Finally weighed my Class Tioga 31m on a CAT scale

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Gary RV_Wizard said:
Because of the van cutaway chassis, the GVWR for a Class C is set in stone for the chassis.  The coach builder has no meaningful way to alter that (a Class A is a bit different).  14,050 is the GVWR for a Ford E450 van cutaway.

The coach builder is required to weigh the rig as it leaves the factory, accurate to within 100 lbs, so the UVW shown on the weight placard should be correct.  However, if the 11,860 "dry weight" is a number from a Fleetwood brochure, then it's a generic number for some fictional configuration and has little chance of being accurate fore any specific coach.
You are kidding yourself, Bob.  Two adults alone exceed 200 lbs, plus there is about 10 gallons of water in the lines and heater tank (80#), probably a few more gallons in the bottom of fresh & waste tanks, pots & pans & dishes, water & sewer hoses, extension cords, etc.  Weight builds up in an insidious manner and people are always shocked how much it totals up.
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My RV was empty except for 200lbs of stuff and I did not include the weight of my brother and I in that number obviously.  Having said that, no way this RV weighed under 14,050 lbs when it left the factory floor.  There have been zero additions to the RV that would have added any weight and why I was shock to see the rig 900lbs overweight with no water in the tank, no food, no dishes, no linens. minimal in black and gray tanks (under 10 gallons). No matter how you look at this, there is nothing I can do reduce the weight below the 14.050 max rating. I know, if all the tanks are full and I am loaded for travel for 2 adults, I will easily top 16,000lbs. This is a problem obviously, especially if I get hit with a random roadside weight check.
 
ksmoody said:
Here is a photo of my cargo carrying capacity for my 2008 Tioga 31M. Sorry I can't get the photo to rotate in the correct direction.
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Thanks for posting this as my RV does not have this sticker.  From my point of view, and what I saw from the CAT  scale, no way this RV weighed under 14,050 when it left the factory.  My understanding,  the GVWR does includes the 55 gal of fuel that this sticker does not account for at all, thats another 330lbs. The real concern I got are with my rear dual tires and the potential random roadside weight check. I will be near 16,000lbs when fully loaded for travel for use 2 adults.
 
decaturbob said:
The real concern I got are with my rear dual tires and the potential random roadside weight check. I will be near 16,000lbs when fully loaded for travel for use 2 adults.
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It kinda is what it is. Best you can do short of trading for a Class A is address the tires as you mentioned. Immediately upgrade as necessary to have some margin at your estimated loaded operating weight. As for roadside weight checks I can't imagine that would ever happen
 
I used to subscribe to Motorhome Magazine and over the years, saw many reports of class C motorhomes being substantially over weight from the factory. They recommended weighing any class C before you buy. Kind of a moot point for you though.
I don't think you need to worry about roadside weight checks. My biggest concern would be keeping the appropriate air pressure in the tires, and making sure your tires are rated for the weight.
Edit:  Thinking more about this. I think MH mag actually recommende.d weighing any motorhome before buying
 
ChasA said:
I used to subscribe to Motorhome Magazine and over the years, saw many reports of class C motorhomes being substantially over weight from the factory. They recommended weighing any class C before you buy. Kind of a moot point for you though.
I don't think you need to worry about roadside weight checks. My biggest concern would be keeping the appropriate air pressure in the tires, and making sure your tires are rated for the weight.
Edit:  Thinking more about this. I think MH mag actually recommende.d weighing any motorhome before buying
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What happens when you assume that what is, really is what is. 
 
Back2PA said:
It kinda is what it is. Best you can do short of trading for a Class A is address the tires as you mentioned. Immediately upgrade as necessary to have some margin at your estimated loaded operating weight. As for roadside weight checks I can't imagine that would ever happen
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Looks like if I go to 235 or 245 series tire on the rear axle, I can hit over 11,000 load capacity at 80psi on the rear, though its over the rating of the axle, I have less concern for that than the load on the tires,  I know my speedometer reading wouldn't be accurate but it wasn't accurate before.  I need to educate myself on what part of the geometry will change be sure its no problem with rims or the wheel well, which I suspect will be fine.  The load on front tires can be handled by adding 5 more PSI, to take it up 70psi.  Just money right?
 
decaturbob said:
Looks like if I go to 235 or 245 series tire on the rear axle, I can hit over 11,000 load capacity at 80psi on the rear, though its over the rating of the axle, I have less concern for that than the load on the tires,  I know my speedometer reading wouldn't be accurate but it wasn't accurate before.  I need to educate myself on what part of the geometry will change be sure its no problem with rims or the wheel well, which I suspect will be fine.  The load on front tires can be handled by adding 5 more PSI, to take it up 70psi.  Just money right?
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Tires are the big one. You have a TPMS?
 
