Author Topic: Weapons on board ?????  (Read 2636 times)

taoshum

  • ---
  • Posts: 679
Weapons on board ?????
« on: August 20, 2009, 12:48:34 AM »
Hello all,

My stepson is a Lt in the sheriff's department.  He has been in this law enforement business, including the SWAT team for years and has told us numerous times that we need to be "prepared" for the possibility that we will need to defend ourselves at some time in the future, especially as we get older.  Now we have a MH/RV and plan to travel to new places via hiways and might find ourselves in territory where the environment is not as safe or familiar as it is around home.

So we are taking some classes in self defense, not base on karate or whatever, but based on having a weapon closeby if needed.  We already understand much of the responsibility it entails and the dangers it introduces as well as the potential for self defense that it provides.  We are not young anymore and we are not going to be able to "outrun" anyone with a MH.   And, when we travel alone, let's face it, we are a noticable "target".  Plus someone already put a bullet through our windshield on the third day after we bought this rig as we were driving through a small town west of here.

I know I'm not the only person who has thought about this topic and there are others who have thought about it much more than we have so I'm hoping to hear about how other people address this issue....

I'm not a hunter so that is not a factor.  I know that it is strictly illegal to have weapons or even ammo in Mexico and Canada so that's a fact if you are going across the border.

I know other people have weapons on board, just in case... but others do not for equally valid reasons I guess, but if you do carry weapons, how do you do it?  Is it complicated to cross state lines?  Do you keep it handy at all times?  How do you keep it from being used against you?  Or, protect it from theft?  Do you get a license of some sort?

If the admin folks think this is too sensitive, please delete the posting.

thanks, Gary.
Started this in April 09
with an 07 Itasca Meridian 34/89 Jeep Wrangler
Learnin' from everyone

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 25184
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2009, 12:57:53 AM »
Gary, try searching for prior discussions on this subject and you'll find some interesting discussions. We don't carry weapons on board and, except for a brief period when we used the RV in hunting season, haven't seen the need to be armed. OTOH we have friends who wouldn't travel without their arsenal.
Tom.   Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

Marsha/CA

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 2021
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2009, 07:28:11 AM »
Gary,

Yes, this seems to be a personal sensitive subject; and as Tom has pointed out, you can search for prior discussions we've had on here.  There are lots of different opinions.

FWIW, we carry a handgun in the coach when we travel.  HOWEVER, it's in a locked gun safe with a "finger tip locking sequence" so we can open it fast; but an intruder would have a hard time opening it quickly.  It's hidden in the coach.  I hope we never have to use it.

The best thing we can do to keep ourselves safe is to be very aware of where we are and what is around us.  We very seldom park overnight in parking lots or off on the side of a road.  Lots of RVers park in Walmarts and we have done it on occasion.  However, I would not park in a Walmart alone, while others might be comfortable with it, we don't. 

Just recently we disembarked from the ferry from Newfoundland, Canada.  It was 2 AM and we didn't want to pull into a campground that late, so we opted to spend the night at grocery store parking lot.  This is a little community that is very used to motorhomes coming off of the ferry at all hours of the night, so we felt very safe staying there.   So for us knowing where we are and what is around us is our way of trying to stay safe.  We also have a dog and I think he is a big deterrent with his deep bark.

The most important thing is to have fun and enjoy this great adventure.

Marsha~
Allegro Bus Diesel Pusher with Hyundai Tucson SUV toad. 
In case of necessity, alternate form of transportation is available in the form of 1 horse.

Wizard46

  • ---
  • Posts: 153
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2009, 08:05:15 AM »
The bed shelf that our mattress rest on is a little larger than our mattress. Just bigger enough that my Ruger in its holster fits there just fine. I dearly hope that I never have to use it but I sure sleep better knowing its there. It really is a personal thing and I respect other peoples rights to make their own decision. However I do believe that anyone owning a firearm should have some type of training. In Georgia anyone applying for a hunting license for the first time is required to take a safety course.
Jerry & Patsy
2002 Winnebago Brave 32V
Ford F53 V10 chassis
2006 Ford Explorer 4X4

RV Roamer

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 17813
  • RV Roamer [Gary]
    • Brinck's Home Page
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #4 on: August 20, 2009, 08:31:04 AM »
We do not carry a weapon (yet, anyway).

Here is some info on carrying a firearm in an RV across state lines:

http://www.handgunlaw.us/documents/USRVCarCarry.pdf

http://www.woodalls.com/shop/display.cfm?productID=25Q4&subcatname=RV%20%26%20Camping%20Books
Gary
--------------
Gary Brinck
2004 American Tradition
2007 GMC Acadia
Homebase: Ocala National Forest, FL

Ernie n Tara

  • ---
  • Posts: 29
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #5 on: August 20, 2009, 09:27:51 AM »
For those who do decide to carry a weapon:

If you live in one of the civilized parts of the country (e.g. not on a coast - FL, etc. excepted), you'll find that reciprocity is pretty much the standard for licensed carry.  In Texas, the license is good for four years and we found the training was extremely valuable (even though I grew up with weapons around) I strongly recommend taking the training, even if you'll never leave home with the weapon.

Ernie

Learn to use it properly & continue to practice.
Ernie 'n Tara
Leonard, Texas
2006 32' Pursuit by Buddy Boy
Ford chassis, TPS, Scan Gauge

geodrake

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 1415
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #6 on: August 20, 2009, 10:30:22 AM »
When we travel there is a loaded weapon right next to me.  There is another in the drawer next to the bed.  At home weapons are also placed where they are most likely to be needed.  I am licensed for concealed carry and frequently do so.   

There are states (IL & WI come to mind) where it is illeagle to have a loaded weapon in a motor vehicle.  There are also states that do not recognise other states concealed carry permits.   The book titled "2009 Traveler's Guide to the Firearm Laws of the 50 States" (see RV Roamers link above) provides specifics for each state, including those with concealed carry permit reciprocity agreements. 

In most states (probably all) it is perfectly legal to have loaded weapons in your home.  Once parked, your RV becomes your home.  But, some State Parks do prohibit them. 

Certainly, the biggest question about having weapons for protection is weather or not you are willing to take the life of another person.  Finding yourself in a situation to use a weapon is not the time to ponder this decision.  That is likely to get you killed.  In highschool I worked for a man at a filling station.  The first night on the job he was showing me around.  When he came to the cash drawer he opened the drawer all the way exposing a loaded pistol.  He said “if you pull it out use it, if you are not going to use it leave it where it is.”  I regard that as very good advise……………. A gun should never be pulled as a threat.  When you pull a gun use it.  And if you are going to shoot someone shoot to kill.

Pretty heavy stuff.  Stuff that needs to be carefully considered by anyone choosing to be armed. 

Every night on the news there is always multiple instances of violent crime.  It seems to have few boundaries and it seems to be getting worse.   
George & Ruth Drake
Olathe (KC suburb), Kansas
2002 Itasca Sunrise 32V

Camp Hosts at Caloosahatchee Regional Park, Alva (Ft. Myers) Florida

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 25184
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #7 on: August 20, 2009, 10:51:21 AM »
Something I was told by a long-time handgun owner some years ago ....

"If, in the dark of night and the intensity of the moment, you miss, you might kill your neighbor in his bed."  :o

Sounds like that could be equally true in an RV.
Tom.   Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

WeatherWunder

  • ---
  • Posts: 69
  • Lincoln, Nebraska
    • WeatherZone 2280
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #8 on: August 20, 2009, 10:54:03 AM »
If you do keep weapons on board, please be sure they are locked up from children.  We just had an instance in Nebraska where two children got ahold of a gun in and RV and a 13 year old ending up killing a 10 year old with the weapon.
Wife Wendy
Dog Roscoe
2005 Dodge Ram 1500
2010 Keystone Passport

kevin

  • ---
  • Posts: 519
  • Tom Sawyer Rv Park-West Memphis
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #9 on: August 20, 2009, 10:58:11 AM »
not sure I would worry about what states have what laws on concealed or not? Many if not all truck drivers carry, and with good reason. If it makes you feel more secure, then carry, if not then don't. end of story

I do agree that anyone carring needs training with that gun, and as stated above needs to know if they are willing to use it to  take someones life, to protect your own. But hey if you hear me late at night outside, please don't shoot, I'm probably just getting a cold one outta my Ice chest(I leave it outside)  ;D
still waiting on that winning lotto ticket

Mc2guy

  • ---
  • Posts: 531
  • Whoso would be a man
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #10 on: August 20, 2009, 11:00:03 AM »

Every night on the news there is always multiple instances of violent crime.  It seems to have few boundaries and it seems to be getting worse.   


