Stealing WiFi is, well, stealing

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In reading that article (in the context of this thread,,, USING a wi-fi connection you happen upon) it appears they are concentrating on laws which prohibit unauthorized computer access.

One could argue if the Linksys Router (or whatever the provider is using) is, in fact a computer, since it does nothing but pass traffic.

However there is more

In the opening paragraph they said they set out to do a Wi-Fi Hack, to read their NEIGHBOR's E-mail.

This, is illegal on it's face

But what about reading your OWN E-mail?

Ok, I'll use myself as an example.

I connect via a stumbled upon Wi-Fi.  Have I accessed the connection owner's computer (likely not, likely only his router and modem were involved)  Have I gotten any "information" from him (Just his SSID)

Now I go for my E-mail... Have I accessed the computer it's on (Yahoo) without permission (NO, I have permission) Have I obtained information from it,  Yes, but again, I have permission.

Did I violate the law?  Depends on where I'm parked and how I stumbled across his connection.

Did he break the law.. Much the same answer

 
I have been struck over the years by the creativity of RV'ers to do what ever fits their agenda and no more so then when it comes to legal issues regarding toys. A few years ago it was folks setting up Direcway tripod units in the face of clear FCC regulations that prohibited such use, then it was and still is over width and now over length violations, then wi-fi access, and coming on fast is in-motion TV viewing within in the view of the driver and the list goes on. We're an unlawful bunch it seems.  ;D
 
I have searched the FCC regulations many times over and have yet to find or has anybody been able to provide a link to any FCC regulation that that prohibit the use to the direcway systems on a tripod.  The only regulation that I have seen relative to the DW systems states that is RECOMMENDED (not required) that the system be set up by a Qualified (not certified) person.  This has not changed.  Additionally the automated systems fall under the same FCC regulations as the tripod deployed systems since both systems use less than a 4 watt transmitter.  This was a rumor started by a few Motosat dealers (not Motosat themselves).  Now if you can provide a link to those "clear FCC regulations" then I will stand corrected. 
 
The FCC does not apply to transmitters of less than 4 watts power.  Hughes, on the other hand, has a number of requirements for the use of their satellite equipment.  That includes the requirement for a qualified installer and the minimum height of the antenna.

This issue has been settled for quite some time and many dealers sell both Motosat and tripod mounted systems.  Nothing illegal involved and no FCC regulations either.
 
I didn't want to start this whole DW thing all over - but the FCC requirements were a flow down to Hughes who is charged with enforcement. It can be found in the licensing agreement. Hughes in turn on October 30, 2002 put out the "Policy on the Installation and Operation of Direcway two-way satellite Earth Stations" of which I have a copy in sight as I type. This policy includes on page 9 of 9 two pictures - one a "compliant Installation" and the other "illegal/Unsafe installation"  The compliant is a unit installed on top of an RV the illegal is a tripod. This policy further laid out the "Responsibilities and Liabilities of Installers" All certified installers were required to sign this document which states "I hereby certify that I have read the HNS Policies ------------ , understand them, and agree to abide by them"

Leo
 
Ok, I'm seeing ferterlizer again.

Years ago, many years ago now, the FCC did require that any transmitter be installed by a LICENSED technician, at least anything over 100mw (That is 0.1 watt) any microwave required a microwave licensed technician no less.

As I said, that was long long ago but not very far away.

Then, long about the time I was in college, they changed to an "Industrial Certification" method for many folks.  I am, for example, a certified electronics technician. (I went to school, I have the wallpaper) When I was much younger this meant nothing to the FCC, but today it means I can work on some transmitters.

As Ron has noted, there is no Federal rule requiring someone setting up a Hughs dish be licensed any more

Hughs requires they be qualified, this is true.  Ron, and one assumes others who "install" tripods, do give training courses to their customers, and observe them setting up their antennas (That is known as a final exam) and though they do not actually issue a physical certificate stating you compleated the training and known how to do it,  They could.

Add to that the antenna, or rather the modem, has some rather sofisicated software in it's firmware that more or less insures you do it right or it refuses to work and near as I can tell all requirements and laws are complied with.

And trust me, I don't want to endanger my federal issued license by breaking any FCC rule or regulation
 
John In Detroit said:
Ok, I'm seeing ferterlizer again.

