Looking for Help with Truck Purchase

The friendliest place on the web for anyone with an RV or an interest in RVing!
If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
See posts with no answers
Gizmo

Gizmo

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 22, 2012
Posts
1,805
Location
Bellingham,WA
I have decided to purchase a diesel pick-up and I am interested in comments, suggestions & real world experiences to help guide my final choice.  Currently I pull my Aliner Expedition with my Jeep Cherokee Sport.  As a point of reference, my Aliner weighs in  (according to a CAT scale) at 2,000 lbs mostly empty but with some water and 2-full propane tanks.  Although the Aliner has a 3,500 lb. gross vehicle weight, I have not come anywhere near to maxing it out.  Although these weights, fall well within my properly equipped Cherokee, I would like more towing ooomph for the mountains.  I recognize a half ton pick-up will provide the extra ooomph I am seeking quite nicely, but have decided on a 1-ton diesel. A 1-ton is more truck than required to pull my Aliner, but I am of the school, "one can never have too much truck, but can have too little truck" and I am considering a potential future increase in trailer size, most likely a 5er.  I also hope to avoid buying what will work for my current needs, then having to buy another truck down the road. So on to my questions. 

Does this make sense to the more experienced here, anything I am overlooking? 

If I do get a 1-ton, should I consider a dually to handle a large 5er, if in the event we decide to go that way?

In which case I am curious to know, outside of the added expense of tires, are there any significant additional expenses associated with a dually over a single rear tire I should be aware of?

Also I heard someone say, but was unable to get clarification, to consider a 2011 or older, because the 2012 (and I presume newer) require an additive with each tank?  The fellow that told me this has a Dodge Ram so it was not clear whether he was addressing Dodge specifically, or all makes.  I know that many diesel owners choose to add additives to mitigate the effects of poor fuel, but thought it was optional and not necessarily done with every fuel-up.  While I have towed boat trailers in the past, I am a nooby with TT's and would appreciate the help.  Thanks.
 
That new fluid is called DEF for Diesel Exhaust Additive. Not all engines seem to use it, Navistar is one exception, I think, but most do use it, as their engines have to meet federal emission standards. Some may have started that as early as 2011 models, but all must meet them by 2012. The fluid can be bought by the gallon or more at truck stops etc but when full, it does last longer than 1 fill-up, I have read.

Max load carried by a dually might be little less because of the additional weight but that load is now spread over 2 more wheels..... Not much point getting one on speculation unless you are secretly planning to get a much bigger trailer.

PSSST, we won't tell if you are!!! Your secret is safe with us!!!
 
My 2005 3/4 ton chev silverado diesel pulls my 27 ft 5th wheel with ease, even fully loaded.so not sure a 1 ton is required unless you are going for really big 5 er. Average 11.7 MPG the last few years going to and from Tucson AZ from Vancouver BC. Not a lot of freeway travell. the truck gets 17.8 MPG when on it's own
Duelys are fun to park especially in parking lots where the spaces are not big enough for even my 3/4 ton truck.
Good luck
 
Gizmo said:
I have decided to purchase a diesel pick-up and I am interested in comments, suggestions & real world experiences to help guide my final choice.  Currently I pull my Aliner Expedition with my Jeep Cherokee Sport.  As a point of reference, my Aliner weighs in  (according to a CAT scale) at 2,000 lbs mostly empty but with some water and 2-full propane tanks.  Although the Aliner has a 3,500 lb. gross vehicle weight, I have not come anywhere near to maxing it out.  Although these weights, fall well within my properly equipped Cherokee, I would like more towing ooomph for the mountains.  I recognize a half ton pick-up will provide the extra ooomph I am seeking quite nicely, but have decided on a 1-ton diesel. A 1-ton is more truck than required to pull my Aliner, but I am of the school, "one can never have too much truck, but can have too little truck" and I am considering a potential future increase in trailer size, most likely a 5er.  I also hope to avoid buying what will work for my current needs, then having to buy another truck down the road. So on to my questions. 

Does this make sense to the more experienced here, anything I am overlooking?  Perfect sense.  Just wish I had done that over the years.  would have saved me a bundle of cash.

If I do get a 1-ton, should I consider a dually is in order to handle a large 5er if in the event we decide go  to go that way?I think you really need to sit down and decide the maximum length and weight of fiver you will ever consider.  this will depend on lifestyle and camping style.  remote camping will most likely dictate a smaller fiver.  Whereas full service camping will allow you a larger fiver.

In which case I am curious to know, outside of the added expense of tires, are there any significant additional expenses associated with a dually over a single rear tire I should be aware of?Other than tires, I suppose I might loose about .5MPG driving a dually.  Then there is the extra width to consider.  Is this a daily driver, or weekend hauler?