I am by no means trying to make this political, but the actual violent crime rate in this country had decreased steadily and significantly since the early '90s.  This is by no means to say it isn't out there, nor am I saying you shouldn't protect yourself.  However, I think the prevailing sense that "it's getting worse out there" is a response to increased media coverage, not reality.  Here are the most recent numbers:

http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/cvict.htm

I do not carry a firearm for many of the reasons Geodrake mentioned...but most noteably because I have young children and therefore will not have a firearm out in the open.  If you are carrying a weapon for self defense, a weapon locked in a safe is not likely to be very useful given how quickly attacks can/do occur. 

Christian, Jenn, Holden, and Emerson
2009 Winnebago Sightseer 35J (F53)

2008 Trek Fuel EX9
2008 Mercier Serpens 30LTD

clarkgriswold

  • ---
  • Posts: 113
  • 1999 National Dolphin
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #11 on: August 20, 2009, 11:04:48 AM »
It's a shame that this has to be a 'sensitive' subject considering the fact that this was meant to have been settled several geneartions back with an amendment to the Constitution.  However, I'll keep to the point.  In reading over several of the post I'll agree that holding a permit to carry a weapon is generally accepted via reciprocity in most honorable states.  

And although I would hate to accidentally kill a neighbor, I likewise do not want to have a reason why I did not protect my family - that would not be an accident.  Sorry if that's off the topic.
"That's nothing to be proud of Rusty.  ......fifty yards."

Wendy

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 6103
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #12 on: August 20, 2009, 12:31:20 PM »
Keep in mind that loaded weapons are not allowed in national parks. There have been attempts to allow carrying concealed in NPS sites if it's legal in the state where the park is located but I don't believe there has been a final resolution. That means that under the 1980s ruling you're allowed to bring guns into parks and refuges only if they are unloaded, stored or dismantled.

Wendy
Wendy, Mike, and Gordon
~We can't be lost because we don't care where we're going~
Here's where we are http://map.datastormusers.com/user2.cfm?user=2276
2004 Winnebago Sightseer
1973 Sunshine Yellow VW Bug

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #13 on: August 20, 2009, 01:16:00 PM »
Geodrake, you're a good guy, and knowledgeable in the subjects where I see your posts. So, I hate to take issue with you, and not strongly, even then. You said,
Quote
He said “if you pull it out use it, if you are not going to use it leave it where it is.”  I regard that as very good advise……………. A gun should never be pulled as a threat.  When you pull a gun use it.  And if you are going to shoot someone shoot to kill.

Agreed strongly, right up to the last sentence. Shooting to kill is not generally advised. And, there is a superior mind-set, both for legal and for strategic purposes. Shoot to resolve the threat, instead. It gives you more shooting opportunity, longer list of effective hits, and saves time which is ordinarily in short supply. And, it is a lawful intention in almost every state.

In every state, killing another person is Homicide. It is the degree of the charge that we care about. The "degree" we are looking for is some variation of "Justifyable" or "Excuseable." Those are not crimes and there is no criminal penalty. The "State of Mind" of the shooter can be a determining factor and "Shooting to kill" is not acceptable. "Shooting to Stop the Threat" is in most states, acceptable. (Often called "Shooting to Stop.") (I like "Shooting to Resolve the Issue.")

Ray D  8)
« Last Edit: August 20, 2009, 01:20:06 PM by Ray D »
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

napalm204

  • ---
  • Posts: 25
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #14 on: August 20, 2009, 01:29:30 PM »
Frankly, I like what one contributor said about the constitution and how it addresses this issue. I also wonder why such a topic should be offensive or sensitive.  Kinda' like the phrase, "In God We Trust." And I often wonder how many students and others would have not died at VA Tech if another student had been able to end it with his/her own weapon.  Just wondering......

Heck, in Texas we are considering putting a sign up at the state line that reads:

IF YOU DO NOT HAVE A GUN, WE WILL ISSUE YOU ONE."

Just joking.  I know many people are adamantly opposed to gun ownership.  And once I returned from Vietnam I gave up hunting, all my guns and all aspects of gun usage, although I am not against that right and respect those who wish to own one.

This thread started with one forum member who'se relative is in law enforcement and sees daily the underside of society that we rarely ever see.  I think he is correct that in a year's time many of us will have had an experience where we wished we had a weapon for protection.

Let's hope and pray it does not become a recognizable need for those of us who enjoy this RV freedom so much.

Mark R.

  • ---
  • Posts: 559
  • 1986 Executive Industries 1967 Ford Fairlane,toad
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #15 on: August 20, 2009, 01:51:19 PM »
In the whole country I can only think of one place I would not want to be found with a gun, that is NYC, last I new 1 year in the slammer , no excuses accepted, mandatory time. At least this is what I think I have heard.
If you do not stand behind our troops please feel free to stand in front of them!

Mc2guy

  • ---
  • Posts: 531
  • Whoso would be a man
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #16 on: August 20, 2009, 02:45:56 PM »
I also wonder why such a topic should be offensive or sensitive. 

Because like religion, people have their personal beliefs and tend to hold them very dear.  The issue is still hotly debated in the courts in various spots across the country and various rulings move the needle in one direction or the other, but it is by no means "settled".  It also closely parallels political affiliations, which means this discussion invariably bleeds over into political debate (forbidden on this forum). 

Let's hope and pray it does not become a recognizable need for those of us who enjoy this RV freedom so much.

I think we can all agree on that. :)
Christian, Jenn, Holden, and Emerson
2009 Winnebago Sightseer 35J (F53)

2008 Trek Fuel EX9
2008 Mercier Serpens 30LTD

geodrake

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 1415
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #17 on: August 20, 2009, 02:59:47 PM »
RayD, we are in concert.  The object is to stop the perp.  However a wounded drug crazed individual is not likely to stop if only wounded.  Certainly, in court after the shooting, the answer needs to be "I intended to stop him".   
George & Ruth Drake
Olathe (KC suburb), Kansas
2002 Itasca Sunrise 32V

Camp Hosts at Caloosahatchee Regional Park, Alva (Ft. Myers) Florida

Mr Bojangles

  • ---
  • Posts: 274
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #18 on: August 20, 2009, 03:07:29 PM »
I have been in situations (not RVing) that had me very scared for my life.... it had to do with roving gangs (kids) years ago. (I was where I should not have been). And, I have watched TV replicas of what people (groups) can do....

I keep an UNLOADED weapon with me when I Travel in case I encounter the same kind of situation (very unlikely, but never want that to happen)
Today I Boondock 9 nights out of ten (Wal-Marts, fringe of Truck stops, bank parking lots, Glacier Point parking lot at Yosemite Nat'l park, most anywhere I can park when tired. These locations can be isolated at times.... if a "group" senses no law and they want something inside, they will act. Calling 911 will not do it.... but if I honker down and wait inside it will scare them when gun goes off is how I'm thinking..... and I strongly believe I'll shoot to "STOP" if they continue.

I could not take pistol (not allowed) into Canada on last trip, so, I carried my rifle (unloaded) in Trailer, filled a form out, paid $25.00 to Canada and was able to cross border (June this year).
When asked WHY I wanted to bring rifle, I knew not to say "protection". I just said I always travel with weapon in trailer.

Now The young female Officer explained I could take the gun into the woods to protect me from animals if I had to enter woods (I could not hunt, just keep for my safety against animals). Then she made an unkind and judgemental comment  (my interpretation) that I would not be encountering animals in Calgary (my destination).
I let remark go... not wanting to argue. But the animals I'm afraid of are in every large city.


