I just purchased 1995 Luxor and did our walk through on an extremely hot day. The dealer thought they had the coach cooled down but when we went it it was discovered that we had blown the breaker(on the outlet at the dealer, not on the coach). This happened a couple of more times before they realized we had the coach set on 50A and we were plugged into a 30A shore power outlet using pigtail. Now keep in mind we were only running the AC and a couple of lights. I was/am concerned that the coach was not cooling properly. I could certainly feel cold air coming out of the vents, but it was 95 degrees inside the coach, so anything would have felt cool. After an about two hours inside the temp dropped 2 degrees. The tech told me the air would cool better if we could run on 50 amps. My question is, is this true? Does the basement air run in economy mode at 30 amps, but has more power at 50 amps? Overall, what kind of cooling can I expect on a hot day? Am I going to keep the coach cool enough? Of course they told me it takes alot longer to cool the coach down when starting at 95 degrees inside on a 98 degree outside air day than if it was held at a constant temperature for a longer period? This is my first RV and I am just concerned that the unit is not cooling properly or is just not going to be able to keep things as cool as I want. Any words of advice would be greatly appreciated.
1995 Winnebago Luxor Basement Air Question
- Thread starter bigpemby
- Start date
The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an RV or an interest in RVing!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
SargeW
Site Team
I can give you our experience with our basement air keeping in mind that ours is 11 years newer and may work differently. Our air will work the same on 30 amp as on 50 amp. The difference on 50 amp is that all of the other systems in the coach will operate normally as well. We are currently hooked to 30 amp and the AC cooled normally yesterday. When the wife started the micro oven to start dinner the EMS (energy management system) in the coach started shutting things down to meet the load. It usually starts with the electric water heater, then AC compressor #2, fan speed, and lastly the fridge. The system sheds the loads one at a time until the load demand is met.
The EMS system should sense what amperage is available and adjust accordingly. In a properly working system you can expect a 20 degree difference between outside and inside temps. It is true that starting with a hot coach sitting in the sun will take longer to cool, but you should feel a difference after a few minutes. If the breaker at the dealer tripped the AC would not be running AT ALL. If the coach is in the direct sun with sun beating on the windows the AC will not cool as fast.
Get some assurance from the dealer that the unit will be put into good working condition before you accept it as normal. If the unit is low on freon it would be a pricey fix to have to pay for yourself. Don't let them BS you. Make them get it right.
The EMS system should sense what amperage is available and adjust accordingly. In a properly working system you can expect a 20 degree difference between outside and inside temps. It is true that starting with a hot coach sitting in the sun will take longer to cool, but you should feel a difference after a few minutes. If the breaker at the dealer tripped the AC would not be running AT ALL. If the coach is in the direct sun with sun beating on the windows the AC will not cool as fast.
Get some assurance from the dealer that the unit will be put into good working condition before you accept it as normal. If the unit is low on freon it would be a pricey fix to have to pay for yourself. Don't let them BS you. Make them get it right.
John Canfield
Site Team
First, read this thread. Both compressors will run on 30 amp power depending on other loads.
It will take hours to cool down your 95 degree interior. You should use a non-contact (IR) thermometer to measure your discharge air - it should be about 20 degrees cooler than the return air. Set the thermostat to say 70 degrees to be sure the second compressor will kick in.
As a general rule of thumb, if you are parked in full sun and in the hottest part of the day, your interior will be about 10-15 degrees cooler than the outside ambient air when it is cooled to the maximum.
The dealer's 30 amp breaker tripping isn't surprising - could be his breaker is bad. Old 30 amp outlets lose their spring tension and don't grip the plug blades tightly, then the plug/outlet heats up. I hate being on 30 amp power.
It will take hours to cool down your 95 degree interior. You should use a non-contact (IR) thermometer to measure your discharge air - it should be about 20 degrees cooler than the return air. Set the thermostat to say 70 degrees to be sure the second compressor will kick in.
As a general rule of thumb, if you are parked in full sun and in the hottest part of the day, your interior will be about 10-15 degrees cooler than the outside ambient air when it is cooled to the maximum.
The dealer's 30 amp breaker tripping isn't surprising - could be his breaker is bad. Old 30 amp outlets lose their spring tension and don't grip the plug blades tightly, then the plug/outlet heats up. I hate being on 30 amp power.
Thanks for the replies. I am setting the coach up tomorrow at the Camping World campground which is attached to the dealer I bought it from. I paid for a full check out on the coach and have been assured everything is fine. I am going to spend a few days in their campground and hold them to it. I have a feeling the air may be working properly, but my expectation was too high. We have been having 97 degree days here with high humidity.(Hotter than normal), and I like to keep my home cool. I may ultimately be asking too much of the system. If that is the case I guess my only other option would be to add a roof air. I am really hoping not to have to do that though. Thanks again for all the help. I am glad I found this community.
tennsmith
Well-known member
Just to reaffirm what John said, the basement units are not known for their cooling power. With both compressor's running, they will not hold a 72 degree temperature on a 95 degree day. They work best when the coach is cool (achieved during the night) and then they do a decent job of maintaining that cool to some degree of comfort till the next night. You really need to block all direct sunlight with window shades/curtains or whatever and particularly the front windshield which is huge and allows tremendous heat to enter the coach if the sun is shining through it.
There are a number of vendors of sunshields for the front windows, but if you are crafty, you can buy a roll of mylar thermal insulation (bubble wrap material with mylar coating on the outside) from the likes of Home Depot or Lowes or whatever home improvement store operates in your area and construct your own. You can put it inside or outside, folks use velcro, and/or the windshield wiper blades, and other goodies to hold it in place.
