New Winnebagos . . . What a Disappointment!!! :'(

At 70, where any kind of memory is a bonus benefit, I still have fond memories of the day way back in the Fall of 1998, when we discovered the perfect motorhome: Winnebago Adventurer 32T with no slides. It was at one of those big dealer semi-annual RV Supersales weekends. It was our very first motorhome. Before signing on the dotted line, we sat in the rig for a full two hours chatting, while trying to imagine what months on the road would be like in a rig like this. We imagined that life on the road would be absolutely wonderful! And now, almost 14 years later, after crossing the Continent every which way, we are totally satisfied with our original decision to buy this rig.

With 14 years of delaminating sidewalls dissolving in the rain, we are not doing any worse than all the other delaminated Winnebagos in our part of the world. But, it's time to move on and buy a new rig.
#1 objective, would be to find a rig that didn't have laminated luan sidewalls; but I don't believe they exist.

So . . . back to dealing with the devil I know! We spent an entire day at the dealer's show. The first rigs we toured were the Winnebago offerings; and we couldn't believe what we saw. They were all, without exception, dark and horrendously gloomy with only a few TINY windows on each side; and you had to feel your way around the back bedroom. Quite honestly . . . I wouldn't take ANYTHING Winnebago had to offer, as a gift, if I actually had to live in it!!

A very basic known principal of vending realestate, is that bright with lots of windows sells!! Dark and gloomy doesn't!! Whoever is now designing Winnebagos obviously doesn't have the slightest clue as to what she doing, let alone ever having any RVing experience. This toxic combination is not going to work in Winebago's favour. Our local Winnebago dealer, by far the largest RV dealer in Ontario, Sicard RV, has pretty much abandoned Winnie in favour of HR, simply because recent horribly designed Winnies no sell.

So . . . with Winnebago reluctantly off the list, what are the other options?

The Newmar Canyon Star 3856, although a bit large, looks like a good option for older people who tend to slow down a bit, and spend more time at each location. I haven't viewed one of these rigs first hand, and with only two dealers in Ontario, with limited stock, it might be better to simply head down to Camp Newmar to view their offerings first hand.

http://www.newmarcorp.com/images/models_uploads/large_2012_CSCA_3856_colored.gif


         

How dark the interior looks is a factor of what wood is chosen,  maple/oak is light, cherry is dark and darkens with age.  You are exactly correct - a dark interior lends a feeling of being closed in and not cheery.

My impression of walking through many different Winnebago products is dramatically different from yours.  The 2010/11/12 Tour/Ellipse has the most amazing layout and livability of any coach I have ever seen.  These are the quintessential fulltiming units.

If you have seen all of Winnebago floorplans and wood/color choices and don't like them, I can without reservation recommend Newmar products.  I like Tiffen as well.  Monaco is fine.

>How dark the interior looks is a factor of what wood is chosen,  maple/oak is light, cherry is dark and darkens with age.  You are exactly correct - a dark interior lends a feeling of being closed in and not cheery.

>My impression of walking through many different Winnebago products is dramatically different from yours.  The 2010/11/12 Tour/Ellipse has the most amazing layout and livability of any coach I have ever seen. These are the quintessential fulltiming units.

Thank you John, but the units on display were somewhat south of the Tour; but even looking at the Tour:

http://www.gowinnebago.com/products/2012/tour/exterior/

I don't know what the driver's side looks like, but there are only two teensy weensey tiny windows on the passenger side. And this represents my experience in viewing lower end Winnebago units at the show. They all had teensy weensey tiny peepholes for windows, and some of the bedrooms had none.

I remember when we bought our first TT way back in 1973: the brightest one with the biggest windows, was the one we towed home.

If you have seen all of Winnebago floorplans and wood/color choices and don't like them, I can without reservation recommend Newmar products. I like Tiffen as well.  Monaco is fine.

Thanks. I intend to pursue the Newmar option as first choice. Although the only two dealers in all of Ontario are close by, they don't carry a lot of stock.  For a decision this critical, we would probably be best served by taking a trip to Camp Newmar. 

