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Author Topic: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?  (Read 792 times)

scottydl

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Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« on: November 26, 2019, 02:50:06 PM »
Check it out: www.tesla.com/cybertruck

I'm not a fan of the name or the physical appearance (looks like a bad idea of what people in the 1970's-80's thought today's "future" flying vehicles would look like)... but the Tesla Cybertruck is advertised with up to 3500# payload and 14,000# towing capacity. Granted, I'm sure pulling that kind of load would seriously limit the mileage range-per-charge... but I'm pretty surprised that a consumer level Electric Vehicle is boasting that kind of towing ability. That matches or beats many 3/4 ton gas trucks (including mine) currently out there.
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Joezeppy

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #1 on: November 26, 2019, 03:00:39 PM »
Where's the Flux Capacitor?
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Barnibus

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #2 on: November 26, 2019, 03:10:06 PM »
I see 250 miles estimated range, and 7500 lb towing cap.
 
So, would like to see what the range might be while towing that 7500 lbs

Not sure it's quite ready for prime time.

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SpencerPJ

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #3 on: November 26, 2019, 03:19:10 PM »
But some of the solar guys, could have panels on their TT, and drive all day long, free   ;D ;D ::)
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scottydl

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #4 on: November 26, 2019, 03:22:29 PM »
Range is definitely the limiting factor. Let the fourth set (scrolling down) of images rotate and you'll see the 14,000# towing statistic, with an image of the truck pulling a futuristic-looking box trailer. Although I believe that image is likely computer generated at this point.
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SpencerPJ

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #5 on: November 26, 2019, 04:47:31 PM »
Ford f150 vs Tesla Cybertruck
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yo23xYwODdI
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Barnibus

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #6 on: November 26, 2019, 04:50:51 PM »
Ah, yes. The specs have three options in check boxes
Option 3 Tri-motor AWD shows 500 mile range and 14K towing cap.
option 2 dual motor AWD shows 300 m range and 10K towing cap.

So, the unanswered question is how much does actually towing to capacity affect the range.

I don't expect it is quite ready for extended travel with a TT or a 5W, just yet.

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Lou Schneider

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #7 on: November 26, 2019, 05:04:23 PM »
Towing a big, boxy RV trailer means you have twice as many wheels on the ground (double the rolling resistance),  2-3 times the total frontage area (wind resistance),  and 2-3 times the solo rolling weight.

This translates into needing 2-3 times as much power to move down the road.  Your range per charge (or fuel fillup) will decrease by a like amount.

Put a 14K iron beam on a flatbed trailer and you'll get better mileage because there won't be as much additional wind resistance.

This holds true regardless of motive power.  A gas or diesel pickup with less aerodynamics than the Tesla truck typically gets half or less of it's solo MPG pulling an RV trailer.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2019, 05:17:36 PM by Lou Schneider »

Barnibus

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #8 on: November 26, 2019, 05:13:16 PM »
Towing a big, boxy RV trailer means you have twice as many wheels on the ground (double the rolling resistance),  2-3 times the total frontage area (wind resistance),  and 2-3 times the total rolling weight.

So expect to get 1/3 to maybe 1/2 the range of a solo truck since you're using 2-3 times as much power to move down the road.

This holds true regardless of motive power.  A gas or diesel pickup with less aerodynamics than the Tesla truck typically gets half or less of it's solo MPG pulling an RV trailer.

So, using that logic 200 miles may be a good day running that kind of rig. With a G/D truck, you can just stop and refuel, and keep on truckin' But unless you can find a serious Flash-charging station every couple hundred miles, you're not going to get anywhere fast.
Take us a week to get across Texas.
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Lou Schneider

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #9 on: November 26, 2019, 05:16:28 PM »
So, using that logic 200 miles may be a good day running that kind of rig. With a G/D truck, you can just stop and refuel, and keep on truckin' But unless you can find a serious Flash-charging station every couple hundred miles, you're not going to get anywhere fast.
Take us a week to get across Texas.

