12 volt

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kodak9

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Jun 7, 2008
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I am baffled??? It's happened 3 times now. I am plugged into 30 amp.at an RV park. My fridge is on electric mode. Basically nothing else is turned on during the day if we are away. When i come home the green light on my refrigerator and my propane detector may both be flickering. If i then turn on my ceiling 12 volt lights or any other 12 volt lights, the flickering stops and all works just fine. There is no rhyme nor reason when or why this happens. I presume it's got something to do with my  converter, but my electrical knowledge is very limited.
Any ideas????
John
Vernon, B.C.
 
Just curious, do you have your battery disconnect switch(s) ON or OFF?  (Some folks refer to these as the "Salesman" switches, usually located by the entry door.
It sounds like adding DC load stabilizes your 12 volt supply somewhat.  Some converters are not happy without a battery connected. 

Listing the type of rig you have and the type/model of your converter will greatly assist others in helping with a diagnosis.
 
My battery switch was off, and i have now turned it on. I am in a Durango 5th wheel 31 ft. by KZ. The converter is a WFCO  3 stage converter
 
The 12 volt battery can not re-charge if it is turned off...

Now: Depending on the loads 2 or 3 days WITHOUT CHARGING is a long time.

To charge the battery must be "ON" (Connected) and the unit connected to shore power or generator power.

 
The 12 volt needs to be on even if you are connected to shore power.  The fridge needs 12 volt to operate the control board as does the propane detector.  When you shut off the battery control switch, you shut off the supply even though you are hooked to electric, which effects the fridge and detector.  And as John points out, the batteries will not charge.  Most of us leave the battery shut off in the on position unless we are storing the unit.

Marsha~

 
Marsha/CA said:
The 12 volt needs to be on even if you are connected to shore power.  The fridge needs 12 volt to operate the control board as does the propane detector.  When you shut off the battery control switch, you shut off the supply even though you are hooked to electric, which effects the fridge and detector.  And as John points out, the batteries will not charge.  Most of us leave the battery shut off in the on position unless we are storing the unit.

Marsha~
Click to expand...

Marsha, on some most many coaches, turning off the battery disconnect switch while plugged into shore power  only results in interrupting the path to/from the batteries for charging.  (i.e. the converter continues to power the 12v appliance needs).  Generally, you would see no difference until you unplugged and discovered that your house batteries had not been charged.
 
Lou....ahh....good to know. 

I'm pretty confident on ours, if we click the disconnect switch to off, we loose all 12 volt into the coach even if connected to shore power.  But now you've got me wondering, so when we're connected on the next trip, I'll hit that disconnect and see if we still have 12 volt.

Marsha~
 
Marsha/CA said:
Lou....ahh....good to know. 

I'm pretty confident on ours, if we click the disconnect switch to off, we loose all 12 volt into the coach even if connected to shore power.  But now you've got me wondering, so when we're connected on the next trip, I'll hit that disconnect and see if we still have 12 volt.

Marsha~
Click to expand...
Mine does the same thing, Marsha.  If I turn off the "salesman" switch, nothing works that requires 12v.  I can hear the converter humming, but no lights or anything using 12v works.
 
Maybe I should confine my posts to only those that pertain to Fleetwood coaches, since that is what I have in the driveway to confirm my statements.

My Bounder does exactly as I stated.
 
Molaker said:
Mine does the same thing, Marsha.  If I turn off the "salesman" switch, nothing works that requires 12v.  I can hear the converter humming, but no lights or anything using 12v works.
Click to expand...

If that's the case, then your disconnect is after the CO and LP sensors and maybe doesn't remove their load from the batteries.  Ya think?
 
aka Porky said:
If that's the case, then your disconnect is after the CO and LP sensors and maybe doesn't remove their load from the batteries.  Ya think?
Click to expand...
No, it removes them from the load.  The sensor lights go out.  To be honest, I don't know how the darned thing is set up.  You would think if the switch opens the load between the battery & the converter, then the converter would operate the lights - but it doesn't.  So, you might think the switch opens the load between the converter and the rest of the 12v load.  But, the batteries are not being charged when the switch is cut off.

Some day, I've got to check it out further just to satisfy my curiosity.  But not now, it's about 15 degrees out.
 
