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Author Topic: How many fulltimers?  (Read 9866 times)

JoeSpa

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How many fulltimers?
« on: March 28, 2013, 10:36:41 AM »
Does anyone have an idea how many fulltimers live in the US? I mean real fulltimers, no part time snowbirds.

Clay L

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2013, 11:31:33 AM »
I have seen estimates of 250,000 to over a million. I lean towards 250,000. That was based on census data for people without addresses or something like that.

EDIT

 I found this in my files:

In the 2000 census there was a category called  "other non-standard housing"  defined as boats, recreation vehicles and other such residences which have no permanent physical address. Based upon the 2000 census that number was estimated to be 260,000 people. 
« Last Edit: March 28, 2013, 11:34:29 AM by Clay L »
Clay (WA5NMR), Lee (Wife), Katie & Kelli (cats), Sali (toy poodle)
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Becks

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2013, 01:35:01 PM »
Like Clay, we full time, and all I know is in our travels we meet so many other fultimers we can't believe how many of us there are.
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Pierat

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2013, 01:37:33 PM »
MSN Money says 1.3 million as of last fall. http://money.msn.com/car-buying/can-you-live-in-an-rv-full-time

Not sure they would know any better than anyone else, though.
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Kim (skyking4ar2) Bertram

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2013, 02:27:35 PM »
Define non-standard housing.

Is a recreational vehicle that is permanently parked somewhere still a recreational vehicle? And by that definition, are you a full time RV'er if you live in an RV that does not travel during the year?

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Marsha/CA

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #5 on: March 28, 2013, 06:55:44 PM »
I recall a study done by FMCA (Family Motor Coach Association) several years ago, and their estimate was that 18% of the people who own RVs were full-timers. 

Marsha~
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Wendy

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #6 on: March 28, 2013, 07:45:18 PM »
I guess it depends on which definition of 'full-timing' you're using. Some definitions exclude those who own property, like a lot somewhere. Others exclude those who live in an RV but never move.

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JoeSpa

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #7 on: March 28, 2013, 11:12:42 PM »
MSN Money says 1.3 million as of last fall. http://money.msn.com/car-buying/can-you-live-in-an-rv-full-time

Not sure they would know any better than anyone else, though.

Thanks! That was very helpful!

JoeSpa

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #8 on: March 28, 2013, 11:13:46 PM »
I recall a study done by FMCA (Family Motor Coach Association) several years ago, and their estimate was that 18% of the people who own RVs were full-timers. 

Marsha~

...and how many people do own RVs?

DakotaRed

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #9 on: March 28, 2013, 11:43:03 PM »
I have seen estimates of 250,000 to over a million. I lean towards 250,000. That was based on census data for people without addresses or something like that. ... In the 2000 census there was a category called  "other non-standard housing"  defined as boats, recreation vehicles and other such residences which have no permanent physical address. Based upon the 2000 census that number was estimated to be 260,000 people.
So how does it work for people like us, who are full-timers with no stick-and-brick address but use a mail forwarding service for your permanent address that you give out to folks?


It would also be nice to have a breakdown of types of full-timers, i.e., retirees, fully employed remotes, work campers, etc.
++Larry
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Marsha/CA

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #10 on: March 29, 2013, 12:38:27 AM »
...and how many people do own RVs?

It was a percentage of a random sample.

Marsha~
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DownbytheRiver

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #11 on: April 02, 2013, 12:47:08 AM »
I imagine that if someone wanted to meet and share with fulltimers specifically, one could start a web group dedicated to just fulltimers.  It may not yield the most accurate of numbers, but at least it would be a start to the number of fulltimers that are interested in sharing with other fulltimers, etc.  At the very least, if someone created a survey (with a free program like survey monkey) for fulltimers, I'd take it.  Is there any designation of members to the RVforum that specifies "fulltimer" status in the membership list?
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amandamwright1984

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #12 on: April 25, 2013, 10:38:52 AM »
I consider myself a full timer, live in the RV full time but have a PO Box where I receive mail.

DearMissMermaid

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #13 on: May 04, 2013, 04:12:11 PM »
I don't see how you could ever come up with a number anywhere near accurate for fulltimers. I just know there are a ton of them.

Many folks who are not fulltimers say they are, so that compounds the issue. Then there are people living in an RV fulltime who never go anywhere in it. I stayed in a residential type park where nearly all the RV-ers had never left the park, once they arrived.  Some had been there for decades. Some had even traded up and down in RV's and still not left the park. Of course many of the RV's were no longer road worthy unless you spent big bucks to get them going again.

When I told the RV "neighbors" and management I was departing, they acted insulted and asked me what was wrong!

Defining fulltiming and traveling is complicated too. For instance I settle down for 5 months of workamping so I can travel the other 7 months. During that 7 months I typically travel 2-3 months, then stay in one park 2-3 months then travel another 2 months or so. So does this make me only a semi-traveler who fulltimes?

