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Author Topic: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.  (Read 7039 times)

8Muddypaws

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Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« on: September 07, 2015, 10:07:32 AM »


The thing that millions of people take umbrage about in Windows 10 are the anti-privacy features.  There are too many of them to enumerate here.

Well, it just got serious because Microsoft is rolling those 'features' out to all versions of 7 & 8.  Even worse, the new features disregard any previous privacy settings and begin key logging, recording everything you type.

You can go into the new control panel settings and manually disable these features or un-install and hide the 4 updates as shown in this article.  http://www.itwire.com/opinion-and-analysis/open-sauce/69248-windows-10-snooping-comes-to-windows-7-and-8  There are many more such articles on tech forums.

Key logging is by far the worst idea anyone could ever allow on their computer.  Passwords, credit card numbers, logon ID's?  All being sent to a 'secure' server somewhere.

My statement regarding security: 'there is no security this side of the grave'.  Somebody will eventually hack into the server and gain access to petabytes of passwords, credit cards, etc.

I was in a security class in Chicago in the mid '90s where 'they' boasted that their security platform was impenetrable.  I sat in the back of the room and not only got into it in less than 5 minutes I changed their splash screen to a SF 49'ers logo.  I made it look like one of their employees did it but told them about it after a few minutes of hilarity.  They offered me a job in Boston, which I didn't accept.  At the time I was the technical vice president of the national users group and may have known their systems better than most.   ;)
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oldme

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8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2015, 01:12:37 PM »
Thanks oldme.  The Forbes article was the first one I found yesterday and actually shows you how to uninstall and hide these 4 updates.  That might come in handy for the non techies.
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nvrver

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2015, 04:21:26 PM »
I see KB3068708 IAed 06/11/15 (which replaces KB3022345) & KB3022345 IAed 05/13/15 are installed the other two are not.  Should I remove both of these.  I have my updates on my Windows 7 setup for me to review before they are installed so I will watch for KB3075249 &
KB3080149.  I copied the info from the Forbs article thanks for the good info.   IAed is short for installed.  Dick nvrver

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JerArdra

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #4 on: September 07, 2015, 06:37:08 PM »
My WIN 7 update installed KB3068708 way back on 6/11/15.  BTW, it was rated IMPORTANT so I installed it.  I did uninstall it today and later today checked for new updates and, there it was again, so I re-installed it.  Probably because it was rated IMPORTANT.

I always trusted Microsoft so on 9/3 when the following 6 updates (rated OPTIONAL) appeared. I updated all 6 to my WIN 7.  Some of these are listed as BAD in the Forbes article.

KB3075249
KB3077715
KB3078667
KB3080149
KB3083324
KB3082627

After reading the info here I decided to uninstall all 6 of them.  I rechecked for updates later and the 6 of them did NOT reappear for installation like the IMPORTANT update, described in the first sentence above, did.  Probably because these 6 were only rated as OPTIONAL.

BTW, I did change my choice of updating to tell me when I have updates but let me choose when to download and install them.

Thanks for pointing  this "data collection" to me.

JerryF

JerryF  ;D  ;D

rskrbina

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #5 on: September 07, 2015, 06:53:52 PM »
Following. . Thanks for the information.
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8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #6 on: September 07, 2015, 07:08:00 PM »
I think if you right click on the download an select Hide from the drop down menu it will not download again, and not install.  I said think because I have not fired up a W7 system and tested it yet.
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Gregg

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #7 on: September 07, 2015, 07:56:26 PM »
Come on Microsoft.....I liked Windows 10 and began to think they have made a turn to the better.  Then I read this post. 
Make everyday a good day.
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oldme

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #8 on: September 07, 2015, 08:10:20 PM »
If I were on a metered internet connection I may be more worried.
Still I hate a company watching my every move.

Anything you take out MS will try to sneak back.

In W10 you can go into settings and set it to "network metered" and you will only get the
most important updates, supposedly. 


Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #9 on: September 07, 2015, 08:13:57 PM »
Microsoft is collecting anonymous usage data to better understand how people use Windows so they can improve it.  They're not stealing your credit card numbers or passwords.  This is no different than Google, Facebook, Yahoo, etc. have been doing for years.
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Larry N.

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #10 on: September 07, 2015, 08:38:30 PM »
Microsoft is collecting anonymous usage data to better understand how people use Windows so they can improve it.  They're not stealing your credit card numbers or passwords.  This is no different than Google, Facebook, Yahoo, etc. have been doing for years.

And that makes it OK?
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Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #11 on: September 07, 2015, 08:46:06 PM »
And that makes it OK?

Yes, if it's used to improve the product.  It's no secret how to opt out of the data collection, as the KB items have all been identified, so it's your choice.  Participate or be paranoid :)

You might want to read this article that explains that this is part of the Customer Experience Improvement Program that you had to agree to join.  If you're not part of the CEIP, then the data won't be collected.
« Last Edit: September 07, 2015, 08:51:18 PM by Ned »
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Tom Hoffman

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #12 on: September 07, 2015, 10:18:56 PM »
PARANOIA   -    I have an advanced degree in procrastination and another one in paranoia.

I know because my house and TT are lined with aluminum foil...
Wife said to me. "What cha doin' today?"  "Nothin'" says I.  "Ya did that yestiday!" Says she.  "I didn't get done!" says I

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8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #13 on: September 07, 2015, 10:46:18 PM »
It is the nature of key loggers to log every key.   Even if it's encrypted before transmission at some point the data is unencrypted so Microsoft can decide what to store in their database.  A character stream that contains a credit card number is easily identified, and usually surrounded by name, address, security code, expiration date etc.

The others do not use key loggers, only unencrypted web traffic.  All financial transactions should be encrypted and as such are of no use to them.  I don't care if they know I've been looking for a certain PEX connector and it appears on every page I load for weeks. (Real example BTW)

So call me paranoid, I do not want a key logger running on any machine of mine.
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Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2015, 06:36:40 AM »
If you're really that concerned, install WireShark and spend a few hours seeing exactly what is being sent.  The servers are know so you can filter the data to just the packets that are going to MS.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
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BinaryBob

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #15 on: September 08, 2015, 06:39:06 AM »
Muddy, you might be paranoid, but call me skeptical.
"Customer Experience Improvement Program"... seriously? Microsoft? How much are they investing to assure my "customer experience."
Perhaps I'm too binary... Either the platform works or it doesn't. If it doesn't, fix it. Where I navigate shouldn't be part of the scenario.
What adds to my skepticism is the layering of BS nerd-speak...
These updates “add telemetry points to the User Account Control (UAC) feature to collect information on elevations that come from low integrity levels,”
Oh.. sure... that certainly explains it.... I feel much better.
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Larry N.

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #16 on: September 08, 2015, 08:36:01 AM »
Quote
You might want to read this article that explains that this is part of the Customer Experience Improvement Program that you had to agree to join.  If you're not part of the CEIP, then the data won't be collected.

Sorry, but I don't trust Microsoft. I followed all their hijinks during and after their antitrust proceedings, and there was nothing there to inspire confidence. Rather it indicated that they'd lie whenever it seemed to make them more money or get them more control. There's a big difference between collecting data from web browsing and collecting it from inside your machine itself, where they have no business being unless you invite them.

Actually, according to what I've read, if you're not part of the CEIP, then these won't be installed. That's how data won't be collected.
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SeilerBird

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #17 on: September 08, 2015, 08:39:49 AM »
Microsoft can track me and log all my keystrokes. No problem. I only use my Windows laptop when I am working on my photos once a month. It takes me about thirty minutes. Then I open up Picasa and upload the photos. They cannot get much information from that. The rest of the time I use my Chromebook. Sure Google does keep track of me but I don't feel Google is nearly as evil as Microsoft.