   
 
Jim O
Dodge Ram 3500 4X4 Quad Long bed, -6.7L Cummin's Diesel, 3.73, Laramie.
2006 R-Vision Trail-Sport TS19RDB ...... 14 trips out.... 51,000 Miles -South to Key West, SW to Gulf...w to Texas, NW Oregon, across Canada's middle.
EQUALIZER -Model # 90-00-600
Honda 3000W Generator -Inver

kevin

  • ---
  • Posts: 519
  • Tom Sawyer Rv Park-West Memphis
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #19 on: August 20, 2009, 08:43:16 PM »
Ray I gotta disagree on that one, I would shoot to kill and here is my reason.

OK first off your gonna get sued If the survive they will sue you, if they die, someone in their family will sue you.
Now I feel like I could take it better if it aint the sorry ...you know what that was tryin to rob me, there for, shoot them, and anyone with them. ;D
still waiting on that winning lotto ticket

taoshum

  • ---
  • Posts: 679
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #20 on: August 20, 2009, 08:59:32 PM »
I forgot to inquire about caliber... 32, 380, 38, 40, 357, 45, 9mm, ...revolver/semi-auto... too many choices...

 I don't know what is going on with ammunition these days but there is none available in our little town.    The shelves are, literally, bare at Wally World.  We called the Lt and he is able to help us out for the class. 

thanks for the discussion, it is very, very informative for me.

Started this in April 09
with an 07 Itasca Meridian 34/89 Jeep Wrangler
Learnin' from everyone

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #21 on: August 20, 2009, 09:14:11 PM »
Kevin, that's kinda hard to respond to.  :-\ But you will do what you will do. Fortunately, the liklihood of this event is low.

I want to come through the event, first of all, alive, preferably uninjured. Secondly, I'd like for everyone else to make it, also. (Yes, including the Bad Guy.) Thirdly, I have very little I am willing to fight for. Everything is insured. That leaves my wife, two dogs and a cat to fight for.

I have much more unpleasant experience than is fair, for one person, quite a bit more training than most, and a drive to avoid any trouble I don't have to accept. If I don't have to do any of that, ever again, that will be just fine with me.  ;D

Ray D  ;D
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #22 on: August 20, 2009, 09:32:27 PM »
taoshum, you asked,
Quote
I forgot to inquire about caliber... 32, 380, 38, 40, 357, 45, 9mm, ...revolver/semi-auto...


They will most likely discuss that in your class. A  few notes, my opinion:

Avoid the 32. It is notoriously ineffective with a sad history.  >:(

Be ware of 357 and 9mm, if you will be using a gun for home defense. They penetrate well beyond what is needed and useful, and endanger innocent people down range. 9mm can be made safer by ammo selection. You can discuss that in your class. There is no redeaming the 357, for potential inside work. You can, however, use 38 special in a 357, and be careful about selection, for bullet type. I suggest Glasser Safety Slugs. They stop, when they hit almost anything, under most circumstances. Of course, any bullet that misses your target is a hazard, down range. Have a backstop, or don't shoot!

Semi Auto is fast, carries larger ammo loads, more compact, more complicated, a bit more inclined to malfunction - vs - Revolver which is almost perfectly reliable, a little larger and heavier, generally, and uncomplicated to operate and maintain (foolproof). I have both, depending upon where I am going and how I am dressed.

Ho hum, what shall I wear, today?  :D  ::) ::)

Ray D  ;D
« Last Edit: August 20, 2009, 09:43:19 PM by Ray D »
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 25184
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #23 on: August 20, 2009, 10:17:00 PM »
I kid my SIL because he wears a Leatherman and mini mag lite on his belt.
Tom.   Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #24 on: August 20, 2009, 10:53:57 PM »
 :D :D
Quote
I kid my SIL because he wears a Leatherman and mini mag lite on his belt.


Get used more often than a gun!  ;D :D
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

Howard Rawley

  • ---
  • Posts: 166
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #25 on: August 20, 2009, 11:05:17 PM »
I kid my SIL because he wears a Leatherman and mini mag lite on his belt.

My kind of guy!  Me too.   ;D

Howard
2001 Fleetwood Southwind 35R
V10   F53
Pueblo West, Colorado

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #26 on: August 20, 2009, 11:10:42 PM »
taoshum, sorry, I can't help myself.  :D

Don't worry too much about the gun selection. It's a  lot like RVing, or any other hobby/interest. There aren't enough toys to satisfy the need  interest. If you like the venue, you will need another gun, and then another. You will have all of the calibers and two or more of some of them. You may have more ammo than Cabellas has. But that ain't what gets you!  ::)

Holsters get you. I have more holsters for each of my guns, than I have guns. For each gun, you need a hip-holster for the belt. You need a pocket holster! You need one that goes on the belt, but inside the pants, for concealment. Also, you need one for the ankle, under the arm, small of the back, and more. You will need some nice ones, too. That would be like alligator, for the side, shark skin for the ankle and small of the back. You will need a Dick Tracy rig for the shoulder and more, and variations for each gun. You need a  >:( BLACK  >:( holster, for each! That is because black is mean! I have more money invested in holsters than I ever did in guns.  :D

Edited: I just realized! I need a leather hip-holster for my J Frame Smith, stained to match the colors on my motorhome!  ::) ::)

Then, you need belts. You need - - - never mind, I'm going back to my corner!  ::)

Been passing guns down to the kids. (These kids are 49, 50, and 51 but they are still my kids.) I load them up with holsters!  :D :D :D
« Last Edit: August 21, 2009, 12:00:25 AM by Ray D »
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

taoshum

  • ---
  • Posts: 679
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #27 on: August 21, 2009, 10:18:07 AM »
Ray, you sound like my stepson... his gun safe is so large, when they moved last time, they had to hire a crane to lift the safe into a big truck and then unload it at the new house...  What is your favorite?
Started this in April 09
with an 07 Itasca Meridian 34/89 Jeep Wrangler
Learnin' from everyone

Mark C

  • ---
  • Posts: 43
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #28 on: August 21, 2009, 02:05:39 PM »
Been passing guns down to the kids. (These kids are 49, 50, and 51 but they are still my kids.) Ray .how would you like another son.I really wouldn't mind being the youngest. I sometimes do take a pistol with me when camping. I have a ccp and a membership at a pistol club. What really scares me are the people who take guns and have not practiced in a long time. I think most people are not as good of shot as they think they are.
2009 Silverado 2500HD crew cab  6.0L
2008 Puma 28 bhs

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #29 on: August 21, 2009, 02:11:09 PM »
I went back and reread your original post. I will try to answer your question with that in mind.

My favoite gun? All of them! That's easy.

I have 8 guns left, with two of those scheduled to be handed down, as soon as I settle an argument in my own mind. The kids stayed up to date in my vigilante days, that's 10 years; and then my volunteer PD days, 10 more years. I lived in a nice, middle class neighborhood, that turned very dangerous when hostile, drug dealing gangs moved in and tried repeatedly to "take over." The kids all want the "experienced" guns. I suppose those guns will become family legends. That's fine.

You indicate that you are more interested in a gun for travel in a motorhome. You, also, mentioned that someone fired through your windshield. I strongly advise against engaging in a gun fight between moving vehicles. If you want to pursue that type of preparedness, you need specialized training for that, and at least two guns. I had that problem as a constant threat, in our cars, and used a 357 mag, revolver and a 357 mag Winchester 94, Trapper, "car guns." One stops the vehicle, blocking as much traffic as possible. Then one uses the revolver for cover, getting to the carbine. The carbine is used to keep the fight at a distance until help arrives. Training for this is a bit rough and tumble. Those guns are not, otherwise, weapons of choice for self defense. Avoid areas where this is a hazard, and skip the preparations for it. YMMV

My "favorite" for ordinary carry was a Colt, Officer's Model, 45ACP, stainless, very lighty modified by an experienced, locally renowned, gunsmith, for concealed carry, quick access and smooth draw. Recently my oldest son "inherited" it. It had become unmanageable for me, due to weakening wrists as old age takes its toll. Too painful to shoot. I really hated to see it go. My 9mm Glock 26 moved up, into the vacancy. It is unmodified. Comes ready to go, right out of the box.

