Oh no, it's an RV. We better get in front of him!

LA: I will say that LA drivers are much better than Phoenix. In LA usually if you put on your turn signal to move over a lane, they will make space for you - while in Phoenix they will speed up to make sure you can't move over ahead of them. Chicago drivers are also pretty good.

Oklahoma drivers. Years ago while traveling through OK City a guy on an entrance ramp was mad because I didn't more over to make room for him (no way I could with traffic to my left), now if he had looked before the last minute he would have had plenty of room to speed up and enter ahead of me. Instead he hit the horn, then entered behind me and then went around to get in front . Then the idiot slammed on his brakes. Maybe he had a death wish.This was just after we had come through a crash site that per the truckers on the CB was caused by road rage.

ken

Many years ago, I went to LA about once a month and drove from LAX to China Lake... I5 if I recall correctly, maybe 405?.  Anyway, once I got onto freeway, I'd notice the color and model of a few cars around me... 10, 20, 30+ miles later, sometimes more, there they were, the same vehicles in the same relative location without any special effort.  Amazing.  Any other place, it's unusual to see the same vehicles for even 2 minutes unless the freeway is really clogged and going about 10 mph of stop 'n go.  LA drivers really know how to use freeways...truly amazing.  The worst I've seen is Houston.

Stella said:

I have to relate what happened when I first brought my RV home last week. I had driven my cousin's 28 foot class C several times and figured a class A 30' would be about the same. We live on a cul-de-sac street and as I went down to the turn around I fully expected it to be a three point turn as always.

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Stella -
The turning radius on a class C and a class A are different not because of the length of the vehicle but because of the wheelbase. A 30 foot class A generally will have a much longer wheelbase than a 28 foot class C. Recently I upgraded from a 27 foot class A to a 32 foot class C. Lou Schneider had explained to me that the unit I was buying had a much longer wheelbase so the turning radius would be different and as always, Lou was correct. However the upside to a longer wheelbase is that it will be much more stable in wind and when a semi passes you. With the shorter wheelbase 27 foot I would scrape the back end going in and out of parking lots. With the longer wheelbase 32 footer I don't think I have scraped even once.

Check out the two photos below. The top one is the 32 foot Damon. Notice the wheelbase is about 65% of the overall length of the vehicle. Compare it to the 27 foot Allegro. The wheelbase is about 50% of the length of the vehicle.

They found that LA commuters exercised rigid lane discipline:  They entered the freeway, moved immediately to their ideal lane and then stuck to it until it was time to transition off the freeway.  They did not weave from lane to lane trying to find a faster lane.

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Interestingly, I made the same observation about Bay area drivers on my first visit in the 70's. My host, who had previously lived on the east coast, agreed with the observation. However, driving habits here changed significantly over the years, and I wouldn't characterize folks as disciplined drivers nowadays.

So where are the worst freeway drivers found? That one is easy. Honolulu. I used to vacation there every year when I was an electrician and they really take the cake as far as bad habits on a freeway go. They are clueless. But there is a good reason. There were only about ten miles of freeways in the entire Hawaiian Island chain and the rest of the roads were narrow, curvy two lane roads so they really didn't have much experience.

I remember one memorable trip in SF about 15 years ago. I was living in Utah at the time and I had just come off the Golden Gate bridge in 35 mile per hour traffic. It was crowded and I had to change lanes. When I finished the lane change some idiot pulls up next to me and screams at me "A--hole, go back to Utah!"

I discovered the real secret of freeway driving in any city is to stay in the lane that is just to the left of the right hand lane. If you are in the right hand lane you must continually put up with people merging onto the freeway. If you go any other lane it means you must change lanes a bunch of times. So I merge onto a freeway, move over one lane and stay there.

Tom said:

Interestingly, I made the same observation about Bay area drivers on my first visit in the 70's. My host, who had previously lived on the east coast, agreed with the observation. However, driving habits here changed significantly over the years, and I wouldn't characterize folks as disciplined drivers nowadays.