As mentioned you have to be real careful changing the size of tires on the duals.  Also you may want to consider adding rear helper Airlift airbags to help take some of the load off the rear springs.  This is not a fix for your GAWR issue, but can help drivability, reduce spring sag, etc.
 
Gary with this being a 2008 model, it may have been built a few months before the government mandated OCCC weight sticker was introduced, so might not have a UVW label, even though they were common industry practice before the government got involved in mandating it.
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If it is pre-OCCC labeling, it still has the RVIA mandated CCC label, as shown in ksmoody's message. Both have a UVW, but the CCC label is typically less accurate than an OCCC because it often did not include factory options.  The net difference between OCCC and the RVIA CCC value is the weight of propane, water and what RVIA calls SCWR (people weight).  If you add those in, ksmoody's OCCC would be 1660.

Since dakotabob says he doesn't have either label, one has to ask were he got the 11,860 UVW weight? If it came from a brochure or website, all bets are off.

My understanding,  the GVWR does includes the 55 gal of fuel that this sticker does not account for at all, thats another 330lbs.
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The UVW is supposed to include a full tank of fuel, regardless of whose label is used.    GVWR includes everything in or on the vehicle, no matter what.

It is what it is, and more tire capacity on the rear is about the only action that is practical to take (short of buying a new rv).  Not ideal, but it reduces the risk somewhat.  It may be possible to use a slightly wider tire, but a better choice is a higher load range in the same size. That will probably require new wheels on the back to accomodate the higher psi.
 
Gary RV_Wizard said:
If it is pre-OCCC labeling, it still has the RVIA mandated CCC label, as shown in ksmoody's message. Both have a UVW, but the CCC label is typically less accurate than an OCCC because it often did not include factory options.  The net difference between OCCC and the RVIA CCC value is the weight of propane, water and what RVIA calls SCWR (people weight).  If you add those in, ksmoody's OCCC would be 1660.

Since dakotabob says he doesn't have either label, one has to ask were he got the 11,860 UVW weight? If it came from a brochure or website, all bets are off.
The UVW is supposed to include a full tank of fuel, regardless of whose label is used.    GVWR includes everything in or on the vehicle, no matter what.

It is what it is, and more tire capacity on the rear is about the only action that is practical to take (short of buying a new rv).  Not ideal, but it reduces the risk somewhat.  It may be possible to use a slightly wider tire, but a better choice is a higher load range in the same size. That will probably require new wheels on the back to accomodate the higher psi.
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I got a great local commercial truck tire place that I will have some serious conversations.  No doubt in my mind the Tioga left the factory over the GVWR and my only recourse is to be sure I have tires that can handle the load.  Like I said before I have had 3 major trips in 3 years with no signs of issues of "overloading". But now I know and I must address it.  Sometimes being ignorant ain't a bad place to be.
 
This is interesting.  I have a 2012 Fleetwood Tioga Ranger 31N.  My sticker says factory weight was 13,180 pounds.  Gross vehicular weight is 14,500.  OCCC weight is 1,320 pounds, which I always figured was fine because I travel alone.

However, I also weighed my rig after driving it around the country for 6 years.  I can't find my records right now, but I was horrified to find that my vehicle weighed 400 pounds over the maximum, with all of it in the rear, the front being a couple of hundred pounds under.  I got busy and completely rearranged my basement storage, putting the heavy stuff in the two front basement storage areas and pass-throughs.  I moved my lightweight chairs, ladders, and such into the rear compartments.  I also did a thorough tossing of unneeded stuff.  However, no matter how hard I tried, I could not get the front and rear balanced according to the specs, probably because of my heavy electric bike on the rear.  I am a little reassured that I have driven this thing for 134,000 miles overweight and unbalanced.

I think some really good advice is for EVERYONE who buys a new vehicle to have it weighed the same day they drive it from the factory.  That would really be interesting--does the real factory weight match the sticker? 

The thing is, I have lots of storage space both in the underneath basement bins and in cupboards and closets inside.  I also almost never travel with any waste water and more than 1/4 tank of fresh water. 
 
JudyJB said:
This is interesting.  I have a 2012 Fleetwood Tioga Ranger 31N.  My sticker says factory weight was 13,180 pounds.  Gross vehicular weight is 14,500.  OCCC weight is 1,320 pounds, which I always figured was fine because I travel alone.

