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That sure doesn't mean I think my setup is the best way to go, just an economic reality for me. In fact, as we've discussed privately, I've even had thoughts of shutting off DW, either temporarily or permanently

I believe you can put your direcway service on vacation for a limited time each year when you aren't using it.  Might be something to check into.
 
IIRC I had a contract and I couldn't do a vacation thing until it was up. I'd better go re-read it.

BTW do you know if the system has to be on the air to do a vacation hold?
 
Tom said:
IIRC I had a contract and I couldn't do a vacation thing until it was up. I'd better go re-read it.

BTW do you know if the system has to be on the air to do a vacation hold?

I am not sure about that.  Guess we could ask.
 
Ron said:
Guess we could ask.

Would be nice to know. I suppose I could set the dish up in our front yard for that if I had to, but the dish and tripod normally stay in the coach at the storage lot.
 
Tom said:
Would be nice to know. I suppose I could set the dish up in our front yard for that if I had to, but the dish and tripod normally stay in the coach at the storage lot.

Better yet check it out while your at the Quartzsite rally in January.
 
Ron said:
....there was one case where the guy had the BD but had never updated the instrument data thus giving him problems.

Ron, that reminds me that I haven't updated my BD software since ...... :-[  Any chance you could tell us where and how to get the update(s)?

TIA
 
Tom,

Go to the following website.? Instructions are there.? I load the TV sats as well as the internet sats.?

http://www.birdog.tv/default.asp?CallType=CONFIGURE

I load my internet Sat first so it is the first thing in the list on the BD.
 
Good Morning, Tom.

>> I own both an OPI and a BD and I know which I prefer to use. I don't disagree that the BD is overpriced, but I usually don't consciously strut out the BD when others are looking, so I'm not sure what you're trying to say.
====
Tom, sorry that my kidding statement offended you. However, that's exactly what it was and included a cool smiley. As you well know, that is the clue to the reader just how a statement is intended. You did this once before and even implied public ally that I was lying -- with responses to my explanation of references to pictures "I" had posted with statements without smiley's such as, "Well, maybe . . ."

In this case, you know me personally and know I would not post otherwise -- so ensuing references to me such as, [. . . but for some reason personal preferences get misinterpreted &/or misquoted as "mine is better" or "mine is the only way to go". I've seen this in a number of discussions and can't figure out why folks misinterpret things that way.] and [It sure had nothing to do with wanting to impress ?my neighbors] are causing me to become more and more reluctant to post here.

If you want to continue to dig back into me, please wait until at least tomorrow -- as today is my birthday.
 
Happy birthday Bob, sincerely meant. Reminds me I should talk with Calendar Girl about if/how we flag birthdays on the message board. I don't often check the calendar, so I miss upcoming birthdays. Might be nice to have an automated message saying something like "Happy birthday xxxx", or "Pssst, it's xxxx's birthday today, if you want to wish him/her happy birthday". I seem to recall reading somewhere that this can be done, but don't recall if it's in the next rev of the software or if I have to do some coding.

Bob Buchanan said:
You did this once before and even implied public ally that I was lying

I sure didn't imply anyone was lying, but I know you misinterpreted what I'd written and were hung up on a single word that I'd innocently used instead of a more appropriate/accurate one. In addition to apologizing publicly, I even called you, explained what I'd tried to say and apologized.

If you want to continue to dig back into me .....

Wow Bob! Where did that come from? All I did was ask for clarification of what was written, but again this seems to have been misconstrued as having some negative connotation.

Maybe I should be the one who quits posting here, because I'm really dumbfounded by the way some of my comments are being interpreted. It's actually quite upsetting, given the hours I and others put in behind the scenes.
 
Ron said:
Go to the following website.  Instructions are there.

Thanks Ron. For some reason I was thinking I had to get them off the air or call the manufacturer. It sure explains why there's a USB cord in the carboard box. Another HFWPOH moment :-[  I guess I should take the BD out of its case to find where the USB receptacle is.

BTW between trips, my Birdog gets used very infrequently and I find the battery will have lost its charge. Do you see the same thing if you're in one place for a long time, or do you use it often enough that it's not an issue?