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Bay area drivers seem to be pretty good, for the most part.  My RV is my only vehicle, so I do a fair share of around the town driving, and I'm quite surprised how courteous drivers are around here.  I try to be as well.  One thing I do notice, is how often folks do not seem to look when they merge onto the freeway.  Some people seem to expect the red carpet to be rolled out for them when getting on the freeway.  If a person merging, can not adjust their speed to go faster, or slower, than a big huge box going 55 mph on the freeway, I have a hard time being courteous.  I've seen them look at the last minute, see me, then I get that surprised look...and I wave "yes I'm here".   

zzyzx,

Fantastic observation! Yes the wheel base is different. At first it felt strange- then after inflating the tires and rear air bags (they were empty) to proper pressure the ride was a joy!

I am also learning that, though I always respected big-rig drivers, they are now truly amazing people. Not because they can drive the vehicles but because of the courtesy most have for me in my RV. I get waves, nods, they allow me in generously.

I was in a lane that would take me off an off ramp under construction and had to move over in traffic. Trucks and large vehicles are prohibited to use it because it is so narrow with concrete bumpers on each side and low overhead. The car drivers were pretty stuffy about letting me over and I began to panic, visions of my lovely new rig suffering a severe modification.

Eventually I had to use the "gradually move into the lane and let them swear as they make room" technique. :::sigh::: I need a serious air horn!

Tom writes: "Third, the LA freeways have the off ramps marked really well. Third, the LA freeways have the off ramps marked really well. "

Yes, except they only put one or two of the names on the signs. As most large cities do, they name the freeways with up to 5 or 6 different names. The exit signs point you to the "Purple County Freeway". Your map says you're looking for Highway 999. The business you're headed to says they are on the Freedom Highway. All are common usage names, but seldom listed together to give you that vital piece of information.

Electronic driving aids are helping some in that if you can just stay on the blue line you'll get to wherever the machine thinks you told it to take you. But even that can be a trick when there are 3 lanes exiting the highway when you're headed south. The map shows you want to go west, that is to the right. Up ahead, the 3 lanes split to 2 and 1 in a maze of swooping ramps, make sure you pick the correct one. Now  the right lane crosses under the 2 other lanes and heads to the left. The center lane turns right and the right lane merges back to the freeway as the right most lane of the next exit which you are now committed to which is Purple Road. Any relation to the Purple Freeway? Who knows. Ask the co-driver and she (he) says, "huh, I don't know, I wasn't paying attention." This is not more than 2 minutes after the conversation where you expressed concern about picking the right road and asking them to help keep a lookout. And what does the electronic driving aid say? Recalculating, recalculating.......

Ken

bucks2 said:

Tom writes: "Third, the LA freeways have the off ramps marked really well. Third, the LA freeways have the off ramps marked really well. "

Yes, except they only put one or two of the names on the signs. As most large cities do, they name the freeways with up to 5 or 6 different names. The exit signs point you to the "Purple County Freeway". Your map says you're looking for Highway 999. The business you're headed to says they are on the Freedom Highway. All are common usage names, but seldom listed together to give you that vital piece of information.

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Ken - That is a definite problem on every freeway in every city. What I am referring to is not the name of the road but how well it is marked in advance. In some places the first sign you see is about 1/4 mile from the off ramp causing problems if you are in the wrong lane. That doesn't happen in LA.

When you drive on a freeway you can't use a map at the same time. Therefore before you start the engine you should know exactly what off ramps you are going to be taking. While the roads may have different names and numbers almost all of them are identified by number in LA.

And if you really want to get confused then try driving in Miami where every road has many names and almost none of them have numbers.

bucks2 said:

Up ahead, the 3 lanes split to 2 and 1 in a maze of swooping ramps, make sure you pick the correct one. Now  the right lane crosses under the 2 other lanes and heads to the left. The center lane turns right and the right lane merges back to the freeway as the right most lane of the next exit which you are now committed to which is Purple Road. Any relation to the Purple Freeway? Who knows.

