Oil question

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Bigmau

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Aside for the one recommend by the manufacturer, is there a better, may be synthetic oil the can be used on an Onan 4000 generator? Does the generator requires an oil filter?

How about the engine oil for a E450 Ford? Is a full synthetic oil recommended?
 
The engine on the Onan is nothing more than an engine on a lawn mower. Personally, I don't see the need for synthetic oil in it. They do not have an oil filter. The oil used and recommended by the factory in the V-10 is a semi synthetic. If changed every 5000 miles, you can 250,000 miles from that engine. It would be up to you to make the decision if full synthetic is worth it. As an fyi, my F-150 company truck has always used Motorcraft 5-20, changed every 5000 miles, and just came out of the shop yesterday. Got a clean bill of health at 278,000 miles. It's been run like a scaleded ape all it's life. There are people out there that run full synthetic, change at 3000 miles, and tout all the "advantages". Personally, I think they're just wasting money, but it makes them feel like a big shot and all knowing. I used to be of the camp that thought oil aged out at a year or so, but found out that was hog wash too.
 
@kdbboat, thanks for the reply. Always good to ask questions and get helpful answer.
 
  Needed or not....I run synthetic in everything we own ( lawn mowers, utv/atv, RV, boat, tractor, generators), all trucks/automobiles, even my air compressor. It?s simply a better lubricant. If it?s better for extreme usage...it certainly can?t hurt, for normal usage! 
 
Onan's do not have an oil filter????? Mine does.

And I too use semi-synthetic. same as I use in the big 8.1L Vortec.  No need to stock multiple oils.

ONAN does recommend their own oil. for which they make PROFIT.. and that's why they recommend it.. If you buy say  Quaker State or Pennzoil semi synthetic.. ONAN (Well Cummins) Makes no PROFIT on the sale.
 
John From Detroit said:
Onan's do not have an oil filter????? Mine does.

Onan 4000 watt Microlites do not have an oil filter, they are splash lubricated.
 
I watch a video on the Onan 4000 and it does not have an oil filter. may be an Air filter?
I will definitively got with full synthetic.
 
At one time in my trucking business I was running a minimum of 25 Honda engines ( mostly 13hp, some 24hp. 24hp had oil filter, 13hp did not.) on pumps unloading rail car tankers into semi trailer tankers. When in use these engines ran at full load around the clock in temps from -20 to 100f. All had hour meters. When we switched to full synthetic engine oil in the mid nineties, we doubled the ? time to overhaul? on these engines. Time to overhaul was determined by engine oil usage.
  Just a side note, when I was still buying new trucks, Eaton heavy duty rear differentials came with a 500,000 mi. 5 year warranty with synthetic oil, or a 100,000 mi. 1 year warranty with conventional oil.
 
As already noted, the Onan 4000 does not have a filter (no oil pump to move oil through it). The 5500 and larger models do. It does have an air filter. All this is covered in the op manual. Both the Operator manual and the service manual are available free online.

http://www.joshwakefield.com/xplorer/onan-microquiet-4000.pdf
https://www.manualslib.com/manual/1271955/Onan-Microlite-4000-Series.html

You can use a synthetic oil of the same viscosity that Onan recommends (SAE 30 for most operating conditions).  However, the small engine is fairly dirty-running so I prefer to change its oil fairly frequently, so I always used a less expensive non-synthetic in it.
 
Thanks Gary. That is good to know. The reason I don't have the manual with me, it is in the motorhome having a wheel alignment done. I will downloaded from your link.
 
My 2001 Miata came with conventional trans oil.  Visiting mom in Chicago in the winter, I could barely shift the thing until I had driven 2 or 3 miles and the oil warmed up.  I changed to full synthetic and it shifts smoother and has no cold weather stiffness.
 
grashley said:
My 2001 Miata came with conventional trans oil.  Visiting mom in Chicago in the winter, I could barely shift the thing until I had driven 2 or 3 miles and the oil warmed up.  I changed to full synthetic and it shifts smoother and has no cold weather stiffness.
Then again,, some folks are just weak wristed.>>>Dan ::)
 
Mbenazeraf said:
Aside for the one recommend by the manufacturer, is there a better, may be synthetic oil the can be used on an Onan 4000 generator?

Air cooling is less efficient than water cooling at controlling engine temperatures, so air cooled engines have wider internal tolerances when the engine is cold so they can expand into proper tolerances as the engine heats up.

Like the old air cooled VW's, Onan recommends 30w single weight oil so the engine has a thicker oil at startup compared to multi-weight oils to accommodate the wider tolerances.  Multi-weight oils can be used if the expected low temperatures are below the limits of straight 30w oil but they have lower high temperature limits than 30w.

From the Owner's Manual:

"Single grade SAE 30w oil is preferable when temperatures are consistently above freezing.  Multigrade oils are better when wide temperature ranges are expected."

