Windows 7 upgraded - very neat and clean upgrade

[Tom]

No one forces you to upgrade to Windows 7...

Never suggested they did.

When I was in corporate America, if we designed/built/delivered a complex product that didn't perform as expected &/or had problems, we didn't/wouldn't/couldn't charge the customer to redesign/rebuild.

With the resources that MS has, and the numerous volunteer beta  testers, there's really no excuse for them to deliver the buggy stuff they deliver, and absolutely no reason they should charge for fixing the limitations of the product. Calling them "new or enhanced features" is, at best, fooling the consumer.

By all means continue to line the pockets of MS and its over-paid people and, in so doing, encourage them to continually produce buggy &/or underperforming, over-bloated software.

There's a reason that Bill is the, or one of the, richest people on the planet    BTW MS has the largest number of $millionaire employees of any company. They respectfully ask that y'all continue to send them your hard earned $$.

[John Canfield]

I'm confused; I know you run Linux on some machines, but didn't you also just upgrade to Win 7 

Tom - nope.. not doing W7 yet but I will at some point since I'm a geek    Your critique of Microsoft I believe is accurate and well said.  Bill G. happens to have quite a bit of technical and business prowess so here we are with W7.  I think Apple's OSX is by far the absolutely best operating system - it has the efficiency and robustness of Unix with the corporate commitment to make certain all of the apps play well together.

[DonTom]

I got that three pack of Windows 7.

From the first install, I learned what to do for the second, so I could have it completely install when I am not even at home.

Here's some advice to those who are going to install it.


1. Uninstall  I-tunes if you have it installed, or it will stop the installation after it checks for compatibility. And then you have to start over.

2. Turn all passwords off BEFORE  upgrading. That way you can leave the computer for  hours while installing and not have to enter any passwords. Or else you have to enter the password at every reboot and there are several reboots.

I was able to completely upgrade this computer to Win7 from the start to end without even being home. 

-Don- SSF, CA

[Tom]

... with the corporate commitment to make certain all of the apps play well together.

Aye John, that's a commitment they've stuck to from the beginning.

[Ned]

Since Windows runs on the vast majority of desktops, both business and consumer, in the world, and I make a lot of money writing software for those Windows systems, I benefit a lot more from MS than they do from me.

But I run Linux on my netbook

[Tom]

I found it interesting that Best Buy was selling Toshiba notebooks with Win 7 for approx $350. Didn't stop to check the specs on the Toshiba, or which version of Win 7. I've been thinking of getting a "cheap" computer for my grandson to play on, and was tempted to take a closer look. But I was on a mission yesterday, and figured I'd take another look next time I'm in town.

I realize that OEMs pay only a fraction of the retail cost of a full OS package, but it stuck me as ironic that I could buy a laptop with Win 7 installed for that price. Retail prices I've seen for Win 7 Home Premium range from approx $123 to $216.

[BernieD]

Hate to throw a wet towel on all the euphoria, but today I checked store prices on Win 7. I couldn't help asking myself aloud in the store "why should I pay to fix the shortcomings in Vista?" This is deja vu all over again (many times); Microsoft charges people to fix things they didn't do right in the first place. I didn't purchase the upgrade.

Tom

MS has a "Family 3 Pack Upgrade" which has licenses for up to 3 computers. Costco sells it for about $131. Not that bad.

[Tom]

Thanks Bernie. I didn't see the family pack when I was in Costco yesterday, although I wasn't specifically looking for it. For some reason, they'd moved and compressed (shrunk) the software area of this particular store since I was there last, and it appeared they didn't have as many software choices as I was used to seeing there.

Meanwhile, since it's not broke, I'm not going to fix it, unless/until I need to. I have 2 laptops running XP, one running Vista, and Chris' desktop is running Vista. I'll let y'all find the bugs while I sit back and watch the same old scene play over again.

[scottydl]

Bugs are handled with the monthly (or more frequent) Windows Updates.

More frequent, I'd say so!  I get those things popping up every few DAYS.  

If you're happy with Vista or XP, there is no compelling reason to upgrade to Windows 7.

That pretty much says it for me.  And I could probably even qualify for the $30 W7 upgrade for students.  But I just don't see the need, and while I'm not thrilled to have Vista for "status" reasons (since it seems to be the "Windows ME" of this decade) I really have had no problems with it.  Microsoft is my opinion has some major R&D problems if they can't come up with an OS that will last more than a few years.  

I can't afford a Mac but this commercial rings awfully true...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BpOvzGiheOM

[FrontrangeRVer]

In case it's interesting, and slightly off topic, but I work in the Energy Trading industry and have traded in the very biggest trade floors in Houston with over 1,000 traders/people on each floor.  In over 25 years of trading, I have never seen a Mac anywhere....they just flat aren't the workhorse of the industry.  I ran 8 screens on my workstation when I was trading in Houston....on a PC.   