Also I heard someone say, but was unable to get clarification, to consider a 2011 or older, because the 2012 (and I presume newer) require an additive with each tank?  The fellow that told me this has a Dodge Ram so it was not clear whether he was addressing Dodge specifically, or all makes.  I know that many diesel owners choose to add additives to mitigate the effects of poor fuel, but thought it was optional and not necessarily done with every fuel-up.  While I have towed boat trailers in the past, I am a nooby with TT's and would appreciate the help.  Thanks.
Click to expand...

2011 and newer Ford and GM offerings use urea (DEF) to help them meet the current diesel emission standards.  This is an added expense above and beyond the cost of fuel for every mile you drive.  At this point Dodge is meeting the standards without the DEF.  So there is no additional tank for the DEF or additional cost per mile.  This only applies if you are buying new.  Buying used, then keep your purchase older than 2009 and you will be good to go with both Ford and GM.  However you do need to be aware of Fords infamous engine problems.  research is the key.
I will tell you what I have, what I tow and what kind of real world fuel economy I have.
2007 Dodge 6.7L Cummins, quad cab 4X2 dually, 4.10 rear end.  Scales 8000 pounds ready to go less trailer.
Trailer is a 36 foot Fifth wheel, scales 13,500 pounds.  That equates to 3000+ pound pin weight.
Last trip fuel economy numbers, (all hand calculated)
9.8,11.5,16.4,18.6,17.3,11.5,11.9.  The three high numbers were all road miles non towing at elevations that ranged from 4500 to 5500 feet.  The lowest number represented towing loaded fiver over the mountains from basically see level to around 4500 feet.
This is no lies, no BS real world numbers for a truck that is not even broke in yet, 17,000 miles on the ODO.
Bottom line is like I said earlier, decide on what the maximum trailer you will buy will be and decide on a truck to match that.  1 ton SRW IMHO is good for a fiver up to about 12,000 pounds GVWR  Anything more you should consider a dually.
 
Great Horned Owl said:
All information that I have seen indicate that 2011 and later Dodges also use DEF. Only Navistar tried to go without it.



Joel
Click to expand...

That only pertains to the 4500/5500 C&C  NOT the 2500/3500 trucks.
 
I think you have a good plan.  A dually may only be considered if you are planning/dreaming of going really big when you upgrade.  Other than that, SRW would do you just fine.  And don't let anyone scare you away from the DEF.  If you want to consider it an expense, it is fairly insignificant.  I have over 13,000 miles on my truck and have put in about $20.00 of DEF.  The latest commercial from Dodge I had to snicker at because they touted their truck "not having to pull over to refill the DEF".  Good grief.  You can pick up a 2.5gal jug at Sams Club for around $11 dollars.  In the Fords, it's a 5 gallon tank. 

I will say that the new 6.7L PowerStroke in the Ford is an amazing engine.  Drive one and you'll agree.  But in the fairness of good sport, drive all the brands.  Go to the forums for each and do some reading.  See what issues they're having.  They all have some issues.  It's the nature of the beast.  I love my Ford and the two I had before it, so I'm happy with my choice.

Good luck, and keep us informed.
 
Last year I had the same conundrum you now have.  I was pulling a 26' travel trailer with a Dodge 1500 with the hemi.  The wife wanted a larger TT/5'er.  I knew this meant a new truck.  Not knowing what TT/5'er we would wind up buying, I started looking a trucks.  I decided I would buy enough truck to pull any 5'er I might decide to buy.  I decided to go with a 1 ton and after researching towing vehicles on this and other forums, I decided to go with dual rear wheels for added stability.  I wound up buying the RAM 3500 DRW with High Output 6.7L Cummins.  I am extremely happy with it.  It pulls our 37 foot Montana 5th wheel with no problems and is extremely stable.  It DOES NOT require the additive to meet emissions requirements. 

I'm sure the Ford and Chevy/GMC 1 tonners are great vehicles also.  Some years of the Ford diesels show there were many issues with the 6.0L diesels.

Wishing you the best of luck in your decision making.
 
Thank you all for the helpful comments & suggestions.  So here is where we are, the "accounting department" has suggested to wait till the end of the year to early 2013, definitely by spring.  This will give us some time to take all this in and investigate how big of a 5er we might end up with a few years down the road.  At this point, I am still leaning towards a 1-ton, but not ruling out a 3/4-ton as was suggested, and I am up in the air about a DRW.  A good point was made about potential parking headaches and is not to be taken lightly, since I will also use the truck as a daily driver as well as for towing.  So we will be looking at specs on 5er's as if we were purchasing now, to guage just how big we will need. Depending on where that takes us, will determine whether to go for a DRW.  I am still interested to know if there are any increased expenses associated with a DRW vs SRW other than tires.  Once again thank you all.
 
Gizmo said:
I am still interested to know if there are any increased expenses associated with a DRW vs SRW other than tires.  Once again thank you all.
Click to expand...


