Panasonic FZ35 "almost" dSLR

[JerArdra]

I finally found a through review on the 27-486mm Panasonic FZ35.  It's really a long one.  Printed out it's 56 pages.

http://www.dcresource.com/reviews/panasonic/dmc_fz35-review

JerryF

[Tom]

Thanks Jerry. I'm still wading through it.

Searching around on that site, I stumbled onto the Canon SX20 IS, which appears to be a serious contender in what is being called the "prosumer" market. They didn't yet have a review of this camera, but here's a review on Steve's Digicams.

[56kz2slow]

Tom,

I have the great grand father to the Canon SX20-IS, the Canon S1-IS and love it, my brother had the same one too and he loved it.  But when my brother broke his, he got the SX10-IS, which he does not like as much as his original S1.  So I hope Canon made some improvements on the SX20.  Things like low light conditions were better with the original then the SX10.  So it would be worth reading reviews and testing things like that with the SX20.

Still think you can't go wrong with a Canon.

When I upgrade from my 6 year old Canon S1, I am definitely jumping to a DSLR.

Marc...

[Tom]

Thanks Marc.

[Tom]

I was getting ready to order this camera but, when I re-read the review, I realized you can't add an external flash. Having found the added pleasures of external flash on my Canon XSi DSLR, the lack of this ability makes me re-think the purchase of an FZ35.

[56kz2slow]

Thanks Marc.

It was not the SX10 he bought, but some cheaper Canon with a decent zoom (on paper).  He now has the SX20 though and he's much happier than with his S1, simply a normal evolution of the S1.  He loves the 20x optical zoom.  He said it's the next best thing to a DSLR.  The only reason he did not get a DSLR is that he does not want to carry lenses and he knows if he only brings one it will be the wrong one.

Marc...

Edit to add:  The SX20 has a hot shoe for a flash

[Tom]

Thanks Marc. I've been looking at the SX20, and it's a serious contender in the 'prosumer' market.

[Tom]

I went ahead and ordered the Canon XS20IS. It has many/most/all of the features of the Panasonic FZ35, but has the added advantage of a hot shoe, allowing me to use my external flash, and and has longer zoom. Methinks that Panasonic omitted a significant feature.

ETA is Monday, so I'll let you know how it works out.

[56kz2slow]

Also Canon has been in the imaging business for a long time and Panasonic in the stereo business.  Not saying Panasonic is not good, but they have less experience.

[Tom]

Marc,

I've had corporate business dealings with both companies and they're both solid companies.

Some years ago we discussed a related issue here, and agreed that the "winners" in this market would be the long-time camera/optics guys, not the consumer electronics guys. Kodak, unfortunately, didn't make the grade; They're still trying to figure out where their film market went.

[56kz2slow]

I agree with you Tom, it was not a stab at Panasonic, just that it's not their initial area of expertise.

Also agree with Kodak, what happened to them?  They were like the Kleenex of cameras.

[seilerbird]

Kodak has a lot of the original patents on digital photography. But they had no faith in digital photography (as most of the camera manufacturers of that time didn't have any faith). So they decided to ignore it and hope it would go away. By the time they figured out that film was doomed, Kodak was doomed.

[JerArdra]

Tom,

You're correct I used an external flash with my, now long gone, 35mm film SLR and it worked great.  My current take is a camera that is "easy to carry" and convenient. My current Panasonic FZ-30 could use an external flash but in 3 years I never needed one so I guess I just didn't get one.  The built in flash worked fine for me and the indoor flash pictures that I took looked GREAT.

As you all know I neither want to carry extra lenses nor an external flash so the external flash is not important to me.

The item I have struggled with the most is the electrically controlled zoom but after 2-3 FZ35 trials I find it's okay because when I push the lever full left or right it telescopes FAST but if I push it part way left or right it moves very slowly so I can easily frame a telephoto picture to full the entire frame.

I still find that the Panasonic FZ35 is my favorite "almost" DSLR camera.  I even downloaded the detailed 200+ page manual, printed it, and read it.  It seems to have more features than the competing Canon, Nikon, and Olympus competitors but, that's not so big deal because from 3 years of experience with my Panasonic FZ-30 and all it's features I do not use but about 1/3 of all those many features. 

Another thought on how lightly I like to go when I carry the camera on a hike, rally, to someones house, or anywhere is, I don't even take my camera case.  I just stick a second battery in my pocket and take my FZ-30 SANS any lenses or external flash attachments.

So now the world knows my bias' re cameras.

In fact, today (12/30) on our trip to Sabino Canyon here at Tucson I only used 2 camera settings, the P (Automatic) and the A (Aperture) settings and no tripod.  99% of the time I only use the P, A, or S (Speed) settings.  Yea, I know I'll never match Marabito, Buchanan, or Silerbird's quality but I can take my photos faster (less overall time) then they can if that counts!  BTW, that doesn't really count it's just a joke.

Good luck on your quest for a camera,
JerryF

[Tom]

Jerry,

I have no doubt that the FZ35 is a great camera. As I said, I was about to order it. Like you, I prefer light weight and compactness, and I've enjoyed my FZ7 and its shirt-pocket cousin for several years.

OTOH I've come to appreciate the things I can do with the external flash I recently purchased. Doesn't mean I'll be toting it everywhere though.

