Heating the bays

lucyakers said:

Larry & Mary Ann,
You should have come home with me! Only lows of 25 or so here and not a trace of snow!

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Thanks Lucy, but we really needed to get home.

Join us, we saw 81 yesterday.

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Is that in Florida, George? That's not a state I want to visit again, even with comfortable temps. I don't much care for the big water, so that attraction doesn't hold, and it's too wet and moldy-looking, at least in the couple of areas we've seen. I'll stop there...

We did get out of Colorado City yesterday morning about 11 AM -- so late because of about 6 inches of snow on our slide topper. Finally got an extension ladder (my 7-footer wasn't enough) from the KOA folks and cleared off the remaining ice and snow -- learned a lesson. We learned a bit more about our rig, too, with all the cold, etc. The tanks really are heated, it's possible to use the bed with the slide retracted (better heating when zero and below -- no topper flapping in the strong winds), and we need to find a way to get our water bays heated. The utility bay has a plug, so we can put a drop light there when stopped, but we still need to find heat on the road (may not be possible, but...). And there are two other bays with water pipes, etc., one including the pump and water filter, the other with some drain valves and the water heater bypass valve, neither of which has electric plugs (not even 12V). The heat needs to be available when driving, too, since we encountered temps well below freezing on the road.

Of course since we winterized before leaving Benson, there wasn't a problem with freezing but it left us relying on water jugs for several days, which takes a lot away from the utility of an RV.

We finally got home about 2 PM yesterday, then unloaded. We were plenty tired, and even went to bed early (for us).

Betty Brewer said:

Wow ,
Larry and  Mary Ann thanks for the update.  We sure planned our Death Valley Rally at a peak of perfect weather.  A tad cold at night and if the wind blows, just plain cold.  But beautiful scenery .  Glad to meet you in Q and hope to see you back.

Betty

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It was good to meet you and all the other folks at QZ, too. We had a good time while there, but our storm experiences on the return trip will need a bit of thinking about and discussing. We won't make any final decision on return until later this year.

Larry
I have a 12v utility bay heater installed.  I think it is called a Back Seat Heater, you can remotely turn it on, I have a switch on the dash.  Monaco installs these as well as some other mfg's.  I would run a new wire and fuse it if you install it. 

http://www.safehomeproducts.com/shp2/product/back-seat-heat-plus-1100-btu-12-volt-truck-heater/12-volt-supplemental-heaters/377/377.aspx

Link to the heater, it has mounting backet, and remote trigger.  Works great!

A neat idea, Bill, but at 25 amps DC for each of them (3 needed), I don't think my alternator could keep up on the road -- not sure about the converter when stopped, with all the other stuff.

Thanks, though.

Larry N. said:

A neat idea, Bill, but at 25 amps DC for each of them (3 needed), I don't think my alternator could keep up on the road -- not sure about the converter when stopped, with all the other stuff.

Thanks, though.

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i installed 3 wired inside-outside temperature gauges from harbor freight in my water tank areas. i should have used wireless. 
i found that the water heater in the fwd comp. where the water pump and fwd part of the water tank is located keeps that compartment from freezing.
the middle compartment also is ok with the water heater on.
the aft water service compartment requires a 110v 100w bulb in a trouble light to stay above freezing when parked without the propane furnace running. my propane furnace warms this compartment  enough when we are not hooked up to shore power.

Thanks, Dan. I've had thermometers in the compartments, and they remain very close to outdoor temperatures. I do use a drop light in the utility compartment when parked, but that's not very practical when going down the road. Thanks for the thoughts, though.

Do the newer Bounders no longer have the utility compartments heated by the furnace(s)?  Our Southwind has the wet bays heated by the furnaces and yes, the colder it is outside the more the furnace runs, but it does heat the bays.  And that solves the problem going down the road also.

Howard

It's matter of choice but using the furnace while driving has never been noted to be a danger.  In our Newmar Dutch Star, the furnace has a switch that directs heat to the water bays.  The kitchen sink is a bad place but keeping the cabinet doors open helps.

Howard Rawley said:

Do the newer Bounders no longer have the utility compartments heated by the furnace(s)?  Our Southwind has the wet bays heated by the furnaces and yes, the colder it is outside the more the furnace runs, but it does heat the bays.  And that solves the problem going down the road also.

Howard

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There's certainly no heat in those three bays in our 2010 Bounder, Howard, although the water/holding tanks are heated. I'm hoping to find a way to get the furnace heat in those bays the way you mention on your Southwind -- that would solve all our water/heat problems.