Now, at my church (mega-church), all the musicians have Macs.... 

Sorry, not trying to change this thread to a Mac vs PC thread....now back to the Windows 7 upgraded chat!

[Tom]

ROTFL Scott. Now if only Apple could meet some of the WinTel/WinAMD price points, they'd really see a huge swing in market share in their favor.

[Ned]

Apple will never see a significant market share until they open the architecture, and Jobs just won't do that.  Proprietary architectures, even superior ones, have never survived long term in the technology industry.  Remember Betamax, Arcnet, Microchannel, PS/2?

[scottydl]

True but Apple computers have been around for a LONG time, maybe never commanding the market but always holding onto a loyal customer base.  And obviously the company trumped Microsoft in the music market, with the Ipod making up something like 95% of digital music players out there.  Not to mention Itunes software... all proprietary creations.    I'm not even really a fan of Apple/Mac and do not own an Ipod (my mp3 player is a Sandisk Sansa) but their business position nowadays seems pretty secure.

Consumers seem to be Apple owners because they WANT to... and Microsoft owners because they HAVE to.  Big difference.

[John Canfield]

Microsoft is my opinion has some major R&D problems if they can't come up with an OS that will last more than a few years.  

Scotty - I don't think it is an R&D problem, but a business strategy.  It would make no business sense to have a product so great nobody would ever see a reason to change 

It is a shame Macs are so expensive and so proprietary - if they weren't, it would be my platform of choice (by a wide margin.)  Macs are THE standard of professionals for video and graphics editing.

I have a older Mac 12" Powerbook and it is a thing of beauty (should be for the price!)

[Pat]

Just an opinion here, but many of the upgrades are not bug fixes, but rather security updates, in order to keep up with the bozoheads who keep spewing viruses and invading people's computers.

Now I'm going to back everything up and do a clean install of Win7 just for fun.  I'm curious to see what components of this computer need updating from HP.

--pat

[Tom]

... many of the upgrades are not bug fixes, but rather security updates...

There's two sides to that coin Pat. If MS did a better job of avoiding the gaping back doors that people keep finding in their software &/or if they did a better job of checking out the product before it ships, consumers wouldn't have to face the risks or put up with the continual security fixes. I detest the virus writers as much as the next person, but some of them do it just to show that MS can't deliver a secure product.

[BernieD]

I didn't see the family pack when I was in Costco yesterday, although I wasn't specifically looking for it. For some reason, they'd moved and compressed (shrunk) the software area of this particular store since I was there last, and it appeared they didn't have as many software choices as I was used to seeing there.

Tom

It should be available on the website. I didn't see it either on the shelf yesterday at our local store. Costco has really cut back significantly on it's software selection. Somewhat disappointing. At least they stopped moving around the store what they did have.

[RV Roamer]

I updated my Vista system today and all went smoothly. I got warned in advance about one device driver but a check of the net showed I did indeed have the correct Win7 compatible driver so I went ahead and it worked fine.

[Ned]

To get back on topic, I did an install of Windows 7 to my MSI Wind netbook today.  Followed the simple instructions on the MS TechNet article and copied the Windows 7 DVD to a USB flash drive and booted from it.  Told the installer to format the C: drive and in about 20 minutes, Windows 7 was up and running on the netbook.  Networking is so much simpler than previous Windows versions.  It sees all my shares on my Vista desktop, but not the XP notebook.  That one's getting  Windows 7 soon so it's not a problem, I can still see it from my Vista desktop.

Pinning my most used programs to the task bar is a very useful improvement.  No more setting keyboard hotkeys and trying to avoid conflicts although that feature is still available.  I'll use it for less used programs.

So far, what I've seen says Windows 7 is the biggest single improvement in Windows since Windows 2000

[Pat]

Ned:  I can't figure out how to pin Control Panel and Internet Options to my taskbar.  I use them a lot and prefer them down on the bar.  Any ideas?  I did learn how to pin folders and other non-program shortcuts.  I think pinning is a lot more complicated than the quick launch bar.  I don't like the way the open programs mix in with the unopened icons.  I think the new taskbar is a bad change for the sake of change the way the toolbars in MS Office 2007 are.  I've worked with those things for a couple years now and still miss the menus.

Did you do any Win 7 clean installs?  I upgraded on my PC, but I want to see what a clean install looks like.  Hope it picks up the necessary video, audio, printer, scanner and other driversr for this HP.   I have a touch screen and am interested to see if Win7 uses its own touchscreen drivers or if I have to do an HP update to get that back.  I've had a tiny bit of mouse irregularity twice in the past week and a half since upgrading and had to recover the mouse functionaity by touching the screen.

One thing I have notice is that my internet connection has stopped crashing every hour or so.

--pat

[Ned]

I don't think you can pin control panel applets.  I configure the control panel to open as a menu off the start menu so it's just 2 clicks to any applet.

