House batteries not charging....pulling my hair out!!!!

2007 Winnebago Access 31C on a 2007 Chevy Workhorse Chassis 6.0L engine
2 6 volt U.S. house batteries  1 Sears Platinum Engine battery

Ok so I had an issue of the Aux Start switch not working and the house batteries not charging.
No Problem, got it figured out that the solenoid was bad as when I pressed the AUX START = no click
Changed it out for a new one.......NOW comes the bad part.....
Start engine =Fine
Check alternator at engine =Fine
Check AUX Start = Fine, Solenoid clicks like it should
Check house batteries = NOT fine, no connection from Alternator to house batteries

So while the engine is running I can push the AUX START and the house batteries jump to 14.3 volts........ perfect!
This means they connect if I need to boost the starting aspect.

Let go of the switch and house batteries are now disconnected....It's (the solenoid) supposed to pickup the fact that "Engine is on" and is supposed to connect the house batteries to charge them while driving....this does NOT happen.

I checked the AUX switch it's fine.  I installed a new solenoid and I know it works as I press the AUX button and batteries all connect.

The issue that I'm pulling my hair out is that there is a fuse or something from the AUX switch to the solenoid that is preventing the connection to the solenoid. Winnebago can't help me they say check the fuse but have no idea where that fuse is.

I checked both fuse boxes and all fuses are good. 

Winnebago then says follow the wire from the switch and see where is goes.

NO F*****G way I'm taking the entire front end, seats, flooring out etc. to follow a wire.

So has anyone here had this issue you can give me a clue what fuse Winnebago uses in the Chevrolet Chassis?
Or, do you have any idea where the wires from the AUX switch go?

I'm really not in the mood for bunch of possible things to check as I think I've got it narrowed down.

If you KNOW great !!!! if your guessing.....Thanks anyway.

Edit by staff:  changed message icon to topic solved

I'm sure help will be on the way shortly. You've made such an attractive post, for post #1, BobtheGod that people will be flocking to help.

Ken

Thanks Bucks.  I've actually been on here for years under an old name. But reregistered with my new stuff.
Don't tell anyone though, I need help on this one.

If you go HERE you can see a diagram of the way Winnebago typically wires the AUX (battery mode) solenoid. If you download it and open it in Windows Photo Viewer you can enlarge it so the nomenclature is easier to read.
The activation wire on mine is labeled LR. It is activated in two ways  - one by the AUX switch and also by the the RUN terminal on the ignition switch. The wire from the switch goes to the fuse panel under the dash, The panel in is the back left side next to the firewall. The fuse is in the back right side of the panel and is labeled "Step Alarm". Wires from that fuse also provide signal power to the step control board and tells the step to retract when the ignition switch in on, power to the back up monitor, and the fan on the MotorAid heater option if you have it.

Thanks Clay but I have a couple of questions;

1. So there's a third fuse box?

2. You said "The panel in is the back left side next to the firewall" so under the dash or under the hood?

3. You also said "Wires from that fuse also provide signal power to the step control board and tells the step to retract when the ignition switch in on, power to the back up monitor"  My power step works but isn't dependent on the key being on. However it is connected to the Chassis battery regardless of key position. So I'm guessing that fuse it solely for the AUX switch connection itself.  And my backup monitor works so it must be fused someplace else. If they were connected together and the fuse were blown the camera wouldn't work either...but it does.

4. On my Aux Start Switch there are three wires.  One (outgoing) goes to the Solenoid, One (incoming), should be hot, and  one should be momentary connection of the 12 volt hot to Solenoid for extra for starting if needed.  Am I correct?

Thanks for your assistance also.

Bob

On my 2006 Voyage there are 2 solenoids & the one for the jump start is NOT the one for charging. Art

Bob, I don't know if this will help or not, because I don't know if you have the same type of charging system as mine, but a few months ago, I was having a similar problem (or at least I thought I was). All my connections worked just as you've described, but the engine's alternator wasn't charging the house-batteries. I had recently installed two additional house-batteries and I was sure that I must have disconnected or damaged something in the process. I solicited help from the good folks here but nothing resolved the "problem."

