EPDM Coatings
RV LED Bulbs offer Sponsored by Spotless Water Systems rvupgradestore.com Composet Products EVDO

Author Topic: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts  (Read 902 times)

CP

  • ---
  • Posts: 67
Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« on: August 25, 2013, 06:59:35 AM »
Anyone have thoughts regarding a 2013 Thor Palazzo 36 ft 300cummins diesel vs. 2011 31ft fleetwood Terra Ts 362hp Triton v10. We currently have the Terra and love it but are considering a small diesel.

Thanks
CP
Chuck
2011Fleetwood Terra
2011 Lincoln MKZ Hybrid

Oscar Mike

  • ---
  • Posts: 1173
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2013, 08:04:33 AM »
The first question that came to mind; How many miles per year are you going to put on the diesel vs the gasser to offset the additional expense of the coach, the fuel, and the maintenance. 
John & Susan
2014 Winnebago Aspect 30J
2005 Jeep Wrangler X, Toad
Expectant Grand-Father x 2!
Northwest Las Vegas, NV

Gary RV Roamer

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 42797
  • We're on the road again...
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2013, 09:12:22 AM »
Since you already have a coach you love, what do you expect to gain by switching?  Your expectations plays a big role in whether this is a good move for you or not.

The Palazzo is a pretty nice coach and has some features the Terra lacks, e.g. a residential fridge and air suspension & brakes, and the rear engine will be quieter for those in the front seats. You will enjoy driving the diesel too, with its excellent low-end torque & horsepower.

The economics of buying, maintaining and operating a diesel coach is a whole separate  discussion and has been discussed here many times. I suggest you use SEARCH (on menu bar) to find previous diesel vs gas messages.
Gary
--------------
Gary Brinck
2004 American Tradition
2007 GMC Acadia
Homebase: Ocala National Forest, FL

Selah

  • ---
  • Posts: 150
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2013, 10:24:21 AM »
I would like to say that if your happy with your current coach, why would you want to change. However,we did it. went from an Allegro 36LA to a Phaeton 42LH. So my advice now is to do your research and make you decision on facts.
Gary's advice is bang on concerning expectations and economics. Here are some of my thoughts on the issue.
Search the forum(s) for Gas vs Diesel. You will get lots of comments ranging from you nuts to switch to your nuts not to switch. You'll have to sort through them and see what fits your situation.
Sometime economics is a secondary issue. RVs are not investment by any stretch of the imagination, however we all have to reconcile expenses to income.
Lastly, gassers are much more forgiving of poor maintenance than a diesel. The diesel has a bigger up front cost and higher maintenance costs. However, for that you get a smoother quieter ride, more power for climbing hills.
It ain't easy making these decisions, sometimes you just have to go with your gut feelings; assuming they match up with the DW of course..
Paul & Kathy
2014 Phaeton 42 LH
2013 Honda CR-V
SMI DUO braking system

CP

  • ---
  • Posts: 67
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2013, 03:45:03 PM »
Thanks all for your input. Our current thought is to gain a little more room, reduce noise in the front portion of coach and have a more solid ride with good climbing while towing. Although the Terra rides very nice the noise is a bit much.  We plan to retire in 3 yrs and travel the country. So if we upgrade, now is a good time to meet the upfront expenses assuming the annual expense stays within reason.

CP
Chuck
2011Fleetwood Terra
2011 Lincoln MKZ Hybrid

Marsha/CA

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 4224
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2013, 03:50:20 PM »
You might want to make sure the 300 hp Cummins is adequate for a 36' motorhome.  Sometimes that 300 cummins can be a bit sluggish climbing hills.

Another thing to think about is that the diesel engines can have a longer life than a gas engine.

Marsha~
Allegro Bus Diesel Pusher with Hyundai Tucson SUV toad. 
In case of necessity, alternate transportation is available in the form of 1 old horse.

George Lewis

  • ---
  • Posts: 113
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2013, 07:16:46 PM »
We came VERY close to buying a 34' Palazzo, but our 1999 34J Bounder runs well, no problems and we don't travel a great deal.  We decided the cost of a Palazzo could not be justified with our needs.  However, it is a personal decision....enjoy.
Boerne, TX
1999 Bounder 34J
Ford V10
USAF (ret) and Sony Corp. (ret)

docj

  • ---
  • Posts: 554
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2013, 07:48:17 PM »
I mean no offense to Palazzo owners, but that Cummins ISB engine at 300 HP and ~800 ft-lbs of torque is not going to be a barn-burner in a 28,000 lb MH.  IMHO those are truly entry-level diesel specs and you probably have better performance in your current rig.  Don't be "awed" by diesels and end up with something not as nice as what you have today, JMO.

