EPDM Coatings
rvupgradestore.com Composet Products Custom Yacht Interiors

Author Topic: Beginner guitar  (Read 16457 times)

JWBishop

  • Posts: 1
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #30 on: May 17, 2014, 07:59:32 AM »
I am a beginning guitar player also. I know there are a lot of chords that don't use all six strings and I know not to play those extra strings on the chord. However, I had never heard that the unused strings need to be muted. I just don't hit them. It seems that SeilerBird is saying those unstruck strings will still ring enough to bother the tone. My ears aren't that good.

SeilerBird

  • ---
  • Posts: 10951
  • Everything I state is my opinion.
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #31 on: May 17, 2014, 08:53:12 AM »
It is called sympathetic vibration. If you take your guitar and with one hand pluck the low E string hard. Then mute it immediately and listen to the other strings ringing. If you touch the high E string at this point you will feel it moving. In other words when one string is vibrating the energy from that string is transmitted to the unmuted strings.

Let me give you an example of how to mute. Take the standard D chord as shown below, You are not suppose to strike the low E string, only the top five strings should be used. What I do is wrap my thumb around and put it on the second fret of the E string so it is an F# which is part of the D chord (D-F#-A). Or you could just have the thumb lightly touching the E string to mute it. Or you can use the pinky finger of the left hand to mute the string, or you could use the palm of your right hand to mute it. If you don't mute the string or turn it into an F# then it will play an E which does not fit into the chord. Actually it turns the D into a Dadd9.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
My new Pixel camera:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rMSw5eVkCfKuuEOP2
My portfolio:
https://goo.gl/photos/Cx4SaYhGfYFShSty7
My Grand Canyon shots:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Nc1AT8tQp25wJwfm1

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #32 on: May 17, 2014, 09:00:45 AM »
Thanks for that explanation Tom, it's very clear. I hadn't thought about 'sympathetic vibration', and playing the second fret of the E string is a trick I wouldn't have thought of. Playing a redundant note in a chord is something I occasionally do while playing keyboard, but it didn't occur to me to do it on a guitar.
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

SeilerBird

  • ---
  • Posts: 10951
  • Everything I state is my opinion.
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #33 on: May 17, 2014, 09:03:36 AM »
I thought about making a video to describe what I am talking about then I realized someone else already has. Turns out there are a few of them.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IMII37neQD8

Tom, you are going to hate the tone of the guitar in this video but the more distortion the more the sympathetic vibrations are heard.

The reason I am mentioning this now is because it is easier to learn guitar properly rather than having to relearn it later.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
My new Pixel camera:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rMSw5eVkCfKuuEOP2
My portfolio:
https://goo.gl/photos/Cx4SaYhGfYFShSty7
My Grand Canyon shots:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Nc1AT8tQp25wJwfm1

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #34 on: May 17, 2014, 09:20:29 AM »
A good illustrative video, although he's talking about muting residual vibration from a string he's just played, not vibration from another string, which is what I thought sympathetic vibration is.

Just curious if either type of vibration is more noticeable with an amplified guitar vs an acoustic guitar  ???

Quote
... you are going to hate the tone of the guitar in this video

You're not kidding; I wanted to put my hands over my ears and scream  ;D
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

SeilerBird

  • ---
  • Posts: 10951
  • Everything I state is my opinion.
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #35 on: May 17, 2014, 09:39:11 AM »
He is talking about both residual vibration and sympathetic vibration. It is a lot more noticeable on an electric. Have you ever heard a guitarist play and thought to yourself "he sure plays cleanly"? This is how you play cleanly.

I have not mentioned this before because with a uke you don't worry about it since most all of the time you are strumming all the strings and rarely are you picking single notes.

There is a lot of muting he is doing and not explaining. Most beginning guitar instruction teaches it wrong. They tell you to bend your left hand fingers so that they push down on a string and don't touch the string above it and below it. That is wrong many times.

Let's try a power chord. A power chord is not really a chord since it is only two notes and a chord has to have three notes, however a million rock and roll songs use power chords (think the intro to Smoke On The Water). Put your left hand index finger on the second string fifth fret (D) and your ring finger on the third string seventh fret (A). This is a D power chord, D, the root and A the fifth. It is missing the third F# which is the least important member of the chord. The tip of your index finger should be gently pushing up against the E string. The underside of your ring finger should be laying on the top three strings. Now you can strum away and it will sound only the two notes you want it to sound.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
My new Pixel camera:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rMSw5eVkCfKuuEOP2
My portfolio:
https://goo.gl/photos/Cx4SaYhGfYFShSty7
My Grand Canyon shots:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Nc1AT8tQp25wJwfm1

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #36 on: May 17, 2014, 03:40:03 PM »
For clarification, my guitar is tuned E A D G B e (strings 6 5 4 3 2 1).