I eventually got a data-sheet from the maker of the Battery Isolation Manager (BIM), a component that monitors and controls how much, and when, the house and chassis batteries get charged by the alternator. I learned that the house-batteries won't get charged until they're down to 84% and only then if the chassis-batteries are near full charge. The BIM prioritizes the chassis-batteries over the house-batteries. In other words, my system was working just fine. I just didn't understand how it was supposed to work. The addition of two house-batteries changed how fast my house batteries were running down on longer trips (it took longer to get down to 84%), so they weren't charging as often, which caused me to believe that that weren't charging at all. 

Like I said, I don't know if your system is like mine or not but if it is, that may be what's going on.

Kev

Thanks for the reply Kevin but my MH doesn't have a BIM device.  But I'm going to try and drop the charge on my house batteries and see if it kicks in as a test.

Instead of troubleshooting the existing wiring, I have two suggestions:

Run a new wire from your Aux Start (to the solenoid) to a source of switched 12V (ignition on)
Replace your dumb battery mode solenoid with an intelligent charging relay.  I did this years ago after four solenoid failures.

I'm assuming you have downloaded your appropriate wiring diagram(s.)

--> wow, my 9,000th post - I need to get a life <--

Bobthegod said:

...
4. On my Aux Start Switch there are three wires.  One (outgoing) goes to the Solenoid, One (incoming), should be hot, and  one should be momentary connection of the 12 volt hot to Solenoid for extra for starting if needed.  Am I correct?...

Click to expand...

There should be 3 wires on the Aux Start switch (oddly labelled the Battery Changeover Switch in the Body, 12 Volt Wiring Diagram for your coach).  The wire labelled LR runs to the Battery Mode solenoid.  The wire labelled LS is a constant source of power.  The wire labelled KE is a run-only power source (only has power when the engine is running).  When the momentary Aux Battery switch is not being pressed it should connect KE to LR which should cause the solenoid to operate if the engine is running.  When you press the Aux Start switch it should connect LS to LR, causing the solenoid to operate whether or not the engine is running.

Since you know that the solenoid is operating when the Aux Start switch is pressed you know that wire labelled LR which runs to the solenoid is OK, as well as the LS power source.  If you can verify that the wire KE at the switch has power when the engine is running then the Aux Switch is bad (or has a bad connection to the KE wire).  If you have no run-only power on wire KE then you'll need to chase that wire back to its source.

OnEdit: Typo fix

Bobthegod said:

Thanks Clay but I have a couple of questions;

1. So there's a third fuse box?

2. You said "The panel in is the back left side next to the firewall" so under the dash or under the hood?

3. You also said "Wires from that fuse also provide signal power to the step control board and tells the step to retract when the ignition switch in on, power to the back up monitor"  My power step works but isn't dependent on the key being on. However it is connected to the Chassis battery regardless of key position. So I'm guessing that fuse it solely for the AUX switch connection itself.  And my backup monitor works so it must be fused someplace else. If they were connected together and the fuse were blown the camera wouldn't work either...but it does.

4. On my Aux Start Switch there are three wires.  One (outgoing) goes to the Solenoid, One (incoming), should be hot, and  one should be momentary connection of the 12 volt hot to Solenoid for extra for starting if needed.  Am I correct?

Thanks for your assistance also.

Bob

Click to expand...

2) Under the dash
3) The step retracts when the key is on if it is out. It is operated from the engine battery. The wire from the ignition run terminal is a signal lead and is not the power lead.


If the monitor works and the step retracts when the key is on then that means that the fuse is okay.
Regarding the three wires, it appears that cbeiyrl's answer is a good one.

Art In Mobile said:

On my 2006 Voyage there are 2 solenoids & the one for the jump start is NOT the one for charging. Art

Click to expand...

Yours may be wired differently but Winnebago usually uses two solenoids - one for AUX starting and charging the house batteries when the engine is running and the other is the battery disconnect solenoid.
They may do something different on some models.