If the FZ35 works out OK, I'll probably return the Canon XSi DSLR. It's a great camera but, for this point and shoot guy, I can get more consistent results with a non-DSLR; Not necessarily photographic quality, but no need to stop and think about the various settings.

[Bob Buchanan]

If the FZ35 works out OK, I'll probably return the Canon XSi DSLR. It's a great camera but, for this point and shoot guy, I can get more consistent results with a non-DSLR.

What's the difference between the PS Canon and the XSi in Program mode other than deciding what lens to mount? That's the "only" decision you have to make when in that mode. The advantage of the XSi is that you have more room to grow, if you find you want to. And if you move out of Program mode on the PS Canon, the decsions will be the same as when using the XSi out of program mode -- only you would have greater latitude with each such as higher ISO settings available if in lower light.

If you move to Aperture, Shutter, or Manual modes - the decision processes will be the same with either camera. Also, to cover that much zoom with a single lens will rarely give you the sharpness and color of a shorter lens.

As you know, I am big on external flash and very UN-big on the built in flash. However, if it weren't for lack of hot shoe - and I wanted a PS, I would also go with the Panasonic. The Panasonic lens is built to Leica specs. Canon makes great glass -- Leica makes incredible glass.

When Panasonic made the deal with Leica, the agreement was that Leica would give them the exact specs -- not that Leica would build the lenses. However, armed with the specs, the Japanese can build as good as Leica with the exception of the Panasonics are not made of all medal parts and are not water proof. Bottom line, I would take the Panasonic 18x lens over the Canon 20x any day.

I know what a tough decision you are having - and the associated frustration. I might suggest that when you test the two, do it with each shot taken with both cameras. Put the XSi in PS mode and take a number of varied tests shot with each camera - then put them side by side on your computer screen.  Once you set the PS at the same focal length, the two should be otherwise the same as to settings, or having to think about settings.

BTW, I find that UN-big IS in the forum spell checker. 

[Jeff]

This afternoon Jerry and several of us got to play with Russ's new Panasonic Lumix DMC-ZS3K and I am convinced the small camera that will fit in my shirt pocket with the features of my FZ50 will probably be my next camera.

Like Tom over half of the photos we take are on Sue's small Casio because she always has it with her while I have left the larger FZ50 in the car or m/h/.

[Tom]

Thanks for the comments Bob; I understand, but don't necessarily agree with them all.

What's the difference between the PS Canon and the XSi in Program mode other than deciding what lens to mount?

Less weight, less stuff to carry, and a lot less $$.

The advantage of the XSi is that you have more room to grow

Understood, but I don't feel the need to "grow". I'd prefer to take P&S pictures that I can make sense of, than DSRL ones that frustrate me.

...I would take the Panasonic 18x lens over the Canon 20x any day.

Given that I've owned a couple of Panasonic cameras for several years (should be evident from my prior posts), I'd normally agree with you. But the lack of external flash capability made this a no-brainer.

I know what a tough decision you are having - and the associated frustration. I might suggest that when you test the two...

Therein lies our different approaches. My "test" of the Canon XS20 IS will be limited to various shots, but won't include some comprehensive side-by-side comparison; I probably wouldn't be able to tell the difference.

I would take the Panasonic 18x lens over the Canon 20x any day.

Me too, if it were not for the lack of a hot shoe. Interestingly, when I bought the Panasonic FZ7, folks here on the forum said I made a mistake by not choosing a model with a hot shoe. Things change I guess.

I find that UN-big IS in the forum spell checker.

FWIW it's not "the forum spell checker". It's an open source app called p=spell &/or a-spell.

[Bob Buchanan]

. . . I don't feel the need to "grow". I'd prefer to take P&S pictures that I can make sense of, than DSRL ones that frustrate me.

Understood, Tom.  And good luck with the new camera . . . 

[JerArdra]

As Jeff said I, too, was VERY impressed with Russ' small Panasonic Lumix DMC-ZS3K.

JerryF

[Jeff]

Today we went for a hike and Russ let Jerry use his new Lumix DMC-ZS3K.I'm sure Jerry will comment also but it does not have a viewfinder and Jerry had a great deal of trouble seeing zoomed-in landscape details on the LCD in the very bright sunlight we had today.

Since that is what I would use a new camera for I guessa new camera just dropped in importance on my list.

[Tom]

A viewfinder was a must-have on my list, for the reason that Jerry discovered. I previously bought Chris a neat Nikon Coolpix S200, but I have a real issue with the lack of viewfinder in sunlight.

[JerArdra]

Re Russ' DMC-ZS3K, as Jeff said I had a terrible time framing a zoomed-in photo.  When you faced the sun I had to hold the camera close to my face in order to have the brim of my hat over lapping the top of the camera for shade and even that did not completely fix not being able to see the outer edges of the potential zoomed-in photo's edges.  But even worse, when the sun was behind me it was impossible to see anything in the LCD  because when the LCD was close to my face all I could see was the reflection of my face and when it was further away the sun completely washed out the image on the LCD.  I never could take a telephoto shot with the sun behind me.  I learned a lot and was told that some small digital cameras that have a viewfinder are NOT "electronic through-the-lens viewfinders" so you cannot compose a telephoto photo using the viewfinder.

I wonder if there are any small (in size) digital cameras that have 10X or 12X telephoto ability and an "electronic through-the lens " viewfinder?

JerryF