I think the tires are going to be your main added expense.  The engine and transmission are the same, so no additional cost there.  I think the axle and rear end may be different, but as far as maintenance goes, that would be very minimal if any additional expense.  You may have a higher rate for registering it depending on where you register it.  Brakes maybe, but again, it would be fairly minimal as near as I can tell.
 
If I were you I would opt for a 2003-2004.5 Chevy/GMC 3/4 or 1 ton with the duramax diesel. Post 2004.5 have emissions equipment on them. Pre 2004.5's have absolutley NO emissions on them not even a cat converter.  ;) They get good fuel mileage too.
 
The 2000 F-350 diesel has a Dana 80 rear end in it, super strong. Tires are the same on the dually, just have two more rear ones. I'm glad I bought a dually. That extra width in the back means the truck always feels totally planted no matter what (wind, rain, cornering) when towing.
 
Like myself I kept my 2002 Dodge 2500 Diesel because of the stability and the longevity of the engine and drivetrain. It rated for 20,000# GCW and it holds up to the 30' Jayco Eagle and firewood hauling just fine. The more I keep researching the newer diesel vehicles with common rail fuel systems the more expensive repairs become and longevity of the powerplants seem to be getting shorter as well MPG numbers getting lower.
 
Mopar1973Man said:
The more I keep researching the newer diesel vehicles with common rail fuel systems the more expensive repairs become and longevity of the powerplants seem to be getting shorter as well MPG numbers getting lower.
Click to expand...

Are you suggesting that older diesel trucks are more reliable and desirable?  What year(s) would you say that the newer designs have started to diminish the powerplant/MPG numbers?  If our family ends up with a large trailer in the next 2-3 years (a good possibility), I will want to know as much as I can about what used diesel trucks to consider.  I have no preference on manufacturer, which should hopefully open up the realm of possibilities.
 
scottydl said:
Are you suggesting that older diesel trucks are more reliable and desirable?  What year(s) would you say that the newer designs have started to diminish the powerplant/MPG numbers?  If our family ends up with a large trailer in the next 2-3 years (a good possibility), I will want to know as much as I can about what used diesel trucks to consider.  I have no preference on manufacturer, which should hopefully open up the realm of possibilities.
Click to expand...

For info on used diesel trucks, see http://www.dieselpowermag.com/features/1201dp_10_best_used_diesel_trucks/viewall.html.
Joel
 
New emissions regs came into effect 1/1/2007 and again 1/1/2010. Systems got more complex each time. Fuel economy went down with the 2007 EPA regs but back up slightly for 2010. Still not as good as the pre-2007 engines, though.
 
I have a new Dodge 2500 4x2 with the Cummins 6.7l turbo-diesel and LOVE it!  I did not opt for dual rear wheels - mostly cause I don't like the look and have zero stability problems!  I tow a 34.5ft Montana 3150RL (11,115lbs dry) with no problems, and cruising at 65mph (1600 rpm) I reliably get 11mpg.  Not towing depends on the run - but long runs at 55-70mph cruising gives me between 19 and 20mpg.  Around town I get about 15mpg.  Compare that to my old Minnie Winnie with a Ford V10 that got 6 - 8mpg!

At 65mph, the revs coincide with peak torque (800ft-lbs) so it take a substantial incline before the truck loses speed, or downshifts - it really is amazing, and extremely quiet and comfortable.  Two other items I love - the two/haul mode (although most HD trucks have this) and the exhaust brake!  The exhaust brake makes easy work of the rapid slow-downs when leaving the freeway, and will handle steep descents with hardly any brake use at all!

It does NOT use DEF, but I am told the 2013 model will!
 
Chevy/GMC diesel trucks started to use cat converters on 2004.5 trucks. Before that all there was was the exhaust resonator.
 
I'm right there with Limey with a Dodge Diesel as well but there is subtle differences between us like cost of fuel system parts are greater. Just for example looking at RockAuto.Com 2002 Dodge fuel injector is $48 bucks a piece. 2010 Dodge fuel injector is $751 a piece! I'm also with a exhaust brake too wonderful tool when I gone 185K miles on the factory OE brake pads. With a few mods to my truck its just as powerful as Limeys if not slightly more. But I don't have all the EPA stuff like EGR valve, DPF filter, etc. So consider why you buying a new rig for...

http://articles.mopar1973man.com/images/2ndgen24v/injector-cleaning/injector-exploded.jpg

Way I see it we have come around a full loop again. "Huh? you say!" Think about it. Back in the late 1960's when the muscle cars came out they where big and bad and produced huge amounts of power. By the time the 70's came along the fuel embargo and other problems and EPA crush the big 3 auto makers with EPA/CARB rules. So here is the diesel relm started in the early 90's and now look at it now most diesel trucks look like gasser engines from the 80's.  ::)

Just food for thought... ;)

 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Members online

Total: 952 (members: 28, guests: 924)

Forum statistics

Threads
131,960
Posts
1,388,238
Members
137,712
Latest member
number1RVuser
Back
Top Bottom