It took me several hours but last fall I found a way to run a good extension cord from 1) inside the sink lower cabinet into the water pump bay on passenger side and 2) from bathroom down the washer/dtyer opening into the water intake and tank dump compartments on the other side.. both extension cords are out of sight ..
I now can use either light bulbs or the small 200watt heaters in either/both compartments... either when on shore power or when gen is running if traveling..
coach is supposedly good to 20 but I now believe I can travel or park safely at least down to zero or below as long as I supply 110V power to them..

Larry N. said:

There's certainly no heat in those three bays in our 2010 Bounder, Howard, although the water/holding tanks are heated.

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So they're just using heater pads on the tanks now?  That would sure seem like a step backwards.

Howard

Howard Rawley said:

So they're just using heater pads on the tanks now?  That would sure seem like a step backwards.

Howard

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No, no heater pads -- the tanks are heated by the furnace, and are inside the under belly of the rig, but the three water bays are separate from the tanks, two of them being normal storage bays, as well. One of the three is the utility bay, which has the shore water connection, low point drains, pressure fill valve, the "outside shower," the sewer hose connections and the cable TV connection, in addition to the main electrical plug (50/30/etc. amp cord for shore power). The second of those bays has the water pump, the whole house water filter and some valves and piping in it, in addition to the storage space. The third one is just behind the water heater, and contains the water heater bypass valve, a couple of drains (not low point), and some piping, in addition to being a normal storage bay. Of the three, only the utility bay has a 120VAC receptacle in it.

I was wondering how our Itasca would hold up in cold weather so I called and asked and was told that while my LP Furnace will heat the bays, it probably wouldn't hold up in subzero weather.  Do any of you have this same type of setup, without special tank heaters?  We like to camp all year long and while here in California we don't worry much about that type of weather every once in awhile we head up to the mountains and have had it snow on us.  In our Super C, we had a switch that turned on the tank heaters and whenever the water would freeze they would take care of it.  Now, I'm concerned that this new Class A won't be as easy to cope with snowy weather.  Any info would be appreciated.  Thanks!

Ok I'm still a little confused ... I think what you're saying is all three of the water bays are heated with the furnace but you are looking for alternative ways to heat them on the road other than the furnace?  Or am I still confused ...  not unusual.  ;D

Howard

Howard Rawley said:

Ok I'm still a little confused ... I think what you're saying is all three of the water bays are heated with the furnace but you are looking for alternative ways to heat them on the road other than the furnace?  Or am I still confused ...  not unusual.  ;D

Howard

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I think your confusion is that you assume the tanks are in the water bays. The tanks are heated by the furnace, and are inside the underbelly of the coach, but are not in the three bays I'm referencing.  The water bays I'm talking about do not contain tanks. Two of them are just your ordinary storage bays which happen to also contain a little water-related stuff. The third is the utility, or hookup bay, not used for storage, but rather for water/sewer/etc. connections. None of the three is heated at all.

Larry N. said:

The water bays I'm talking about do not contain tanks. Two of them are just your ordinary storage bays which happen to also contain a little water-related stuff. The third is the utility, or hookup bay, not used for storage, but rather for water/sewer/etc. connections. None of the three is heated at all.

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OK, gotcha now .... that seems rather counterproductive ... heat the tanks but not the lines ... not good for Colorado this time of year. 

Howard

Don't like Florida?

Is that in Florida, George? That's not a state I want to visit again, even with comfortable temps. I don't much care for the big water, so that attraction doesn't hold, and it's too wet and moldy-looking, at least in the couple of areas we've seen. I'll stop there...

We did get out of Colorado City yesterday morning about 11 AM -- so late because of about 6 inches of snow on our slide topper.

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Really?  I hate snow and ice.  Haven't found any here in Southwest Florida in the last 17 years that I have been here.  We did have a cold front come through last night.  Its 60 degrees and I'm freezing my tail off.

Well, it's 2? F outside here, Bill, and I'm comfy (inside, of course). Temperature is only one of many criterion for comfort. Humidity bugs me a lot and there's much more, but I won't continue that here, other than to say that mountains and desert are my favorite places. I've noticed over the years that there are lots of folks that love boating, oceans, Caribbean cruises, and many other things that aren't exactly up my alley, and relatively few that share a lot of my likes. But that's OK -- leaves a bit more room for me in my favorite places (some are already crowded, though, and no longer my favorites).

Larry
I spoke with my Fleetwood contact about your situation.  Even the wet bays get heat, but not enough for those temps.  She gave me this number for you to call for more hints on cold weather challenges and solutions.  800-322-8216  Let me know if you get anything good.

You can buy tank heaters here

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/NEW-TANK-HEATER-12V-26-X-7-25-390840-_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQhashZitem2a0d4e4ea2QQitemZ180611862178QQptZMotorsQ5fRVQ5fTrailerQ5fCamperQ5fPartsQ5fAccessories

4.8 Amps with a thermostat, designed for 30 gal tanks. Marked way down under $10.00 each.