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About 6 or 7 years ago, 2 other RVers & I were heading from NY to VA Beach and got split up around DC somewhere. The 1st exited too soon, I got the right one, and the 3rd got stuck in the wrong lane and had to exit later. To my surprise, about a half hour later, we all met up at another merge of highways & on ramps. To this day, it still baffles me that we found each other so quickly.

bucks2 said:

Tom writes: "Third, the LA freeways have the off ramps marked really well. Third, the LA freeways have the off ramps marked really well. "

Yes, except they only put one or two of the names on the signs. As most large cities do, they name the freeways with up to 5 or 6 different names. The exit signs point you to the "Purple County Freeway". Your map says you're looking for Highway 999. The business you're headed to says they are on the Freedom Highway. All are common usage names, but seldom listed together to give you that vital piece of information....

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Actually, CalTrans has a crazed sort of logic in its signage and naming.  Highway numbers like I-10, US101, and CA-1 are overriding route designations and are of main value for interstate and long distance traveling.  If you want to drive from Phoenix, AZ to, say, Sacramento, and bypass most LA area traffic, I might, for example,  suggest taking the I-10 to the I-215 then north to I-210 then 210 west to I-5 to Grapevine and then CA-99 to Sacramento.  You should be able to follow that easily on a roadmap or atlas.

Freeway names are for local residents especially commuters.  For example, I-405 is called the San Diego Freeway and CA-1 is called the Pacfic Coast Highway (PCH).  History is reflected in some of these namings.  For instance US 101 starts in downtown LA and is known as the Hollywood Freeway; in North Hollywood it turns west and is now named the Ventura Freeway until Ventura where it seeming loses its names until it hits the SF Bay Area where it becomes among other things the Bayshore Fwy.  Most folks just call it the 101 nowadays.  The I-10 is the Santa Monica Fwy west of downtown LA, and the San Bernardino Fwy east of it.  The I-5 is called the Golden State Fwy except south of downtown LA where it is called the Santa Ana Fwy and south of the 405 split were it becomes the San Diego. 

History and usage has made such a hash of these that folks nowadays just use route number like The 10, The 101, and The 405.  The latter is most usually referred to as the Damned 405, tho more colorful adjectives are used.

There are also commemorative names like the George M. Sasquatch Memorial Highway or the Louella J. Herkyjerky Memorial Interchange.  For the most part, folks just ignore those as mere political fumings by a legislature that should be making better use of its time.

Exactly which one did I want?

geodrake said:

Wouldn't it be great to install a train horn on the MH?

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I have a set one my project truck/breadbox  I may just move them over to the RV when I get feeling better. My nephew has heard them a mile away where he lives.
They are probably illegal, like the bull's balls are now.

bucks2 said:

Exactly which one did I want?

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You want the 110 north, the one on the bottom at the bottom of the photo. It is ten miles from there to Dodger Stadium. ;D Notice how smooth the traffic is flowing on all those freeways?

This is the one you don't want:

bucks2 said:

Exactly which one did I want?

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Ah yes - the Intercharge of the I-10 and the Dreaded 405.  Take the ramp that takes you to Santa Monica.  In this weather, you do not to take the one to Los Angeles (aka Downtown).  The one labeled Sacramento will only take you thru worse, the 108/110o weather in the San Fernando Valley -- that is, if you can get thru the CalTrans construction obstacle course in Sepulveda Pass from the Wilshire ramps north. 

Santa Monica is currently 80o-- perfect for grabbing a frosty pint at the Kings Head on Broadway at 2nd, soaking up the rays, and and watching the passing parade.  Or for catching the beach volley ball down on the sand.  Finest weather in the USA.

Carl L said:

Ah yes - the Intercharge of the I-10 and the Dreaded 405. 

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Actually it is the 105/110 interchange.

Ken & Sheila said:

...in Phoenix they will speed up to make sure you can't move over ahead of them. Chicago drivers are also pretty good...

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You got that right!

bucks2 said:

Tom writes: "Third, the LA freeways have the off ramps marked really well. Third, the LA freeways have the off ramps marked really well. "

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That hasn't been my experience! In fact, all of CA, not just LA, has horrible signage.

zzyzx said:

Actually it is the 105/110 interchange.

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Oh well....

Remember in case of a tie the one with the most lug nuts wins!