Our RV guns are J-Frame S&W Revolvers. Mine is an Airweight, hammerless. It's a mean little gun and it hurts to practice, due to recoil. My wife's gun is stainless, with a hammer. Heavier, more friendly to the shooter. They are revolvers for reliability, particulary for sleepy, clumsy hands, when things go bump in the night. They are modified with Crimson Trace laser sights. They are loaded with Glasser Safety Slugs, for limited penetration and ricochet resistance, in a motorhome. Both are experienced guns, and we have confidence in them. Great for defense. Really bad choice for offense. If I must take the fight to the enemy, I'll use the Glock.  Again, YMMV.

There is no safe way to do a gunfight.  ::)

I hope this is useful to you.

Ray D  ;D

 
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #30 on: August 21, 2009, 02:12:50 PM »
 :D :D :D

Mark, I'll put you at the top of the list of "adopted sons."

 ;D ;D
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

Steelers1407

  • ---
  • Posts: 27
  • 11 years until retirement
Choosing a firearm and Shoot to kill vs. Shoot to stop
« Reply #31 on: August 27, 2009, 07:56:37 PM »
First let me say, I am a 19 year active duty LEO just waiting for my time to retire and become a fulltime RVer.

When selecting a handgun, select a quality brand name Firearm. The qualities you are looking for are Safety, dependability, and ability to stop the threat. A few years back My partner and myself were the first to respond to a scene of a shooting. After everybody was secured, the suspects were not cooperative and would not tell us where the gun was. Needless to say, we had to find it then. By this time, about eight of us were there. Unknown to us, the gun was wrapped up in a lightweight jacket sitting on the trunk of a car. One of the officers picked up the jacket. The gun fell out, hit the ground, and discharged. One of the other officers was shot in the groin. He eventually turned out to be ok and continued his career with no problems. This is why you NEVER buy a cheap gun. If you are unsure about what to buy, just contact a reasonably sized PD and find out what they carry. PD's conduct a lot of research on the weapons they carry and anything a cop carries, is going to be a good bet and will meet all of the criteria. Now, you must also carry decent ammo. Again, find out what kind of ammo a cop is carrying. Now some ammo is not available to the general public but most is.

Shoot to kill vs. shoot to stop....Let me explain why this is important. I have been trained to "Shoot to stop", never shoot to kill. In some states you can actually shoot someone to protect property. in most states, you cannot do this. Let's say you are in my state (Ohio), if someone were to look out of there house and see someone breaking into your car. let's say you come out of the house and for whatever reason you shoot the perp and he dies (I would hope nobody would do this in any state regardless of the law). If you say "I shot to kill" you have just set up yourself to face a murder rap vs. Voluntary manslaughter. One will get you a few years in jail. The other is going to get you a minimum of 15 years.

Jeff


Mr Bojangles

  • ---
  • Posts: 274
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #32 on: August 28, 2009, 04:48:17 AM »
Hello again all:

All post were good for me.... knowledge shared appreciated.
I have wanted to share an experience I had while traveling recently, one which made me glad I was carring a weapon. This last post (a week after last post in thread) renewed my resolve to express (relate) this event in STORY form. It would be based on this true happening as I recalled it, and, putting on paper would provide a growth challenge for me.   
I'll be back.....
Jim O
Dodge Ram 3500 4X4 Quad Long bed, -6.7L Cummin's Diesel, 3.73, Laramie.
2006 R-Vision Trail-Sport TS19RDB ...... 14 trips out.... 51,000 Miles -South to Key West, SW to Gulf...w to Texas, NW Oregon, across Canada's middle.
EQUALIZER -Model # 90-00-600
Honda 3000W Generator -Inver

kevin

  • ---
  • Posts: 519
  • Tom Sawyer Rv Park-West Memphis
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #33 on: August 28, 2009, 08:18:17 AM »
ya gotta love our country though, criminals have more rights than the vic. If we could only go back to removing fingers everytime your caught stealing something maybe things would change ;D
still waiting on that winning lotto ticket

Dick Zeiter

  • ---
  • Posts: 110
  • Ready to Go Bluegrassin'
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #34 on: August 28, 2009, 11:49:05 AM »
...we are taking some classes in self defense...

Spend the extra time and money to get a carry permit (if offered in your state).
Both of you should get one in case you are in the toad and had to stow it while running into a store with a Gun Buster Sign and she's in the vehicle with a weapon and no license.

I doubt I'll carry much, but, it's comforting to know I can should I find myself in a bad area from which I can not readily exit. We got our carry permits this year primarily to add a legal buffer for the weapon we keep in the bedroom of the motorhome. It also demonstrates our support for the NRA and their fight for our rights.

Remember: When seconds count, the police are only minutes away.
Dick Z. in Toledo Ohio
2000 Dutchstar
90 nights/year vending at Bluegrass Festivals or boondocking on the way to & from.

Mr Bojangles

  • ---
  • Posts: 274
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #35 on: August 28, 2009, 11:51:15 AM »
Here is story....
Let me know if it was readable and/or entertaining.

                                                                                  "The Story"
I had spent an hour in Cloverdale, CA., filling up fuel, talking to people in and out of gas station’s store front, just relaxing after hours of driving north on Rt. 101 from San Francisco. Now all this time my TV’s tail gate is down, exposing tools and an expensive generator. Additionally, I had climbed up into truck to fill generator with gas, and this activity brought more “eyes” on equipment. It was early evening and community was alive with farmers and “farm help people” coming in and out of the gas station.
In the course of my conversations I had given my plans of travel up to, and along coast to a few people. Most of course were envious, expressing the desire to be able to travel this way; just stopping where convenient to observe the beauty of California’s coast. And I must admit that my “personality” needs to tell others of my good fortunes. I tend to brag.

This road, SR128, is a twisting and narrow road, with young trees overhanging the road providing a canopy which blocked direct sunlight. It is a lonely road, and even more lonely and ominous during the closing hours of the day. Occasionally, driveways leading to farms and sparsely placed homes would allow glimpses of grape vine fields and rolling hills as I moved northwest towards Ft. Bragg. I would never reach the coast this evening, turning back in fear, seeking the familiar, a community where people existed, something other than the unknown of this road.

I left Cloverdale, beginning the climb into the hills allowing cars to pass me whenever I could by pulling to right, at spots designed for that purpose. Traffic became infrequent, and maybe a half hour into climb, I noticed a car following, but not interested in passing. After providing this vehicle enough chances to pass, I pulled over and stopped, making them pass my “Rig”. As the car passed in a normal manner, I saw a low “banger’s” type vehicle, and in it were four young males. I then reentered the road, traveling a few more turns, maybe a mile more, and there was the same car, pulled over in an area to the side, making me pass them.
Now at this point my instincts (and fearful personality) started the wheels turning. I recalled my activities at the gas station and it entered my mind that I may have been identified as a target, someone traveling alone, with an RV that might be attractive & exciting to young men on the prowl and up to no good.  

In front again, and not liking it, I traveled a few miles then I pulled over and stopped for a second time in a driveway. Looking in the driver’s mirror, a few moments passed before their car rounded a curve and slowly approached.  Now in my mind my worse fears were confirmed. I positioned my cell phone to my ear, removing it in a manner that would have allowed them to see I had this phone, but removing it just as they rolled along side my driver’s window. My intent was to pretend I did not want them to know I was on the cell phone, thus creating a sense that I was talking to someone about the situation.
The car pulled along side me slowly and I watched the passenger roll his window down in preparation to talk, and it entered my mind that they would block my path back to the highway. At this moment I made up my mind to just ram and push them away if the driver angled his vehicle anywhere near my front path. I was confident this powerful truck I was driving was up to task.
Now you must understand I’m a bluffer, I’m good at it, all my life I have been proud of my ability to get quiet and look unafraid at moments like this, moments of real or imagined danger.
I reluctantly gave the passenger my attention as he said most respectfully:
“Excuse me sir, do you know if this road goes to Mandocino?”