Thanks Clay & cbeierl,

You guys have confirmed what I thought and gave me some ideas to try.  I'm going to resolve this Saturday, one way or another.
I'll report back.  Geeez I can't wait to fix this!!!!

Well cbeierl I've narrowed it down further.  There's no power (ON) at the KE wire.  It's very difficult to follow it since it's tucked under the floor mat and tight.  I took the driver seat out and found the (Winnebago yellow wire) wire loom from the dash but it has no KE wire in it.  It only goes from the dash to under the seat so that KE wire must break off and go another place (inaccessible).  This is the frustrating part taking the whole front clip off to find one F***ing wire.

So I decided to chuck the whole "Find the wire" and am going with a new (fused) key on hot, and, I'll know it's good and better yet where it comes from.

cbeierl As I said I'm planning on adding a new dedicated 12 volt ON line to my Aux Switch.  It should be less than 10 feet long.  What gauge wire should I use and what size fuse?

Thanks
Bob

According to the wiring diagrams, the existing KE wire is 14 gauge.  According to page 6 of the Chassis Wiring Installation for your coach (see the triangular note '7') Winnebago ties into the chassis run-only circuit by connecting to a Chevy brown wire at the driver's B-post.  Looking at pages 7 and 8 of the Body, 12 Volt Wiring Diagram it shows KE running from the Aux Battery Switch (aka Battery Changeover Switch) to the electric mirror and then to a fuse holder which then connects to a 10-gauge yellow wire labelled FEED which connects to the Chevy circuit in the B-post.  If you can't find that fuse holder I would give Winnebago a call and ask them where it is located.

That's very interesting when you said it's connected to the ELECTRIC MIRROR.  Just after I purchased the motorhome (new) there were problems with the power mirrors.  Works sometimes, then not working, did this for a couple of months then stopped altogether. So since it was under warranty I returned it for repair.  When I picked it up everything was fine mirrors worked ever since.  Why? A NEW WIRE WAS ADDED.  They said, at the time, it was very difficult to find the wire as it's buried in there (I can attest to that).  So they added a new one.  So my guess is, part of the that KE wire went with it.  And my "Charging with the alternator" went too.  So I'm guessing I haven't charged from the alternator for a while.  Which is very possible as I use my genny (I have two, the on board Onan 4000 watt or my little Honda 2000, which I use more since its so quiet and it a great little power pack) while camping and I have great batteries which really don't show a great drop in voltage.  I never really checked them for alternator charging as I only recently realized the Solenoid didn't work when I actually used the AUX button and found "NO CLICK" that's what started all this.

I also did find that fuse holder, it was located under the seat and looked like a 12 yr. old put it together.  Fuse was fine. But like I said before, to follow that wire installation would take a couple of days to undo it all, there's no slack at all and it's been wrapped and secured like Fort Knox.  And I did ask Winnebago where that fuse was, they didn't know since it is not on the diagrams.....I got the "Just look around it's there someplace close by" <<<<Yeah thanks a lot ! ! !

So TODAY I'm installing a new HOT wire and CLOSING this case. Once and for all!!!!

I'd also want to thank you (cebeierl) and the others, for all your help.  I looked at the wiring diagrams and with your explanation of the parts and wiring that I didn't get was a great help.

Will report when completed.

If you've got power at that fuse I would take your new wire from there to the Aux Start switch--that way you don't have to worry about a new fuse, etc.

Nope, no power to that fuse.  Got a Piggy Back dual fuse holder used a spare slot......ran a new wire......SON-OF-A-B**** the F-ing things works PERFECTLY ! ! ! ! !  14.1 volts out of the alternator to the power point up front.....14.1 volts to the House batteries.
I'm a happy camper once again.

Bobthegod said:

Nope, no power to that fuse.  Got a Piggy Back dual fuse holder used a spare slot......ran a new wire......SON-OF-A-B**** the F-ing things works PERFECTLY ! ! ! ! !  14.1 volts out of the alternator to the power point up front.....14.1 volts to the House batteries.
I'm a happy camper once again.

Click to expand...

Sounds great!  I presume that you used a run-only power source.