CALAMITY STRIKES!

The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an RV or an interest in RVing!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
We've never met but this is incredible, almost unbelievable... I've read your account 6 times and each time is even more amazing to me.  It sounds so, (I'm at a loss for words), so horrible, yet miraculous that all of you are OK, in a motel and sending emails.  At some level I know this  can happen but when it does it it doesen't seem real but it is.  I've been in several wrecks but this is something else, the helpless feeling of no brakes has to be eeeerie. 

No matter what, take care of yourself and we wish you the best.  Wow... I'm sure I could have written such a coherent report.... thanks, Gary and Coleen
 
Thank goodness all involved in the accident are OK, Gary & Nancy...never have had a brake failure & your account is bizarre in that back up brakes didn't kick in either.  So glad you are both safe.

Dick & Pat
 
Gary, this one has my attention!! I have the same chassis and systems and am a maintinence professional that typicaly performs his own work. I would be most interested in cause and effect, it appears to be a valveing problem given your discription of events, and of coarse things do happen faster that the mind can keep up sometimes.>>>D
 
Gary,

Great Scott!!  What a terrifying experience!!  I've had to break quickly several times while driving my Coach and have often thought about what a helpless and horrifying experience it would be if the break pedal just went to the floor.  I'm sorry you had to live that fear that I've had.  Sounds like you handled the situation very well, given the circumstances.  It is amazing that no one was seriously hurt.  I'm glad you are all OK and able to start dealing with the minor issues now.  Good luck with getting things back to normal.

Dan
 
Lots of people had horeshoes in their pocket, and I can only guess what is in the seats.  This just hasn't been a good year for you, but like your other problems, this too will resolve.  Glad everyone came through it!
 
We're so very thankful you and the others were not seriously injured!  What a year you two have had.  Hugs to both of you.

Margi
 
What a frightening experience!  We're also glad no one was injured.  Keep us posted.

Jeannine & Dan
 
WOW! Gary, how fast things do happen.  Needless to say, we are glad the two of you are O.K. and your plans are ruined.  We are still planning to be at the campground for the rally and hope everyone else is still planning to attend.  We are leaving Pigeon Forge on Monday and can go in another direction to assist you if need be.  Let me know.

 
Wow, when something close to that happened to me (Brakes worked but even at low speed the road was too slippery due to a light, just started rain) all I crunched was a class 3 hitch NO damage to the truck it was mounted on, $500 to the Damon.  No injury both driven from scene (Michigan requires a report when there is a comma in the damage tag)

Glad to hear everyone, and I mean everyone, came out of it ok, and the only damage was vehicular

Just out of coursity..

1: What chassis (is your former I fear, home built upon) and
2: If you find out... What happened tn the brakes please.

 
    Gary, it has been a tough year for you and Nancy, hope it only gets better from here.  Donna and I send our thoughts and wishes.  I'm sure it will work out but it is a real bummer.
 
WOW!  What a horrible, scary feeling that must have been.  I wouldn't even begin to second-guess anything that you did.

Thank God that you were not injured.

 
When we were seriously looking to buy our Windsor we went on a test drive with the Monaco test driver.  At one point he assured us there was no one else on the road, to make sure our seatbelts were fastened, and then hold on.  As we were driving down the road at about 35 mph he pulled the emergency air brake and we were totally amazed at how fast the motorhome came to a complete stop.  Those emergency air brakes work great - unless something has gone wrong.  I should think if there was an air leak and no air pressure, some alarm would have sounded.  I hope there is some kind of a "what went wrong" report because I'm sure it will help many of us.

ArdraF
 
ArdraF said:
When we were seriously looking to buy our Windsor we went on a test drive with the Monaco test driver.  At one point he assured us there was no one else on the road, to make sure our seatbelts were fastened, and then hold on.  As we were driving down the road at about 35 mph he pulled the emergency air brake and we were totally amazed at how fast the motorhome came to a complete stop.  Those emergency air brakes work great - unless something has gone wrong. 
Click to expand...

Ardra,

I had a similar experience in RV driving school.  Jerry Ray decided I should  pull emergency brake to see how it worked.  I was afraid of a 'wheels locking up and skidding scene' , but like you said the rig efficiently  and quickly slowed with some force, however it was still quite a few yards before a complete stop and that was at 35-40 mph. 
If Gary was traveling in the speed of low 60 mph range I fear even an effective emergency brake stop my not have been enough to slow his destination into the back of an auto in front.  In those few nano seconds our mind races as to how to handle impending dangers.  I  think Gary did well and trust that he will give us a full report on the findings.  I remain happy  that there were no serious injuries.  Makes me want to check my brakes.

Betty
 
The emergency (or parking) brake is a failsafe mechanism.  It uses air pressure to keep the brake off, and in the event of a total loss of air pressure, the brakes are applied to the rear wheels by powerful springs.  It's quite possible that the emergency brakes did apply in Gary's case, but it just took that long to effect a stop.  It's certainly not as effective as applying all 4 wheel brakes, which obviously he couldn't do.
 
We are thankful for your outcome and sorry it happened.

I am sure many more people got up from the easy chair, walked over to the driving station, and throught through what we would do in your situation.  I now have a MUCH better grasp of where that big yellow emergency brake knob is.  Your experience may save some of us from the same fate some day.

Prayers your way, and if you ask for help, you will need a traffic director.
 
Gary & Nancy, so glad that you folks came out OK and with minor injuries to the others, that's a blessing.  I cant imagine a more helpless feeling than "no brakes" and as others have indicated I would like to know the root cause.

