fifth wheel lift

i have a 2007 f250 with a 6inch lift in the front and 4 inch in the rear is it possible to tow a fifth wheel toy hauler like this that weighs approximately 13,000lbs or is it possible maybe to do some kind of a lift on a fifth wheel (lift in the suspension or other) to get it tow level again with my lifted truck thanks for any suggestions Tom

Is the truck a diesel or gas, 2wd, or 4wd? 13000# is gonna be close to or maxed out for a 250 series truck. Another thing to consider, do you have over size wheels and tires with your lift kit? Larger than stock tires will change the final gear ratio, thus reducing your towing capacity. The tow ratings are based on how the truck came equipped from the factory. I know people sometimes "flip" the axles on campers to give them more clearance.

The Fords are already tall if it is a 4x4, so the lift exacerbates the problem.  You ca raise the trailer a similar amount, but be aware that affects stability because it raises the center of gravity on a rig that is already somewhat top heavy.

the truck is diesel, 4x4 crew cab,with banks big hoss bundle on the way. i have 37inch tires on it and have 4.30 gearing on it's way to get the final gearing close to stock, it's be a little bit shorter with the gear calculation thing my gearing would be 4.18 in a perfect world so i had a choice 4:10's or 4:30's from 3.73, anyone have any idea if i flip the axles on the trailer will it give me enough room?

Please be aware, that thru lifting the trailer you affecting the CG, and with lifted truck camper combination you creating a hell on the whells o windy days, a specially in cross wind.... Don't ask me how I know!. 

And you will probably still exceed the weight ratings of an F250.

Personally, I would seriously consider "returning" the banks setup. The 6.0L engines are pretty much maxed out from the factory - the ratings are about 1/3 more that the same engine in any International truck. You would be risking  doing lower end engine damage if you up the hp/torque much, and as for milage, you will probably loose.

As for flipping the axles, measure the thickness of the axle and that would tell you how much taller you would get - probably around 3 1/2".

Oh, and on the side - only Ford engineers can legally change your weight ratings.

Larry

Like others have indicated is sounds like your trailer may be too heavy for your F250.  Check the weight ratings on your truck and trailer using the GVWR, GCVWR.  Empty weight is just fiction and can get one into trouble if used when calculating weights.  I just isn't worth putting yours and anybody around you safety at risk by exceeding weight limits. 

Have you weighed your truck? The tow rating is for a stock, curb weight truck, so you must subtract the weight of all passengers, gear, lift, hitch, etc that will be in the truck. You will be very close to the limits of that truck, if you are within the towing capacities of the truck, then why the Banks kit? I personally just like to have a little reserve capacity, but if you are within the limits and legal weights, then there is not a problem. Weigh your truck as it would be for a trip, and subtract that from the GCVWR rating and see what you have left, then subtract at least another 10% for a safety margin. Also, you must factor in the pin weight to stay within the GVWR of the truck. Where will you be towing< mountains or flat? You really ought to weigh everything to be sure, I felt much better after weighing everything and confirming I was safe, and legal.

2006F350 said:

As for flipping the axles, measure the thickness of the axle and that would tell you how much taller you would get - probably around 3 1/2".

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Everybody refers to "flipping the axles" but the term really isn't an accurate description of what you do.  The axle doesn't change orientation at all - what you are really doing is better referred to as a "spring over" because you are moving the springs from being slung under the axle to being on top of the axle.  Understanding that also makes it easier to understand why the above quotation is not exactly correct in terms of the increase in height.  What you actually gain in height is the depth of the axle PLUS the depth of the spring bundle which typically totals more like 6 or 7 inches.  If you don't want that much of a lift what we did with one trailer we had was to cut the spring hangers off the frame, weld square tubing to the frame and then reattach the spring hangers to the square tubing.  This had the advantage of not requiring moving the spring perches on the axle and allowing us to obtain exactly the amount of lift that we wanted.

