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Author Topic: Allison Trans - What Fluid?  (Read 5764 times)

RGrimm

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Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« on: August 04, 2014, 12:03:25 PM »
I have a 2006 Winnebago Journey 34H with a CAT 350 and a 3000 Allison Trans -

Does anyone know what type of Trans Fluid was used in these transmissions when used in a Winnebago (Synthetic or non-Synthetic)?

When I looked at The Allison Booklet that came with the MH depending on which type of Fluid was used (TranSyn non-TES 295 or TranSyn TES295) the maintenance schedule is quite different. (see attachment)

Thanks,
Russ
~ Russ and Arlene ~
Northeast Florida
2006 Winnebago Journey 34H
Towing - 2013 Edge Limited
SMI - Air Force 1 Aux Braking
Blackhawk 2 All Terrain 10K

John Canfield

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #1 on: August 04, 2014, 12:12:29 PM »
Russ - ours came with TranSyn so maybe you have the synthetic fluid, around 2005 is when the changeover was made.  We have a label on the engine to that fact, if you can't find a label, call Freightliner.
--John
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RGrimm

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #2 on: August 04, 2014, 12:16:38 PM »
Thanks John.  Once the Rain stops (Florida afternoon storms) I'll go out and see if I can find a label in the engine area.

-Russ
~ Russ and Arlene ~
Northeast Florida
2006 Winnebago Journey 34H
Towing - 2013 Edge Limited
SMI - Air Force 1 Aux Braking
Blackhawk 2 All Terrain 10K

RGrimm

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #3 on: August 04, 2014, 02:23:29 PM »
I called Freightliner (Gaffney) and was told the Allison 3000 Trans in the 2006 Journeys had synthetic oil in them.  Since I purchased my Journey used in March (third owner),  I am attempting to establish my maintenance schedule going forward. When I purchased the unit the dealer (43800 miles) changed the CAT 350 Oil and Filter and the Onan Generator Oil and Filter. I am just not sure where the Allison maintenance is. I contacted Detroit Diesel in Jacksonville, FL (near me) and they gave me a price of $375 to change the Oil/Filters in the 3000. At this point I will probably get the Trans Oil/Filters changed so I have a maintenance start point and for a little piece of mind.

-Russ
~ Russ and Arlene ~
Northeast Florida
2006 Winnebago Journey 34H
Towing - 2013 Edge Limited
SMI - Air Force 1 Aux Braking
Blackhawk 2 All Terrain 10K

John Canfield

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #4 on: August 04, 2014, 02:30:33 PM »
Glad you found out, it's tough without previous maintenance records.  TranSyn is expensive - we had ours changed at I think 85K miles and it was about $200.
--John
2005 Horizon 40AD, 2006 Jeep Rubicon Unlimited
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RGrimm

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #5 on: August 04, 2014, 02:50:11 PM »
Glad you found out, it's tough without previous maintenance records.  TranSyn is expensive - we had ours changed at I think 85K miles and it was about $200.

Before I purchased our Journey I pulled a CarFax on it and found it originally came from Arizona (First owners), the last owners were from Tennessee and worked with NOMADS Mission Volunteers. I checked with Gaffney when I was up their in June and they had no record of it being serviced there.  The unit seemed to have been well taken care of (Interior/Exterior) but it is the mechanical maintenance that is what is important to me.

Once I get the Trans Fluid changed I will at least have a be starting point for "The Big Three" - Engine, Trans, and Generator. The tires were replaced in 2012, as well as the 3 House Batteries and 2 Chassis batteries. So I will be good from this point on.

-Russ
~ Russ and Arlene ~
Northeast Florida
2006 Winnebago Journey 34H
Towing - 2013 Edge Limited
SMI - Air Force 1 Aux Braking
Blackhawk 2 All Terrain 10K

Bob Maxwell

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #6 on: August 06, 2014, 08:27:24 PM »
Check with Allison. They maintain the service record on all their transmissions, and will know all about yours.
Adiós. . .

