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Author Topic: Wireless Router and Aircard  (Read 11524 times)

Poltax

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Wireless Router and Aircard
« on: August 28, 2007, 10:58:04 PM »
Please correct me if I am wrong.  I have gotten the impression from some of the posts that you can put your aircard in a router and have a wireless network in your MH.  If this is correct what brands of routers are you all using.  My aircard is AT&T.

If the above is not correct please explain your set up anyway.  Thank you
Dont drive faster then your angels can fly!!

RREngr

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #1 on: August 28, 2007, 11:12:51 PM »
Yes you are correct, I have one that I put my Verizon card in so my wife's Mac Pro can also get the wireless signal.

Rich
Rich & Kay

Tom

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #2 on: August 29, 2007, 04:12:36 AM »
The service used by an aircard router is known as EVDO. My understanding is that EVDO service is provided by Sprint and Verizon, but not AT&T or T-mobile. Here's a link to some EVDO information.

I have two options when we're on the road:

  • Air card with T-mobile, no router.
  • Direcway satellite internet dish and modem, with Linksys router.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2007, 06:55:46 AM by Tom »
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Ned

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #3 on: August 29, 2007, 07:10:04 AM »
The Kyocera KR-1 and Linksys WRT54-3G are two routers that will accept an aircard.  You can get the details at the respective web sites and find out if they will work with the AT&T aircard.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2007, 07:11:56 AM by Ned »
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
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Tom

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #4 on: August 29, 2007, 07:32:22 AM »
EVDO is CDMA based whereas AT&T and T-mobile are GSM based.
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Ned

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #5 on: August 29, 2007, 07:52:17 AM »
Yes, but the router doesn't know or care what the aircard does, only if it's a supported card.  The web sites list the supported cards with no mention of EVDO or GPRS/GSM.  I don't know who uses what card.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
1997 Holiday Rambler Endeavor LE
2007 GMC Canyon

Tom

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2007, 08:53:48 AM »
I would have said the same Ned, until I tried to buy one. The one sold at Fry's (can't recall the brand) was explicitly limited to EVDO. The Kyocera KR-1 router web page specifically states EVDO. The Linksys WRT54-3G product spec says specifically Sprint, but their list of Supported cards talks about Vodafone.
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Whodo

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #7 on: August 29, 2007, 08:58:52 AM »
AT&T, T-mobile etc are 3G/edge technology------ where as Sprint, Alltel, Verizon etc are EVDO/1xrtt technology. 3G and EVDO are not backwards compatible with each other. In other words you can not roam on a Sprint system with a AT&T aircard or visa versa.

Now as already mentioned a ROUTER does not know or care what operating system card is installed, IT ONLY HAS TO BE COMPATABLE WITH THE PARTICULAR AIR CARD. Not all routers are compatible with all air cards regardless of operating mode.
You need to go to the router manufacture and find out what Air Cards are supported by a given router.

Example: I have a EX720 Novatell air card (Sprint service) and a Global router, in order to use the EX720 card in the Top Global router I had to purchase an adapter, but the Sierra (AT&T service) air card that I have also will directly plug and play with the Top Global router.

Bottom line, yes you can use a router with a air card an create your own wi-fi system to operate more than one computer off a single air card.

Tom

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #8 on: August 29, 2007, 09:02:05 AM »
I had to purchase an adapter, but the Sierra (AT&T service) air card that I have also will directly plug and play with the Top Global router.

That's good to know. What adapter did you need to buy (make/model)?
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Ned

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #9 on: August 29, 2007, 09:06:41 AM »
Then, to answer the original question, it appears that the Top Global router will accept the AT&T aircard.  What is the model number of that router? Is it the MB6800 or MB8000?
« Last Edit: August 29, 2007, 09:17:19 AM by Ned »
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Clay L

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2007, 10:39:54 AM »
I would have said the same Ned, until I tried to buy one. The one sold at Fry's (can't recall the brand) was explicitly limited to EVDO. The Kyocera KR-1 router web page specifically states EVDO. The Linksys WRT54-3G product spec says specifically Sprint, but their list of Supported cards talks about Vodafone.

