Question on actual king pin weight.

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5string

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May 8, 2014
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Can somebody give me an idea of what to expect as the  difference between a fifth wheel's "advertised" hitch weight and its "Actual" hitch weight as it sits on the dealers lot?
 
I believe the advertised pin weight is what the weight will be when the trailer is loaded with supplies and all the tanks are full. The actual pin weight is what it weighs with nothing in it and all the tanks are empty.  This is my opinion.
 
If you look at the specs online, they are listed by the manufacture as dry and range from about 18% of total dry weight on many lite 5th trailers to about 22% on the heavier trailers. I always understood that you could figure 20% on the weight dry or loaded, but it would be best to have the trailer weighed.

Stan
 
The pin weight shown in the brochure is invariable the "dry" pin weight, i.e. what the pin weighs on the "dry" trailer weight. That means totally empty, just as it comes from the factory.

Your actual pin weight will be 20-25% of the actual loaded weight. There is some variability depending on how much the trailer is loaded, and where that weight is placed. More weight behind the axles lightens the pin, while more weight forward makes it heavier. The location of the water tanks and amount of water onboard is one key factor.  Since most 5W storage is forward, modern 5W's trend toward the heavier side of the pin weight range.
 
I always heard that actual pin weight is what you find out on the scales when fully loaded. I also learned that pin weight for those with front kitchen is higher than for those with rear kitchen.  Lots of variables, thus the real number will be the one when you loaded ready for camping and take it to the scale.
 
You're right RV, when you put it on the scales while loaded you can compute an actual pin weight.  And after you buy it, the dealer doesn't mind at all if you load it take it to the scales.  ;) :)  I'm trying to get a decent "swag" on what the pin weight's really going to be when I pull it off the lot  if they advertise it at 1705 lbs.
 
5string said:
  I'm trying to get a decent "swag" on what the pin weight's really going to be when I pull it off the lot  if they advertise it at 1705 lbs.

Just figure 20-25% of the fivers GVWR and you should be OK.

 
x2, Bruce.  20% of the GVWR is fine if you are convinced you will not be loaded to the max. If you think you might actually come near the GVWR, I'd use 25% as the estimate. So, the swag range is 20-25% of GVWR.
 
Actually a RV trailer manufacturer?s hitch/pin weight serves a single purpose. It is used with other trailer weight values to determine the trailer?s GAWR and GVWR including the cargo capacity. An owner may never see a hitch weight equal to the manufacturer?s published hitch weight because once sold the owner is then solely responsible for the hitch weights.

By regulation the trailer?s total GAWR added  to the manufacturer?s established hitch weight must equal or exceed GVWR. Established cargo loads are determined by adding  their load value into the equation to equal GVWR.

Because of the numerous storage locations available with fivers, it becomes a challenge to balance their total - down the road - loads. By regulations, propane is part of GVW and water - all tanks - is cargo. Any options added by the dealer or others is deducted from the cargo if done by the dealer and over 100#. After that it?s yours to load and balance.

FastEagle
 
We are at 20,000# and have a 5280 pin. That is actual loaded weights. Dry weight advertised was 14635 and pin of 2845. But when we weighed it on scale dryday we picked it up,  it was over 16k. Taking all this in to account you need to look at gross weight. I would not even consider dry weights.
 
I think we need to think about how much stuff we tend to carry. Our FW went from 11,400 (dry weight) to 12,600 on scale before leaving for winter. Some people need more stuff than others. How much we pack will have a great impact on pin weight.
 
Glenn West said:
We are at 20,000# and have a 5280 pin. That is actual loaded weights. Dry weight advertised was 14635 and pin of 2845. But when we weighed it on scale dryday we picked it up,  it was over 16k. Taking all this in to account you need to look at gross weight. I would not even consider dry weights.

What is your GVWR? Your actual pin weight is 26.4% of your actual gross weight so, as Gary stated, 25% of GVWR is a good wag if you are buying a truck/5er or can't get to a scale.
 
We are good. We are near max when towing. Have hauler bed and air bags. Even within GM ratings we were not happy with the shape of springs loaded. That why we have bags.
 