There are a number of vendors of sunshields for the front windows, but if you are crafty, you can buy a roll of mylar thermal insulation (bubble wrap material with mylar coating on the outside) from the likes of Home Depot or Lowes or whatever home improvement store operates in your area and construct your own. You can put it inside or outside, folks use velcro, and/or the windshield wiper blades, and other goodies to hold it in place.
One more quick question... The coach has day and night shades on each window, but no outside awnings(except the main awning). Would it help to have awnings installed over each window? Also what kind of performance can I expect from the basement air on a hot day when traveling and running the generator. Similar to being parked, or could I keep it cooler inside when moving?
John Canfield
Site Team
Window awnings are a significant help in keeping the sun off of the glass and some heat out of the interior. Our MCD shades are closed while we are traveling in hot weather and that helps while we are on the road. We usually start the gen set and run the air when the outside temps reach 85-90. It really helps to run the basement air on the road to keep the coach somewhat cool so the air doesn't have to work so hard when you stop for the night. I'm not sure the basement air works any better while you are moving, but I think the combination of dash air and the basement air works quite well in hot weather.
S
seilerbird
Guest
bigpemby said:
Whether it is cheaper to run dash air or generator and basement air is a subject which has been debated many times here without a definite conclusion.
The salesmen, being a salesman, blatantly lied to you tell you this so he could make the sale. There is no proof to his claim.
John Canfield
Site Team
bigpemby said:
Absolutely yes. Our dash air went out early last summer and we really missed it. In mild (below mid 80s) temps, dash air is all we need while on the road.
Well, I am not surprised to hear this. The dealer also told me that they don't work on dash AC. Do I need a RV specialist, or would a regular automotive AC repair facility be able to work on this? Or for that matter, if all it needs is to be recharged, is it something I can do without too much complication?
John Canfield
Site Team
Chances are good almost any automotive AC shop can work on your unit. Our problem was a plugged up receiver/dryer; you could try to add some Freon and see what happens. When working properly, the suction side of the circuit will be cold and condensing moisture , the discharge side of the compressor will be hot and dry.
The engine mounted AC compressor is probably using less than 5 hp, our generator is burning about 1/3 of a gallon an hour when we are using it on the road. It's not a debate of economy for us, it is a matter of comfort for running dash air and the genny.
The engine mounted AC compressor is probably using less than 5 hp, our generator is burning about 1/3 of a gallon an hour when we are using it on the road. It's not a debate of economy for us, it is a matter of comfort for running dash air and the genny.
Okay back to the basement air question posed originally. I was in the coach today AC running wide open(shore power). Was able to hold around 78 degrees while being around 94 degrees outside. I decided to switch the coach to 50 Amp power(inside the panel in the kitchen) because I have 50 AMPS coming in. I was in and out over the next 30 minutes or so bringing in things from the car. The inside temp came down to around 72 with the door opening and closing. I know this is not supposed to be the case, but it really seems that switching to 50 amps really made a difference. Is this at all possible?
John Canfield
Site Team
bigpemby said:
Possible if your EMS (energy management system) was switching the 2nd compressor and/or the high fan off. If all of the lights on the EMS were lit, that meant no load shedding was happening, and being on 50 amp shouldn't have made any difference. One other possibility is voltage sag while you are on 30 amp power. You could measure AC voltage at one of your outlets to prove/disprove this idea.
Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
You have a switch inside that does something to change power from 30A to 50A? That's strange and I'm not even sure how it might work. Can you tell us more about this switch & panel? If it is a EMS display panel, it is just reporting what you have, not changing anything.
RV Roamer said:
The switch is inside the kitchen. It looks like a heavy duty light switch. The top side is (50 Amps.. Shore Power or Generator). The bottom side is 30 Amps Shore Power. I was told this was in case I was in a location that only had 30 Amp Shore Power. Pretty clearly the AC unit is cooling the coach much better on 50 Amps for whatever reason. As for EMS, I am not even sure where that panel is. There is a Heart panel which I believe is showing what the Inverter is doing unless that is the panel you are talking about. I have to do some more studying. This is our first motorhome of any kind and i have it parked at the dealer's campground while I get used to it. I am trying to study and learn all I can before attempting to go on the road with it. We will soon be full-timing in it. I am going to take a picture of that switch and panel and attach it to another post later today.
John Canfield
Site Team
Hmm - that's a new one on me. Take a look at your wiring diagrams - check the Winnebago and chassis resources post near the top of this board.
catblaster
Well-known member
We have a 1995 Luxor also, when we bought ours last year the dash AC also did not work. after checking and testing the entire system I found that when it was born they used black O rings on the compressor, they don't like the 134A refrigerant. Change them to the high pressure green ones and tighten up VERY tight. I also found the filter/drier had been installed backwards to flow, looks like it came from the factory that way. Hope this helps with the dash AC.
madrone
Active member
I also have a '95 Luxor. I don't believe the EMS system refered to several times in this thread existed in '95. My coach definately cools better on the generator or 50 amps than it does on 30 amps. I think in this period 30 amps runs only one cooling unit. Also check your filter, it is floor mounted under the couch and gets very dirty very fast.
Steve
'95 Luxor AllSteer 37
'08 Subaru Legacy GT Spec B
Steve
'95 Luxor AllSteer 37
'08 Subaru Legacy GT Spec B