Tom I am not sure what they are trying to say,  but I am using the KR1 with my Verizon PC5740 aircard. It works with both the 1X (National Access) and  EVDO (Broadband Access) networks.
I have had 1X all summer and EVDo just got added to this area a few days ago and I have been connected all the time.
The KR1 now supports RevA aircards -  maybe that's what they are trying to say.
Clay (WA5NMR), Lee (Wife), Katie & Kelli (cats), Sali (toy poodle)
Settled down after full timing for eleven years and snowbirding for one year in a 2004 Winnebago 35N Sightseer, Workhorse W 20 Chassis. Honda toad

Tom

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2007, 01:33:37 PM »
Thanks Clay. I did intend to add a note saying "color me confused" to my prior post  ;D
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Whodo

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2007, 02:33:39 PM »
Ned --- I am using the Top Global 3G Phoebus (MB6000) router.
Tom --- I had to buy a pcmcia card adapter (XCA-3).
Now everyone must remember that not all routers are compatible with all air-cards. The air card manufacture has to write the soft ware for there air-card compatibility to the different routers. Prime example is my Novatell EX720 air card is not supported for use in a Kyocera KR1 router. I keep hearing that the next soft ware release will allow for its use, but I'm not holding my breath waiting for that to happen.
« Last Edit: August 29, 2007, 02:37:49 PM by Whodo »

Tom

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #13 on: August 29, 2007, 06:13:43 PM »
Thanks for the response and the clarification.
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Poltax

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #14 on: August 31, 2007, 10:40:40 PM »
Thank you all for you replies
Dont drive faster then your angels can fly!!

Tim Lassen

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #15 on: September 01, 2007, 12:38:03 PM »
I am confused.  We are looking at using an ATT or Verizon aircard.  My thought was to use in my computer as a backup to the satellite.  I assumed maybe wrongly that Marsha would have access by setting up a direct network between our two computers (peer to peer)or simple passing the card back and forth..manual sharing <gg>.  Our exisitng Linksys router (WRT54GC Compact wireless broadband router) would not be used.   From these messages it appears that there are routers available that will directly receive an aircard.
Allegro Bus
Full Time (Part Time) Still Married to Marsha

Ned

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #16 on: September 01, 2007, 12:51:25 PM »
Tim, you can do it either way.  Using the router allows both of you to be online at the same time.  You would need a new router to use the AirCard.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
1997 Holiday Rambler Endeavor LE
2007 GMC Canyon

Clay L

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2007, 09:35:58 AM »
I am confused.  We are looking at using an ATT or Verizon aircard.  My thought was to use in my computer as a backup to the satellite.  I assumed maybe wrongly that Marsha would have access by setting up a direct network between our two computers (peer to peer)or simple passing the card back and forth..manual sharing <gg>.  Our exisitng Linksys router (WRT54GC Compact wireless broadband router) would not be used.   From these messages it appears that there are routers available that will directly receive an aircard.

Passing the card back and forth got to be a pain for us.
I was successful in getting our peer to peer network configured for aircard internet sharing, but I had to reconfigure it again each time the laptops were turned back on and that was a major pain.
We now have a Kyocera KR1 wireless router with a Verizon aircard and the system works well so far.
The KR1 will accept the new USB aircards and will handle Rev A cards.
You just have to make the aircard you get is supported by it.

It will support the WPA-PSK security protocol. If you generate a passphrase composed of random characters using a web site like http://www.kurtm.net/wpa-pskgen/ or the KR1 web site, everything I have read says you will be secure enough.
Clay (WA5NMR), Lee (Wife), Katie & Kelli (cats), Sali (toy poodle)
Settled down after full timing for eleven years and snowbirding for one year in a 2004 Winnebago 35N Sightseer, Workhorse W 20 Chassis. Honda toad

Tim Lassen

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #18 on: September 05, 2007, 01:15:57 PM »
Clay and Ned..thanks for your replies.  I now need to decide between an ATT or Verizon card.  Clay..I am not familiar with the router that you cited.  Can you tell me where I can purchase?  tim
Allegro Bus
Full Time (Part Time) Still Married to Marsha

Clay L

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #19 on: September 06, 2007, 09:44:32 AM »
Clay and Ned..thanks for your replies.  I now need to decide between an ATT or Verizon card.  Clay..I am not familiar with the router that you cited.  Can you tell me where I can purchase?  tim

The router is a Kyocera KR1. I got it from the 3GStore at http://3gstore.com/.  They have a very good reputation for customer service and sponsor some forums dedicated to EVDO equipment for cellphones and laptops. My order was shipped the same day I entered it on their website.
A link to Kyocera is  http://www.kyocera-wireless.com/kr1-router
D-Link makes the KR1 for Kyocera but I did not consider the router they sell under their own name because oddly enough it does not support Rev A aircards and the KR1 does. (This is what D-Link said in two different email responses I got from them.)

I think Cincular/ATT probably has good coverage in general but there are a number of places I go where they don't have coverage. For example Bouse AZ is poor. Where we are now - Lake Cascade State Park near Cascade Idaho - I have 5 bars and Broadband Access.
To use ATT the campers have to go over to the hill above the boat dock.

I have also been getting broadband access in a lot of places where ATT has not yet added it.