Maybe I should confine my posts to only those that pertain to Fleetwood coaches, since that is what I have in the driveway to confirm my statements.
Click to expand...

I've got some bad news, Lou. Your statement doesn't even apply to all Fleetwood coaches. My American Tradition also shuts off all 12v in the coach, including the LP detector, when the disconnect is used.  Even with shore power present to run the charging system.
 
Gary RV Roamer said:
I've got some bad news, Lou. Your statement doesn't even apply to all Fleetwood coaches. My American Tradition also shuts off all 12v in the coach, including the LP detector, when the disconnect is used.  Even with shore power present to run the charging system.
Click to expand...

Well, guess what?  My own coach no longer works like that either. :eek: :-[ 

The installation of a large inverter/charger, (properly installed electrically and physically close to the batteries) required attachment on the non-switched side of the disconnect relay.  That appears to be the norm today.  It certainly is with the newer and larger rigs of today that come equipped with large Inverter/Chargers.

The old path from; Converter-to-Distribution Panel-to-Disconnect-to-Battery is no longer there.
The new path is now from; Charger-to-Battery-to-Disconnect-to-Distribution.

In my defense, I did say "some most many coaches" (never said all) came wired as I stated. ;) :D ;D 8)

That's my story and I'm sticking to it!!!! :)
 
Well it,s been over a week now.. I have left my battery switch on while connected to shore power and all is well.
So far so good
John
KZ Durango
 
Re: SHuts off everyting, somethings whatever...

I think this is a "Who wired it" thing.. Different mechanic at the factory.. Different set up.

My project of the day.... Wife likes to use an electric space heater.. Well, the motor home's el-cheapo wiring quickly smells a tad "hot" to me when she plugs it in.

So today.. I cut the hole, installed a box with a 20 amp outlet (BLACK, so as to distinguish it from all the RV outlets which are off-white) 12ga back to the Breaker box (no breaks, only thing on the breaker) and a dedicated breaker.. Current breaker is 15a cause that's all I had open.. but I'll drop a 20 in later.

No more hot wire smell.
 
John From Detroit said:
Current breaker is 15a cause that's all I had open.. but I'll drop a 20 in later.
Click to expand...
Changing the breaker is probably unnecessary although not uncalled for.  The wattage on the heater probably is 1500 watts max (12.5 amps at 120v).  Chances are the outlet she was using the heater in has a loose or poor connection or is just worn out.  Excess resistance will cause it to heat up (major cause of most electrical fires at home).  Leaving the breaker at 15 amps will give you a bit of a safety margin.
 
I fully agree Tom.. Though the heater is 2,000 watts and as it happens I have measured it with my Kill-A-Watt and it confirmed it's 2000 watts (well, 1995, close enough) I've run it on 15 amps several times with no problems save that the RV type wireing overheats.. So odds are I won't change the breaker.  The other HD outlet runs both a heater and a breadmaker.. So it got a 20 amp.  It is also on the other leg. (50 amp service)

I had 2 open 15 amp breakers... One on each leg.. So I made sure I picked the OTHER ONE.
 
John From Detroit said:
Though the heater is 2,000 watts and as it happens I have measured it with my Kill-A-Watt and it confirmed it's 2000 watts (well, 1995, close enough)
Click to expand...
Interesting.  I did a quick Google and can't find a 120vac heater that consumes 2000 watts.  There are all kinds of 220/240 vac heaters at that power, but no 120vac.  I think one would find that 2000 watts would not be UL approved if it plugs into a standard wall outlet as it would permit overload in many standard 15amp home wiring situations.  Does your heater actually give the power consumption rating as 2000 watts on the label?  If not, maybe your Kill-A-Watt is not reading correctly.  What Kill-A-Watt meter do you have?  I have a model P4460 which is labeled for max current of 15 amps and max power of 1875 VA.  I don't know if the Kill-A-Watt reads out in wattage or VA (volt/amp), though I suspect it is VA.  And, I don't know what the power ratio is on your heater, but most common heaters are 1:1 so watts consumed s/b pretty close to the same a VA usage.

All that gobbledygook aside, I guess I'm not surprised you smelled hot wires.
 
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