As for Tiffen, while they have an excellent reputation, they have no dealers in Canada. Not necessarily an unsurmountable problem, since I go past their facilties every winter.

I have also been looking into HR Monaco. HR now seems to be the object of choice for our only Winnebago dealer.

Thanks for your input John. It would be so nice if we could simply buy an exact duplicate of the RV that has provided us with so much pleasure over the past decade.   

We did our homework, we had a 2007 Tiffin Phaeton, IOHO, the 2012 Tour/Ellipse, is the most advanced, modern, bright, homey looking RV on the market.  We wanted to stay with Tiffin, but even their top of the line Zephyr did not match up to the Tour (the Zephyr is also a couple of 100k more expensive).  The interior layout with its corner TV/Fireplace, J-Lounge, entire side/slide, RR, bath and a half etc, etc, gets away from the more typical RV with 2 couches looking at each other and the TV overhead between the driver and passenger.  Cocktails for 6, dinner for 4 sleeps 2 - what else could you ask for.

We looked at a LOT of RVs at a couple of recent rallies. Many had dark wood which we do not like. Many had only a couple of tiny windows in the bedroom, dark and no ventilation. We looked at Winnebago, Newmar, Tiffen, Thor and in all of them there was more than one model that was dark and gloomy. BUT in all the brands we looked at, there were models that were light and cheery. So my suggestion is to keep looking and don't eliminate any brand.

Wendy

The large windows all around and light wood (washed maple) of our 2005 Vectra 36RD were a big factor in our choice.  If you look in the 2005 Vectra Brochure the first large interior picture is a 36RD with our color scheme/woodwork--we love it!

Interior an exterior styling is largely a matter of taste. What you hate, someone else will love. And the RV manufacturers have highly tuned antennae for what most current customers will like.

So, you need to shop some other brands: Tiffin, Fleetwood, Newmar, Monaco, to name the major ones.

I can't condemn all Winne's. The dark wood color scheme was a favorite for a couple of years it seems. My last Winne was dark wood and we liked it for the time we had it (4 years).  But when we got the new rig we really loved the coffee glazed maple. Kind of a mid way point between the dark cherry and the light oak. I think many manufactures went that way for a while.

And the fewer windows mean better heat and AC retention in the coach. So it's kind of 6 of one, half a dozen of the other.  Somewhere you will find the perfect match of color scheme, windows and price point. That's the free enterprise system.

Winnebago, Fleetwood, and Monaco are manufacturers that I don't like.
Newmar and Travekl Supreme/Entegra are manufacturers that I like.
I consider Travel Supreme an offshoot of Newmar since the people that founded Travel Supreme in 1989 were ex-Newmar employees that left the company to start their own RV manufacturing business. And then when Travel Supreme went out of business and Jayco bought them to become Entegra-Jayco carrying on the ideas of the founders of Travel Supreme that are similar to Newmar's that continue to make the coaches similar to those of Newmar's.
I consider the Envoy to be Travel Supreme's competitor to the Kountry Star, the Insignia the competitor to the Dutch Star; the Select the competitor to the Mountain Aire, the Alante the competitor to the Essex; and the Limited the competitor to the King Aire. And of course-Travel Supreme's Mid Engine model to be the competitor to the All Star. One thing though-I consider Travel Supreme's Mid Engine model to be more on par with the Mountain Aire whereas the All Star is more of a mid-level coach.
We recently drove from Michigan to Arizona to trade in our 2000 36' Journey and take delivery of a 2006 42' Travel Supreme Mid Engine.

Stan, if you'd keep working on Tom and Jane and convince them that their 42QD is dark and dreary inside, or that it's about to delaminate, I'd appreciate it. Then maybe they'd sell it to us at a great price. We're about to retire and get a new coach, and we really like that rig! I mean... We hate it and we want to take it off their hands, because we don't want to see them suffer anymore.

Kev

^ ;D  ;D  ;D ^

There areas where Winnebago is waaaay ahead of the competition, such as their efforts to provide owners with a complete service manual and parts list for each rig. To my knowledge, Winnebago is the only RV mfg to even attempt to provide customers with such excellent support.