Bob †
and wife Betty Font
. . . still ridin' for the brand.



Holbrook AZ, west of the Petrified Forrest NP on I-40

SCVJeff

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2014, 02:09:19 AM »
As John mentioned, the Synthetic changed happened around 2005/2006. Ours came with Transynd, and it was claimed to run cooler, shift smoother, change it's own diapers, etc.. There was also an extended change interval for fluid and filter, and at the time.. warranty as well. Has anyone looked in the archives around here, or the other forums?
« Last Edit: August 07, 2014, 02:10:52 AM by SCVJeff »
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buchanan

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2014, 08:49:16 AM »
why worry about whats in there now? IF you feel its in need of changing etc just change it and install 295 synthetic.It will last longer than you will(syn295)

The gold (HD)Filter kit is 80$ and 295 is $44 per gallon

RGrimm

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2014, 09:11:52 AM »
Thanks Everyone.

As I indicated in my post above (post #4 of this Thread) I called Freightliner and was told that Yes the Allisons in the 2006 Journeys did have synthetic oil in them. Also in that post I said I contacted my local Allison Service Center, got a price and would probably get the Oil and Filters changed.

-Russ
~ Russ and Arlene ~
Northeast Florida
2006 Winnebago Journey 34H
Towing - 2013 Edge Limited
SMI - Air Force 1 Aux Braking
Blackhawk 2 All Terrain 10K

John Canfield

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #10 on: August 07, 2014, 09:27:35 AM »
.. got a price and would probably get the Oil and Filters changed.
Good plan.
--John
2005 Horizon 40AD, 2006 Jeep Rubicon Unlimited
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Gary RV_Wizard

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #11 on: August 07, 2014, 09:35:41 AM »
Definitely get the two externally accessible filters changed - it's not real expensive and recommended every 2-3 years (depending on usage). For the fluid, consider getting it analyzed by Blackstone Labs or another fluid analysis company. Odds are that your synthetic tranny fluid is still fine if typical motorhome usage - I'm still running the original in my 2004 (73k miles) and it still tests good. TES295 fluid is too expensive to throw away needlessly. Allison approves of extending change intervals when a reliable quality testing program is used.

Also, use the change interval calculator on the Allison site - it is more accurate  than the charts because it asks questions and tailors the recommendation to the actual situation.
http://www.allisontransmission.com/parts-service/fluid-filter-calculator
« Last Edit: August 07, 2014, 09:37:24 AM by Gary RV Roamer »
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mickey53usa

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #12 on: August 12, 2014, 04:49:52 PM »
If you take it to just get the filters changed - external ones - be very specific that is all you want done. Took mine in last year and requested that the shop change the external filter and they drained all the fluid, replaced the filter and the fluid and wanted to charge me $250+ for the fluid (Transynd). After some discussion, I ended up with a free fluid change.  The external filters should not take more than about 1/2 gallon, but you'll have to buy a full gallon.
Michael & Debbie
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8Muddypaws

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #13 on: August 12, 2014, 06:38:01 PM »
I chose to do my own.  It's a simple job and requires only basic tools (a good torque wrench is basic), a big drain pan (depends on your sump size and location of the transmission cooler), a funnel with a long flexible hose, a ladder and a bungee cord.

Why a ladder & bungee cord you ask?  Put the ladder near the transmission fill tube and use the bungee to secure the funnel to the ladder while you pour the fluid in.  (Don't ask me how I learned this and why I had to clean our radiator)



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buchanan

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #14 on: August 12, 2014, 06:44:15 PM »
I chose to do my own.  It's a simple job and requires only basic tools (a good torque wrench is basic), a big drain pan (depends on your sump size and location of the transmission cooler), a funnel with a long flexible hose, a ladder and a bungee cord.