It's complicated...
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Dave R

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2013, 01:36:49 PM »
I would say the number is closer to the one million mark. We see so many people these days that work and live in
their RV and go from job to job. Many that I have talked to are only in a location for a few weeks or a few months,
others for a year or more. Just depends on the type of work they do and the size of the job they are working on.
The park we are in here in Pearland Texas has a high number of folks that are here for the medical center. Some are
just that and others are full timers and are here for the Med. Center.

Dave
Dave & Jeanette  NC
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Camp Colombo

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2013, 11:11:06 AM »
As many have mentioned it all depends on what the people that are figuring the numbers considers "full time."  Even so there is just no way to really figure out how many of us are really out there.

I think that is one of the great things about full timing is not being as traceable.  I kind of like it that no one but our closest friends or family knows where we are at any given time.  And if we are really on the go, not even our families can keep accurate tabs on us!
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Ned

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2013, 11:28:18 AM »
Quote
I kind of like it that no one but our closest friends or family knows where we are at any given time.

Only if you keep your cell phones turned off with the battery pulled and use only cash, and don't get it from an ATM or cash a check.  All of us are more traceable than ever before.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
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bucks2

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #17 on: August 25, 2013, 05:11:13 PM »
I thought I was lost one time. I had no clue where the heck I was. I made one call to Homeland Security and they pinpointed right where I was, who I was with and where I'd been.......... The nice lady on the phone even reminded me it had been over six months since I'd been to the dentist and that I hadn't called my mother lately.

Ken

Lou Schneider

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #18 on: August 25, 2013, 08:00:56 PM »
I imagine that if someone wanted to meet and share with fulltimers specifically, one could start a web group dedicated to just fulltimers.

That's exactly how the Escapees Club started back in 1978.  The term "fulltiming" hadn't been invented yet, but that's what Joe and Kay Peterson were doing, living in their RV while they explored the country.  To support themselves, Joe worked as a union electrician in various locations while Kay wrote column a monthly column for Woodall's Trailer Travel magazine.  One month she asked if there was anyone else doing the same thing, if so she'd start a list so they could correspond with one another.

Today Escapees is a full service RV organization with membership open to everyone, not just fulltimers.  And there are fulltimers who aren't Escapees.   But that's where you're likely to find the largest concentration of them.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2013, 08:02:33 PM by Lou Schneider »

Ernie n Tara

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #19 on: August 26, 2013, 01:02:02 PM »
I don't think you could come even close to how many fullvtimers there are because:

a. There is no definition. We range from "spends majority (over 50%) of his time in an RV" to "spends all of his time in an RV and has no permanent base".

b. A majority of fulltimers have a fixed address for mail, licenses, etc.

c. No accepted definition of an RV. Does a sailboat count? How about homeless travelers/campers? And it goes on.

Frankly, I think this may be a good thing. We don't really need governments like California realizing how large a group of people are easily avoiding their taxes or rules.

Or "your last fixed residence was here  so we consider you to be resident here until you have a different one - mail drops don't count".

Imagine "you're living here for three months so 1/4 of any income you receive (SS for example) is taxable here". It could be done if there were enough fulltimers to make it worthwhile.

Just some thoughts,

Ernie
« Last Edit: August 26, 2013, 01:07:45 PM by Ernie n Tara »
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USA-RVNomads

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #20 on: December 18, 2013, 08:06:48 AM »
Here is a question that will end up being asked by the next time the US Census is taken. Are you a FT RVer or do you live in an RV full time. Yes, there is a difference. If you take the time to walk around many of the RV parks and campgrounds that offer long term residency you'll no doubt find those who are living in and RV as a means of survival. They aren't able to afford any other type of conventional housing. The economy in recent years lead to an increase of those moving into RVs as a permanent dwelling. They don't move and if they do it isn't far.

So the question will probably be phrased as to how many miles do you travel in a year with your RV. How many states have you stayed in the last 12 months. Good thing to keep receipts and records of your travels otherwise the state you might be in for six months or more will come looking for you to pay taxes in that state claiming you are a new "resident" of.

As states face greater financial shortages, they will once again start enforcing existing residency ordinances and create new ones...some in past years had as low as a 90 day rule. If you resided in their state for more than 90 days, you were considered a resident and required by that state to document yourself accordingly...license plates and drivers license and pay taxes!

Another task that the IRS will be handling...Taxes, Healthcare and Residency enforcement.
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DakotaRed

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #21 on: December 18, 2013, 08:27:10 AM »
... As states face greater financial shortages, they will once again start enforcing existing residency ordinances and create new ones...some in past years had as low as a 90 day rule. If you resided in their state for more than 90 days, you were considered a resident and required by that state to document yourself accordingly...license plates and drivers license and pay taxes!
...
That would be foolish and short sighted in my opinion.  As a "real" RV full-timer, this rule from a particular state (especially if they try to enforce it) would force me to take my coach and money and spend it in another state before this time period elapses.
Dakota with Larry & Kathy Belikoff
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Kim (skyking4ar2) Bertram

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #22 on: December 18, 2013, 09:01:38 AM »
As slow as legislatures move, and as much bickering is required to get anything passed, I don't see a national push for consistency any time soon.