I know things are very much up in the air at this point and difficult to plan properly, however, we will be in Lake Aire on Weds, both of us willing to do whatever it takes to help make the rally a success.  If, you folks are able to make it there with your toad we have plenty of room in the coach and would love to be able to offer you a base while you're there.

Let us know if there's anything we can do to help and hopefully there'll be sunny days ahead.

Dale & Karen.
 
Gary - I am glad you and the misses and the cat are all ok. I wonder if the insurance company is going to patch up the windshield or replace it?
 
Ned said:
The emergency (or parking) brake is a failsafe mechanism.  It uses air pressure to keep the brake off, and in the event of a total loss of air pressure, the brakes are applied to the rear wheels by powerful springs.  It's quite possible that the emergency brakes did apply in Gary's case, but it just took that long to effect a stop.  It's certainly not as effective as applying all 4 wheel brakes, which obviously he couldn't do.
Click to expand...

I am also very glad to hear it wasn't more serious and that everybody came out okay!

All this makes me wonder about braking in diesels and so I wanna ask a bunch of dumb questions. I know nothing about diesels, as I never owned one.  I never even took a good look at a diesel engine.

What happens when you shift to the lowest gear? Would it help much to slow down a diesel?

Also, what happens when the engine is shut down (like when the ignition is turned off in a gasoline engine). Does it just turn off the fuel pump or what does it do? There's no ignition to turn off, right? It seems there should be a way to use all that compression to help slow things down.

I have thought about what I would do (but with  gasoline engine rigs), in the case of lost brakes. And I have had to use it once, but only to help, by shifting into the lowest gear. But I didn't totally lose all the brakes, I had a brake line burst open for the rear brakes as I was braking down a deep hill. It was scary, pedal goes down to near the floor, but I was able to slow enough to stop and avoid any damage. Fortunately,  most of the braking power is in the front and with the help of the tranny in low, as well as using the parking brake, I was able to come to an almost normal stop in an almost normal stopping distance.

I have heard of one other person who totally lost brakes but was able to stop by shifting his automatic tranny into REVERSE. It damaged the tranny, but it did stop. What would happen in a diesel if it were forced into reverse?

-Don- SSF, CA​




 
DonTom said:
I am also very glad to hear it wasn't more serious and that everybody came out okay!

All this makes me wonder about braking in diesels and so I wanna ask a bunch of dumb questions. I know nothing about diesels, as I never owned one.   I never even took a good look at a diesel engine.

What happens when you shift to the lowest gear? Would it help much to slow down a diesel?

Comment:
In todays diesels shifting down will slow you BUT it will only shift down to the lowest gear that will not damage things.  If you touch the brake and shift down it should engage the exhaust brake, either the classic Jacobs or the newer butterfly in the exhaust path and shift down as the engine speed reduces below the next shift point.

Also, what happens when the engine is shut down (like when the ignition is turned off in a gasoline engine). Does it just turn off the fuel pump or what does it do? There's no ignition to turn off, right? It seems there should be a way to use all that compression to help slow things down.

Comment:
I have thought about what I would do (but with  gasoline engine rigs), in the case of lost brakes. And I have had to use it once, but only to help, by shifting into the lowest gear. But I didn't totally lose all the brakes, I had a brake line burst open for the rear brakes as I was braking down a deep hill. It was scary, pedal goes down to near the floor, but I was able to slow enough to stop and avoid any damage. Fortunately,   most of the braking power is in the front and with the help of the tranny in low, as well as using the parking brake, I was able to come to an almost normal stop in an almost normal stopping distance.

I have heard of one other person who totally lost brakes but was able to stop by shifting his automatic tranny into REVERSE. It damaged the tranny, but it did stop. What would happen in a diesel if it were forced into reverse?

Comment:
In the newer diesels the transmission will not shift into an unsafe gear so you would have to be either stopped or nearly so to have the transmission shift into reverse.

Computers are smarter than people.  :)

-Don- SSF, CA​
Click to expand...
 
Don, I'll try to answer the questions without getting into the technicalities too deep.  

Yes you can shift transmission down but, on most large class A diesels the shift pad is on a side panel not easily reached in high stress situations.  Shifting down, even to 1st gear will not have the same effect as a normal manual transmission, the speed sensor/computer will not allow the transmission to over speed the engine so will only shift down when it's in a safe range.

Yes you could shut the ignition off to stop the injectors and would gain some braking effect from compression BUT, we're back to the transmission/computer not allowing it to downshift.  In this case you would also lose your power steering just adding to the challenge.

Gary's problem is a worse case situation, no warning that he was losing air pressure, which he probably wasn't, just no pressure or effect from the pedal.  You'll recognize that he had seconds (a few at that!) to react to a situation rapidly going from bad to worse, pulling the emergency brake should have dumped all the air from the rear brakes and allowed the springs to apply full brakes but on the rear axle only.  

As mentioned previously the rear brakes may have applied but not sufficiently to lock up the wheels (no skid marks) and he was working without the front brakes of the coach and depending on his supplementary braking system perhaps without the toad brakes as well

I'm so glad that the situation worked out with out any serious injuries, it seems Gary's reactions to crises is as level headed as his contributions to the forum.

Dale
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Members online

Total: 855 (members: 30, guests: 825)

Forum statistics

Threads
131,966
Posts
1,388,397
Members
137,719
Latest member
mattlov
Back
Top Bottom