Don't want to kill my 2015 F150 5.0! 8000 lbs?

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jnbettes

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Hello all!  Yesterday my wife forced me to go to an RV dealership where we spent over 2 hours looking at travel trailers.  I feel in love and I plan on giving myself a few weeks to find the best one before we change the lives of those in my home!!!  So many local places to camp plus so many other places within half a day's drive. 

I have a 2014 F150 SXT Sport, 5.0 liter with towing package.  I know how to maneuver with perhaps some concern (can drive a trailer used for tools, moving furniture, etc with my eyes closed) but what I worry about the most is the weight.  I don't want to buy a trailer that ends up controlling or killing my truck. 

So with that said, I think 6 - 8000 lb is a conservative range to shoot for?  Family of 5 and would be cool if we could bring family and friends on some of the trips.  So would prefer to be able to sleep at least 9 or so.  Only 5 can fit in the truck though (about 500 lbs of family members).    :)

Any help you can offer would be great.  I would like your thoughts on weight.  I think supplies I throw into the truck or TT plus passenger weight would still keep me at a manageable weight even if I got something right at the 8000 lb mark?

Also, any tips on brands.  The guy we saw Saturday sold Grey Wolf and Cherokee TT's.  They looked great for the price.  However, I mainly find other brands when I do searching online.

Thanks and hope this tracks some attention!
 
Do your homework as far as what your truck can safely tow. Do NOT listen to a RV salesman. They tell you anything in order to get a deal.
 
Your manual should give you your tow capacity.  Be sure you know the rear end ratio,if transmission cooler is pre-installed, etc.
 
Agreed, and really look at the numbers, not just taking some ones word for what you have.
Too many options, reg cab, SuperCab, SuperCrew... 4x2 or 4x4... short, reg, or long bed (Wheel Base) then there's rear end ratio's ... even 2 different towing packages to look up the codes for.  :eek:

For example my 2013 with a 5.0 is a S-Cab, 4X4, 3.55 rear axle ratio, 145" Wheel Base, with tow package (not the "Max Tow"). Rated at 7800#Trailer capacity with a 13,500# GCWR. Factor in the MINIMUM 10% error margin there is no way I would be looking at a 8000# trailer. My trailer has a GVWR of 6260#.
Which brings up another point, make sure you aren't looking at the trailers Dry Weight, go for the Gross. My trailer advertised a 4534# base weight.. that is DRY, no LP, no Battery, no water in ANY of the tanks... bone dry and empty.
By the time I add gear/ firewood/ into the bed of the truck and the wife I in the cab with a grand-kid or two...and maybe a bike rack I am right to the max!!
 

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So using the link, it states 8000 maximum loaded trailer weight.  5.0, 4x2, 3.55 rear axle ratio, supercrew, 145" wheelbase.  So it looks like I wasn't being very conservative.  We were looking at 2 rigs yesterday, one grey wolf (6400 lbs dry) and the other Cherokee (6100 lbs dry). 

A bit of math:
Curb Weight of F150 - 4622
Passengers - 510 (weight of kids 2-3 years from now)
26 gallons of fuel - 208 lbs
Additional Cargo - 300 lbs
Total weight of F150 loaded and fueled - 5640

GCWR - 13,500
Total Weight of loaded truck - 5640

Difference between GCWR and loaded truck - 7860 (max amount loaded trailer can be without considering margin of error)

So for now I'm thinking I don't want to be too ambitious.  I will consider 6500 lbs max (dry).  That gives me 1360 for cargo/liquids already over the 300 lbs I would put in my truck (included in the above math).  I don't see myself traveling with that much stuff.  If I'm traveling cross country I'm traveling with clothes, balls and other kids toys, folding chairs, a few coolers full of ice and food, etc.  Don't see myself getting over a few hundred lbs. 

Anyone see any errors in my logic? 
 