Interesting side note, I lost my virginity I think. I finally got a "virus" or some malware, I don't know which but I don't think it was either. I sold my iPhone and I needed help getting my iCloud password so I called Apple Customer Service. We had a really crappy connection and she directed me to iforgot.apple.com to retrieve my password. I did not hear the dot between iforgot and apple and that site immediately started putting messages on the screen telling me I now had a virus. If I clicked the cancel button a different screen appeared telling me the same thing. Then a voice comes on the computer telling me I have a virus and I need to call a phone number to get rid of the virus. I just laughed at it and shut the machine off and rebooted and went to the right web address and changed my password. You can't get a virus with Chromebook so I guess that might qualify as malware but there are no residual effects from that encounter.
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8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #18 on: September 08, 2015, 10:24:54 AM »
Tom,

That was a prime example of a malicious website.  If you had clicked on anything they wanted you to it would have installed bad stuff on your computer.  I've found that the best thing to do in those cases is to enter task manager (ctl-alt-del) and kill the browser.

Ned,

Microsoft collecting data may be benign.  But it has to be stored somewhere, both on the local machine and their servers.  Such a data store creates a place where someone could  mine every single keystroke made on that computer.  That makes cracking into that data store very attractive to criminals, I'll bet they're already working on it.

I am part of the CEIP.  Or I was until they started keylogging.  I have also been a Windows Insider for several years, since before W8 was released.

The other thing that's happening is that Microsoft's intrusion is causing video playback problems on lots of computers because it takes way too much resource.  I've found dozens of posts on tech forums where removing these 'new features' cures the problem.

If you're on a cellular connection how much are you willing to pay for data Microsoft wants?

Bob,

The elevation they're speaking of is where a program elevates itself to gain access to functions and areas it 'needs'.  Similar to 'Run as Administrator'.  I discovered that Google does this when a normal user attempts to install Chrome.  It elevates itself to Administrator.  (I've had to remove Chrome more often than anything else).
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Irover

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #19 on: September 08, 2015, 10:43:36 AM »
 ;D ;D Exactly why I followed some hopefully good advice! I am use Linux Mint Mate 17.2 and using Mozilla and DuckDuckGo as a search engine! May not be a total cure but some say it safer from viruses and malware.    :D
Don't ever give up!! keep pushing toward the goal!!!
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SeilerBird

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #20 on: September 08, 2015, 10:45:07 AM »
That was a prime example of a malicious website.  If you had clicked on anything they wanted you to it would have installed bad stuff on your computer.  I've found that the best thing to do in those cases is to enter task manager (ctl-alt-del) and kill the browser.
My computer is a Chromebook. There is no task manager and there is no chance they could have hurt anything no matter what I clicked on. You can't install things on a Chromebook.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
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dhyravy

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #21 on: September 08, 2015, 11:07:13 AM »
After 25 years of Windows, I now run a MAC.  I have Win7 on a virtual machine on the MAC for some work things that HAVE to use Windows.  Yes they are expensive but I have none of these problems and as an added "bonus" the MacBook Pro is the worlds fastest Windows machine for the last 4 or 5 years running out of the virtual machine.  I said I would never go MAC for years, but I work with Linux SW for my job and it is so much easier being able to work with those files without extra SW and being able to tar something back up which Windows can't do.  In the almost 3 years I've had the MacBook it has been shut down twice and rebooted only when needed for an update.
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JerArdra

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #22 on: September 08, 2015, 01:03:17 PM »
Is there any way we can tell if we agreed to CEIP?  I ask because, if so, I want to UNAGREE so we are NOT tracked by Microsoft.

Yea...I just found the answer with regard to WIN 7 which is...

To view or change the Windows CEIP settings on a computer running WIN 7 do this.  Click start, select control panel, and click the Action center.  In the left pane click Change Action Center Settings.  Under Related settings you can choose NOT to join the Customer Experience Improvement Program.

BTW,  I also found for those of use that use Microsoft word it also may have put you into the CEIP data collection.  I have Microsoft Office 2010 and here is how it works.  To check if you are in or out of CEIP do this.  Open any office file and then click the FILE tab (UL corner).  Then click Options.  Then click Trust Center.  Then click Trust Center Settings.  Then click Privacy Options and you are at the screen where you can opt in or opt out of CEIS.