I did not vocalize my response, but rather shrugged my shoulders and slowly shook my head. There was a moment of silence and slowly the passenger realized that this was the extent of my willingness to exchange information. His body returned forward and the vehicle moved off slowly to the north. I brought the cell phone to my ear and leaned my head out in an exaggerated effort to read the license plate, as I mouthed an imaginary number to an imaginary person. I did not see if I was observed, but that was my intent.

Was the car and it’s passengers following me? I do not know. It was at this moment that I decided to turn back. Slowly I proceeded to a point where the road provided a turn around. I never seen that vehicle again, and driving south, back the ten miles I had traveled, parking in the lot of Cloverville’s police department; was what was necessary to give me peace of mind.

Was I correct in my conclusions regarding those young men? I’ll never know. But that night as I went to sleep, I was glad my rifle was in trailer.
Mr. Bojangles


« Last Edit: August 28, 2009, 11:54:07 AM by Mr Bojangles »
Jim O
Dodge Ram 3500 4X4 Quad Long bed, -6.7L Cummin's Diesel, 3.73, Laramie.
2006 R-Vision Trail-Sport TS19RDB ...... 14 trips out.... 51,000 Miles -South to Key West, SW to Gulf...w to Texas, NW Oregon, across Canada's middle.
EQUALIZER -Model # 90-00-600
Honda 3000W Generator -Inver

crosscountry

  • ---
  • Posts: 194
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #36 on: August 28, 2009, 01:08:07 PM »
I don't carry outside my state.  I live 10 miles from a state that does not recognize my permit.  However, I have often carried in the other state by mistake.  I almost get an ulcer before I get over the border.  I don't want the hassle or expensive due to carrying in states that don't recognize my permit.

this debate has been raging for years and the only true answer I believe is what are you comfortable with.

I carry a billy tire jack next to my door, obtained at most truck stops for $12. The billy jack is a very small baseball bat used to check your tires. Of course it doesn't do me any good when I'm away from the MH.  I try to be very vigilante however when your tired or having lots of fun it is easy to become complacent.  You can leave your steps up so people can't get up close to the door. (don't forget them on the way out as I did), only open a window to talk to someone not the door.  Leave the door light on at night (annoying to lots of other campers).  Have a motion sensing light by the door. I've heard of people putting 14" or larger shoes by the door.  Also, a large dog bowl of water and a lease hanging off the door handle.

I know many people that carry.  They claim it is there home and they have the right to do so.  How will anyone know if you  are armed, shoot someone, an accident, etc.  I have heard the stories as you probably have, judged by 12 rather than carried by 6.  My 2nd amendment right and so on.

Good luck with your decision.

You could get a nasty dog or one of those fake recorders.
Russ, - WB3FQI/6

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #37 on: August 28, 2009, 03:08:53 PM »
Jim, you asked for it, so i will give you a critique.  ;)

First, well and interestingly written. I'd write a few stories, but I get too wordy - even when someone just asks me the time. Your story was long enough to develop an understanding and short enough to be quickly read.

For advice, always follow your instinct, when your spider-sense is tingling. It is probably correct. When you percieve a threat, move to safer ground.

In my drug war days, my Subaru XT was shot, 4 times - 4 occasions. My Subaru Station Wagon was shot once. My pickup was shot once, resilting in no damage, if you don't count my face. The shooter, a drug gang enforcer stuck a gun out the window suddenlly, at point bank range and took a shot at me. The bullet missed, in the open drivers window and out the open window on the passenger side, but I had powder burns  on my face. Still pick little specs of burned powder out of the left side of my face, from time to time. Police got him, and he is still in prison, last I knew.

Police advised me, when suspicious of a car following, make a random turn. I f he follows the turn, make another. Third time he follows, he's a real threat. Then go to nearest police station if possible, while talking to 911. Alternatively, pull into a crowded parking lot, while giving your location to the operator. Better safe than sorry

Ray D  ;D




« Last Edit: August 28, 2009, 03:15:22 PM by Ray D »
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #38 on: August 28, 2009, 03:18:41 PM »
Previous post was very difficult to accomplish. Wouldn't let me scroll down. I typed some, in the blind. Then it wouldn't let me type any more, at all. Wouldn't let me edit.

WhadIdo? If this continues, it will solve my "wordiness" problem!  ::) ::)

Ray D  ???
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

Ned

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 12373
  • Ned and Lorna are fulltime RVers travelling the US
    • Have you seen Rolling Stock?
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #39 on: August 28, 2009, 03:44:18 PM »
Ray, if you're using IE 8, turn on compatibility mode for rvforum.net.  It's a known bug in IE 8 and affects a number of web sites with text editors.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer since 1997
1997 Holiday Rambler Endeavor LE
2007 GMC Canyon

See where we are

rsalhus

  • ---
  • Posts: 761
  • '01 Rexhall Vision DP
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #40 on: August 28, 2009, 03:47:34 PM »

Ray, read this thread or else try it again after hitting the Compatibility View button.  It involves a scrolling bug in the IE browser software.

http://www.rvforum.net/SMF_forum/index.php/topic,22076.0.html

Rolf Salhus
Currently at:  The Resort, Mesa, AZ

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #41 on: August 28, 2009, 03:51:57 PM »
OK, just switched to IE 8, yesterday. Where is the compatibility button? And, I will read the thread as advised. I think I remember such a thread.

Ray D  :-\
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

rsalhus

  • ---
  • Posts: 761
  • '01 Rexhall Vision DP
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #42 on: August 28, 2009, 03:55:14 PM »

Two buttons to the left of the red X on the second line from the top towards the right center (on my screen anyway).
Rolf Salhus
Currently at:  The Resort, Mesa, AZ

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #43 on: August 28, 2009, 04:04:02 PM »
OK, I see it. Thanks! Now, hope I can remember it!  ::) ::) ::)
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

Ned

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 12373
  • Ned and Lorna are fulltime RVers travelling the US
    • Have you seen Rolling Stock?
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #44 on: August 28, 2009, 05:02:03 PM »
Ray, once you set compatibility mode for the forum you don't have to set it again.  IE will remember it.  It's on the Tools menu.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer since 1997
1997 Holiday Rambler Endeavor LE
2007 GMC Canyon

See where we are

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #45 on: August 28, 2009, 05:12:46 PM »
Thanks.

Did it.

Gonna check it out.

Trying, now.



Going.

Going.

So far so good.

I'm thinking it works.

Still going.

I think I'm happy.

 ;D

 ;D
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

Mr Bojangles

  • ---
  • Posts: 274
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #46 on: August 28, 2009, 05:35:01 PM »
crosscountry:
Quote
this debate has been raging for years and the only true answer I believe is what are you comfortable with.
Amen....

Ray D:
Appriciate your input.... I also suffer from "wordiness" syndrome and "story" served two purposes..., justify carrying weapon, and exercise to improve writing efforts...  it will happen, but, I can not keep using forums.
Jim O
Dodge Ram 3500 4X4 Quad Long bed, -6.7L Cummin's Diesel, 3.73, Laramie.
2006 R-Vision Trail-Sport TS19RDB ...... 14 trips out.... 51,000 Miles -South to Key West, SW to Gulf...w to Texas, NW Oregon, across Canada's middle.
EQUALIZER -Model # 90-00-600
Honda 3000W Generator -Inver

Poltax

  • ---
  • Posts: 46
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #47 on: August 28, 2009, 11:23:34 PM »
Just reading thru all the posts on this thread.  I find it very interesting that very few actually answered the OP's questions.

Here is my advice on what to do:
Go to your local gun shop or range,  Many will allow you to try or rent weapons for your see which ones feel more comfortable when using.  This is very important as you must be comfortable with your choice.  What works for me may not work for you and visa versa.

Make a firm decision on your choice, then go and obtain training in how to handle your weapon.  This would be in how to operate and maintain.  Then sign up for training in how to operate, function, and decide what to do in various situations.  If you do not do this then when your under stress your likely to make some mistakes.  These courses will also help you in the mindset that you need to deal with what ever situation may occur.  Remember, your in a defensive mode.  You have no back up, nor do you have an unlimited resupply of ammo.  Sometimes the best offense is a good defense.  Maybe you situation will be  better to back away from the situation.  The training you receive will help you to make these choices.