In reading up on experiences of happy Newmar customers, it seems that with rigs less than ten years old, when attempting to get replacement parts, they are often met with an apathetic response from Newmar: "Sorry, we no longer stock that part", or "The manufacturer of that part has gone out of business, and we can no longer get that part."  :'( "Yawn . . . " Going the Newmar route is a rather scary venture.

That is so different from Winnebago's commitment to customer support! "If we don't stock the part, we will make one!!" Over the years, I've never heard of anyone no being able to get a part for a Winnebago, regardless of age.

And that's why I am so disappointed with Winnebago's unappealing current offerings. First they eliminated the rear window; and then they started eliminating side windows, and the ones they retained, have shrunk to the size of portholes, leaving a dark gloomy unappealing interior. I would give up RVing before I would ever consider buying any of the recent units I have seen at a show :-\.

I personally don't care for the rear windows in my class C, and surely would not want one in a class A when I get ready to trade up. 
Scott 

Yeah, i feel that way too. But, different strokes for different folks, right?

Kevin Means said:

Stan, if you'd keep working on Tom and Jane and convince them that their 42QD is dark and dreary inside, or that it's about to delaminate, I'd appreciate it. Then maybe they'd sell it to us at a great price. We're about to retire and get a new coach, and we really like that rig! I mean... We hate it and we want to take it off their hands, because we don't want to see them suffer anymore.

Kev

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Thanks for the offer Kev, but Jane, Tom & TC will continue to "Tour" the country bearing the burden of traveling in our "horrendously" dark and gloomy Winnebago, glimpsing out thru our "portholes" and bemoaning the fact we have no rear window.  We have a tough RV life.

tomnnva said:

Thanks for the offer Kev, but Jane, Tom & TC will continue to "Tour" the country bearing the burden of traveling in our "horrendously" dark and gloomy Winnebago, glimpsing out thru our "portholes" and bemoaning the fact we have no rear window.  We have a tough RV life.

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LOL, yep, just don't take up needle point and you should be able to suffer through .

Love my 'NEW' 2012 Itasca Ellipse 42QD... Presently on I-40 heading east to gatlinburg as I write this response. this is the 2nd time the wife has driven the coach and she already thinks she's a truck driver.

This wood is lighter than my last three 5th wheels and this thing has windows everywhere. Best improvement are the MCD shades.

I am running the inverter while on the road to run the fridge and keep my laptop plugged in to the wall socket next to the co-pilots seat, one of many located throughout.

Wow!  I certainly don't see the new Winnie's having only "portholes" for windows!  And I haven't seen a rear window in a class A in over 20 years!  I certainly don't want a rear window in our next Class A. 

Sometimes I do believe that Winnebago takes owner suggestions and comments and incorporates them into the next generations of offerings.  For instance, I believe that the Winnie  roof thickness increase was a direct response from the comments we made several years ago about the lack of insulation in the Class A offerings.  Also from feedback, the BTU increase in the basement air offerings until the elimination of the basement air entirely.  Also, the overhead TV neck straining issue, as floorplans gravitated away from this TV placement.

FrontrangeRVer said:

Sometimes I do believe that Winnebago takes owner suggestions and comments and incorporates them into the next generations of offerings. 

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I believe they really do. I spoke with a rep about the 36M that came out this year, we were seriously interested but the bedroom just would NOT work for us. When I asked him why not turn the bed E/W instead of N/S he clearly stated because that's what so many customers are asking for. Also when we were looking at the 40U when they first came out and they only had 2K CCC, we asked the rep if they could upgrade an axle/tires for us to double CCC and they stated we weren't the first to ask but they could not do it special for us...tada, 2012's have a heavier front axle and therefore over 4K CCC in which we dived in and purchased. Point being, yep, I think they listen.

rvgary said:

Love my 'NEW' 2012 Itasca Ellipse 42QD...

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Welcome Gary!!

(Check the spelling of Itasca in your signature  )