Why a ladder & bungee cord you ask?  Put the ladder near the transmission fill tube and use the bungee to secure the funnel to the ladder while you pour the fluid in.  (Don't ask me how I learned this and why I had to clean our radiator)

Ok why the big drain pan if you only loose 2 quarts as mickey53usa claims

Becks

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #15 on: August 12, 2014, 07:37:42 PM »
A friend and I just changed our tranny filters recently. Mine lost 8 qts, his lost 5 qts. They all seem to vary on how much fluid you lose.
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8Muddypaws

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #16 on: August 12, 2014, 08:19:03 PM »
Obviously because I chose to drain the entire tranny.
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buchanan

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #17 on: August 12, 2014, 08:25:34 PM »
Obviously because I chose to drain the entire tranny.
did not know that as  I thought we were talking about oil required when just changing the filters

8Muddypaws

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #18 on: August 12, 2014, 09:12:14 PM »
Since there seems to be a wide variance in how much oil comes out with the filters having a big drain pan is still good advice.   ;D
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kevin

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #19 on: August 12, 2014, 10:00:26 PM »
we had a leak with our's and freightliner replaced filters, and new transynd $300 plus. Allison guy's told me it was good til it hit 80,000 miles.

it is a 06 and took syn
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WILDEBILL308

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #20 on: August 12, 2014, 10:22:59 PM »
I changed my Transmission and filters because I didn't have any maint records and wanted a good starting point. Well that went easier than changing the engine oil. I stopped by Inland Truck Parts and Service to double check the torque figures. (Yes I should believe everything I read on the Internet) One of the Cummins techs told me yes it is 38-45 pounds foot for the filter housing bolts and 18-24 pounds foot for the drain plug.
I have been torque bolts in the aerospace world for a lot of years and it seamed a little high for torque into a cast alloy part. The way they can do this is they have a lot of threads on the bolt probably double the standard amount and so the load is spread over a larger area. The torque is also called out on the instructions in the filter kit. I think I got my full 19-˝ quarts out on draining the sump and filter housings. I filled a 5 gal paint bucket pretty full. I didn't actually measure it but when I was done it checked good using the shift pad method of checking the level. 
I would caution anyone that does do their own fluid change to be careful when removing any of the old paper gaskets from the mating surfaces. DON’T scratch or gouge the surface as this could produce a leak path even with a new gasket. When torquing the filter bolts start with about 25 pounds foot and cries cross your pattern then do your final torque
Any questions just ask.
Bill
« Last Edit: August 12, 2014, 10:27:17 PM by WILDEBILL308 »
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Mavarick

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Re: Allison Trans - What Fluid?
« Reply #21 on: August 14, 2014, 01:22:58 AM »
The complete oil level will depend on which model trans you have and which sump, the 2" or 4". The info can be copied off the tag on the side of the trans and then call Allison or the local dealer if you need any clarification. The torque values are in your manual also or on the web.
I would always recommend using Transynd and the new style high capacity filters only. As stated you need a good torque wrench for the filter housing bolts but it's a pretty simple job doing just filters or even the whole service. If you don't use the torque wrench Allison sells a thread repair kit for when you strip them out so be careful.
On the 3000 for instance with the 4" sump the complete job will be app 22 qts, or just the filters will be 2 qts for the main and 8 qts for the lube filter.
With the rig reasonably level use your stick for the cold level to start the engine and always use the electronic level on your keypad (if you have it) to finish the job so you don't overfill.
Pay attention to which gaskets you have when you remove your old filters. The new filters will come with both styles so you will use one style ad throw the others away. After you remove your old filters look at the bottom of them for the date stamp, it will give you an idea of when they were installed.
An easy way to get a good drain pan is to find a used plastic 30 gal drum locally, they go for about $10. Cut it in half and it will be large enough even when doing your cooling system. If you want to get fancy drill a hole and install a bulkhead fitting then you can drain the contents into smaller containers to bring up for recycling.
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