Most states already document a 30 day residency for driver's licenses, but, practically speaking, it is not worth the enforcement effort. It will come into play, though, when you apply for some public program run at the state level and some other issues like insurance.

Since even RV'ers don't have a consistent definition, I am not looking for anything but a bunch of goofy laws that are easily circumvented in the near future. This full time definition is going to be a tempest in a teapot for a while.
Kim & Christi Bertram
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Dragginourbedaround

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #23 on: December 18, 2013, 09:05:25 AM »
I thought I was lost one time. I had no clue where the heck I was. I made one call to Homeland Security and they pinpointed right where I was, who I was with and where I'd been.......... The nice lady on the phone even reminded me it had been over six months since I'd been to the dentist and that I hadn't called my mother lately.

Ken

That's funny!
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Clay L

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #24 on: December 18, 2013, 11:29:10 AM »
SNIP
As states face greater financial shortages, they will once again start enforcing existing residency ordinances and create new ones...some in past years had as low as a 90 day rule. If you resided in their state for more than 90 days, you were considered a resident and required by that state to document yourself accordingly...license plates and drivers license and pay taxes!

Another task that the IRS will be handling...Taxes, Healthcare and Residency enforcement.

Co still has that requirement (90 day) and enforces it they find out you have been in the state for 90 days or more. They don't seem to aggressively enforce in it the Grand Junction area. Probably because there are so many oil field and transient workers in the area.
Clay (WA5NMR), Lee (Wife), Katie & Kelli (cats), Sali (toy poodle)
Settled down after full timing for eleven years and snowbirding for one year in a 2004 Winnebago 35N Sightseer, Workhorse W 20 Chassis. Honda toad

Gary RV_Wizard

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #25 on: December 18, 2013, 11:50:23 AM »
Quote
As states face greater financial shortages, they will once again start enforcing existing residency ordinances and create new ones...some in past years had as low as a 90 day rule. If you resided in their state for more than 90 days, you were considered a resident and required by that state to document yourself accordingly...license plates and drivers license and pay taxes!

Another task that the IRS will be handling...Taxes, Healthcare and Residency enforcement.

Nothing new to that. Nearly all states have laws that make you subject to local taxes and fees if you "reside" there for more than some period of time, typically 90-180 days.  And they are enforced whenever they have time and evidence to back it up - some places like Colorado and Washington and Massachusetts have made big news doing so.

By the way, the IRS, a federal agency, has nothing to do with those state laws or the collection of state & local taxes, and no legal authority to get involved in any way.

The US Census already includes a question about your type of residence. You are asked whether your residence is a single family house, apartment-type building, a mobile home, or a "Boat, RV, van, etc.". This is part of the American Community Survey and required as input to several HUD programs that are mandated by federal law. I think that data is available to states as statistics, but does not identify individuals, so census data would not help identify tax evaders.
Gary
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USA-RVNomads

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #26 on: December 18, 2013, 11:50:46 AM »
There are a lot of laws that haven't been enforced, but again money is the issue and if they can levy a hefty enough penalty it will offset the costs. They might not go looking for you for this but if you get stopped for something else...you can bet if they can they'll enforce and collect. The Feds are now taking away retirement funds and benefits from the military retirees, which at one time was sacred...NOT ANYMORE!  >:(

I can remember being stopped for speeding once. The second question I was asked was..."How much money do you have in your possession? If you don't have $200.00 you are considered a vagrant...and that'll be another $50 over and above the speeding ticket."  Of course I had proof of insurance which sufficed in lieu of the $200 cash. If you have any of your old insurance cards from back in the day, most had a statement on them that your auto insurance company would post up to X amount in such cases to avoid you being arrested for vagrancy.

« Last Edit: December 18, 2013, 11:52:19 AM by ImagesByHawkeye »
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Jeff

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #27 on: December 18, 2013, 12:29:43 PM »
Our insurance cards post a bond guaranteeing appearance for the ticket, not a deposit to prove we are not vagrants.

wheelman65

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #28 on: February 02, 2014, 10:15:21 AM »
God Day folks.. I gotta queston,, the wife and I are deciding about  full time RVING .....What is on your drivers license? we plan on selling our home..so what state do we live and where ? since our RV will move often...thanks Scott

Ned

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Re: How many fulltimers?
« Reply #29 on: February 02, 2014, 11:00:30 AM »
Check the forum library in the full timing section, particularly the article on choosing and establishing a domicile.  Your choice of domicile has numerous considerations, like vehicle and driver licensing, insurance, taxes, etc.  The important thing is to firmly establish it yourself or the states will choose for you, and it won't be to your advantage.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
1997 Holiday Rambler Endeavor LE
2007 GMC Canyon

 

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