What is LP?  You gave a few examples that would not be included in the dry weight.....battery, LP, anything else?  Again, if I'm traveling far, I'm going to have a plan and reserve locations that have power/water hook ups.  If I want to be a bit more spontaneous and still keep the wife happy then I would probably want to fill the water tanks or rely on the water tanks which could add as much as another 1000 lbs.  In that scenario, we're now at 7500 lbs for the trailer (still not considering battery, LP, etc).  That's 360 lbs shy of the 7860 I came to below.  Am I playing with fire getting this close? 

Again, all this math is based on a rig coming in at 6500 dry.  There was a second set up that we also liked that was right at 6000 dry. 
 
We don't know where you live and so do not know the towing environment.  It is usually recommended that you allow 10% margin for miss figuring and other unknowns if in the Midwest  and not having to pull long passes in the mountains, allow for altitude, etc.  If towing in the mountains, it is usually recommended to allow a 20% margin for the harder pulls, altitude, temperature, etc.  8000X0.8= 6400# max in the mountains and 7200# if in the Midwest. 

So yes, I think you are pushing it!

Just my opinion though,
 
jnbettes said:
What is LP?  You gave a few examples that would not be included in the dry weight.....battery, LP, anything else?

LP = Liquid Propane. Usually our TT's have twin tanks.
Also be sure to check tongue weight. A TT the size you looking at will need a WDH (weight Distribution Hitch)
The factory hitch isnt rated for weights that high. It's in the link I posted.
 
Get that term "dry weight" out of your vocabulary before going any further.  It's meaningless....and may not even include the A/C, awning, tanks and propane, water, etc etc.  It also won't include the up to 100 lbs of hitch you'll need to pull the thing.  The ideal scenario would be having the trailer loaded up to the gills ready to camp, and put it on a commercial scale.  Since that usually isn't practical, use GROSS weight. 

There are "half ton" (ie 1500, F150 class) trucks that can be configured to tow north of 10K lbs.  That said, I think if you're looking at a trailer that grosses in the neighborhood of 8000 lbs, you're getting into that gray area between 1500 and 2500 trucks.  I have a 30' trailer that grosses at just a tick under 8K.  I tow it with a 2014 Ram 2500 Cummins diesel, and it pulls like a dream and the truck barely knows it's back there.  Then again, I tow exclusively in very high elevations up long steep grades.  Is my setup overkill?  Possibly....but I used to pull it with an older F250, which had about the same capabilities as a newer F150....and there were times it got a bit white knuckle.  That doesn't happen with the new truck.

Here's the thing.....it's not all about weight.  Remember if you're towing a 30' or so trailer, it's a giant sail. Can your half ton truck get the load moving?  Of course.  Can it control the load if something bad or unexpected happens?  Say you get a sudden 30 + mph sidewind gust.  Or say you lose your trailer brakes coming down a steep grade (a blown fuse from reality)....can you stop the load behind you?  How about if a tire on the trailer blows?  And is it really good to run your equipment near it's maximum capacity for extended periods of time?  Your engine may have a red line of 6000 RPM....is it smart to let it run there for hours on end?  You get the picture.

Honestly, there are a lot of folks towing trailers like you're contemplating with half tons, and doing it successfully.  Me personally, I like to set the cruise at 55, crank up Classic Vinyl on XM, and just enjoy the ride with minimal drama.  Having way more truck than I need enables that.  Nothing is worse than getting to your destination a nervous wreck after 5 hours of white knuckles because the trailer was walking your truck all over the highway because it turns out the weather man was wrong about the wind. 

You wanted opinions, so here's mine....especially for someone with minimal experience towing a travel trailer.....Bigger truck or smaller trailer.  JMHO of course....not all will agree.  Your call.

 
The loaded weight of the trailer is always much higher than you can imagine. If not on the first trip, it will be after 3-4 more. You will continuously add gear, both for pleasure (lawn chairs, BBQ, outdoor games, etc) and need (hand tools, extra hoses, extension cords, etc). And there is always at least some water on board, several gallons in the heater and lines, 10-20 gallons on the tanks, etc.

You really need to looking at a trailer GVWR of no more than 7500 lbs, which probably means a dry weight of 6000 or less.
 
