RV community needs a revolution?

I could not afford the production RV that Rebelsun implies should be the standard.

as long as consumers are willing to purchase expensive, but substandard homes on wheels

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We've had five motorhomes and haven't considered even one of them to be "substandard" so that's your opinion which I do not share.  Our two Lazy Daze Class Cs had one minor problem each on delivery.  The 22' had the hot water line going to the toilet which Jerry fixed before we got home.  The 30' had a small leak in an underbay which was fixed at the factory while we were on a business trip.  Both our Monaco Class A DPs have been great.  Yes, there was a fix-it list at the beginning and there have been occasional things to have fixed at the factory but I certainly wouldn't refer to either of them as "crap".  Even our very first 1972 18' El Dorado that cost about $8,000 new was remarkably well put together.  We bought it and a week later took it on an 11,000-mile circumnavigation of the USA.  I think we had two problems.  First in St. Augustine FL when an air conditioning hose came loose and had to be recharged and second in the FL panhandle when a wiring harness started to smoke and Jerry ripped it out to prevent a fire.  Both were repaired quickly and were a just blip in the trip.  We enjoy RVing too much to let little things like that change our enjoyment.

ArdraF

So far, the best part of my RV experience is still having the money in my pocket. So funny and over the hill, some of you, talking to me about perfection.

I'm NOT planning to quickly lock myself into an RV, to make some of you happy, pushing me to be a real RVer and buy.

I'm NOT planning to quickly lock myself into an RV, to make some of you happy, pushing me to be a real RVer and buy.

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Au contraire.  I definitely think you should keep your money in your pocket and do something besides RVing because you probably would not be a happy camper.  Just because we're happy doing it does not mean you would be and I would never encourage someone to do something obviously not right for them.

ArdraF

RodgerS said:

So far, the best part of my RV experience is still having the money in my pocket. So funny and over the hill, some of you, talking to me about perfection.

I'm NOT planning to quickly lock myself into an RV, to make some of you happy, pushing me to be a real RVer and buy.

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Holy Moly, you're pretty full of yourself aren't you. If you think for an instant that this conversation has been about "getting" you to buy a RV then I might suggest professional help for your delusion. I can only speak for myself, but I don't give a rip if you buy a RV or not.

It's such a blessing to be simple souls.  We bought a 1995 Bounder diesel, fired her up, never looked back, and enjoyed more than 20 years of bliss.  Beats the heck out of 20 years "evaluating" everything that might possibly go wrong, IMHO.  Your mileage, of course, may vary.  Good luck to you.

RodgerS said:

So far, the best part of my RV experience is still having the money in my pocket. So funny and over the hill, some of you, talking to me about perfection.

I'm NOT planning to quickly lock myself into an RV, to make some of you happy, pushing me to be a real RVer and buy.

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Truth be told, most of us are completely indifferent about whether you (or anyone else) chooses to buy or not buy an RV or anything else for that matter.  Do (or don't do) whatever makes you happy.

Oscar Mike said:

I could not afford the production RV that Rebelsun implies should be the standard.

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Makes two of us.  CAN an RV be built to this standard?  Of course.  Will it result in huge price increases that will push most consumers out of the market and thus ultimately cause many manufacturers to be pushed out of business?  Yes.  And don't expect foreign competition to force improvement like it did in the auto industry.....the sales volume and markup isn't there to support this happening. 

ArdraF said:

The 22' had the hot water line going to the toilet which Jerry fixed before we got home.  ArdraF

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Ardra, are you sure that was a mistake?  I used a toilet once that shot a nice warm spray of water where the sun don't shine.  Maybe you really had one of those really high end units.   

Me?  I'm just a pie-eyed dolt that jumped into the first bucket of bolts I looked at to "get rollin down the road" all anxious to catch that elusive RV dream...... :

FLASH........ 