Back to dish pointing, I just had another thought - maybe we could get Chris trained to do the pointing for a manual roof setup with the BD around her neck (?) I know a very good trainer who is also an installer (hint). I wasn't kidding when I said the roof is a real challenge for me, but Chris has no problem going up the ladder. With everything hard wired in the coach, I might not keep hearing "you're not going to set that up just for one night are you?"

BTW I went to the storage lot yesterday to retrieve the dish and tripod so I could finally get to make/add some of the fine adjusters (I have a photo of yours printed out here ready). There's not much room between rigs at the lot and I occasionally see scratches from the landscape trailer next to me if the guy hasn't been to the dump before parking. Yesterday I saw some new scratches and was a bit annoyed, although I can easily buff them out. But I lost concentration long enough that, as I was squeezing past with the gear, one leg of the tripod popped open and left me with some unsightly scratches on the door of the coach. I was so mad with myself for not having secured the legs of the tripod last time I put it away, I just had to walk away, get in the car and drive home.
 
Not hard to up date.  I think the USB port is on the side of the BD.

Yes the battery does run down.  That is considered normal for the BD. One of the thing I do before pulling up stakes for a move is to verify the BD battery is not too low.


If you can talk Chris into pointing the dish I can do the necessary dish pointing training. 

Ouch.  scratches do tend to be upsetting no matter who put them there. :(  Hope you secured the tripod and dish before you drove away. :D
 
Ron said:
Yes the battery does run down. That is considered normal for the BD.

Interesting. I wonder what causes the drain. When we're on the move I'll have to remember to get into your habit of recharging before breaking camp.

If you can talk Chris into pointing the dish I can do the necessary dish pointing training.

That would be wonderful Ron. Now all I need is a roof mount. I'll send you a PM with a couple of questions.
 
Bob:

You said, "My opinion differs -- in that I "know" having a BD would have saved me only an occasional extra trip up and down the ladder. "

One question on that.  How do you retrieve your OPI without an additional trip?  Or do you leave it installed?  I assume you have a roof top mount.

Please be clear, I am not saying the BD is BETTER than the OPI.  For your situation, the OPI is certainly more appropriate than the BD.

I am just saying that I find climbing up to the roof, for me, to be a task I do not look forward to.  One time to set the dish is fine, as it also gives me time to clean the roof and check on other maintenance issues.  I can do that all in one trip.  When I have to go up a second time to retrieve my OPI, and sometimes a third time because of a necessary reboot... well that just makes me yearn for a BD.  :D 

It is a matter of personal preference, not that one is better than the other.  In fact, when Ron installed my dish he gave me the option of getting a BD.  I turned it down because at that time I did not think the benefit warranted the additional cost.  I have since changed my mind based on first hand experience.  Also keep in mind that my experience DOES differ from others, as I explain below.

And no, going back to a previous software page does not eliminate the need to reboot.  The dealers all acknowledge that some systems need regular reboots, and no one is sure why.  Based on the discussions I have read on the Yahoo RVsatnet forum, this issue varies from individual to individual, but plenty of folk out there have to regularly do an extra boot to get past the 8L8 problem.  For example Ron almost never has to do it, and I frequently have to do it.  Ron witnessed this when he installed my dish and ran into it himself.

I might add I never get a signal level above a 63 and currently I am at 57. Ron witnessed the 63 when he aimed my dish, yet I regularly read about people who get 70s and even 80s readings.  Since Ron and I are on the same sat, I assume it is likely a dish or arm problem on my hardware.  The roof bracket provided by Ron's dealer is a little loose, and Ron pointed this out to me when he installed it.  This might be contributing to the problem, or I might have a slightly warped dish.

At any rate, I concur with your closing statement that despite the hassles it sure is nice to have unlimited high speed access wherever I go, even when boondocking in remote areas.
 
Signal quality readings will vary between different transponders and the only valid numeric comparisons are for receivers on the same transponder.  On my present transponder, readings in the low 70s are normal.  On my first transponder, I always saw readings in the 90s.  both are normal and correct.
 