RVRAC said:
I think we need to think about how much stuff we tend to carry. Our FW went from 11,400 (dry weight) to 12,600 on scale before leaving for winter. Some people need more stuff than others. How much we pack will have a great impact on pin weight.

That's true. Saw one guy next to me ( a snowbird) that had about 10 cases of beer and another 5-10 cases of soft drinks in his bay. Must not know we have Publix down here. But you can also get the pin weight down to 25% but judicious packing and selective tank capacities.
 
I think that a LOT folks would be surprised at how much weight their 5th wheel has gained over the years and I'm as guilty as most when it comes to not weighing the rig on a regular basis.  Two years ago I re-weighed as we were departing Cody for the winter and got a 500lb surprise, that is we were 500lb over gross at 16.5k.  The fix of course was easy as we tend to travel with water all I had to do was dump about half the water to bring us a little closer to the comfort level.

5th wheels and campers even trucks gain a lot of weight just by virtue of the fact that we use them, all the little things add up.  I accuse my wife of overloading us by bringing all the books she does, not to mention all the shall we say junk that she buys for the kids and insists on dragging along to deliver instead of shipping it when she buys it.  She of course blames all the guns, reloading and casting equipment that I drag along.  In my defense everything but the guns goes into the back of the truck and with a medium duty there's not much to worry about weight wise even with a 16k lb rig on it.

For the last ten years or so we've been enforcing "The Rule" which reads as follows:  If something goes on the road with us and over the course of the trip it does not get used then when we get home it comes out of the rig and is never to return no matter how much I or the wife promises to use it next time.  Suffice it to say that I no longer have a deep fryer and she no longer has that quesedilla maker.
 
we've been enforcing "The Rule"

You need one more rule, "When something comes in the RV, something goes out of the RV".
 
What I have observed is that most folks carry so much stuff in their FW basements, but as I spend weeks next to them, the stuff is not used.  Why would I carry heavy cases of beer or water from WI to either TX or FL knowing that I can buy down there if I need them? Makes no sense to me.
 
One of the things that has to be re-learned as you transition from weekends to long-time RVing is that there are  stores most everywhere. You don't need to bring it all with you - buy it as you go.  I chuckle at folks who use basement freezers to carry large amounts of frozen food. Makes sense if you fish or hunt and carry your hard-earned meats, but if you shop at supermarkets, why bother?

However, most of us have favorite brands and many of them are regional or even local. We tend to take along as much as we can, cause when its gone there may not be any more for awhile.
 
It's funny that you mention the hunting.  A few weeks prior to our departure a deer made the mistake of walking in front of my 30-30.  My lovely wife managed to get the entire deer into the fridge/freezer in the 5th wheel, of course I was informed that there would be no ice until we got to AZ other than what was on the roads.  Once down here our daughter has a fridge that you could park a car in so we just moved the long term storage stuff from ours to hers.

I definitely see RVRAC's point too.  I've got some "stuff" in the forward basement that probably could get left behind but on occasion I actually use the silly little Coleman picnic table that I spent way too much money on but for the most part the stuff that's in there does get used or submits to "The Rule".  I will say that I have a rather "heavy" hobby though.  I shoot a lot, my reloading equipment weighs in at over 200 lbs and then of course there's the boolit casting equipment...given that boolits are lead the weight of the lead ingots can easily go into the hundreds of pounds.  This is where the medium duty truck is a life saver as the heavy stuff like lead and reloading equipment resides forward in the bed of the truck.

I'll make an observation also about "Campers" vs "RV'rs".  Don't get me wrong, I'm not disparaging either group but in my estimation there definitely is a difference.  "Campers" tend to take off for the weekend or the occasional week or so family vacation.  If a "Camper" forgets something they tend to either do without it or purchase it and eat the cost as one of those lessons on what to bring next time.  If something breaks or needs repair chances are they can limp the rig back home if they're not clear across the country which is seldom.  An "RV'r" on the other hand tends to leave with a lot more supplies and provisions simply because they'll be away for a longer period of time and typically a LOT further away, if something needs repair they have to either make the decision to lay out considerable funds for repair or learn how to do it themselves.
 
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