JerryF

PS,  Both of our computers were, but are not now, opted into CEIS via WIN 7 and I was not opted into CEIS via Microsoft word 2010.  I am really pleased to be opted out of CEIS via my Win 7!!!
« Last Edit: September 08, 2015, 02:41:04 PM by JerArdra »
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ArdraF

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #23 on: September 08, 2015, 02:50:22 PM »
This whole discussion reminds me of something.  Two weeks ago we had breakfast with friends.  She raved about some pants she bought so I went to their web site when I got home.  Within ten minutes I was getting popup ads from that site and I'm STILL getting them every time I go on the internet.  This is enhancing my experience??  I think not.  It's extremely annoying and intrusive, especially when I'm trying to find an obituary.  I now would not buy those pants on general principle!

ArdraF
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8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #24 on: September 08, 2015, 03:51:24 PM »
Ardra,

That's just targeted ads based upon your web browsing history.  That's one of Google and Yahoo's main sources of revenue.  And the business Microsoft wants to take away from them.  once in a while it actually pops up something useful.  Maybe 1:1000 times.   ;). But if I looked for blue widgets yesterday why would they assume I'm still looking for blue widgets today.

BTW, Apple has had their share of privacy issues too. Particularly in relation to location services and the storing (on an Apple server) of every location you've ever visited, when you were there, and for how long.  If I remember right they disabled the server but the data is stored on the local device for x days. 

It strikes me as funny that when I start the calculator on my iPhone/pad/iPod it requests access to my location.  Why would a calculator care?

Nothing to hide in that regard, but it is disturbing that we are so complacent about what few shreds of privacy remain.
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SeilerBird

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #25 on: September 08, 2015, 04:19:00 PM »
It strikes me as funny that when I start the calculator on my iPhone/pad/iPod it requests access to my location.  Why would a calculator care?
Because it wants to know if you are going to use the metric system or the Imperial system ::)
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
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Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #26 on: September 08, 2015, 04:30:28 PM »
You can avoid a lot of those extraneous ads by not allowing third party cookies in your browser.  There is no legitimate need for those other than for tracking for advertising purposes.  Also, use a script blocker like NoScript or uBlock Origin and only enable scripting for those sites that you decide on.  Either of those addons (don't install both) will also do a very good job of automatically blocking known advertising scripts and images and actually makes a noticeable difference in page loading times, sometimes as much as 3 or 4 times faster.  Of course, you can disable the blocking the rvforum.net so you support our sponsors :)
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8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #27 on: September 09, 2015, 11:38:08 AM »
This just in!  http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/spybot_anti_beacon_for_windows_10.html

A no muss, no fuss way of disabling the windows 'features' only MS likes.

I trust spybot products explicitly.  I can't say that for any of the other 'anti-beacon' apps on MajorGeeks. 

On edit:

This only applies to Windows 10, not Windows 7.  So it doesn't belong in this thread.
« Last Edit: September 09, 2015, 07:47:40 PM by 8Muddypaws »
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Jerrygroah

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #28 on: September 09, 2015, 01:40:03 PM »
Hello Jerry F. Would you be so kind as to list the release dates of the updates that were posted on your response a few days ago? I cannot find them on my PC.
They are; KB3075249
KB3077715
KB3078667
KB3080149
KB3083324
KB3082627
Thank you, Jerrygroah
Jerry Groah
Mims, Florida

ArdraF

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #29 on: September 09, 2015, 01:44:35 PM »
Thanks, Ned.  I upped my level of blocking by one click so we'll see if that improves it.  Sure wouldn't want to block the RV Forum!!!  :o

ArdraF
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BruceinFL

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #30 on: September 10, 2015, 08:29:11 AM »
This only applies to Windows 10, not Windows 7.  So it doesn't belong in this thread.

Yes it does. It answered a question I had when reading this thread. :)
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8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #31 on: September 10, 2015, 11:06:43 AM »
Thanks.

I can stop,hanging my head in shame.   ;)
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Larry N.