I just had a problem with my new 5th wheel because of the height of the new F150's. The rear of the box is about 2" higher than previous years, I'm not sure when the change was made. When you go over a bump or small hill the front of the truck goes down and the rear goes up and the tail gate gets close to the bottom of the trailer. Mine is a 6.5' box and with an 8' box it's worse. You need about 7" of clearance for normal conditions. On mine they changed the springs to get it up. If the front is too high it overloads the rear axle & tires also. On most trailers the axles & tires are just barely rated for the load anyway. They had lift kits already made up like he described above with the spring mounts already welded on. Another problem with lifting a trailer is the added leverage of the longer spring mounts. When you turn it pushes side ways and any sway also bends it back & forth. This will lead to frame failure from the constant side load. Just Google trailer frame failure and you'll see examples.
Get on the Ford website and find the Truck towing guide to find out where you really are about capacity. One thing I found is that wheel diameter has a big effect on tow capacity. Going from 17" to 18" you loose 500 lbs tow capacity.
I had to take my trailer back to Elkhart because of my problems and ran into a guy that has made a business of lifting trailers. If you go that route send me a message and I'll dig up his phone number, I don't remember it right now.

98greensi said:

the weight limit on a my f250 is just under 16,000lbs so my tow hauler with all my gear and 2 bikes might weight 13,000 it's just under 10,000 empty.  how is this over loaded and whats wrong with the banks set up it's just not a tuner. and i will also be upgrading the brakes this summer as soon as my garage gets built. i am a heavy  duty mechanic by trade

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The weight 16,000Lb weight limit to refer to, please clarify - is that the GCWR minus the actual truck weight or is that the GCWR on the door pillar?

If it is the actual weight available "after" subtracting the truck, you may be OK as long as the pin weight of the trailer does not exceed the weight rating of your rear axle (weight each axle separately, add the pin weight to the rear axle weight and it should not exceed the RAWR rating).

If the 16,000 is the actual GCWR of your vehicle, then lets look as some hard cold facts ---- your F250 4X4 is going to be around 7000Lbs give or take. You state your trailer is just under 10,000Lbs empty. Add the 7,000Lbs of your truck and 10,000Lbs of the trailer (EMPTY) and you have already exceeded the 16,000Lb GCWR of your truck. Now, if you say the trailer is 13,000Lbs loaded, take your 7,000Lb truck, add the 13,000Lb trailer, now your are at 20,000Lbs or 4,000Lbs over your GCWR.

Before you start running your foul mouth making remarks like you did, you better learn exactly what GVWR and GCWR means. I wouldn't make the 'overweight' comment just to hear my brains rattle. Upgrading your brakes will not do a thing to increase your weight ratings. As I mentioned, only a Ford Engineer can do that (legally).

As for banks bundle - are you willing to spend a couple thousand dollars to potentially shorten the life of your $15,000 engine? If you think banks will cover any engine damage if it is determined by Ford that the banks setup caused or contributed to the problem when you take it in for engine problems .... I have a very large orange suspension bridge on the west coast for sale - cheap!.

Larry

Folks,

Just a reminder of our forum rules regarding message content (click the Rules button in the toolbar above) and remember why we're all here. I've moved a message that violates our forum rules (sorry, I missed it earlier). If the discussion goes further downhill, I'll be forced to lock it.

first off the banks bundle has nothing to do with towing. more power thats it, i'm not going to be towing this trailer everyday, it's like my civic i had a good motor only 125,000kms and i swapped it out WHY because I CAN and wanted to go faster, the big brake set up ON the truck will slow me down (and compensate for the big tires) you know it's called braking not load limit. how would brakes increase my load capacity in any shape or form and your calling me the stupid one. if the engine blows ohh well time to build a new one, 15,000 is not that much and can rebuild it myself for at the most 2000 bucks if the block is not messed up. so why would i pay 15,000 bucks for something i'm gonna blow up and the new motor in the Civic has over 50,000kms on it and still running strong even with the mods i did and Nitrous


now the only thing i wanted to know was can a lift be done on a fifth wheel because this is a Rv forum not a diesel truck forum and what was involved and what cons and pros from from it not all this stuff... Thanks for the people that did help me answer my questions and too the others...........................

Another thought is to go to conventional hitch trailer. People like Equalizer make dropped hitches that are very sturdy. I have a friend that pulls a snowmobile trailer that's about 7000' loaded with a Dodge truck that is lifted and a Suburban. He uses different shanks for each. I believe they go up to about 12,000'.

thanks alot, rbell, i'm not usally an ass but some people on here are pushing my limits, thanks again for your thoughts and will check into the equalizer.