pure Junk statement was refering to the electric system. The RV's are not so much Juck as most of the problems are from Quality control. If they had some of that then we probaly woun't be having this thread.

Clever and well built?? Seriously? As a retired Master Electrician I would expect more for an engineer. If you spent as much time in the field troubleshooting this things as you did behind a desk you would have a whole different outlook. If they are clever and well built, why were a very simular product OUTLAWED in the S/B world 30 years ago? The system was called stablok and Kwick stab. At least the electrician had to strip a 1/4" of insulation off the wire before inserting it into a tang to hold it in place. That was much safer/reliable then what we have in the RV world. This perce the insulation method is not a good system. Causes MANY loose connections and burnt wires. At least the S/B world captured this hazard in an electric box to prevent fires and allowed the breakes/fuses to do thier job.

"If you spent as much time in the field troubleshooting this things as you did behind a desk you would have a whole different outlook."

I won't argue with you, but before you take some one that you know nothing about to task I'll inform you that for the last ten years of my career after I came up through the electrical field my main job was in the field inspecting, testing and correcting what the electrical contractors supplied and installed that was inferior to what was on the plans and in the specifications, and believe me along with the perfect jobs, I saw plenty of shoddy work that was trying to be sneaked through.
Enough said from my end!

Jack L

John From Detroit · Dec 3, 2018

Do not have a photo of a good one but there is a photo of what happens if you plug in a space heater floating about (NOT pertty).

THe wire is pushed down in a metal slot or two. Not a good connection at AMPS. great at mA or uA (Telephone use) but at 10 amps.. IT melts. There are no screws.

I put in a pair of 15/20 amp outlets for my heaters (And more in fact) all wired with 12ga each (save one) with a circuit breaker dedicated to that one outlet (That one has two duplex outlets one GFCI feedign the other side by side.. Kitchen 2 circuit). No problems with overheated wires on these lines.

John From Detroit · Dec 3, 2018

JackL said:
Why is it "poor junk" ?
As a retired Electrical/instrumentation engineer I think it is pretty clever and well built.
With the lack of space in RV walls, trying to cram several 2/c with ground cables in a shallow box is like trying to cram 10 pounds of potatoes in a five pound bag.

Jack L

The punch down type connector is great at Telephone line current levels but when you start sucking 12.5 amps for a space heater.. IT MELTS and fires can reslut. I feel they are unsafe. I had one overheat (Did not melt cause I got there fast enough) some others have had serious issues (Melted. burned wires. arcing and .. they are lucky it didn't "FLAME ON".

cavie · Dec 3, 2018

John From Detroit said:
The punch down type connector is great at Telephone line current levels but when you start sucking 12.5 amps for a space heater.. IT MELTS and fires can reslut. I feel they are unsafe. I had one overheat (Did not melt cause I got there fast enough) some others have had serious issues (Melted. burned wires. arcing and .. they are lucky it didn't "FLAME ON".

Gary RV_Wizard · Dec 4, 2018

So, if we use screw-terminal receptacles instead, we won't ever experience an overheated outlet or a melted wire? ???

cavie · Dec 4, 2018

Gary RV_Wizard said:
So, if we use screw-terminal receptacles instead, we won't ever experience an overheated outlet or a melted wire? ???

Your chances are very slim if the wiring used to it's design and not overloaded by stupidity.

Prior member · Dec 4, 2018

Gary RV_Wizard said:
So, if we use screw-terminal receptacles instead, we won't ever experience an overheated outlet or a melted wire? ???

You took the words right out of my mouth Gary!

Makes me think of the old days when the wiring was done to code, but some one replaced a fuse with a penny

Jack L

RV trailer 120 volt 15 amp duplex receptacle question

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