Problem with Dicor self leveling lap sealant

The story goes like this...

I went to Camping World and asked a sales person what sealant should I use on my roof to seal cracks and seems. They recommended the Dicor self-leveling Lap Sealant 505 LSW. It will go on as a bead and level out to seal the seem and any other areas.

I put it on and it went on as a bead, like they said. I came back a few hours later and it was still a bead and had already skinned over! No leveling what-so-ever! I called Dicor and was told to email warranty support, which I did. I sent pictures and they said I have "over expectations". Well, after posting on another RV forum, a senior member with 18,661 posts stated I do not have "over expectations", and that the bead did not spread at all! He said it should have spread at least .5" to 1", which I would have expected also.

I wrote an email to Dicor stating I was unhappy with the product and that customer service did not stand behind their product. Well, I got a phone call 10 minutes later from the woman I was emailing with in the warranty department and she was extremely rude, and condescending.

So, my opinion is to avoid Dicor. There are other brands on the market that will do as they should. Also, I'll bet if you contact customer service at the other companies, they will not be rude, condescending and will do what they need to do to make sure you are happy. I was taught that the customer is always right, and they are the ones that can make you or break you.

Thanks for the warning. I will try eternabond instead

Steven:

I am sorry to hear of your problems with Dicor. I have used Dicor self leveling sealant for years with great results. Was the temperature 70 degrees or higher when you applied it to give it time to level?

Temperature was 80 degrees, sunny and no humidity. There's probably nothing wrong with the product and it probably does what it's suppose to. But, there is a lack of education on the part of the sales people that sell it and customer service at Dicor needs to go back to school on how to treat their customers when they have a problem, not be rude and condescending.

I'm surprised that you had a bad experience with DICOR.  I have contacted them several times over the years and had good results from my questions.  Two years ago we recovered the roof with their EPDM.  Again they were very helpful.  We had an issue with their rubber cement and they took quick action. 

The pictures you show and how the lap sealant flowed is the same as what we have seen.  There are other brands that flow out more like the original stuff, but using DICOR for this need will take several coats to fill it all.  No matter which product you use, be sure to remove the old stuff first to be sure you get a good seal.  Eternabond may best the best option for you.

Thanks Bob. I'm thinking of going the eternabond route for the seams and Proflex brushable sealant for the rails and around the skylights.

I am the person at Dicor that Mr. Miller talked with.  I did receive an email with many pictures from Mr. Miller along with his phone number.  He indicated he had purchased 3 tubes of the Dicor lap sealant, used 1 tube, and that it did not level the way he thought it should. 

I tried to explain that I felt he was trying to bridge areas that were over and above the expectations for the material.  Also, according to the pictures it appeared as if other products had been used previously and not cleaned off prior to applying Dicor.  I suggested that he try one of our other products that is a little more self leveling.  I didn't realize that not enough time had passed for the material to cure and finish leveling.

After several emails back and forth, I sensed he was getting more and more frustrated (I have been in customer service for Dicor for 21 years).  I decided to call him and explain.  I was right about the frustration.  It didn't take long before we were at a disagreement about Dicor's product and expectations for the leveling process.  Mr. Miller indicated that the response from the tech on this forum was that his expections were not too high (even though the tech admittedly did not use Dicor products).  Soon after, he hung up on me and indicated on this forum that I was rude.  I disagree - I will admit that I can't always help everyone everytime.  Between his frustration level and my defense level we just didn't see eye-to-eye.  That's just part of the job.

After the phone incident, I emailed Mr. Miller and offered to authorize a refund through the company he purchased the lap sealant and again suggested he try the more leveling lap sealant.  Obviously, that didn't help either.

Dicor (and I) enjoy a very strong reputation for customer service and reliable products.  I'm sorry I couldn't help Mr. Miller and hope that he will move past this and find a material he prefers and will do the job he is needing.

Kathy McCleery/Dicor Customer Service

As always, there are two sides to every story.  Thank you for taking the time to tell us yours.

I've used that same Dicor sealant many times with more than acceptable results.  It's obvious, from the supplied photos, that NO effort was made to adequately prepare the area for application.  I didn't see anywhere on the product label where it claimed to seal all old and cracked seams with one small narrow bead, but I'll check again. ??? 

People appear to be missing my point.
1. I was directed to the product by the sales people of Camping World when I explained what I was looking for. The sales people need further education on the products they sell. This product was what I needed, obviously.
2. I called Dicor and after explaining what my problem was, I was told to contact the warranty department by email along with photos. I did that, and there was a miscommunication between me and the Dicor customer service rep. She thought I came for advice, which is not what I was emailing for. Why would I be emailing the Warranty department for advice, and how would I have gotten her email direct address unless I had already talked to someone and they referred me to her. Anyway...I explained that I thought self-leveling meant "put a bead down and it will flatten out." Well, it didn't do that and that is what I expected, as per the sales people at Camping World. I was annoyed because I was told I had "unreal expectations". I wouldn't have unreal expectations had I been directed to the proper product in the first place. But, that is Camping Worlds fault, not Dicor. After that email, I was pretty PO'd. The emails between us just went down hill from there.