However, I also weighed my rig after driving it around the country for 6 years.  I can't find my records right now, but I was horrified to find that my vehicle weighed 400 pounds over the maximum, with all of it in the rear, the front being a couple of hundred pounds under.  I got busy and completely rearranged my basement storage, putting the heavy stuff in the two front basement storage areas and pass-throughs.  I moved my lightweight chairs, ladders, and such into the rear compartments.  I also did a thorough tossing of unneeded stuff.  However, no matter how hard I tried, I could not get the front and rear balanced according to the specs, probably because of my heavy electric bike on the rear.  I am a little reassured that I have driven this thing for 134,000 miles overweight and unbalanced.

I think some really good advice is for EVERYONE who buys a new vehicle to have it weighed the same day they drive it from the factory.  That would really be interesting--does the real factory weight match the sticker? 

The thing is, I have lots of storage space both in the underneath basement bins and in cupboards and closets inside.  I also almost never travel with any waste water and more than 1/4 tank of fresh water.
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Having learned what I  have in past 10 days, we can have little faith in what RV manufacturers indicate for GVWR and payload capability.  I would say before buying any RV, whether a MH, TT, or a 5th wheel you better have it weighed "empty".  I am at the crossroads of what to do. It will cost me $1600 to get 4 tires on the rear to be able to handle the actual weight on the rear axle. We have had it this RV for 3 years and have done 3 major trips with no problem and in 6 weeks take it to Florida.  I am almost willing to roll the dice and leave well enough lone BUT take what ever measures I can to reduce the weight of what I will carry as much as possible. Not going to be significant impact into the overweight condition as it stands now but I will feel like we are making an effort. In 2 years I will need to replace tires and at that time, I will probably go up in size on the rear.
 
I tried to get new tires with a higher load rating, but was told by two tire dealers that they do not exist, at least in my tire size.  They also said that going up a size in tires would not work on my motorhome because they would rub on various things. 

I am going to go on the knowledge that manufacturers of chassis, motorhomes, and tires do leave some room for error in setting weight limits.  I have had several blowouts, but two were due to Michelin sidewall blowout issues in 2012-3, one due to cutting it close to a sharp stone wall.  I also had one with no apparent reason, so I don't know.
 
Did a previous owner add/replace anything?  Heavy beds, Redo the roofing/flooring with thicker plywood?  Tile for flooring? 

Could you have several hundred pounds of mice hiding? ;D
 
JudyJB said:
I tried to get new tires with a higher load rating, but was told by two tire dealers that they do not exist, at least in my tire size.  They also said that going up a size in tires would not work on my motorhome because they would rub on various things. 

I am going to go on the knowledge that manufacturers of chassis, motorhomes, and tires do leave some room for error in setting weight limits.  I have had several blowouts, but two were due to Michelin sidewall blowout issues in 2012-3, one due to cutting it close to a sharp stone wall.  I also had one with no apparent reason, so I don't know.
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My rear wells have enough room to go up to a LT235/85/R16, my debate is spending $1600 in replacing 4 tires as no apparent issue due to overloading has happened.  For the time being, I am going back thru and removing/reorganizing what/where we carry items as well as adding more items into the tow Ford Escape tow car.  I have had my beast fully loaded and with water/waste tanks/gas tanks 100% full at times on 3 major trips with no issues but now that  I know, I will never be in that position again.
 
KandT said:
Did a previous owner add/replace anything?  Heavy beds, Redo the roofing/flooring with thicker plywood?  Tile for flooring? 

Could you have several hundred pounds of mice hiding? ;D
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previous owner replaced nothing and added nothing and why 100% certain Fleetwood built an RV that was overweight when it left their floor.
 
Gary RV_Wizard said:
If it is pre-OCCC labeling, it still has the RVIA mandated CCC label, as shown in ksmoody's message. Both have a UVW, but the CCC label is typically less accurate than an OCCC because it often did not include factory options.  The net difference between OCCC and the RVIA CCC value is the weight of propane, water and what RVIA calls SCWR (people weight).  If you add those in, ksmoody's OCCC would be 1660.

Since dakotabob says he doesn't have either label, one has to ask were he got the 11,860 UVW weight? If it came from a brochure or website, all bets are off.
The UVW is supposed to include a full tank of fuel, regardless of whose label is used.    GVWR includes everything in or on the vehicle, no matter what.

It is what it is, and more tire capacity on the rear is about the only action that is practical to take (short of buying a new rv).  Not ideal, but it reduces the risk somewhat.  It may be possible to use a slightly wider tire, but a better choice is a higher load range in the same size. That will probably require new wheels on the back to accomodate the higher psi.
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Gary,

Michelin Agilis CrossClimate 225/75R16C  121/120R has a higher load rating @ max psi of 83psi of 3085 lbs in a dual configuration.  Apparently the tread is "directional" but this can solve my issue for loads on the rear.  I don't have any knowledge of this Michelin tire for ride or road noise. 

This maybe something I would consider going to now, before we leave in December.
 
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