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #32 on: September 10, 2015, 12:50:03 PM »
Sorry, but I don't trust Microsoft. I followed all their hijinks during and after their antitrust proceedings, and there was nothing there to inspire confidence. Rather it indicated that they'd lie whenever it seemed to make them more money or get them more control. There's a big difference between collecting data from web browsing and collecting it from inside your machine itself, where they have no business being unless you invite them.

Actually, according to what I've read, if you're not part of the CEIP, then these won't be installed. That's how data won't be collected.

Apparently MS wants everyone to have Win 10, whether they want it or not: http://tech.slashdot.org/story/15/09/10/148238/microsoft-is-downloading-windows-10-without-asking

It's a good thing I have auto-update disabled. I don't need more intrusion. It's stuff like this, among other things, that cause me to not trust MS.
Larry and Mary Ann N.
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JerArdra

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #33 on: September 10, 2015, 02:18:28 PM »
Jerry Groah,

All 6 of the updates you listed in your post were updated to my computer on 9/3/2015.

Try this to see your updates.  Go to Windows update, Click on View Update History.    Look at the right most column.  If you click on the very top of the column it will put your updates in a sequence from most recent to oldest.  In this way you can see if you have these recent updates.

JerryF
JerryF  ;D  ;D

JerArdra

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #34 on: September 10, 2015, 02:22:56 PM »
Larry N,

By disabling  auto update do you mean in the Control Panel?  I ask because I already did this and did not want to miss something.

JerryF
« Last Edit: September 10, 2015, 02:29:38 PM by JerArdra »
JerryF  ;D  ;D

Larry N.

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #35 on: September 10, 2015, 03:16:52 PM »
Larry N,

By disabling  auto update do you mean in the Control Panel?  I ask because I already did this and did not want to miss something.

JerryF

That's the place, Jerry.
Larry and Mary Ann N.
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JerArdra

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #36 on: September 12, 2015, 01:34:20 PM »
For WIN 7 here is an easy way to view and/or opt in or out of CEIP.

Go to Control Panel and click on Action Center.  Then in the left pane click Action Center Settings and go to bottom of that page and click Customer Experience Improvement Program (CEIP).  Now you can and make your choice to opt in or out.

JerryF
« Last Edit: September 12, 2015, 01:37:04 PM by JerArdra »
JerryF  ;D  ;D

Jerrygroah

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #37 on: September 12, 2015, 02:33:55 PM »
Thanks for the info Jerry7f.
Jerry Groah
Jerry Groah
Mims, Florida

Alfa38User

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #38 on: September 16, 2015, 10:40:48 AM »
This just in!  http://www.majorgeeks.com/files/details/spybot_anti_beacon_for_windows_10.html

A no muss, no fuss way of disabling the windows 'features' only MS likes.

I trust spybot products explicitly.  I can't say that for any of the other 'anti-beacon' apps on MajorGeeks. 

On edit:

This only applies to Windows 10, not Windows 7. So it doesn't belong in this thread.

No longer true!! The latest version (V1.4) downloadable directly from Spybot handles W10, W8, W7 and is available here:

https://forums.spybot.info/downloads.php?id=55
« Last Edit: September 16, 2015, 10:49:49 AM by Alfa38User »
Stu
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8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #39 on: September 16, 2015, 04:29:26 PM »
Let me know if it works.  Several users have reported that there is a bug in SpyBots code that stops the changes from taking effect.
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Alfa38User

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #40 on: September 16, 2015, 09:34:30 PM »
Let me know if it works.  Several users have reported that there is a bug in SpyBots code that stops the changes from taking effect.

It seems to do exactly as the V1.3 did but I am not sure how to check it out without dumping the appropriate register entries and examining them!! Is there still a register editor available in win10?? Even then, Microsoft should be very capable of simply ignoring them should they choose to....
Stu
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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #41 on: September 17, 2015, 08:10:10 AM »
Regedit works the same as always in Windows 10, but use it only if you know the risks.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
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2007 GMC Canyon

8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #42 on: September 17, 2015, 11:35:33 AM »
Or as an alternative you could go to system privacy settings and look at the individual items should now be disabled. 