Check out your states CCW laws and also obtain the laws for all 50 states.  Some states will recip with your state.  Others will not.  Some of those that do not recip,  will allow you to obtain a non resident permit.  Make sure you understand all the laws, and which states allow you to travel in and how your weapons can be carried.

Once you receive your training continue to train on your own and also with other courses.  Practice, practice, practice..... If you full time there are many facilities around the country that you can use, or sign up for.  Just google firearms training.

Someone in an earlier post mentioned they travel with an unloaded weapon.  You might as well not even carry.  If a situation should occur you will not have the time to find your rounds and load.

Do not travel to Canada, or Mexico with weapons or ammo.  Make sure you fully understand the laws of each of those Countries.  Canada will allow long guns but not pistol.  Mexico is a no go on weapons and ammo.

With all that said, the best advice and go get some training, more training, practice, practice, practice.
Dont drive faster then your angels can fly!!

crosscountry

  • ---
  • Posts: 194
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #48 on: August 29, 2009, 11:21:36 AM »
A handy tool to have is a shotgun.  A pump shotgun is very loud when you pump it inside your rv in the middle of the night.

If for some reason you need to show it or tell you have it with you then you can claim it is to go TRAP SHOOTING.

However, before you show it take the infrared scope off and the mag lite.

Russ

crosscountry

  • ---
  • Posts: 194
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #49 on: August 29, 2009, 11:59:07 AM »
check these sites out for additional information:

http://www.usconcealedcarry.com/public/department10.cfm

Select the state you are in and see states that will honor your permit.

http://www.handgunlaw.us/

Russ
« Last Edit: August 29, 2009, 12:04:04 PM by crosscountry »

taoshum

  • ---
  • Posts: 679
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #50 on: September 01, 2009, 12:37:57 AM »
First of all, Thanks for all the thoughts and stories!  We finished our CC class last Friday at the local shooting range.  Both of us passed with 100% of the qualifying rounds on the target.  The classroom sessions were very helpful and covered many of the topics that are in this thread.  The instructor was a retired state department security chief and had some chilling stories.  Now he has a security alarm response company.  Just encountering him in full field equipment would get me to "give up".

We fired 380's, 9mm's, 38's, 45's all in revolver and semi-auto.  Just have to remember the "safety circle" and a load of other things.  He demo-ed a 45 cal silencer as well.  There were tactical reloads, speed reloads, and even some close quarter drills, even though he said most "situations" take about 3 rounds max to resolve.

Learning the details of the laws in NM was a real eye opener.   We have reciprocity with 20 other states which  seemed low but  what do I know... at least all of our bordering states reciprocate.  I also ride a motorcycle from time to time and was amazed to find out that "any motorized conveyance" is an extension of your home... so whatever you can do with weapons in your home, you can do in your vehicle, even without a ccp, at least in NM.

Seems like this thread oughta be a tutorial somewhere, it is so insightful, so thanks again to all.

Now we have to make some decisions.
Started this in April 09
with an 07 Itasca Meridian 34/89 Jeep Wrangler
Learnin' from everyone

tomtownod

  • ---
  • Posts: 8
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #51 on: September 03, 2009, 09:16:54 AM »
I have been considering caring a weapon for protection and several friends in law enforcement suggested that I take a shotgun there are several reasons but a few were the sound of racking a shotgun will stop most intruders if you have to fire the sound is much more terrifying and most people without training and practice could not hit a target the size of a person under the pressure of the moment.

Tommy T  2006 Magna

taoshum

  • ---
  • Posts: 679
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #52 on: September 03, 2009, 03:08:22 PM »
re: shotgun

yes, it has a distinctive sound and throws a big pattern... if you have the space, if you can get to it quickly, if the confrontation is not in close where the person/animal you are trying to protect yourself against can knock the gun away, if you can swing the barrel around to fire at additional targets, ... RVs are roomy but not as roomy as we might think.  I'd borrow one of each, handgun and shotgun and practice some in the situation you think you might encounter.  JMHO, FWIW.
Started this in April 09
with an 07 Itasca Meridian 34/89 Jeep Wrangler
Learnin' from everyone

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #53 on: September 03, 2009, 03:47:50 PM »
The shotgun is simply not a RV protection weapon. Will work fine, in most stick houses. For an RV, it is too long for the confines, too slow to bring it up and into action and too slow to get to, to start with. Yes, the racking sound is blood-curdling, especially in the dark. But, once you rack it, you're just about done as far as bringing it to bear in tight quartrs.  :(

Just to run the rest of the table, put the rifle behind, well behind, the shotgun for home defense, either in a stick house or in an RV. Same problem as shotgun, plus the bullet is going to go through the target and then, a lot of walls. Includes neighbor's walls as well as your own.  >:(

Taoshum, you seemed to have learned some, in that class. Good for you!  ;D

Handguns are made for that application. And, to echo a previous post above, by Jeff, buy only the top of the line brands. Cost a little more. Buys reliability. But then how much is your life worth?   ;)

Ray D  ;D
« Last Edit: September 03, 2009, 03:50:24 PM by Ray D »
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

marine422

  • ---
  • Posts: 63
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #54 on: September 04, 2009, 07:23:54 AM »

 Gary , You did not mention where you were from and of course every state is different.  I lived in NY which was hard to get a carry permit unless you owned a business, but it depends on which county you reside because when we moved north an hour that county only issued full carry. (I don't understand that because it is still all NY and is good throughout the state) except the city. I moved to NC and within 3 month total (after taking a class) had my concealed carry which is honored in 38 other states.

  I believe it should be nationwide, but anyway , I was at a gun show and an elderly couple were there for the same reason you are asking about and they bought a shotgun , which you may have even in NY without a permit. I myself have a Mossberg 500 with pistol grip handle.

 If you get your permit(which I recommend) A good weapon for close quarters is a Taurus "Judge" , comes in different barrel sizes, will use a 45 slug or 410 shotgun shell. It is also a revolver ,so if you do not have experience with guns it may be to your advantage to get a revolver rather than an automatic which may jam. You can Google it and watch the video.

Brett

DonTom

  • ---
  • Posts: 1550
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #55 on: September 04, 2009, 07:36:39 AM »
Ray I gotta disagree on that one, I would shoot to kill and here is my reason.

OK first off your gonna get sued If the survive they will sue you, if they die, someone in their family will sue you.
Now I feel like I could take it better if it aint the sorry ...you know what that was tryin to rob me, there for, shoot them, and anyone with them. ;D

So true. Read this story--watch the U-tube.
-Don- Reno, NV
-Don-   AA6GA

2000 Fleetwood Tioga 24D, 7.4L

SSF, SF, CA or Reno, NV

taoshum

  • ---
  • Posts: 679
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #56 on: September 04, 2009, 06:21:11 PM »
We aren't sure what we are going to do but if we cannot find any ammo, and the shelves are bare around here, I guess it doesn't make any sense to look at guns.  I ask the Wally World sporting goods manager when they might get some 45 ACP ammo and he said "we had some on Monday, three cases, and by noon it was all gone".  My DW suggested that we could, LOL, throw the gun at 'em if we can't find any ammo.

Makes me wonder why?
Started this in April 09
with an 07 Itasca Meridian 34/89 Jeep Wrangler
Learnin' from everyone

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #57 on: September 04, 2009, 08:20:25 PM »
taoshum, you've mentioned looking at big box stores for ammo, and coming up empty. Even if ammo were in plentiful supply, I would not buy it at a large department store. It is likely to be old, stale, and cheaper brand. I don't want my safety to be dependent upon 2nd grade ammo. It is more likely to missfire or hangfire or fail to load in a .45. If the sound of a gun being fired is frightening, I'll tell you that a more terrifying sound when you are trying to fire any gun is a "click." Nothing quite like it.  :o

Try smaller, gun stores. Gotta be some good ones, there. If they don't have what you need, they will order it.

Also, you can buy ammo on line. I have never done that and don't know what hoops one has to jump through. But I have friends and associates who do it regularly. Google Handgun ammo.

I have no interest in any business, but would suggest for a .45 that you consider Federal Hydroshocks or Federal Personal Defense Ammo, (PDA). The PDA has slightly less powder and a slightly lower weight bullet. In .45, they are also affectionately known as "The Flying Dinner Plate." When they expand, they are huge! Last I knew, they had the highest "one shot stop" rate of any handgun ammo.

