Registering Vehicle in SD

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Jeff said:
Joel


Except for corporations registered to do business in the state IL, WA, and SD require you to have a valid driver's license to register a vehicle in those states, or did while we resided in each.  MT requires the same, in this case the LLC is registered in MT.


State requirements regarding use of vehicles in their respective states make it pretty clear what the laws are.

Not all states require you to hold a license from that state in order to register a vehicle.  For example, here's a lift from the Orgeon DMV website:


In addition, a vehicle may qualify for Oregon registration even if the owner is not a resident of Oregon or domiciled in Oregon if one or more of the following applies:

The owner is a business that maintains a main office, branch office or warehouse facility in Oregon and operates motor vehicles in Oregon;
The vehicle is usually left in Oregon when the owner is away from Oregon, is used primarily for personal transportation in Oregon, is a private passenger vehicle or a vehicle having a loaded weight of less than 10,000 pounds, and is not a motor home or a camper; or
The vehicle is operated in intrastate transportation for compensation or profit for other than seasonal agricultural work.


If you'd like to see this quote in context, you can find it here: http://www.oregon.gov/odot/dmv/pages/driverid/residency.aspx

I have no idea how many states permit this but I sure it's not limited to OR.  Quite a few states have rules that state that vehicles that spend more than XX days in the state have to be registered there.  It's difficult to force people to register them if the Catch 22 is that the person owning the vehicle has to be a resident.

Here's a discussion about snowbird vehicle registration from a forum of The Villages, a major snowbird community in FL.  Several people responding to this thread say that they have vehicles registered both in FL and at their "other" home.  It doesn't sound like this is such big deal issue.  Here's the forum link: http://www.talkofthevillages.com/forums/villages-florida-non-villages-discussion-93/fl-car-registration-snowbirds-100923/

As another example, Maryland appears to handle the issue through what the State calls "dual registration": http://www.mva.maryland.gov/about-mva/info/27300/27300-07T.htm

As for the MT LLC, yes, my MH is registered in the name of my LLC which is a business entity, but it doesn't make the vehicle a commercial vehicle in the eyes of my insurance company.  So the net effect is that it is registered to me.

Note added later--Here's the FL motor vehicle code section dealing with vehicle registration.  Note that it says that the person registering the vehicle must have a drivers license issued by FL or another state:

320.02 Registration required; application for registration; forms.?
(1) Except as otherwise provided in this chapter, every owner or person in charge of a motor vehicle that is operated or driven on the roads of this state shall register the vehicle in this state. The owner or person in charge shall apply to the department or to its authorized agent for registration of each such vehicle on a form prescribed by the department. A registration is not required for any motor vehicle that is not operated on the roads of this state during the registration period.
(2)(a) The application for registration must include the street address of the owner?s permanent residence or the address of his or her permanent place of business and be accompanied by personal or business identification information. An individual applicant must provide a valid driver license or identification card issued by this state or another state or a valid passport. A business applicant must provide a federal employer identification number, if applicable, or verification that the business is authorized to conduct business in the state, or a Florida municipal or county business license or number.

The more I look into this the more I'm convinced that this is a pretty common situation.  Lots of people own properties in multiple states.
 
Hy guys Newby to this forum and this site reading all this I wonder how would I as an Ozzie fit in with this topic in regards to LLC  and different state registrations ,with an Ozzie and international licence and wanting to live full time for few years, but not stay in any state for long .want to see Usa and Canada for 6month central and south Americas for 8-9month and back to us for 6month which states would be best to register vehicle and all nesecery paper work including insurance inspections rego drivers licence and wothever I forgot thanks guys
 
johnfromoz said:
Hy guys Newby to this forum and this site reading all this I wonder how would I as an Ozzie fit in with this topic in regards to LLC  and different state registrations ,with an Ozzie and international licence and wanting to live full time for few years, but not stay in any state for long .want to see Usa and Canada for 6month central and south Americas for 8-9month and back to us for 6month which states would be best to register vehicle and all nesecery paper work including insurance inspections rego drivers licence and wothever I forgot thanks guys

I don't think there's anything stopping you from setting up a Montana LLC and registering your vehicles into it.  Although there are legal fees associated with setting it up, there are considerable savings since MT doesn't charge a percentage-of-value tax to register a vehicle.  Since you aren't planning this as a long term investment, trying to take advantage of those savings would be worthwhile IMO.

I don't know anything about obtaining insurance for a non-US resident, but I wouldn't be surprised if your existing insurance company had a corresponding US company that it deals with that might be able to help you out.
 