I just updated one of my remaining W7 systems last night and haven't had time to futz with it.  Maybe this afternoon.
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JerArdra

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #43 on: September 17, 2015, 01:22:45 PM »
Anyone,

Just wonderin' about this?  I have a new unknown folder that appeared on my C:\ drive.

This folder is $windows.*BT but where I put the * there really is an S like symbol turned 90 degrees to the right. Sorry no keyboard symbol for that character.

In this folder there are 9 other folders and 5 files one of which is setup.exe (79KB).  When I click on setup.exe I get a screen showing the new WIN10 Logo and a little further below that is the word INSTALL.  No I did not click on install because I m not yet ready for WIN10.

Is this the way Microsoft sent any of you folks their free version of WIN 10??

JerryF
JerryF  ;D  ;D

8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #44 on: September 17, 2015, 02:28:54 PM »
Yup.  That's exactly what it is.  But the normal way to install is via the windows logo in your system tray.  It'll work either way though.
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Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #45 on: September 17, 2015, 02:33:41 PM »
That's the Windows 10 update.  The easiest way is as 8Muddypaws (your mother had a funny sense of humor in names) is via the icon in the system tray when you're ready.  After the update, there will be a Windows.old folder there as well, and that will contain your previous Windows version if you decide to roll back in the first 30 days.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
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2007 GMC Canyon

Alfa38User

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #46 on: September 17, 2015, 04:00:54 PM »
Quote
After the update, there will be a Windows.old folder there as well, and that will contain your previous Windows version if you decide to roll back in the first 30 days.

....And can that folder simply be deleted once satisfied with W10? My preference has always been a clean install but that "FREE" part got to me. That and I don't want the hassle of re-installing the software I already have and use!!
 
Stu
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Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #47 on: September 17, 2015, 04:17:38 PM »
Once you're sure you're not going back, or 30 days has elapsed, you can delete both of those folders and regain the disk space.

I know of many successful upgrades that kept all of the previous software intact, including 2 of our computers, and only a very few that had problems.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
1997 Holiday Rambler Endeavor LE
2007 GMC Canyon

Tom Hoffman

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #48 on: September 17, 2015, 04:23:17 PM »
After reading all of this,  why is it that so many are willing to jump on the band wagon and willy-nilly install this NEW FREE W-10,  MS history is not really good when it comes to newer and bigger and better.  Can't seem to leave well enough alone for a while.

I guess I am just paranoid living in my aluminum foil lined house....
Wife said to me. "What cha doin' today?"  "Nothin'" says I.  "Ya did that yestiday!" Says she.  "I didn't get done!" says I

2003 F-350 Super Duty Lariat Dually 7.3 Diesel
2008 34' Sunny Brook, Brookside

Alfa38User

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #49 on: September 17, 2015, 04:35:19 PM »
After reading all of this,  why is it that so many are willing to jump on the band wagon and willy-nilly install this NEW FREE W-10,  MS history is not really good when it comes to newer and bigger and better.  Can't seem to leave well enough alone for a while.

I guess I am just paranoid living in my aluminum foil lined house....

Not sure about this willy-nilly stuff but I have been using Windows since if first came out. I have also used Apple DOS, Microsoft DOS, a bit of Linux and a couple of others. My judgement is that Microsoft has done a really good job this time for my uses of it with the possible exception of the data extortion that may be happening. I did not just "jump into W10" without a lot of forethought. The "FREE' only caught my attention and curiosity. I paid for many of the other versions or had them preinstalled on new 'puters I had bought.

Perhaps just a bit paranoid... but the good news is that heavier tinfoil is now readily available.... Just my 2 cents...
Stu
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8Muddypaws

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #50 on: September 17, 2015, 07:54:34 PM »
Some of us like to live 'on the bleeding edge'.