As for cleaning the area, I scrubbed it down with soap, water and a brush. I was expecting the product to behave like paint and to flow and seal the cracks and pinholes, not sit like a bead. Again, lack of education on a product. Also, if I wanted a product that flowed like paint and leveled out like paint, it would not make a difference if I removed all the old stuff or just scrubbed it down to get the dirt and grime off.

I'm not familiar with these products, so I rely on people that sell the product to know what they are talking about. I know what I see on the roof of my camper and I want something that is going to behave the same way. What is on there is a material that looks like it is a paint like product and flowed and sealed. That is what I was expecting. That is not what I got.

As I had said in a previous post, there is most likely nothing wrong with the product, and it apparently does what it is supposed to. But, it is not what I asked for.

Steven

If "there is most likely nothing wrong with the product, and it apparently  does what it is supposed to", why should we be warned to "Steer Clear of Dicor Products"?

It should have read, "Dicor customer service was not very friendly, and Camping World sales people are morons."
But, I did acknowledge in an earlier post there is probably nothing wrong with their product. It's just not what I was looking for and didn't do what I was looking for it to do.

I'm no expert at all this, but to be honest, if the product used was labeled "self leveling" it doesn't appear to me, from the pictures, that it did much if any self leveling. I would think cleaning or not cleaning would/could affect adhesion, but shouldn't affect leveling characteristics. If purchasing without proper guidance, I would have easily made the same mistake that stevenhmiller did. I have window caulk that will flatten out more that what the Dicor self-leveling Lap Sealant 505 LSW showed, and it's not labeled self leveling at all. Just my observation, glad of the post though, I need to reseal my TT soon, and this will help me make a better choice in what to use, and what not to use. I'm not sure I would have titled this post the way it is, but maybe something like ?research which product you need", and then comment in the post on my displeasure with the customer service provided if warranted, but that's just me.

  I have had the same problem...no flow leveling whatsoever. I was surprised.

  My theory is that perhaps the age of the product (DICOR) as bought from the store,  may have something to do with that. I bought the self-leveling stuff and it come out of the tube rather "thickly" . No leveling took place.

  The other theory is the ambient temperature when it is being applied. Bright sunshine at 80?F may be not be the optimum condition.

I don't know..

carson FL

 

robroy said:

I'm no expert at all this, but to be honest, if the product used was labeled "self leveling" it doesn't appear to me, from the pictures, that it did much if any self leveling. I would think cleaning or not cleaning would/could affect adhesion, but shouldn't affect leveling characteristics. If purchasing without proper guidance, I would have easily made the same mistake that stevenhmiller did. I have window caulk that will flatten out more that what the Dicor self-leveling Lap Sealant 505 LSW showed, and it's not labeled self leveling at all. Just my observation, glad of the post though, I need to reseal my TT soon, and this will help me make a better choice in what to use, and what not to use. I'm not sure I would have titled this post the way it is, but maybe something like ?research which product you need", and then comment in the post on my displeasure with the customer service provided if warranted, but that's just me.

Click to expand...

I agree with you 100%, even on the title of the post.  ;D Thanks.

Well.. I have used DiCor products many times for assorted jobs on the RV. Removal of a ladder (plugged the holes) mounting a "long wire" antenna (really a 1/2 inch pipe) on standoffs on the roof for in-motion HF, adding portals, andmore.

I've been very impressed with the performance, it's done exactly what I wanted it to do, no problems save getting it off things I accidently got it on (IT's very sticky stuff takes a bit of work to get it off)

In short.. If someone were to ask me, I'd recommend it.

That said.  I do admit I thiought it leveled faster than it appears it does. (if you are using self leveling)

I have both kinds in stock, Self leveling and beading.. I mostly use the latter.

Seems to me there are two issues here: (1) does it really "self-level" and (2) Dicor customer service response.

While no self leveling lap sealant flows out like paint, my experience with similar products is that a bead does indeed quickly lay down flat and I would expect a bead  to flatten out to at least 0.5 wide within a few minutes. I don't think the surface prep has anything to do with the self-leveling action. The bead in the first photo clearly did not. Second one is thin and mushed around some, so hard to tell.

As for the Dicor response, each of us can judge that for ourselves.

[quote author=stevenhmiller]It should have read, "Dicor customer service was not very friendly, and Camping World sales people are morons."
[/quote]

I'm sorry, but I still have trouble with this kind of generalization and characterization. JMHO, and maybe the influence of a little old fashioned training in mutual respect and civility.  Thanks Mom... 

OK, I give up, just what is that old, opaque 'self leveling' stuff up there on the roof in the pics? 

My old Lance had that stuff on every seam from the factory - looked like good stuff, and it's almost impossible to get off - an 'overcoat' after a thorough cleaning would seem to be the easiest way to reseal...

What's it called?

Thanks, Ray

Mexray said:

OK, I give up, just what is that old, opaque 'self leveling' stuff up there on the roof in the pics? 

My old Lance had that stuff on every seam from the factory - looked like good stuff, and it's almost impossible to get off - an 'overcoat' after a thorough cleaning would seem to be the easiest way to reseal...

What's it called?

Thanks, Ray

Click to expand...

I agree, it is impossible to get off, as I have tried. I'm not going to scrape up the top of my camper trying to get it off if it's just got some cracks in it. If it's pealing or breaking then I will remove it. But, it's good stuff and I wish I knew exactly what it was also.