You also mentioned a family of five.....every soul you load into the truck beyond the 154 lbs driver reduces the truck's capability.  Deduct whatever Fido weighs if he's coming along.  Easy to load in 200 lbs of firewood....And don't think those two cases of beer come along for free either, and if you're meeting up with friends and want to sleep 9, you'll need them. 

No free lunch, unfortunately.  And yes, deduct the weight of lunch.  ;)
 
Frizlefrak said:
You also mentioned a family of five.....every soul you load into the truck beyond the 154 lbs driver reduces the truck's capability.
154 pound driver.........
That's what this driver's left leg weighs!
 
Gary RV Roamer said:
The loaded weight of the trailer is always much higher than you can imagine. If not on the first trip, it will be after 3-4 more. You will continuously add gear, both for pleasure (lawn chairs, BBQ, outdoor games, etc) and need (hand tools, extra hoses, extension cords, etc). And there is always at least some water on board, several gallons in the heater and lines, 10-20 gallons on the tanks, etc.

So true! My trailer as as loaded for normal camping is really pushing the envelope for weights, but we don't go far with it. We are camphosting at the time. My wife was pulling double-duty for a while, as there wasn't anybody to do the cabin cleaning host position. The park found someone to take that position. We had the "site of choice", but the 5th wheel the incoming host has wouldn't fit on the other site. We moved to the other site as we would fit and gave our site to them. We have been camphosting since March 1st and have brought more stuff from the S&B and cramed it in the TT. Hooking up and pulling it around two loops to get into the new site showed us both how much weight adds up quickly. The TT is still probably under the GVWR, but there is no way I would pull it down the road loaded like that.
 
Man you guys got me thinking!!!  90% of the time, I would feel good about the choice I have settled on, the lighter of the two TT's I'm currently looking at or anything less.  As I live in the southest, I would avoid most of the inclines/declines as I would keep it local or drive down to Florida.  I live right on Lake Lanier which is north of Atlanta.  For the next few years it would not be hard to be aware of the weight issues and keep it simple for local travel or down the the gulf. 

HOWEVER!!!  My wife lives in Montana and we are actually looking to do something we would not do very often which is drive out there, then to Arizona, then back home.  I'm not sure I care to do a white knuckle drive into Park City or through some of the other passes.  I did this pulling a car into Jackson Hole once and I am also started crying!  :) 

I can still do our tour of the states but would drive the mini-van and leave the TT at home.  Or I can go buy a new truck or I can buy a smaller TT.  I think I want at least the size we're looking at and would just have to keep it local or pack lite and avoid the mountain passes altogether.  Second option would be to wait and buy a bigger truck and then buy the TT we want.  I don't want to buy a smaller one b/c then I may lose the excitement of some of my city slicker kids and wife.  If it's not comfortable, they won't want to do it, I'm convinced!! 

And my kids are 3, 5 and 8 and are skinny as can be as well as the wife.  I actually come in around 200.  :)
 
Frizlefrak said:
Get that term "dry weight" out of your vocabulary before going any further.  It's meaningless....and may not even include the A/C, awning, tanks and propane, water, etc etc.  It also won't include the up to 100 lbs of hitch you'll need to pull the thing.  The ideal scenario would be having the trailer loaded up to the gills ready to camp, and put it on a commercial scale.  Since that usually isn't practical, use GROSS weight. 

There are "half ton" (ie 1500, F150 class) trucks that can be configured to tow north of 10K lbs.  That said, I think if you're looking at a trailer that grosses in the neighborhood of 8000 lbs, you're getting into that gray area between 1500 and 2500 trucks.  I have a 30' trailer that grosses at just a tick under 8K.  I tow it with a 2014 Ram 2500 Cummins diesel, and it pulls like a dream and the truck barely knows it's back there.  Then again, I tow exclusively in very high elevations up long steep grades.  Is my setup overkill?  Possibly....but I used to pull it with an older F250, which had about the same capabilities as a newer F150....and there were times it got a bit white knuckle.  That doesn't happen with the new truck.