In recent years, some states in a quest for additional revenues, have challenged the MT LLC ownership method when the person behind the LLC is was not a MT resident. Some have been taken to court in their home state and lost the case which became very costly for them. I presume the giveaway was the fact that they left the vehicle with MT plates (ie garaged) in plain view and someone, perhaps out of jealousy, questioned/reported it. For someone from out of the country, this should never become a problem though. The Texas or SD plan just seems much easier and cheaper to deal with with no backlash as you are actually declaring a new domicile.

There are many Canadian snowbirds who own cars in Florida and they are registered and left there as well. Many obtained a temporary drivers license but many others have not and use their own Canadian issued licenses quite legally. The major problem with that temporary Florida permit is that it requires the holder to renew it yearly exactly on its anniversary and requires the person to be present on that exact date for testing etc. With many, this is not always feasible year after year. A friend of mine was told outright 6 years ago that to obtain insurance in FL he had to obtain and use that temporary license. This has since been proven false, so the various sources of information don't always have good information, including the State of Florida or County employees, unfortunately.
 
Alfa38User said:
In recent years, some states in a quest for additional revenues, have challenged the MT LLC ownership method when the person behind the LLC is was not a MT resident. Some have been taken to court in their home state and lost the case which became very costly for them. I presume the giveaway was the fact that they left the vehicle with MT plates (ie garaged) in plain view and someone, perhaps out of jealousy, questioned/reported it.

If your register a vehicle to a MT LLC and then keep in your home state in excess of the number of days per year specified in your state's vehicle regulations then you are violating the law.  Misusing a MT LLC by some people shouldn't overshadow the fact that there are plenty of full-timers and others for whom using an LLC is totally legal.
 
docj said:
If your register a vehicle to a MT LLC and then keep in your home state in excess of the number of days per year specified in your state's vehicle regulations then you are violating the law.  Misusing a MT LLC by some people shouldn't overshadow the fact that there are plenty of full-timers and others for whom using an LLC is totally legal.

Exactly!!! In opening an LLC like that, they have not declared domicile in MT and that rule (often 30 days) comes into effect in their domiciled state. The situation was perhaps made more obvious by the MT plates as it is a well known method.
 
South Dakota and Montana are great when make big purchase for tax breaks but that's about it. I live in Florida fulltime now and there is plenty of advantages.

There are obvious advantages to becoming a Florida resident. The first, and most well-known, is?Florida has no state income tax.
Full-time RV living in Florida has become a lifestyle choice for increasing numbers of modern-day nomads and Florida is a popular destination. Improvements in RV amenities and the scarcity of affordable housing are a few of the reasons that some people take their home to the open road permanently. Since home-schooling options have become more widely available, even families with young children can be full-time RV residents. Improvements in technology have made it possible for full-time RV residents to telecommute, pay bills, and stay in touch with friends and family while on the road.
How do you become a Florida Resident?
A lot of identity verification rules have been put in place since we hit the road, adding some additional hoops to getting a driver?s license in any state. Which means you need to start your process a month or so before getting your driver?s license to make sure you have everything you need.
Here?s the steps we recommend after going through the process ourselves:
 Get quotes for your health and auto insurance and check into registration fees, so there will be no surprises.
 Establish your new domicile address at least a month before you anticipate applying for your driver?s license or ID card. Do your research as to which is best for you ? rates for insurance (vehicle & health) can vary widely at different zip codes. Vehicle insurance rates are very reasonable in Okaloosa County.
 I recommend Good Sam Mail Service https://www.goodsammailservice.com/ in Florida. They?ve been in business for many years serving the cruising, RVing and traveler communities, and we?ve heard nothing but glowing recommendations. They were easy to work with, sign-up was handled all online, and they provided all of the forms and instructions. They quickly answered our questions, including verifying that you could use our new address for our businesses without needing any additional occupancy license. Very impressed with their high tech scanning solution that actually lets you see the outside of incoming mail as soon as it arrives, and for a small extra fee they will even open your mail and scan the contents on request!
 As with any mail forwarding service, you?ll need to fill out a Postal Form 1583 to authorize the service to forward mail to you. The form must be notarized, and you must send copies of 2 forms of identification for each person along with it.
 Make sure your SSN card shows your name exactly as you want it to appear on your license.
 Start changing your address with banks, credit cards and insurance companies.

Why Florida over other states?
- Very little red tape in Florida making it an easy transition.
- Some of the most beautiful RV Resorts in the country.
- The obvious, no state income tax.
- Driver?s license is good for 8 years plus it?s easy to renew online wherever you?re at.
- No annual vehicle inspections like Texas. This is big because you have to move your RV to the inspection station every year.
- In Florida you only need a Class E driver?s license for any size RV. In some states you?ll need a special non-commercial Class A or B driver?s license.
- Florida is highly regarded by a few RV Club?s for mail forwarding ? Florida has far more resources for mail forwarding. 
- No pension tax in Florida
- No astronomical fees for vehicle registration, Florida is very reasonable.