Quote
Put your left hand index finger on the second string fifth fret (D) ... The tip of your index finger should be gently pushing up against the E string.

I read it literally as "pushing up", although it's actually "pushing down" to touch the e (1st) string.

Quote
The underside of your ring finger should be laying on the top three strings.

This must be one of those anatomically impossible things for me. My ring finger is coming up and over from the bottom of the neck to reach the third string. How on Earth can it possibly lay on the top three strings (6 5 4)?
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

SeilerBird

  • ---
  • Posts: 10951
  • Everything I state is my opinion.
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #37 on: May 17, 2014, 05:30:50 PM »
By the top three string I am referring to the G B and e strings. By pushing up against the E string I am talking about pushing up as in towards the ceiling. This is a very hard thing to explain by computer.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
My new Pixel camera:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rMSw5eVkCfKuuEOP2
My portfolio:
https://goo.gl/photos/Cx4SaYhGfYFShSty7
My Grand Canyon shots:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Nc1AT8tQp25wJwfm1

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #38 on: May 17, 2014, 06:00:09 PM »
Quote
By the top three string I am referring to the G B and e strings. By pushing up against the E string I am talking about pushing up as in towards the ceiling.

OK, that makes sense. But, sorry to appear dense ...

 
Quote
The tip of your index finger should be gently pushing up against the E string. ... By pushing up against the E string I am talking about pushing up as in towards the ceiling.

If my index finger is on the second (B) string, pushing gently up won't reach the E string?

Quote
This is a very hard thing to explain by computer.

And equally hard (for me) to understand.
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

SeilerBird

  • ---
  • Posts: 10951
  • Everything I state is my opinion.
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #39 on: May 17, 2014, 06:37:42 PM »
You are not being dense. It is very difficult to teach guitar technique via a keyboard. Let me try again:

>Put your left hand index finger on the second string fifth fret (D)

This means the second from the bottom of the guitar, the A string. Fretting at the fifth fret gets you a D. Now the tip or your index finger can gently push up (up meaning towards the ceiling) against the E string above it.

>and your ring finger on the third string seventh fret (A).

This means the D string and then gently lay the rest of the ring finger on the G B and e strings.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
My new Pixel camera:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rMSw5eVkCfKuuEOP2
My portfolio:
https://goo.gl/photos/Cx4SaYhGfYFShSty7
My Grand Canyon shots:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Nc1AT8tQp25wJwfm1

Larry N.

  • ---
  • Posts: 4485
  • Westminster, CO
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #40 on: May 17, 2014, 08:55:05 PM »
Tom J,

Just to rephrase, Tom S. is using "top" to mean highest pitch, rather than physical height (they're the lowest physically).
Larry and Mary Ann N.
2016 Newmar Ventana 3709 -ISB6.7 XT 360HP
2015 Wrangler Sahara Unlimited toad
Formerly: Trailmanor 2720SL
  de N8GGG

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #41 on: May 17, 2014, 09:00:34 PM »
Thanks Larry, I finally figured that out.
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

SeilerBird

  • ---
  • Posts: 10951
  • Everything I state is my opinion.
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #42 on: May 17, 2014, 09:11:42 PM »
I am not a guitar teacher by any means and I don't know all the correct terminology.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
My new Pixel camera:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rMSw5eVkCfKuuEOP2
My portfolio:
https://goo.gl/photos/Cx4SaYhGfYFShSty7
My Grand Canyon shots:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Nc1AT8tQp25wJwfm1

BigSkyTrailerGuy

  • ---
  • Posts: 232
  • Love your country, but fear your government
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #43 on: May 19, 2014, 02:10:42 PM »
Your next step will be Barre chords; with a barred chord, you just strum your plectrum across all 6 strings. No muting necessary.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pBnS4uhaXAI

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #44 on: May 19, 2014, 02:56:00 PM »
Barred chords are not in the tea leaves. I've tried and tried, and failed miserably to barre a chord with my ukuleles and banjos. I decided some time ago that it's one of those things that's just anatomically impossible for me, and it would be even harder on guitar.
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #45 on: May 20, 2014, 10:41:48 AM »
Quote from: SeilerBird
Let me try again:

Didn't mean to appear to ignore your message Tom. I mentioned a sprain in my left hand/wrist, and it's very evident when I try to play guitar. Since I have a uke concert coming up tomorrow (and practice this evening), I decided to lay off the guitar for a while.