And no, going back to a previous software page does not eliminate the need to reboot.

Actually, it does. All you need to do is close the current signal strength display window, go back one page, click on the "enable OPI display" box and reselect "Display Signal Strength". No reboot of either the computer or modem is required.

If your error rates are within acceptable limits, it doesn't matter what your signal strength reads. Otherwise, I would suspect the cables or the receiver/transmitter as being the culprit; rather than any physical dish geometries - those babies are molded and not easily warped or mis-shapen.

"Regular" modem reboots are not the norm. If I have to reboot mine once in 2-3 months, that would be a lot.
 
59 sounds low but you would have to compare with others on your same satellite and transponder.  31 is the minimum SQ to get online, but the lower the value, the less margin for signal degradation, such as rain.

The best place to ask about other on your transponder would be at the Datastormusers forum.
 
Smoky,

We can look at your signal strength while at QZ. Your SS should be similar to mine and unless you are on a different transponder.  We can check it out while we are in the same location.  I have never tried this but if I wanted to leave the OPI in all the time I think I would get a plastic box with a cover that I could run the cable through the sides and connect to the OPI. Then seal where the cables enter the box.  Just open the lid to view the OPI during setup and close the lid when done.

 
Good Morning, Smoky:

>> I assume you have a roof top mount.
====
Yes, I have the same mount that Ron has. Actually, Ron and I have paralleled mounts and setup techniques from square one. I had scheduled my training just after QZ 4 years ago -- and Ron scheduled his 2 weeks later. However, he and Sam decided to drive over to Gila Bend and sit in on my training. It worked out well because some fellow kept bugging our trainer w/questions -- and Ron ran him off whereas I was reluctant to say anything. :)

At that point in time, there was no OPI nor was there a BD, nor was there a roof mount, nor was there a tripod mount. We simply bolted the mast to a 2x4' piece of plywood weighted to the ground with a concrete block -- and leveled with a torpedo level and shims. Our equipment consisted of the CW analog meter, cheap compass, and a wrench. Set up time was about 45 minutes.

I go thru this because even as archaic as this sounds, we only made one trip to the dish for set up. Ron only had to make one trip because Sam could tell him if the screen meter was green and on the correct bird. We knew which satellite we trying to hit and its position relative to the 3 satellites to right of the one we wanted. So we just moved the dish to the right past ALL the satellites and then brought it back to the 4th one that registered on the meter. Once we knew we had the right one, we peaked the signal using the 4 quadrant test. If you tug each of the 4 sides to the dish - and the CW meters reclines on each side, there is no other meter that will get you more dead center. I do the same thing now with the OPI as a final test prior to leaving the roof.

BTW, I was able to tell if on the right sat way back then because I purchased a set of $9.95 walki talki's from RS. I left one by the computer turned on and took the other with me to the dish. There are three levels of beeps when when finding the bird. When the highest pitch of the tree is heard, that's the right bird.

>> One question on that. ?How do you retrieve your OPI without an additional trip? ?Or do you leave it installed?
====
When I arrive at a new location, I first turn on the computer and modem. My main machine is a desktop. I go thru the setup screens up to the signal strength dialog -- having checked that I am using the OPI. The signal strength bar at that juncture is showing black bars -- and beeping very slowly. Along the way up to the signal bar screen, I note the three readings based on new location that I am going to need when I do the roof thing. ?I then grab my ditty bag of tools that consists of one ratchet wrench, a piece of paper containing the 3 readings, the OPI, and a cheapo compass -- and do my trip to the roof.

I set up the the dish and point it roughly toward Texas which where my bird is. After getting level, and setting the skew and elevation, ?I place the OPI in the line. At this point it is usually registering under 30. I then skirt the sky over Texas until the numbers begin moving up indicating I have found my bird. Using the 4 quadrant test, I peak the signal. I then take the OPI out of the line and put it back into my ditty back and return to the computer. I usually just click exit and restart (of the modem reboot) and let it do its thing on CrossPol and such -- whereas other times I continue all the way thru the DW setup.