A second suggestion would be Glasser Safety Slugs, (in blue.) They fragment, when they hit soft tissue or a hard surface. They penetrate less, but still plenty, especially in .45 caliber. The benefit is a harder hit, when the bullet fragments in soft tissue and in the case of a miss, less likely to penetrate walls or even windows, with lethal force still in them. The downside is that this ammo is spendy enough to curl your hair!  :o Use something else for practice. (I do have Glaser Safety Ammo for our RV guns.)

An additional benefit to the smaller specialty store is that you may meet some skilled gunsmiths. Good to know when a gun misbehaves.  ::)

Let me know if I made a sale, here.  :D ;D

Ray D  ;D
« Last Edit: September 04, 2009, 08:30:10 PM by Ray D »
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

pedataa136

  • ---
  • Posts: 76
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #58 on: September 07, 2009, 09:45:39 AM »
I never leave without my Glock .40 cal.Unloaded.Can get it fast enough if needed.

BruceinFL

  • ---
  • Posts: 1531
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #59 on: September 07, 2009, 11:17:06 AM »
Check with Cabela's for ammo too. Cabelas Most ammo has come back to normal supply except for .380 which is still hard to find but stocks are increasing. The good part about short supplies of ammo is that what is on the shelf is probably fresh. Also. make friends with the sporting goods clerks at Wally World. Maybe they'll let you know when a shipment comes in. Usually gets there at night but they can't sell until 7:00am. If you're not there, it'll be gone in a flash.

Be very wary of foreign made ammo. Try to buy American if you can.
Bruce A.
2004 Alpenlite Valhalla 29RK 5W
2005 Ford F-350 SRW 6.0L

codgerbill

  • ---
  • Posts: 58
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #60 on: September 07, 2009, 12:40:12 PM »
As a person who does not own a gun or rifle and has not fired one since his days in the military I am wondering if there is some other way to protect onself and ones family? I am referring to maby taser gun or maby something to stun? Rubber bullets? Something non lethal that might get the job done.
2000 Winnebago Adv 35U
2007 Jeep Wrangler Sahara 4 Dr
Chocolate Lab ( Buddy)
She who must be obeyed

Ray D

  • ---
  • Posts: 1554
  • Jasper
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #61 on: September 07, 2009, 01:45:05 PM »
Quote
I am wondering if there is some other way to protect onself and ones family?


codgerbill, the world is full of other ways. The most effective is actually, easy to do. Just don't be where the trouble is. Sounds simplistic, but it isn't. We all have a "sixth sense," that cautions us sometimes that something isn't right. Pay attention to it, and give it its due. Be aware of your surroundings, always. Leave when you become uncomfortable. The Bad Guy is looking for a victim who is asleep or blissfully unaware. Take a few seconds to look around, now and then.

The most effective weapon I have ever had is a Boxer - a dog. Mine were trained, in the midst of unavoidable trouble, but that really isn't necessary, as dogs know all about that, when they are born. Any medium to large sized dog is a "protector," and far more accurate and effective than a gun. Any small dog is a "warning system," a burglar alarm. Ordinary "Obedience Training" is sufficient for a protection dog.

In order of effectiveness/usefulness, I place the gun and training for it, next. Now and then, caution and a dog are simply not enough. That is where the gun comes in. Others place little or no value on the gun, and the need for it certainly is rare. So, they might be right. I carry a gun, and have been where the rubber meets the road, many times. --- Just unlucky?  Don't know. Got the caution. Got the dog. Got the gun. Got the T-Shirt.

Non lethal weapons are not, in my opinion, good substitutes for the ordinary person. The taser, for example, is wonderful for cops. Solve a lot of problems at little cost and are rarely fatal. Great tool. An untrained person using the same weapon may have it fail, or turn on him. I have a lot of guns, and no tasers - no pepper spray.

You have unconventional weapons strewn around your house and RV. Tools, of all types - kitchen knives, etc, - anything heavy is a blunt intrument. Virtually all of them are legal to own, but legally become lethal weapons when used to threaten or injure another person. You need no permit to own those. You need to think about how one would use them, from time to time. (Become aware of their potential.) I have used that type of weapon, effectively.

Martial arts can be effective. Takes years of training, practice, more and continuous training. I have had some of that, and have relied upon it a fair number of times. It is no less dangerous/lethal, than a gun. If you don't want that for an everyday hobby, don't even bother to start.

Some things to think about.

Ray D  :)
« Last Edit: September 07, 2009, 02:30:59 PM by Ray D »
Boise, Idaho. U.S.A.F. Vet. Damon Challenger, Workhorse/Vortec, 2005 towing a Suzuki XL-7, 2003.

pedataa136

  • ---
  • Posts: 76
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #62 on: September 07, 2009, 03:34:22 PM »
All the diligence in the world may not be enough.The bad guy is usually faster,meaner and more ruthless.He is stalking you,not you him.I'll take handgun insurance anyday.

KodiakRV

  • ---
  • Posts: 1492
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #63 on: September 08, 2009, 01:10:24 PM »
...Also, you can buy ammo on line. I have never done that and don't know what hoops one has to jump through. But I have friends and associates who do it regularly. Google Handgun ammo. ...
Ray D  ;D

I've never had a problem with CheaperThanDirt.com.
Frank
Florida

Sarah

  • ---
  • Posts: 8
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #64 on: September 11, 2009, 06:23:25 AM »
Thanks for asking this question because I was wondering myself.  When I told my dad that we are going to travel the States he told to get a will.  My husband has a gun licence as he like go shooting, mainly roo's and rabbits.  From reading this topic we might have to get some sort of weapon for protection.  Is it really that dangerous over in the USA?  We dont really have much problems with gangs or anything over here.  What about the wild animals over there, do you have many problems with bears and wild dogs ect?  Now I'm scared.

1joester2

  • ---
  • Posts: 326
  • If I only had thumbs...
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #65 on: September 11, 2009, 07:03:31 AM »
I have traveled teh states and I can honestly say there have only been two times I was concerned. Once while camping in Yosemite National park (signs everywhere promoting the use of bear boxes to store food regardless of the type of vehicle or RV) and we had a bear wander through in the early am hours. The dog knew something was out there, and maintained a low growl for several minutes. The next day we found out. The other time was while shopping in Fresno California. Several youths had watched us park and enter the store, and I stood inside the store and watched them. They approached the RV and started peeking in the windows. SURPRISE! Dog inside. They tried the outer storage compartments, but ran off when they spied me running at them.
Hind sight tells me that we had chosen a poor location to shop. I now have a few rules about stopping for anything.
1. Observe the area in general. If there is grafitti, keep moving.
2. If there are high fences around repair shops to protect the vehicles, keep moving.
3. If the houses in the area have fenced yards with fences higher than 4 feet, keep moving.
4. If the residences have garages and no cars are kept outside, keep moving.
5. If the gas stations have bullet proof glass, keep moving.
6. If the younger people look like they belong to a gang (dress, walk, actions, ect..), keep moving.

We normally will boondock at Walmarts, but I ALWAYS speak to the manager personally about the neighborhood. They know the area and can advise about vandalism, youth activity, ect. We also prefer State or National parks as a place to stay. It's cheaper, and quieter. We normally will camp in a privately owned camp ground when laundry is due.

As far as wildlife goes, keep the area cleared of food, follow the advise of signs or if you are in a park, ask a ranger.

Bottom line is this... If ANYTHING makes you uncomfortable, then it probably isn't worth stopping. Sleeping with one eye open results in a poor nights rest.

I do not carry a handgun, but as mentioned above, there are many items that can be used to protect yourself. Some common sense can prevent your ever needing to do that.
Common sense to some of us is, unfortunately, the higher education others strive to attain.

Mc2guy

  • ---
  • Posts: 531
  • Whoso would be a man
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #66 on: September 14, 2009, 09:33:35 AM »
Is it really that dangerous over in the USA?  We dont really have much problems with gangs or anything over here.  What about the wild animals over there, do you have many problems with bears and wild dogs ect?  Now I'm scared.