Strangely, I've been playing my plectrum banjo (4 strings, much narrower neck), apparently with no adverse affects. I feel the sprain 'improving' (less pain) daily, and I'll hopefully get back to the guitar shortly.

Now if only I could recall how I got the sprain  ???
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

SeilerBird

  • ---
  • Posts: 10951
  • Everything I state is my opinion.
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #46 on: May 20, 2014, 10:57:41 AM »
That's a bummer for a guitar player to sprain his wrist. I hope you feel better soon.

Do you use a pick? If so here is a little tidbit you may not know. Picks come in different stiffness's. Most guitarist use a stiff pick for lead and a thin pick for strumming. Of course there are many who don't follow this convention but I thought I would mention it just in case you were not aware.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
My new Pixel camera:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rMSw5eVkCfKuuEOP2
My portfolio:
https://goo.gl/photos/Cx4SaYhGfYFShSty7
My Grand Canyon shots:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Nc1AT8tQp25wJwfm1

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #47 on: May 20, 2014, 11:16:00 AM »
Thanks for the tip. I don't use a pick, although I bought a couple at the music store when I got the guitar. Maybe it's because of the way I've played uke for the last couple of years, but I find it easier to strum with my forefinger and thumb; Actually use the fingernails. I occasionally try a pick, but don't stick with it. I suppose that, if I was picking notes, a pick would be almost a must.
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

SeilerBird

  • ---
  • Posts: 10951
  • Everything I state is my opinion.
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #48 on: May 20, 2014, 11:40:39 AM »
Actually there are many guitar players that pick notes without a pick, like Jeff Beck. I don't see how they do it but they do. Strumming with your forefinger and thumb is a great way to do it.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
My new Pixel camera:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rMSw5eVkCfKuuEOP2
My portfolio:
https://goo.gl/photos/Cx4SaYhGfYFShSty7
My Grand Canyon shots:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Nc1AT8tQp25wJwfm1

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #49 on: July 27, 2014, 06:58:44 PM »
Quote
I picked up a nice Yamaha acoustic electric guitar ... They let me have it on their rental program, with full credit towards purchase should I decide to buy.

I made it official last week, and outright purchased the Yamaha when I visited my favorite music store. Formal guitar lessons start mid August. I couldn't resist wandering around the store, trying out different instruments, including a mandolin; I see another instrument in my future  ;D
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

Stan Birch

  • ---
  • Posts: 175
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #50 on: July 28, 2014, 11:15:31 PM »
I once purchased geetar, like  . . . forty years ago, and learned to play it rather well. ??

I must have been rather awesome! When looking for it one day, my wife mentioned that she had donated it to neighbour to sell in her garage sale!!

How much?

$$ 7.00!!

Obviously . . . . I got the message. 
« Last Edit: July 28, 2014, 11:19:17 PM by Stan Birch »
1999 Winnebago Adventurer 32T Ford V-10
Newmarket, Ontario

BigSkyTrailerGuy

  • ---
  • Posts: 232
  • Love your country, but fear your government
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #51 on: July 30, 2014, 09:06:19 AM »
I just plunked down $2600 for a new Taylor 718e. I'm beginning a killer cancer battle, so I thought I at least owed myself this fun treat; first guitar since college.  Plus, It'll be a nice leave-behind for my son.

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #52 on: July 30, 2014, 09:19:19 AM »
Bummer on the cancer. Hope you get it beat. We have a number of survivors here on the forum.

Enjoy that Taylor!
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #53 on: August 01, 2014, 10:57:44 AM »
Haven't attempted (much) to play my guitar; Classes are just 10 days away. Meanwhile, a friend who played it suggested I change the strings, and to get "accoustic electric, lite" strings. Following some research, I ordered a set of DR Zebra Accoustic Electric Lite (9-42) from Amazon, along with a string winder.