And each time you recharge you'll have to drop the trailer first since I haven't seen any charging stations designed to accommodate a vehicle pulling a trailer.

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #10 on: December 02, 2019, 07:46:28 PM »
Our SIL works for Tesla, I asked him about the design, I'm not a fan for sure. It's that way because of the type of steel they used doesn't lend itself to stamping so it has straight lines, That's why when he hit it with the mallet, it didn't bend,,,gregg
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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #11 on: December 03, 2019, 06:34:15 AM »
FOr RV use.. there is a very logical way to extend the distance limits..  Put a good size inverter generator (i'm told these need 30-50 amps at 240 volt to re-charge) in the  bed of the truck with a lift/hoist system.. Even a smallr one may work (one you can lift out) now you gas up.  few gallons. drive way more than the charge limit since the generator is re-charging.  Gas up. run your RV all night at the truck stop. Gas up do day 2. and when you finally get to Group site in QZ.. you have power. (Set the generator out or just run an extension cord to the Rig and leave it in the bed._)
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cerd

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #12 on: December 03, 2019, 07:18:04 AM »
Our SIL works for Tesla, I asked him about the design, I'm not a fan for sure. It's that way because of the type of steel they used doesn't lend itself to stamping so it has straight lines, That's why when he hit it with the mallet, it didn't bend,,,gregg
I'm actually surprised that they didn't use aluminum or carbon fiber for the body, minus the box.

FOr RV use.. there is a very logical way to extend the distance limits..  Put a good size inverter generator (i'm told these need 30-50 amps at 240 volt to re-charge) in the  bed of the truck with a lift/hoist system.. Even a smallr one may work (one you can lift out) now you gas up.  few gallons. drive way more than the charge limit since the generator is re-charging.  Gas up. run your RV all night at the truck stop. Gas up do day 2. and when you finally get to Group site in QZ.. you have power. (Set the generator out or just run an extension cord to the Rig and leave it in the bed._)
I would think that there is a protection circuit preventing charging while it is running. That aside, I was doing a little math. Referencing the Honda UE7000 Inverter Generator, it uses 5.1 gallons for 6 hours of run time at a full 7200 watts (although the EU7000 is only rated for 5,500 watts continuous). So say it takes 8 hours minimum for a full charge due to limitations of generator, you are looking at a minimum of 6.5 gallons of gas, which equates to appx 30mpg. That's not bad, but I think some of the hybrids are close to that now and there is no need to charge. Just gas up and keep going. They are probably cheaper than a Tesla too.
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PancakeBill

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #13 on: December 03, 2019, 07:52:05 AM »
Reminds me of early computer gen vehicles in something like Minecraft.  2.9 0-60 for the trip-motor!  Wow, impressive.  I didn't click the buy now, I was afraid it might just auto withdraw my money.  What would these cost?
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Lou Schneider

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #14 on: December 03, 2019, 01:41:29 PM »
Tesla has already oversold their charging network.  Over the Thanksgiving holiday people were reporting half mile long lines for charging stations along I-5 and US 101 in California despite Tesla bringing in additional temporary chargers on a semitruck.

https://www.infowars.com/video-tesla-drivers-wait-up-to-an-hour-to-charge-electric-vehicles/


« Last Edit: December 03, 2019, 01:44:59 PM by Lou Schneider »

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #15 on: December 03, 2019, 02:17:21 PM »
I suspect that is only in California, here in the middle of the country I have yet to see a Tesla at any charging station other than at hotels.  One of the first ones in Louisiana is at a Target shopping center about 50 miles from where I live, with maybe half a dozen charging stations, which I have driven by many times in the last decade and have yet to see it in use.
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Arch Hoagland

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #16 on: December 03, 2019, 02:35:47 PM »
Tesla has already oversold their charging network.  Over the Thanksgiving holiday people were reporting half mile long lines for charging stations along I-5 and US 101 in California despite Tesla bringing in additional temporary chargers on a semitruck.