I'm a Windows insider (beta tester) and am already gearing up to test the first major update to W10.  What do I get out of this?  I get to tell MS what they've done wrong before everyone else.  (sometimes, like with the start menu in W8, they don't listen)

I really like W10.  So far I have not found a program or device I can't get to work in it except for a USB to serial adapter that won't  work because it's a counterfeit chip.

Mostly it's just fun.
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Tom Hoffman

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #51 on: September 17, 2015, 08:18:54 PM »
I guess I shot myself in the foot, when I made my blanket statement regarding W-10.  The OS that was ticking over in the back of my paranoid mind was "VISTA"  my wife had it on a new Lap Top and it was a nightmare for her.

Guess I'd better order that NEW heavy duty super duper 28 gage  Aluminum foil. ;D

Just have to pull the nice metal ear flaps down again ang back in my burrow. ;D ;D
Wife said to me. "What cha doin' today?"  "Nothin'" says I.  "Ya did that yestiday!" Says she.  "I didn't get done!" says I

2003 F-350 Super Duty Lariat Dually 7.3 Diesel
2008 34' Sunny Brook, Brookside

Tom_M

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #52 on: September 20, 2015, 10:01:45 AM »
I really like W10.  So far I have not found a program or device I can't get to work in it except for a USB to serial adapter that won't  work because it's a counterfeit chip.
I have my notebook set up to dual boot Win 7 and Win 10. I found that AutoCAD 2013 will not install on Win 10 so I have to run Win 7 when I need to use AutoCAD.
Tom
2005 Born Free 24 Rear Bath
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Alfa38User

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #53 on: September 23, 2015, 01:33:53 PM »
Once you're sure you're not going back, or 30 days has elapsed, you can delete both of those folders and regain the disk space.

I know of many successful upgrades that kept all of the previous software intact, including 2 of our computers, and only a very few that had problems.

Hmmm, was thinking of doing just that today for the files windows.old and windows.~BT but on this  upgraded Windows10 computer, I can no longer find them. They were there before!!

Is it possible that after the 30 days Windows came along and did it for me?? How nice, if so!!
« Last Edit: September 23, 2015, 01:35:36 PM by Alfa38User »
Stu
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Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #54 on: September 23, 2015, 01:36:20 PM »
You may have to turn on view hidden files, it may have been turned off.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
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2007 GMC Canyon

Just Lou

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #55 on: September 23, 2015, 02:19:01 PM »
I know of many successful upgrades that kept all of the previous software intact, including 2 of our computers, and only a very few that had problems.

Ned, is there any way to make use of the OLD (win-7)?  Like an alternate boot or maybe a virtual Machine?

 
'97 Bounder 34V (F53 w/tag), '99 Honda Accord EX

Alfa38User

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #56 on: September 23, 2015, 02:22:41 PM »
You may have to turn on view hidden files, it may have been turned off.

Good thought but... When I look up how to for W10, I find:
  •   Open Folder Options by clicking the Start button , clicking Control Panel, clicking Appearance and Personalization, and then clicking Folder Options.
But... On my Machine the only folder in the Control Panel  I find is Personalization and, no Folder Options within it. Any other way to get there?

On the other hand I did find these files while the previous notes on the subject here were new.



I have found several anomalies in the W10 web pages, when asking for W10 help ends up pointing to W7 info which no longer works in the new O/S.??? A work in progress maybe??
« Last Edit: September 23, 2015, 02:25:37 PM by Alfa38User »
Stu
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Alfa38User

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #57 on: September 23, 2015, 02:33:34 PM »
Ned, is there any way to make use of the OLD (win-7)?  Like an alternate boot or maybe a virtual Machine?

If you have an original disc you could probably install it on a new partition and use a Dual boot. Otherwise, doubtful!  Installing full image of W7, if you have one, on a new partition would also install all your other applications too and then you would have to figure out how to make into dual boot. Was easily done in previous versions but with W10....I don't know.