Here's the thing.....it's not all about weight.  Remember if you're towing a 30' or so trailer, it's a giant sail. Can your half ton truck get the load moving?  Of course.  Can it control the load if something bad or unexpected happens?  Say you get a sudden 30 + mph sidewind gust.  Or say you lose your trailer brakes coming down a steep grade (a blown fuse from reality)....can you stop the load behind you?  How about if a tire on the trailer blows?  And is it really good to run your equipment near it's maximum capacity for extended periods of time?  Your engine may have a red line of 6000 RPM....is it smart to let it run there for hours on end?  You get the picture.

Honestly, there are a lot of folks towing trailers like you're contemplating with half tons, and doing it successfully.  Me personally, I like to set the cruise at 55, crank up Classic Vinyl on XM, and just enjoy the ride with minimal drama.  Having way more truck than I need enables that.  Nothing is worse than getting to your destination a nervous wreck after 5 hours of white knuckles because the trailer was walking your truck all over the highway because it turns out the weather man was wrong about the wind. 

You wanted opinions, so here's mine....especially for someone with minimal experience towing a travel trailer.....Bigger truck or smaller trailer.  JMHO of course....not all will agree.  Your call.

I like this scenario, more truck than you need! 
 
jnbettes said:
Or I can go buy a new truck or I can buy a smaller TT.
Considering your truck is still new my opinion would be to consider the latter. There are plenty of lightweight TTs in the 24'-26' range that could easily accommodate your family without taking the truck to close to or above its limit. As much as you think you might use the TT you WILL use your truck daily. You might regret the additional cost of a new truck, and the loss of MPG, for a vehicle that is not towing over 90% of the time.




Michael


 
Tinmania said:
Considering your truck is still new my opinion would be to consider the latter. There are plenty of lightweight TTs in the 24'-26' range that could easily accommodate your family without taking the truck to close to or above its limit. As much as you think you might use the TT you WILL use your truck daily. You might regret the additional cost of a new truck, and the loss of MPG, for a vehicle that is not towing over 90% of the time.

Michael

I agree.  Since your truck is still young, you'll take a beating on depreciation trading it.  Going with a lighter and smaller trailer probably makes more sense.  You'd likely be OK in the flatlands with the F150 and big trailer towing exclusively in low elevations and in the flat lands.  But if you plan to travel in the Mountain West.....
 
So my wife ran into a friend and they said they had a hyrbrid.  So started looking at those.  After reviewing a bit today I found the X254 2015 JAY FEATHER ULTRA LITE.  I know I'm not supposed to consider dry weight, but this one is 4500 dry. 

I lose a couch but driving into Jackson Hole may be possible with this set up??  Perhaps still scary but I would only do something like this once every 2-3 years.

Am I still being ambitious? 

Loaded truck - 5640 LBs
Loaded TT - 4500 + 1500 = 6000

Ford specs says I can haul 8000 lbs.  I'm not 1500 under easy.  Only way I'm touching 1500 is if all 3 tanks are full.  That would be close to 1000 lbs right there.  And I won't be driving through a mountain pass with that happening. 

 
 
jnbettes said:
So my wife ran into a friend and they said they had a hyrbrid.  So started looking at those.  After reviewing a bit today I found the X254 2015 JAY FEATHER ULTRA LITE.  I know I'm not supposed to consider dry weight, but this one is 4500 dry. 

I lose a couch but driving into Jackson Hole may be possible with this set up??  Perhaps still scary but I would only do something like this once every 2-3 years.

Am I still being ambitious? 

Loaded truck - 5640 LBs
Loaded TT - 4500 + 1500 = 6000

Ford specs says I can haul 8000 lbs.  I'm not 1500 under easy.  Only way I'm touching 1500 is if all 3 tanks are full.  That would be close to 1000 lbs right there.  And I won't be driving through a mountain pass with that happening. 
There are pros and cons with hybrids.  One "con" is you may not be able to use it in certain "bear country" campgrounds.  Some CGs require hard sided campers only.  Just be aware of this possible restriction.
 

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