https://www.infowars.com/video-tesla-drivers-wait-up-to-an-hour-to-charge-electric-vehicles/


Thanks for the post , I've been wondering what happens at this time of the year. 
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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #17 on: December 03, 2019, 03:40:30 PM »

I would think that there is a protection circuit preventing charging while it is running. That aside, I was doing a little math. Referencing the Honda UE7000 Inverter Generator, it uses 5.1 gallons for 6 hours of run time at a full 7200 watts (although the EU7000 is only rated for 5,500 watts continuous). So say it takes 8 hours minimum for a full charge due to limitations of generator, you are looking at a minimum of 6.5 gallons of gas, which equates to appx 30mpg. That's not bad, but I think some of the hybrids are close to that now and there is no need to charge. Just gas up and keep going. They are probably cheaper than a Tesla too.

I do not see why that (Protection circuit) would be needed or why there could not be a way (For the company) to design so a generator would work around it.

And though you calc 30 mpg running ENTIRELY on the portable genny,  I'm talking about extending the range by use of the generator. You would still do your major charge at a "Charging station" This would be simply a range extender.

What car was it. The Chevy Volt or another that had a generator. for short hops you used only the battery but for a longer run the genny (Which only burned premium gas) kicked in?   Same idea. only a bit more practical
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Lou Schneider

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #18 on: December 03, 2019, 04:04:42 PM »
I do not see why that (Protection circuit) would be needed or why there could not be a way (For the company) to design so a generator would work around it.

Powering the pickup from a dirty, non-pollution controlled generator in the truck bed would ruin Tesla's green image and probably violate several vehicle emission laws.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2019, 04:09:44 PM by Lou Schneider »

SLOweather

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #19 on: December 03, 2019, 06:23:33 PM »
Heh. Those San Luis Obispo/Madonna Inn pics and vids are about 2 miles from here. We saw the unused charging trailer when we went there for breakfast on Sunday.

I was talking with a friend who works for PG&E yesterday. Tesla wants to add a lot more Superchargers to that site, so many that PG&E needs to reengineer their infrastructure to support it. That is a harbinger of things to come...

Tesla has already oversold their charging network.  Over the Thanksgiving holiday people were reporting half mile long lines for charging stations along I-5 and US 101 in California despite Tesla bringing in additional temporary chargers on a semitruck.

https://www.infowars.com/video-tesla-drivers-wait-up-to-an-hour-to-charge-electric-vehicles/
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glen54737

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #20 on: December 03, 2019, 07:03:57 PM »
I think you would need a charging station in addition to the generator, which would further reduce your payload. ;D

There are cars that are hybrids that plug in so you can go something like 25 miles without starting the gas engine. It might be cool if you had one that you could plug the TT into for boondocking.

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Lou Schneider

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #21 on: December 03, 2019, 10:12:46 PM »
I was talking with a friend who works for PG&E yesterday. Tesla wants to add a lot more Superchargers to that site, so many that PG&E needs to reengineer their infrastructure to support it. That is a harbinger of things to come...

Not as far off as you may think.  When SFO opened their new International Terminal building in December 2000 they had to decide by 4 AM each day whether or not they would need to air condition the sealed building.  The main power feed down the length of the peninsula was running so close to capacity there was a real danger of blacking out large areas if the airport tried starting the a/c plant after people got up and were using electricity.

I had a FM radio transmitter nearby on Mt. San Bruno and the remote metering told me of their daily decision - if the airport started the a/c the incoming voltage would drop so low for about 10 seconds that the transmitter would fall off the air and then recover.
« Last Edit: December 03, 2019, 10:43:27 PM by Lou Schneider »

cerd

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #22 on: December 04, 2019, 06:22:58 AM »
Powering the pickup from a dirty, non-pollution controlled generator in the truck bed would ruin Tesla's green image and probably violate several vehicle emission laws.