To give you more specific data, we have a 32,000 lb coach and tow a ~4,000 lb car which isn't all that much more than the specs for the Palazzo.  According to my SilverLeaf, at ~60 mph on a reasonably level road I'm using on the order of ~230 HP to maintain speed.  But it doesn't take that much of a grade before I'm using close to 300 HP if I don't want to slow down.   That means that with just rolling hills that coach will probably be running at close to full power. 

That's not even beginning to compare my ability to go up 6% grades at ~55 mph in 4th gear pulling all 425 horses.  No one has to have that much power, but I'd be reluctant at having to run at close to full tilt on fairly level ground.  It isn't rocket science to figure out that an engine that has to run at nearly full power most of the time isn't going to last as long as one that doesn't need to.
Sandie & Joel

2000 40' Beaver Patriot Thunder Princeton--425 HP/1550 ft-lbs CAT C-12
2014 Honda CR-V AWD EX-L with ReadyBrute tow bar/braking system
WiFiRanger Ambassador/RVParkReviews administrator
Follow our adventures on Facebook at www.facebook.com/weisstravels.net

Selah

  • ---
  • Posts: 150
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2013, 08:40:16 PM »
I don't want to offend anyone either but that Palazzo will get to the top of the same grade as a Beaver Patriot or my Phaeton. Even with 450 HP I don't have any problem getting in line with some semis and putzing up the mountain. Im just not in a hurry. If it was about speed I'd be driving a London Air with 600 HP.

Paul & Kathy
2014 Phaeton 42 LH
2013 Honda CR-V
SMI DUO braking system

docj

  • ---
  • Posts: 554
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #9 on: August 26, 2013, 10:36:58 AM »
It's not a question of being in a hurry, just an observation that having a bit more reserve power makes these vehicles easier to drive.  I happen to enjoy being able to drive mine more like a car than a MH and not having to stay in the truck lane going up the mountain.  JMO
Sandie & Joel

2000 40' Beaver Patriot Thunder Princeton--425 HP/1550 ft-lbs CAT C-12
2014 Honda CR-V AWD EX-L with ReadyBrute tow bar/braking system
WiFiRanger Ambassador/RVParkReviews administrator
Follow our adventures on Facebook at www.facebook.com/weisstravels.net

Oscar Mike

  • ---
  • Posts: 1173
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #10 on: August 26, 2013, 10:48:50 AM »
I too am seriously considering trading my Bounder and moving into a Class C. Thor has a front engine diesel in a F550 chassis that really looks interesting to me. The new Ford 6.7L V8 is pretty quiet, and I would think it would be as quiet as my Ford pick up diesel in the cab.  Still, you lose the first 6' of the coach because of the cab. So, a 33' coach grosses out at about 27' +/- of livable space. The F550 boasts 300 hp and 660 ft lb of torque @ 1,700 RPM.   
John & Susan
2014 Winnebago Aspect 30J
2005 Jeep Wrangler X, Toad
Expectant Grand-Father x 2!
Northwest Las Vegas, NV

Gary RV Roamer

  • Forum Staff
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 42797
  • We're on the road again...
Re: Palazzo diesel vs. Fleetwood Terra ts
« Reply #11 on: August 26, 2013, 11:00:43 AM »
"Adequate" performance is another very personal factor. I'm operating a 37,700 lb rig with a 370 hp ISL diesel. It's ok on the flats and up to around 3% grades but slows down to around 40 much beyond that. I would like more horsepower on the steeper grades, but am never in doubt about getting where I want to go and seldom far back in the pack of larger rigs. Cars, of course, zip right on by. So, yes, I would recommend more than the typical 100 lbs/hp ratio if you feel a "need for speed".

As for engine longevity, my ISL develops full power at around 1750 RPMs and doesn't ever seem to be straining. Probably becasue the torque peak is even lower at 1200 rpms.  Cummins reps claim it is good for a million miles at full rated horsepower, so I'm not worrying that I spend nearly all my travel time between 1400 and 1750 rpms. I'll never wear the engine out.
Gary
--------------
Gary Brinck
2004 American Tradition
2007 GMC Acadia
Homebase: Ocala National Forest, FL