Years ago, many years ago now, the FCC did require that any transmitter be installed by a LICENSED technician, at least anything over 100mw (That is 0.1 watt) any microwave required a microwave licensed technician no less.

As I said, that was long long ago but not very far away.

Then, long about the time I was in college, they changed to an "Industrial Certification" method for many folks.? I am, for example, a certified electronics technician. (I went to school, I have the wallpaper) When I was much younger this meant nothing to the FCC, but today it means I can work on some transmitters.

As Ron has noted, there is no Federal rule requiring someone setting up a Hughs dish be licensed any more

Hughs requires they be qualified, this is true.? Ron, and one assumes others who "install" tripods, do give training courses to their customers, and observe them setting up their antennas (That is known as a final exam) and though they do not actually issue a physical certificate stating you compleated the training and known how to do it,? They could.

Add to that the antenna, or rather the modem, has some rather sofisicated software in it's firmware that more or less insures you do it right or it refuses to work and near as I can tell all requirements and laws are complied with.

And trust me, I don't want to endanger my federal issued license by breaking any FCC rule or regulation
Click to expand...

You are a poster child for my observation.
 
Blueblood... I should take a closer look at that instalation if you would provide the URL please. (I do seem to recall seeing something like you describe)

There are tripod instalations and there are tripod instalations

It would be far easier for me to install my dish at about 4.5 feet off the ground than at six foot plus.

And what is more I could use the same tripod (just don't extend the legs)

That, however, would not be compliant.  Grounding can be an issue with tripods if you do not know how to do it

One of the things I have received special training in is how to set a ground.

But then, that was long before I heard of Hughes or Direcway internet service
 
John,

This may or may not be the same document Leo is referring to, but here's a link to a copy of Hughes Network System?s Policy for the Installation and Operation of Two-Way Satellite Antennas. Illustrated examples of a "Compliant Installation" and "Illegal/Unsafe Installation are shown in Annex C. This version, dated May 15, 2005 may or may not be the latest version of the document.
 
I wonder how many MH rooftop installations, including HNS Certified Installer installed Motosat units are in compliance, spewcifically as it relates to section 5.4 quoted below. My guess is very few.

5.4 For vehicles with roof mounts, if a roof access ladder or any other means of access to the roof exists on the vehicle, the
ladder or access must be blocked by a suitable rope or other barrier while the Antenna is deployed or in operation. The
Installer must provide this rope or barrier directly to the End User at the time of Installation and advise the user to
employ it at all times when the antenna is deployed or in operation. Caution signs must also be provided by the
installer to the End User to be posted on the rope or other barrier cautioning all persons not to attempt to access the
roof of the vehicle while the antenna is deployed or in operation.
Click to expand...
 
When our Datastorm was installed, they affixed such a caution sign to the ladder.  Of course, it was removed the next day as it interferred with climbing :)
 
The lower half of our ladder is removable; I stow it in a locked storage bay and it is temporarily attached only long enough to get on the roof and come down again.

BTW it's unfortunate that the photo of the "compliant" roof installation doesn't show the ladder (or alternatively, the sign) on that coach.

Maybe we chould have a compliance check at Moab. I'll have a tape measure in the toolbox and could bring some signs, stakes and rope for sale.
 
Tom,

I agree about the photo. You can bet it has a ladder! BTW: you won't need your tape measure; it's a well known fact that Compliance Officer Bob regularly measures tripod mounts for proper height above ground, so he's sure to have one! ;D
 
Karl,

Bring your calculator along so we can correctly position the fences around any non-compliant mounts. The formula is spelled out in Appendix 1 of Annex D of the HNS policy document.
 
LOL Karl, you can use the table instead of doing the math.
 
LOL Karl, just multiply by 3, add 10% and it's close enough to feet  ;D  Alternatively, just multiply by 39 and the numbers are in inches. Told you to bring your calculator.
 
Convert the numbers to base 39 and the math is much simpler :)
 
Karl said:
Tom,

That's even worse. This is the U.S. - we don't do meters very well ;D
Click to expand...


Several of us do meters very well, even here in the US.  (Generally anyone with an ID that conists of one or two leters, a single number and 1,2 or 3 letters can do meters, often in his head)

Usually I do 2 meters in fact
 
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