I do not see why that (Protection circuit) would be needed or why there could not be a way (For the company) to design so a generator would work around it.

And though you calc 30 mpg running ENTIRELY on the portable genny,  I'm talking about extending the range by use of the generator. You would still do your major charge at a "Charging station" This would be simply a range extender.

What car was it. The Chevy Volt or another that had a generator. for short hops you used only the battery but for a longer run the genny (Which only burned premium gas) kicked in?   Same idea. only a bit more practical
In addition to that, there is a chance that the onboard systems may feedback into the generator or power grid causing damage to the exterior power systems. I don't know how Hybrids and Electric vehicles charge at stations. There is no need to turn on the motors since you are parked while charging. I wonder if anyone has tried driving off while the car was plugged in; like when people forget to take the nozzle out of their gas filler.

The volt was kind of a joke in the sense that it only lasted 30 miles or so before the generator kicked in. From my understanding, most of the hybrids on the road use a generator to charge the batteries when they run low. In theory, you should be able to use an external generator, but the batteries in most hybrids/EVs use a different voltage and the onboard generators are custom designed for those vehicles. The BMW EVs use a battery thats about 400v. The "mild hybrid" systems that GM and RAM are offering in newer pickups run a 48v system.

I think if you need to extend your range, you'd be better off stopping for lunch and running the generator while you are parked, but not while driving. Who actually wants to drive 400 miles without stopping anyways?
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garyb1st

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #23 on: December 04, 2019, 02:01:10 PM »
Reminds me of a Wobbley Goblin on wheels. 
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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #24 on: December 05, 2019, 09:11:35 AM »

Thanks for the post , I've been wondering what happens at this time of the year.
.

We were in Quartzsite last winter.  On the day before Christmas we headed to Carl's Jr for lunch.  There's a 6 stall Tesla charging station behind the restaurant.  All 6 stalls were full and Teslas were backed up in a line clear out into the street waiting on a charge.
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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #25 on: December 05, 2019, 09:49:55 AM »
.

We were in Quartzsite last winter.  On the day before Christmas we headed to Carl's Jr for lunch.  There's a 6 stall Tesla charging station behind the restaurant.  All 6 stalls were full and Teslas were backed up in a line clear out into the street waiting on a charge.

That’s a good thing. Shows folks are embracing the new technology. Means more charging stations should be installed.
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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #26 on: December 05, 2019, 10:00:58 AM »
On our run across Nebraska I notice a lot of hotels now have Charging stations on their property.

Even a number of the lower-end, like Super 8 and La Quinta.

And, of course, the inevitable finder app on the web:
https://www.evgo.com/charging-locations/
« Last Edit: December 05, 2019, 10:03:21 AM by LarsMac »
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Lou Schneider

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Re: Tesla's Cybertruck - EV towing actually possible?
« Reply #27 on: December 05, 2019, 11:01:01 PM »
I see 250 miles estimated range, and 7500 lb towing cap.
 
So, would like to see what the range might be while towing that 7500 lbs

Not sure it's quite ready for prime time.

A couple of Tesla geeks tried towing a 4500 lb. V-nose horse trailer behind a Tesla Model X over a standardized 65 mile freeway loop.  The power consumption more than tripled compared to the solo car, along with a corresponding reduction in range.

Here's the video and yes, they did run out of battery.  They had to transfer the trailer to their SUV chase car and draft the Tesla behind it to reach a charging station.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhX3BmhJXc8

The same geeks then decided to make a trip from Denver to Portland towing a low profile camping trailer.  The Model X needed more than 7 hours of Supercharger charging time en route, increasing the trip time from 19 hours to 27 hours and creating lots of range anxiety.  They again offloaded the trailer to the chase car to make it to a charging station:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yjklex38lkQ

In other words, using an electric vehicle to tow a trailer is nowhere near ready for prime time.
« Last Edit: December 05, 2019, 11:47:09 PM by Lou Schneider »