Multigrade oils are only recommended if the generator will be operated in below freezing temperatures (15-100 degrees for 15w-40, 10-80 degrees for 10w-30 or 10w-40, -20-50 degrees for 5w-30 oil).

Note that most synthetic oils are 5w-30 or 10w-40, meaning they're out of spec for the engine above 50 or 80 degrees F.

Using a multigrade oil that's thinner than 30w at moderate starting temperatures will cause lower oil pressure and reduced lubrication at startup, which will likely cancel out any advantage of using synthetic oil over the recommended single weight (30w) conventional oil.
 
Utclmjmpr said:
Then again,, some folks are just weak wristed.>>>Dan ::)

Dan!!  And here I thought you were a NICE guy  ;D  ;)

For a great little car which normally shifts with the flick if the wrist, that cold oil was almost too stiff to move the shifter to neutral!
 
In 1960 my father in law was pulling out of the driveway one morning in North Dakota at a temp. of 23 below.. As I watched out a window I noticed neither front wheels were turning as He progressed down the street.
 
John From Detroit said:
Onan's do not have an oil filter????? Mine does.

And I too use semi-synthetic. same as I use in the big 8.1L Vortec.  No need to stock multiple oils.

ONAN does recommend their own oil. for which they make PROFIT.. and that's why they recommend it.. If you buy say  Quaker State or Pennzoil semi synthetic.. ONAN (Well Cummins) Makes no PROFIT on the sale.

Mine has a filter too, so must depent on which model you have.
 
5w40 synthetic in ALL of my engines.  That includes my diesel truck, my 3kw generator, my SUVs and Passenger cars (which say to use 5w20 but in other countries go up to 15w40 in hot climate areas), my lawnmower, my snowthrower, and any other 4 stroke engine I come across.  Never had an issue with the thicker viscosity nor cam phasers which are reliant on oil flow.  I'm not a believer in 5w20 oil because it is only there to promote fuel economy at the expense of engine longevity.  My 2013 Santa Fe lists 5w20 or 5w30 oil in warmer temps but for other parts of the world, its 5w30 all the way up to 15w40 in their manual.  Why is that?  Is the 100 deg F in the middle east hotter than the 100 deg F heat in Arizona?  Not buying it.

HDEO 5w40 oil has more antiwear additives, suspend insoluble better to prevent them wearing engine components and better shear stability and ability to handle high temperatures.

I've even run it in a Jeep 5.7L engine that strictly recommends 5w20 oil or their camshaft phase system would not supposely work.  Think about it, when an engine and oil are cold, their oil vicsocity is higher than a 5w40 oil at 100 deg C temperature. 

Pleaes don't preach to me about tighter engine tolerances.  That may be been true in the 50-70s when engines were fairly loose and quality was poor which a lot of manufacturing variations.  Piston to cylidner, piston end ring gaps, connecting rod to crankshaft bearing clearances haven't gotten tighter in the past 20 years or so.  Lighter oils is nothing more than acheiving better fuel economy to satisfy the EPA. 

BTW, did you know that new modern oils to meet ACEA A5/B5 specs in 5w30 oil weights must show a 2.5% improvement in fuel economy over a 15w40 oil?

Wonder why semi's still use mostly 15w40 oil today?  Perhaps it is what allows them to go over a million miles and more before needing new pistons and rings.

I will put my money where my mouth is.  I bought a new car 2 weeks ago.  I put 1110 miles on it in 5 days with the factory 5w20 fill.  Since it is cold here right now, I switched to 0w40 and will use it in winter months and use 5w40 in summer months.  It is a Hyundai Elantra and I'll let you know over the course of the next 10 years how it is doing.  So far getting 42-44 mpg on the highway at 70mph with cruise set on the 0w40 oil and I'm very happy with this figure.



 
Wonder why semi's still use mostly 15w40 oil today?  Perhaps it is what allows them to go over a million miles and more before needing new pistons and rings.
I think semi's use 15W40 because that's the standard oil for larger diesel engines that are designed to use it. They get as much as a million miles on the pistons for several reasons: (1) diesels operate at much lower rpms than gas engines, (2) the engine internals are more robust to begin with, (3) rigorous preventive maintenance on all components (not just oil changes).  Choosing an oil because it works well in a different type of engine that has different operating needs strikes me as plain foolish.

That said, 15W40 is one of the recommended oils for an Onan 5500, suitable from 10 F to 100F.  Ought to be fine for most owners but comes up a bit short in some areas where daytime temps can hit 120.  Onan also specifies API Service Grade SH, SJ or SG, an equally important parameter.
 
NEW ONAN/CUMMINS 4 KW HAVE NO OIL filter, as said splash technology just like the $400 units on sale everywhere.
ONAN before Cummins have oil filters and pumps.

I believe RV manufacturers pushed for a cheaper genny to cut costs.

SO everyone is right and everyone is wrong
 

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