Everyone will offer their opinion, but in a word, no, it is not that dangerous over here and you should in no way be scared to visit this great country.  Violent crime in the U.S. has been dropping rapidly since the early 1990's and continues to do so.  You can find more detailed information about the crime rates here: http://www.fbi.gov/page2/sept09/crimestats_091409.html

I have never felt the need to carry a handgun on my person and I travel extensively both for work and pleasure.  Common sense and self awareness will prevent the vast majority of dangerous situations (see above post).   There are definitely a few remote areas where I would want a long gun for wildlife protection, but that is only if you are really isolated in some of the more remote areas of the West where foraging bears/coyotes are a nuisance to people. 

Again, the vast majority of violent crime in the U.S. is domestic violence and/or drug related.   Many people choose to arm themselves as is their right under U.S. law, but it is certainly not a necessity, nor should you be in fear during your visit.  Follow some simple precautions as mentioned above and you will have a great visit.

Christian

P.S. I think it is natural to fear the unknown.   I visited Western Australia last year, and I was much more terrified of the snakes and spiders when I visited the Outback than I have ever been of bears and people in the U.S...go figure. ;D
Christian, Jenn, Holden, and Emerson
2009 Winnebago Sightseer 35J (F53)

2008 Trek Fuel EX9
2008 Mercier Serpens 30LTD

Wendy

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 6103
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #67 on: September 14, 2009, 09:48:41 AM »
I've been backpacking, camping and RVing for over 40 years. I've never had an unpleasant encounter with any wild creatures (other than an occasional mosquito bite). Just remember while traveling that wild animals are, well, wild. Don't ask your children to stand next to the buffalo for a picture, don't try to get close to the rattlesnake for a picture. Don't leave food out on your picnic table or in outer compartments. Use common sense and you'll be just fine.

As for carrying guns, it's a personal choice. We've never felt the need. We've only been places that we felt not secure a couple of times and we just left and moved on to someplace where we did feel secure.

You'll be just fine and will enjoy visiting our country.
Wendy
Wendy, Mike, and Gordon
~We can't be lost because we don't care where we're going~
Here's where we are http://map.datastormusers.com/user2.cfm?user=2276
2004 Winnebago Sightseer
1973 Sunshine Yellow VW Bug

serrano31096

  • ---
  • Posts: 30
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #68 on: September 14, 2009, 03:56:55 PM »
I never owned a gun until we had some stuff stolen from our house. My Rv insurance is Mercury and my other insurance is Ruger.
I would rather be safe then sorry. I have only been in one situation about 16 years ago and wish I had a gun back then.  ;)

PatrioticStabilist

  • ---
  • Posts: 218
  • Sue Anne and Carolyn
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #69 on: November 06, 2009, 11:37:00 PM »
I was reading this, wondering about carrying a weapon onboard when traveling. Had not seen the topic addressed in here till I did a search  I haven't traveled alone in a long time and I won't at night.  I have a permit to carry a concealed weapon here in Texas and intend to renew it. In my younger years I wasn't afraid of anything or anybody, but I guess as I've aged or listened to to many news programs I've become more cautious.

I will have my cellphone and hubby is going to put his CB in the motorhome, my only concerns are breakdowns. I'm already careful where I go in both Houston and also certain areas in the small town north of us and other places.

Even though we have neighbors I still live in the country, with my husband working away all the time I decided this was necessary.  Though I have a feeling my neighbors are likely armed to the teeth also. We have quite a few guns, all inherited from his dad and mine, from shotguns to rifles to all types of handguns. After the last hurricane when people were streaming through our area and some got on our road by mistake I decided I didn't want to be vulnerable again, even my husband got his too. 

I have told people do not ever come into my home and not let me know it especially at night, I will not take kindly to that at all and you might be in for a horrid surprise.  We have an automatic gate and a dog so you have to make an effort to come into my yard.
1991 Class C Holiday Rambler AlumaLite XL with tag axle 27'
2 1983 Silver Streaks 34'11'

Dick Zeiter

  • ---
  • Posts: 110
  • Ready to Go Bluegrassin'
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #70 on: November 18, 2009, 03:21:48 PM »
     Before you travel, check >  http://www.handgunlaw.us/  < regarding the states you intend to travel through for exceptions or special rules. Both of you get a nonresident permit from another state to give you more reciprocity options (we have Ohio resident and Florida nonresident permits) Florida added ten or so more states for us.
     Avoid suspicious areas and stay alert. Be ready to move on if things don't feel right. After nearly 30 years of Walmarts, rest centers and a few camp grounds, the wife and I have moved several times. Most problems we've had though, are noisy cars in parking lots or reefers in rest centers. By the way, we stay in the car side of rest centers to leave room for the truckers and it's quieter also. I would say that except when on site vending at fairgrounds / campgrounds, we spend 95% of the time at Walmart Supercenters. After 10 years, we've established a travel pattern and are familiar with areas along our route.   
     Hopefully you have a motorhome and don't have to go outside between a tow vehicle and trailer. If I had a trailer, I would definitely do things different than I do now.
     The main thing is don't let fear ruin your trips. Have fun and keep your eyes open just as you would around your home town.
Dick Z. in Toledo Ohio
2000 Dutchstar
90 nights/year vending at Bluegrass Festivals or boondocking on the way to & from.

John Canfield

  • Winnebago moderator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 2405
  • Home for most of the winter
    • Jane and John's Internet Home
Re: Weapons on board ?????
« Reply #71 on: November 18, 2009, 06:19:08 PM »
Thanks for asking this question because I was wondering myself.  When I told my dad that we are going to travel the States he told to get a will.  My husband has a gun licence as he like go shooting, mainly roo's and rabbits.  From reading this topic we might have to get some sort of weapon for protection.  Is it really that dangerous over in the USA?  We dont really have much problems with gangs or anything over here.  What about the wild animals over there, do you have many problems with bears and wild dogs ect?  Now I'm scared.

Others have said not a problem and no worries.  That is absolutely true for where we travel and sightsee. Now if you were wandering around on foot in a depressed inner-city of a major American city looking lost and vulnerable, you would lose your wallet, watch, rings, etc in a matter of an hour or two (or sooner.)

Like others, we have hiked, biked traveled around the country for many years and miles and never ever felt unsafe from either two-legged or four-legged critters.  Even in Alaska (and Canada), you would have to be extremely unlucky to get attacked by an animal (but it does happen once in a while.)  We were in Haines, Alaska bear watching and a black bear was no more than a hundred feet (30 meters) from us - the bear had no interest in us.  Now if you surprise a sow with her cubs, I hope you can run faster than the other person in your party  :D

As blue-water sailors of a few years ago, to carry or not carry weapons was always a hotly debated topic among cruisers.  In a second or third world county (or offshore), you can't dial 911 (emergency) and expect quick help (or call the Coast Guard.)  When we took off for the Caribbean, we carried a stainless steel Mini-14 (cal .223) with a folding stock and 40 round magazines.  Always being law abiding, we declared the weapon every time we entered an county.  This got to be such a hassle (typically they would impound the weapon), we decided we would be better off without the Ruger, so we mailed it home.  Never missed the Ruger.

The question one needs to ask themselves is, "are you prepared to point your weapon at a person that lets say is stealing from you, and pull the trigger"?  At what point is deadly force justified (personally justified and legally justified.)  There were several instances of boardings of cruisers where the cruisers decided to fight back, the bad guys wound up with the cruiser's weapon and they shot the cruisers.  Typically, these were crimes of property that would have ended with a theft and not a loss of life.

We were burgled while anchored in Grenada - fortunately we were not aboard and no doubt the locals were watching our boat and waiting for an opportunity to swim out to us and steal things.  It was a terrible feeling, a sense of being violated, but in the end, it was just stuff we lost. In retrospect, we hated the situation, but it wasn't worth a loss of life.

On the flip side, if I am in a life-threatening situation, I'll use whatever means I have to protect myself and Jane.
--John
2005 Horizon 40AD, 2005 Jeep Liberty
Datastorm - F1
Our current location
Our blog
Our web site
Our weather