There is a simple solution to the issue of quality.  No more discounts.  Everyone simply agrees to pay full price.  That way the manufacturers are happy.  They have the financial where-with-all to warranty their work product.  They also no longer have a need to buy the least expensive and likely second rate components.  They no longer need to compromise on quality when producing their product.  The dealers are also happy.  They've made enough money on each sales to employ technically astute quality sales people who are not pressured into providing nubies with bogus info.  The dealers can also afford to hire the best workers and therefore assure their customers that all warranty work will be performed correctly, on time and guaranteed for a year.  Their workers will also be happy because if the manufacturers and dealers make enough money on each sale, they can pay their employees a decent wage and offer them benefits.  Like health and welfare programs.  Of course if the manufactures make their product too good, then the dealers may suffer.  But that can be worked out between the manufacturer and dealer.  Now we the buyers will be happy because we get a quality product and know that if we have a problem, it will be fixed promptly by service reps who all haves smiles on their face and it won't cost us a red cent.  And when you think about it, even if you had to pay 100% of the asking price, if everyone else was paying 100% of the asking price, you'd do so without hesitation.  Because, all we really want is a fair deal.  But wait there's more.  Others will open their doors because they can make a product that is even better and RV buyers will want that product.  We'll also have more dealers.  Because after all, dealers are really just business folks trying to make a few bucks.  And heck, if they can make a few bucks selling RV's, why not.  So for me it's a win win solution.  What do you think?  Forget about research.  Forget about NADA.  Just pay what they want.  8)


I'm not sure how to fix the purchase price and quality of used vehicles.  Working on it.  News at eleven.  ..............

I now return you to your regular programming. 

I guess I just don't understand how it can be more expensive for them to do it right the first time than to have everyone coming back to get the stuff fixed under warranty. Either way they are paying for it to be right, and it seems like they are paying to do a job twice every time its returned.

Search this forum for RV Quality and you should get lots of messages.  A little extra in the engineering phase should save lots in Manufacturing and warranty repairs but you can't convince most people of this fact.  The Japanese learned this from an American and whipped our butts in the auto world and are still doing a pretty good job in spite of our companies doing much better than in the past.

One example is in  the use of "pre-fabricated" cable harnesses.  Years ago I showed a RV manufacturer how they  could save money on the amount of wire, copper,  as well as reducing the labor required to install and trouble shoot wiring errors.  They built 10 units and went back to the old way of wiring, each wire run individually, as they couldn't keep things going the easier way.  People problems mostly.

BinaryBob said:

Me?  I'm just a pie-eyed dolt that jumped into the first bucket of bolts I looked at to "get rollin down the road" all anxious to catch that elusive RV dream...... :

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Same here,I bought the third motor home we  looked at found on e bay. Drove 300 miles to look at it.Bought 1 wk later.We had never owned any type of rv and were not campers but every time we travel it is the journey not the destination.
I am still amazed at how quiet and smooth it goes down the road (on good roads).  Issues,yes there is always something sometimes maintenance sometimes adding that new toy.

Staff edit: Add missing close quote tag

garyb1st said:

FLASH........ 

There is a simple solution to the issue of quality.  No more discounts.  Everyone simply agrees to pay full price. 

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I'm not convinced that would fix anything..... just changes the target in the game

I figure a manufacturer sets his target price at say $68k
then sets the MSRP at say $93k
knowing that they are knowing to discount to make the customer "think" he's getting a deal.
and they will hope the customer isn't so shrewd and will pay $71k, netting a bigger margin for the seller, and still making the customer think they got a great deal with a discount.
all a game.....

One of the good things that has come out of all these discussions is a clear line in my mind between a recreational vehicle vs motorized mobile home, despite the confusing multitude of crossover designs.

As to the theme, I have learned that buyers simply don't have high expectations of mfg quality, the mfgs know it, and therefore they provide an after purchase salve. And this is unlikely to change since buyers rationalize away the quality failures with the idea that the entertainment value justifies the suffering.

"knowing that they are knowing to discount to make the customer "think" he's getting a deal."

Unfortunate, isn't it??? the level of the average customer's ability to do the research and learning, so as to actually know they aren't getting a deal.

So much emotional pressure we can put on ourselves and others to just do it.

I find it difficult, just me, to be a pie-eyed dolt when spending say $200,000, and just do it.

Rodger, something tells me the RV lifestyle, be it full or part timing, isn't for you.

Kev

Kevin Means said:

Rodger, something tells me the RV lifestyle, be it full or part timing, isn't for you.
Kev

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And that is not necessarily a bad thing.

Oscar Mike said:

And that is not necessarily a bad thing.

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John, you need to disconnect from this discussion. A troll is baiting you.