I am sure the reverse is true in some areas, but for me Verizon is the right choice.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2007, 09:51:26 AM by Clay L »
Clay (WA5NMR), Lee (Wife), Katie & Kelli (cats), Sali (toy poodle)
Settled down after full timing for eleven years and snowbirding for one year in a 2004 Winnebago 35N Sightseer, Workhorse W 20 Chassis. Honda toad

Whodo

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #20 on: September 06, 2007, 10:33:44 AM »
I now need to decide between an ATT or Verizon card. 
I have a AT&T air card as well as a Sprint air card. I originally went with AT&T because we have AT&T phones, we found that AT&T is not really putting a effort into it's broadband system. It has great potential, but for some reason it is not being utilized. I purchased a Sprint air card and have found that Sprint is pushing its broadband system to its max. With Sprint you have EVDO roaming on Alltel's system as well as 1xrtt coverage for roaming on Verizon. I have yet to be any place that I wasn't able to get coverage (may of been slow 1xrtt signal but I had coverage). In 2 months when my contract with AT&T is up I will be dropping them. One more important item, NOT all air cards are compatible with all operating systems or computers. Make sure the air card (regardless of the service provider) that you chose will work with your computer and operating system.
As far as routers go, the router you buy will be depend upon what Air Card you purchase, different air cards, even though they are for the same service (Sprint, Alltel, Verizon, AT&T) do not all work with a given router. Select your air card, then find what routers will work with that particular air card. Some routers even though they will work with a given air card will have through put issues and really slow things down. If you go to http://www.evdoforums.com/ and start reading the post concerning different routers/air card combinations you will quickly become confused but don't give up you will quickly learn what will work with what with the fewest problems.

AlexSian

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #21 on: September 08, 2007, 10:00:20 AM »
Clay and Ned..thanks for your replies.  I now need to decide between an ATT or Verizon card.

As an RVer, your choice of carrier should be based on coverage. Having discussed it with many, many, many RVers who have called for pre-sales assistance, "Coverage" to an RVer typically means one of two things.

Some RVers want to know who has the largest 1xRTT network footprint?
They ask this because they know that where they travel rurally there is mostly slower 1xRTT network coverage.
My opinion is that the largest 1xRTT footprint is currently  Verizon.
Verizon, Sprint and Alltel all allow each others customers to roam at 1xRTT, but Verizon currently has more agreements with smaller carriers that Sprint does not.

Some RVers want to know who has the most High Speed BroadBand EVDO available?
These folks are more interested in having the fastest speeds in the most areas.
My opinion is that the largest EVDO footprint is currently  Sprint.
Aside from Sprint's native EVDO coverage, Sprint customers can roam on Alltel networks at EVDO speeds, where available.
Conversely, Verizon's customers can only roam on Alltel networks at 1xRTT speeds, regardless of EVDO availability.

What about ATT?
ATT's slower EDGE network is fairly expansive and comparable to 1xRTT in size, but on average it has not been as fast as 1xRTT.
ATT's faster HSDPA network is really poorly deployed and slow to expand. Really slow.
They don't use EVDO technology, so don't roam on Sprint/Verizon/Alltel.
While Sprint and Verizon proudly list their coverage info in press releases, ATT must be ashamed of their comparative information.
Sprint and Verizon boast that their EVDO is available to more than 200million people in US... last known claim by ATT was 100million, and most did not believe them.
What about speed? Isn't HSDPA faster? In theory, yes. The technology is capable of 7.2mb/s vs EVDO Rev-A's 3.1mb/s.
But the reality is, the carrier's implementation of the technology is what affects speeds you actually receive.
By far, EVDO Rev-A is way faster than HSDPA on average, and available in probably 10 times (or more) places than HSDPA, and the gap widens each week.

For those who wonder about bias of my opinion... 3gstore sells and supports devices and service from Sprint, Verizon, and later this month, ATT/Cingular.
We don't care which carrier you choose, but do believe you should get your service with expert support from 3gstore.  ;)

Since this is a forum post which may live forever, everyone who reads this MUST please understand that all carriers are CONSTANTLY expanding their native networks, and constantly negotiating new roaming deals with smaller carriers, or even buying up smaller carries and combining networks.
no longer working for 3G store

AlexSian

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #22 on: September 08, 2007, 10:09:30 AM »
Yes, but the router doesn't know or care what the aircard does, only if it's a supported card.  The web sites list the supported cards with no mention of EVDO or GPRS/GSM.  I don't know who uses what card.

hmm. i originally posted a link to a chart i maintain because i thought it would be useful information for all these folks who keep saying "don't know what card works with what router"..... the chart i linked to lists routers, and shows what cards/devices are known to work with them.

however... since ron doesn't feel its appropriate for me to have listed a link to that chart... all who are interested will just have to be resourceful and find it on your own (or maybe ask me privately for the link?)


In addition to the chart, here are some "cliff notes" for you:

The KR1 only works with certain Sprint and Verizon EVDO devices. Because it was the first consumer EVDO router, has been out for 18+ months, and is the least expensive, the KR1 is by far the most popular. But it does have its quirks, and is a little long in the tooth as far as technology goes. It may not represent the best purchase decision over the long haul.