My dish is still the original so the OPI does require a filter.  Either way, it does not have to stay in line so I bring it back down with me after pointing. If it did stay in the line - I would retrieve it when I broke down the dish.

>> Please be clear, I am not saying the BD is BETTER than the OPI.? For your situation, the OPI is certainly more appropriate than the BD.
====
Actually, the BD is "far" better than the OPI. I got a call from an RV park in OR yesterday that was looking to downsize their software. The package they were using would run a mega park, whereas mine is not designed for all the bells and whistles accounting stuff needed in such a park. The point is, the BD does all kinds of things that I don't need and would never use. Finding the TV sat is such a piece of cake, I wouldn't even use it for that. The OPI does 2 things for me -- mainly gives me the digital readings of SS that I got previously from my analog CW meter. It will also allow me to see if I pass XPol from the roof -- which I have never had to do anyway.

So bottom line here is that all one really needs while on the roof is to know when SS is peaked. The CW meter did that just fine -- and that is all I need from the OPI. If the CW meter would tell me if on the right bird, I wouldn't even need the OPI. The OPI let's me know that I am on the right bird plus gives digital read out and that's all I need and worth the $75. I paid for it.

>> I am just saying that I find climbing up to the roof, for me, to be a task I do not look forward to.? One time to set the dish is fine, as it also gives me time to clean the roof and check on other maintenance issues.? I can do that all in one trip.? When I have to go up a second time to retrieve my OPI, and sometimes a third time because of a necessary reboot... well that just makes me yearn for a BD.? ?:D
====
Oh -- I agree, for sure. That's one thing I checked out the day I bought the roof mount. Ron and I discussed this that day -- as that was the same day he bought his. If I have to make a second trip up that ladder with my less that perfect hip problems, the words I mutter are not acceptable on this forum. ?:mad:? Not sure why you need to go back up to retrieve the OPI? ?Once the SS is peaked, I put it away. If needed in the line, I would leave it there. Of course, you DO have to go back up to break down the dish for travel -- but this discussion is about set up vs. break down.

>> It is a matter of personal preference, not that one is better than the other.? In fact, when Ron installed my dish he gave me the option of getting a BD.? I turned it down because at that time I did not think the benefit warranted the additional cost.? I have since changed my mind based on first hand experience.? Also keep in mind that my experience DOES differ from others, as I explain below.
====
Again, the BD "is" better than the OPI. ?It's just that those extra features are not needed to set up a Direcway dish. And being able to set up w/o connection to the modem, to me, is far from worth the incremental cost.

>> And no, going back to a previous software page does not eliminate the need to reboot.? The dealers all acknowledge that some systems need regular reboots, and no one is sure why.
====
Then something is wrong -- it's a simple as that. If my system did that I would be on the horn to Direcway tech support in a heartbeat and would have them sending me new dishes, modems, or whatever until one worked correctly.

>> I might add I never get a signal level above a 63 and currently I am at 57. Ron witnessed the 63 when he aimed my dish, yet I regularly read about people who get 70s and even 80s readings.
====
I read that others have chimed in on that issue. Mine is 92 right now. If you know what you get most of the time, I would be content. As Ned mentioned, it should be high enough that a rain storm will not cause it to degrade below acceptable. Over the years as I watch the SS it does very weird fluctuations that I now just ignore. Once you peak properly on set up, you know you are getting best it has to "at that juncture" - so if you know it's dead center, just let it do it's thing from there. If it's raining at the NOC location and the sun is shining over your rig, the SS will go down.

>> At any rate, I concur with your closing statement that despite the hassles it sure is nice to have unlimited high speed access wherever I go, even when boon docking in remote areas.
====
Good -- and that's the bottom line. When you get to QZ you will find many dealers selling DW setups - and all will be selling OPI's as part of the package and none will be selling BD's. The StarBand dealers are using and selling the BD because they are not fortunate enough to have an OPI equivalent. ?Also you will find many of us at the QZ site that you can compare setup and other notes with. You will find us all very happy to share with you.
 
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