Rear Panel Bonding Agent Failing

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wincom6

wincom6

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Joined
Dec 10, 2009
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Location
Robinson Township,Pittsburgh, PA
The rear panel on my 2004 Meridian has broken away from the mounts that holds it to the frame. After inspecting, I discovered  the mounts are glued or bonded to the panel.  Has anyone encountered this problem and what kind of bonding agent did you use to repair it? As I look at the panel, it looks like some of the mounts that are still holding are in a place that is almost impossible to get a screwdriver to. 


Edit by John: changed message icon to Topic Solved
 

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JB Weld has been used with good success by several folks on the forum. As always, proper prep of the surfaces is the key.  Or you can call Winnebago owner relations and ask what specific type of bonding agent that they are using.  What you experienced has been pretty common with hatch doors and the like. Some folks went a different route and drilled hinges through the hatch in question and used stainless screws to fix the problem. 
 
I'd be afraid to use chrome carriage bolts for this application. There might be too much vibration there and you'd end up cracking the fiberglass panel. It looks like the adhesive used was there as a vibration damper also.  Best bet is an adhesive putty.
 
Thank you everyone for the quick response,  Wayne/judway ,  I would appreciate a picture of your repair. I had thought of doing it with carriage bolts but was apprehensive of drilling, if it didn't work I would be stuck with extra holes.
 
Looks like the same problem (among others) that I have encountered with our 2004 Journey.  Mine first manifested itself with the left headlight "falling" back in its "socket".  I used the stainless steel bolt method of reattaching that assembly.  Upon further musing, I then located the other vulnerable adhesive points (more points than adhesive) and pre-emptively drilled through and strengthened the adhesion points with more stainless steel bolts and nuts.  So far, so good. 

note to Winnebago:  please, next time when you design the junction points for the adhesive, please mold the bumper or other fiberglass facia to include (as a unit) the brackets, so that the adhesive has less chance to fail and cause separation of these rather important body parts.

Wendell
 
Thinking about the vibration or flex issue a little bit. Since Winnebago is known for good customer service I might call them and see if the method of attachment was chosen to provide some give. If it was then drilling holes might not be a good way to go, over time spider cracks will spread out from the hole. I could see how engine torque or some twisting of the frame rails could happen at least to a small degree.

It looks like they were counting on the adhesive ooze to provide some bite through the four holes in the metal bracket. The adhesive sheered off and the rest probably didn't stick that well since it was freshly painted metal.
 
From what I can see, the bonding was not to allow flexing of the fiberglass, any flexing would be taken by the metal structures. I would clean all surfaces and then apply more adhesive then drill and install bolts through the fiberglass and the metal parts. There should be no further problems as the adhesive just didn't take to vibration and lost it's bond. By bolting the fiberglass and the brackets together there should be no danger of the bond releasing, and the bond will prevent cracking of the fiberglass around the bolts.


Lee
 
I would go with Lee's advice.

My Revolution has carriage bolts holding the rear facia on. It was made that way as well as many others. It does not look bad and holds very well.
 
I tried to get the two surfaces back in the original position then used a "c" clamp to hold them together. I then drilled two 1/4" holes and installed 1/4" stainless steel round head bolts in the holes. Next I used touch-up paint to cover the heads. The installation looks pretty good. I can take pictures but the last time I tried I had trouble getting the files small enough to post.

Lee has a better way of fixing the problem. However, it sounds like a lot more work.
 
Wayne,

Feel free to email the photos to me and I'll take care of resizing and attaching them to your message. Sending email via the 'envelope' icon beneath my avatar doesn't allow you to attach files/photos. But, if you click the 'envelope' icon, you can copy/paste the email address into your email client.
 
In the 9+ years that I have owned my '04 Meridian, I have reattached several of the infamous bonding failures. Each time was with JB Weld, and each bond has held - some as long as 8 years. I am confident that, if the surfaces are prepped properly, mechanical fasteners that can and will cause the fiberglass to crack, are not necessary.

(On each repair, I have observed that the metal attachment was painted. I removed the paint, drilled the metal attachment to provide more bonding surface, and "reglued" the joint. I'm sold on JB Weld.) 

 
It's been around a long time. I'm sure they have repaired lots of them. This is what I don't understand about Winnebago. Many things they pay for warranty repairs of could save a lot of money if they just remedied the problem. It could either add a lot to the bottom line or allow upgrades to basic models.
 
From what I can determine, Winnebago just puts dollop of whatever epoxy they use, press the bracket into it, a small amount squishes out of the several holes in the bracket and thats  that. The adhesive does not bond to the "painted" surface of the bracket so the only thing holding it is the few holes in the bracket . When I replaced the bracket, I sanded the surface to make it rough.
 
AA4WP said:
note to Winnebago:  please, next time when you design the junction points for the adhesive, please mold the bumper or other fiberglass facia to include (as a unit) the brackets, so that the adhesive has less chance to fail and cause separation of these rather important body parts.

Wendell
Click to expand...

I need some of that stuff for my own rather important body parts!  ;D ;D
 
If you can get both surfaces smooth and flat (a 4" angle grinder with a 80G pad should do). I would recommend this 3M VHB double sided tape. I know that it sounds ridiculous but this is the strongest bonding agent that I have ever seen. Much stronger than mechanical fasteners because it spreads the load over a larger area. It's easy to use and relatively inexpensive for a project like this. I think that the F/G will break before this bond will let go, if you apply plenty of pressure during the initial adhesion process. If you need to remove it for a repair, simply use a multi-tool with a blade edge and force it between the 2 surfaces. Wipe off the residue with acetone and start over. It's AMAZING stuff.

http://solutions.3m.com/wps/portal/3M/en_US/Adhesives/Tapes/Products/~/Industrial-Adhesives-Tapes/Double-Sided-Bonding-Tapes/VHB-Tape?N=5485815&rt=c3

Look through the selection and find the one that has the highest "Shear strength" and thickest cushion (to account for surface irregularities).

Check this out:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S_fM5cqSODc
 
If indeed they do use Plexus to attach the brackets you have an issue.  I use the stuff everyday in my work and it is a tenacious adhesive with only two problems. One, it does not like dirty surfaces and two, once cured not much sticks to it including more Plexus. The 3M VHB tape may be a good option but it needs a great deal of pressure to get a strong initial bond.  My personal preference would be VHB tape along with SS fasteners.  If you do use a methacrylate adhesive(Plexus or Weld-On) you must leave a thickness of the adhesive to allow it to cure properly.  Depending on the formulation there is a minimum bond thickness.
 
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