There are now two different Linksys routers - one for all current Sprint EVDO PC cards (works with some verizon cards too, though only supported by 3gstore), and another Linksys that works with only the Sierra Wireless AC875 from ATT. While Linksys is the most recognizable brand of all 3G routers, these units are compatible with the fewest aircards, and updates to be compatible with newer cards are notoriously slow in coming.

The TopGlobal MB6000 works with all current PC cards from Sprint, Verizon, and almost all from ATT. So does the newer MB6800, but because it has USB port it works with more devices. MB6800 also has external wifi antenna which can be replaced with higher gain antenna, allowing for wider wifi range. The MB6800 is more conventionally shaped (not a pyramid like MB6000) and has 4 ethernet ports (vs. mb6000's one ethernet port).

Interesting to note is that the MB6800 works with EVERY currently sold EVDO device from Sprint or Verizon. Throw in the number of ATT devices it works with, and you have the most universal 3G router on the market. That fact is what TopGlobal uses to justify its higher price tag. Additionally, TopGlobal has been quickest to respond with new firmware to support new devices. 3gstore will be selling a new USB modem for Sprint service, called the Franklin CDU680, and TopGlobal worked with us to come up with a beta firmware to allow the CDU680 to work on MB6800, in very little time.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2007, 11:01:35 AM by EVDOinfo »
no longer working for 3G store

Whodo

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2007, 11:05:45 AM »
The TopGlobal MB6000 works with all current PC cards from Sprint, Verizon, and almost all from ATT.
Important note to remember: Most new laptop computers are now using the Express Card slots. TopGlobal MB6000 will only work with a "express card" type air-card when you purchase a very expensive PCMCIA adapter, without it, the TopGlobal is just another expensive paper weight. I know, I learned the hard way after purchasing the TopGlobal MB6000 from the 3gstore, I found out after receiving it, that I had to now purchase a PCMCIA adapter. PCMCIA or XCA-3 adapters are not cheap.

Tom

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #24 on: September 08, 2007, 12:19:58 PM »
... since ron doesn't feel its appropriate for me to have listed a link to that chart...

Don't blame Ron; He and the forum staff merely follow the forum rules. I followed the link in several of your messages and they led me to sales pages on your online store. That violates our forum rules that we all signed up for when registering for an account here.

The only "comparison chart" I could find contained side-by-side sales pitches. Do you by any chance have a non-commercial chart you could share, or is there a way you could extract the information that I'm sure will benefit a lot of folks? I believe you have a lot of information that could be shared with others, but our rules don't permit any kind of commercial ads or solicitations in forum messages. OTOH entering the URL for your web site in the space provided in your profile, as you've done, is acceptable as is including the URL in your signature line.

Appreciate your non-commercial posts to help raise everyone's understanding of this subject, including mine.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2007, 12:35:46 PM by Tom »
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KodiakRV

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #25 on: September 10, 2007, 07:42:21 PM »
Don't blame Ron; He and the forum staff merely follow the forum rules. I followed the link in several of your messages and they led me to sales pages on your online store. That violates our forum rules that we all signed up for when registering for an account here.
...
Not wanting to step into the middle of something here, but how is that different from Ron's link to his commercial "Satellite Internet Solutions" that is in each and every post that he makes?  (That site is, in fact, hosted my the RV Forum server.) 
Frank
Florida

Tom

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #26 on: September 10, 2007, 10:42:17 PM »
Frank,

The difference is that Ron & others do not post ads in the body of their forum messages. We (I) actively encourage folks to include a link to their web site in the field provided in their profile and in their signature line, as I did with EVDO. Folks who follow the rules don't tell members to "click here for information" as a camouflaged ad.

The "site hosted by the RV Forum server" is a few static pages that take up a miniscule fraction of resources. It doesn't begin to repay Ron for the huge amount of time he spends here tirelessly helping our forum members for no reward. FWIW  Ron didn't ask for those pages, nor did he ask that they be hosted on our server.
« Last Edit: September 10, 2007, 10:45:18 PM by Tom »
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Poltax

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Re: Wireless Router and Aircard
« Reply #27 on: September 30, 2007, 01:25:36 PM »
Finally got this all sorted out.  I picked up the Lynksys Router.  I scanned the internet for the best price.  Picked one up for less then $220 and that included frieght.  I spoke with 3G but they were not willing to match price & frieght.  The router is all set up, it was an easy process.  I didnt even use the included software.  Went to the Lynksys site and set up router that way.  I have noticed that it seems to download faster thru the router then putting the aircard directly into my laptop.

Thank you all for the info that was posted.
Dont drive faster then your angels can fly!!