Pinning should be used for the most used programs.  I recall an article about recreating the quick launch toolbar but can't say where.  A Google search should turn something up if you want to look for it.  Applications on the task bar will be outlined if they're running, plain if not.  I like the grouping of multiple instances into one icon.  Makes much better use of the task bar space.  The thumbnails make it easy to choose the instance too.  It took me about 1 minute to see the benefits, but it is different.

The netbook install was a clean install.  It had XP on it so I just formatted the drive during the installation.  It has drivers for all the hardware too.  Your HP may need some drivers from HP so have those on hand before you start.  A clean install won't use anything from the old Windows on the machine.

Networking does seem much better, but I've never had a problem with the connections dropping.  It's certainly easier to set up than either XP or Vista.  Almost as easy as Linux

[edjunior]

Well, I just did the upgrade, and it went smooth as silk for me.  No problems encountered.  Took a long time though (at least 3 quarters of the Dallas Cowboys spanking of the Seattle Seahawks!).  But it did just what it was supposed to, and other than a slightly new look, it brought everything over it was supposed to.  I saw the part on "uninstall iTunes", but in the parenthesis it said "de-authorize the computer".  That's all I did...I did not uninstall iTunes.  Now, I haven't gotten around to playing with it, but W7 did install with no issues.  More to come I'm sure.

[BernieD]

Ned:  I can't figure out how to pin Control Panel and Internet Options to my taskbar.  I use them a lot and prefer them down on the bar.  Any ideas?  I did learn how to pin folders and other non-program shortcuts.  I think pinning is a lot more complicated than the quick launch bar.  I don't like the way the open programs mix in with the unopened icons.  I think the new taskbar is a bad change for the sake of change the way the toolbars in MS Office 2007 are.  I've worked with those things for a couple years now and still miss the menus.

Pat

I'm not on my W7 machine so am pushing my recollections very hard. There is a screen in W7 settings that offers you choice of desktop icons for "Computer", "Control Panel", "My Documents" and a couple of other choices. Don't remember how to get there.

Did you do any Win 7 clean installs?  I upgraded on my PC, but I want to see what a clean install looks like.  Hope it picks up the necessary video, audio, printer, scanner and other driversr for this HP.   I have a touch screen and am interested to see if Win7 uses its own touchscreen drivers or if I have to do an HP update to get that back.  I've had a tiny bit of mouse irregularity twice in the past week and a half since upgrading and had to recover the mouse functionaity by touching the screen.

I did a clean install after the upgrade issues with my Vista/Acer machine. The clean install cleaned up everything, but I did lose all of my crapware and some helpful programs (like keyboard mapping). All things considered, I am happier without the whole package. W7 had all of the drivers needed to get everything working after the install.

[Tom]

Just curious if there are printer driver issues going from XP to Win7 as there were going to Vista 

[BernieD]

Just curious if there are printer driver issues going from XP to Win7 as there were going to Vista 

Tom

It depends on your printer. You must (most highly recommended) run the W7 Upgrade Advisor before doing the upgrade and it will tell you if the printer is compatible and where to find an upgraded driver, if available.

[Tom]

Thanks Bernie. When Vista came out, many printer drivers were either late or non existent, and Fry's was giving free printers way with new PCs.

[Ned]

XP drivers won't work with Windows 7 (or Vista either).  Bernie's advice about the Upgrade Advisor is good.  Be sure to have all your peripherals connected when you run it.  This includes things like external disk drives, printers, scanners, etc.  and be sure they're turned on

[Tom]

Thanks Ned. I wasn't asking if XP drivers would work with Win7, just trying to understand if Win7 drivers would be available for peripherals, unlike the Vista fiasco where a lot of folks had to buy new peripherals. I suppose this is down to the peripherals manufacturers, not MS. Is the Upgrade Advisor part of the Win7 package, or can it be downloaded without buying Win7?

[Ned]

The drivers are the responsibility of the peripheral manufacturer.  Some chose not to write new drivers for Vista and 7 which forces the user to buy a new printer, scanner, etc. if they want to upgrade their OS.  It's usually just the older models that won't have new drivers.  Current products will almost all have Windows Vista/7 drivers available.

The Windows 7 Upgrade Advisor can be downloaded from here.

[BernieD]

Thanks Ned. I wasn't asking if XP drivers would work with Win7, just trying to understand if Win7 drivers would be available for peripherals, unlike the Vista fiasco where a lot of folks had to buy new peripherals. I suppose this is down to the peripherals manufacturers, not MS. Is the Upgrade Advisor part of the Win7 package, or can it be downloaded without buying Win7?

Tom

Our Canon Pixma i4000 printer and Canoscan 9950F are both 3-4 years old and Canon has W7 drivers available. Many Vista drivers work in W7.