A friend of mine has done it but has not shared the details yet and he has access to all the original O/M files as he builds machines as a hobby.   JMHO.
« Last Edit: September 23, 2015, 02:48:29 PM by Alfa38User »
Stu
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Just Lou

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #58 on: September 23, 2015, 02:40:30 PM »
If you have an original disc you could probably install it on a new partition and use a Dual boot. Otherwise, doubtful!  Installing full image of W7, if you have one, on a new partition would also install all your other applications too and then you would have to figure out how to make into dual boot. Was easily done in previous versions but with W10....I don't know. A friend of mine has done it but has not shared the details yet.   JMHO.
I understand all that, but that wasn't my question.  I do not have a win-7 disk.

BTW - the answer to your previous question about changing folder options, is that when you get to the personalization page, you need to click on "tools" from the drop down menu.
'97 Bounder 34V (F53 w/tag), '99 Honda Accord EX

Alfa38User

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #59 on: September 23, 2015, 03:05:32 PM »
Just using the W10 version of your W7 back up to make a dual boot w7/W10 install is not possible. At least that is what I tried to say the first time!! Sorry!


That does it Just Lou. It is too bad the W10 Help I quoted did not say that!!! And and all View Hidden Files items are unchecked so the files show (as they always have done on my machines)!!

 Still no joy here!!
Stu
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Just Lou

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #60 on: September 23, 2015, 03:27:52 PM »
Just using the W10 version of your W7 back up to make a dual boot w7/W10 install is not possible. At least that is what I tried to say the first time!! Sorry!


That does it Just Lou. It is too bad the W10 Help I quoted did not say that!!! And and all View Hidden Files items are unchecked so the files show (as they always have done on my machines)!!

 Still no joy here!!
Do you think maybe Microsoft remotely erased them?  I wonder if they could be copied and renamed (before they get hidden or erased), and made usable as a restore option at a later date?
'97 Bounder 34V (F53 w/tag), '99 Honda Accord EX

Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #61 on: September 23, 2015, 03:48:53 PM »
Lou, no, those files can't be used to install Windows 7.  Dual boot is no longer recommended, and with UEFI and secure boot, probably won't work anyhow.  To run multiple operating systems, use VirtualBox (free) to create virtual machines and install as many different OSes as you like.  I have 4 flavors of Linux, 5 different Windows versions, and 6 other misc. OS machines.

The simplest way to set the folder options is open File Explorer (formerly called Windows Explorer) and click on the View tab.  All the view options are right there.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
1997 Holiday Rambler Endeavor LE
2007 GMC Canyon

Just Lou

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #62 on: September 23, 2015, 06:29:55 PM »
Ned, I do use VirtualBox, and have Win-XP and Win-2K on it for some old Draw programs that I still use, but I don't have a disk for a clean install of Win-7.

I have 1-desktop and 2-Laptops from Lenovo, but they all came with pre-installed Win-7, with a system restore partition on the HD.  No Install CD.
'97 Bounder 34V (F53 w/tag), '99 Honda Accord EX

Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #63 on: September 23, 2015, 07:59:09 PM »
Lou, those OEM installs aren't transferable to another computer.  Even if you restored a disk image to a different machine, Windows wouldn't activate.  The only way to get a fresh Windows 7 install is to buy a consumer version.  Windows 7 Home Premium is going for $90 at Amazon, about the best you'll find.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
1997 Holiday Rambler Endeavor LE
2007 GMC Canyon

Just Lou

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #64 on: September 24, 2015, 10:53:23 AM »
Thanks, Ned
I'll just leave the last laptop on Win-7 until I'm sure that everything I use will run on Win-10.  As of now, I don't see that anything much has changed affecting the simple stuff that I do.
'97 Bounder 34V (F53 w/tag), '99 Honda Accord EX

Ned

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Re: Coming soon to your windows 7 computers.
« Reply #65 on: September 24, 2015, 11:02:54 AM »
You have until July 29, 2016, to take advantage of the free upgrade to Windows 10 so no hurry.  Just be sure to keep your Windows 7 system updated.  Although you won't get any new features, you will still get security updates.
-- Ned -- Fulltimer 1997-2013
1997 Holiday Rambler Endeavor LE
2007 GMC Canyon

 

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