I've changed nylon strings on ukuleles, but this will be the first time I've changed metal strings on a guitar. I've done some research/reading on this too. No tying knots to secure the strings!
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

SeilerBird

  • ---
  • Posts: 10951
  • Everything I state is my opinion.
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #54 on: August 01, 2014, 11:29:45 AM »
9s are probably not the best choice for strings for you. 9s are basically for lead guitarists who do a lot of string bending. The reason you won't like them is because they will make your guitar thin sounding, especially without amplification. Lead guitarists add a lot of effects to basically give the strings back the balls they are missing. You would probably be more happy with 11s or 12s unless you plan on playing a lot of lead and doing a lot of string bending. You are probably thinking thinner strings would be easier on your fingers. Maybe, but you are better off toughening up your fingers by doing a lot of playing. Thinner strings actually can be more difficult to play and can be harder on your hands, depending on your playing style.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
My new Pixel camera:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/rMSw5eVkCfKuuEOP2
My portfolio:
https://goo.gl/photos/Cx4SaYhGfYFShSty7
My Grand Canyon shots:
https://photos.app.goo.gl/Nc1AT8tQp25wJwfm1

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #55 on: August 01, 2014, 11:56:22 AM »
Thanks Tom. I figured I was probably going to need to try different strings to decide what I needed.
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

8Muddypaws

  • ---
  • Posts: 2268
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #56 on: August 01, 2014, 12:07:05 PM »
Finding strings that sound and and feel good is a very time consuming process.  Personally I have never found an acoustic/electric string I liked.  I don't even like them on electric guitars.    One of my band-mates plays a classic Martin 000 with (gasp) nylon & steel strings.  She might as well be playing under water.  I use nothing but Elixir Lights.   I buy about a case of them a year for several guitars.  They last a long time.

X2, the 9's are going to sound wimpy and may actually hurt your fingers more.  IMHO your efforts would be better rewarded by taking the guitar to a luthier and having the action professionally set up for ease of playing with a normal set of 'Light' strings.  This is the #1 reason why so many beginning guitarists give up.  They buy a guitar that probably has the proverbial 'action from Hell' and never have it adjusted.  Yahaha builds good guitars with perfectly curved necks but they are not known for their silky smooth action right out of the box.

I broke all 4 metacarpals in my left hand and have very little strength left.  You can bet all of my guitars play as easily as possible.  But if I can play 3 hours a day anyone can!

Please tell me you also bought a tuner.........  Or have a tuner app on your smartphone....... :o 
Retired computer professional
Musician, songwriter and music director
2006 Bounder 34H, 2008 CR-V Toad

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #57 on: August 01, 2014, 12:23:15 PM »
My head was spinning by the time I read different folks' opinions on brands and models of strings. So I figured I'd try one of the recommendations.

Good suggestion re the luthier. I used one an hour or so from here to adjust the action on my banjo when I first bought it. I might take a drive down to see him. Didn't buy a tuner; I have a bunch of tuners around here, and the Yamaha has a built-in tuner that seems to agree with my clip-on tuners.
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

Tom

  • Administrator
  • ---
  • *
  • Posts: 44590
    • RV Forum web site
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #58 on: August 01, 2014, 01:32:38 PM »
Quote
Please tell me you also bought a tuner

As mentioned, I didn't need to buy one, but I'm sitting here looking at 9 stringed instruments (6 ukes, a banjo uke/banjolele, plectrum banjo, and guitar), and there's no way I could play them if they weren't in tune  ;)

Quote
Or have a tuner app on your smartphone

I have several different apps on my Android tablet, but I find the clip-on chromatic tuners convenient. I usually seem to have one in my pocket when I'm out and about shopping or visiting garage sales; You never know when I might see an instrument I want to pick up and play.
Tom.  Need help? Click the Help button in the toolbar above.

8Muddypaws

  • ---
  • Posts: 2268
Re: Beginner guitar
« Reply #59 on: August 01, 2014, 06:21:56 PM »
My experiences with the clip on tuners has been all over the map.  One of the guys I sit in with occasionally uses some weird little clip on tuner and it's just plain wrong.  (I think it might be a Frogmind?) I used the same big old Boss tuner for about 15 years until I decided to  stop buying batteries and started using an iPhone app.  The iPhone has a better mic and seems to be spot on accurate.   And I can check my email while everyone thinks I'm tuning!

I don't even know how many instruments I have anymore.  It's a sickness.  But I really only play a couple of them most of the time.  I'm actually thinking of selling a Baby Taylor because I never fly anywhere since I retired.

At least uke's don't take up quite as much room......   ;D

Have a listen to some of my older 'stuff' on soundcloud:  soundcloud.com/Russell-Causey
Retired computer professional
Musician, songwriter and music director
2006 Bounder 34H, 2008 CR-V Toad

 

Hosted by Over The Network