 
Google up Clay County South Dakota treasury office.

http://www.claycountysd.org/treasurersoffice.cfm

The lady who answers the phone is super nice and will tell you EXACTLY what to submit to get your SD registration.

I have registered 3 vehicles there and have never set foot in that state.
Clay county DOES NOT CARE where you live.

Easy online renewals with the tags sent to your mailing address.

Fees are low.....Nevada wanted $600 bucks to renew a 2014 F-150. SD $135 bucks.
No smog tests ever.
 
Jo

I would check with SD but I beleive you can register the RV in SD now IF your husband is the sole owner and he goes to SD within six months to obtain a SD DL.


Florida, SD, and TX are probably recommended more as a domicile than other states but I would still suggest to investigate them all.


Florida would be a long drive for someone who doesn't visit the SE regularly.


When we originally moved our domicile to SD we were allowed to register vehicles but had to appear in SD within six months to obtain SD driver's licenses.


We can renew our plates using a SD address and can renew a DL once by mail IF we have a campground receipt for a night in SD within the last twelve months. The second renewal requires showing up to prove you are still kicking (and to take a vision test). Also if you already own your RV and did not pay any sales tax in your previous state you will be required to pay the 4% SD use tax when you register. If you previously paid tax and have a receipt you receive credit for that tax.


Texas requires a driver's test for RVs over 26000 pounds and annual vehicle inspections if you are in state or upon re-entering Texas.


Many RVers create a MT LLC for the RV as a tax haven but if you use MT as your domicile they do have a personal income tax rate of 8% (IIRC) . The MT LLC is not recognized by many (most?) other states as a legal tax avoidance if you are domiciled outside MT.

Other issues can be the cost of vehicle insurance, availability and cost of health insurance, and wills and inheritance taxes to name a few.

As I said, do your research.
 
Jeff said:
Many RVers create a MT LLC for the RV as a tax haven but if you use MT as your domicile they do have a personal income tax rate of 8% (IIRC) . The MT LLC is not recognized by many (most?) other states as a legal tax avoidance if you are domiciled outside MT.

With all due respect this is a rather sweeping generalization of a rather complex topic.  If you choose to use a MT LLC you should be cognizant of the laws of the state you are domiciled in to determine if you are in compliance.  Irrespective of what is written in forums such at this, there are many very expensive Montana-registered RVs and boats in the US owned by people who do not live in MT.  As with any complex tax issue, advice from an expert is usually advisable.
 
Have any of you considered the benefits you already get from your home state? I have always paid my taxes in full and, frankly, have a very low opinion of those who cheat to avoid paying legitimate taxes. If you don't like paying the taxes, move and avoid them, but accept the reduced benefits if you choose to avoid the inconvenience.

Ernie
 
Gary RV Roamer said:
You won't need an LLC if your husband can establish himself in SD, e.g. obtain a legal address, get driving license, etc. There are SD law firms that will help him get set up, and he can then buy the RV and title it there, paying SD fees and taxes.  If you want the coach in both your names, it would be easiest if also got an SD driving license, but I don't think it is required by SD. Using an LLC might be a way to get around that - the SD attorney could advise on that aspect. What they cannot advise about is your MI tax situation.

Your potential issue is bringing the coach back to MI. If it's in the state 30 days, they are going to want it registered there, and since you would still be a MI resident, they have you over a barrel for the taxes as well. Can you leave the coach outside the state, except for brief periods? That might be sufficient. You probably need to consult a MI attorney or CPA on this, since the situation is not clear cut.

You said you need to maintain MI residency, but I'm not sure if you are using "residency" in a legal sense or just saying you need to physically reside in MI for a while longer. There are subtle differences.

What you say has a lot of merit and worthy consideration for the OP.  I do question the 30 day portion of your post, not because I disagree, as I have read that before.  Rather, I wonder how that can be enforced? Consider hypothetically the OP is legally domiciled in SD, but travel to and stay in Missouri for 30 day's plus whether to visit family, recreation etc. My point is many full timers have the luxury of staying in one state for longer periods if they choose, so does that mean they have to pay that state taxes, particularly if they move on and stay in other states for 30 plus days?  Just curious.
 
Gizmo


The problem is towing or parking a motorhome with SD plates with a car with MI plates. When we in WA it was a given state troopers were going to pull a rv/tow over if they displayed different plates and one was from WA.
 
Jeff said:
Gizmo


The problem is towing or parking a motorhome with SD plates with a car with MI plates. When we in WA it was a given state troopers were going to pull a rv/tow over if they displayed different plates and one was from WA.

OTOH, the general case of having vehicles with registration in two different states is not a big deal as long as you have your papers in order.  Our MH is registered in MT to our LLC and our CR-V is registered in SD where we have our domicile.  We've not been stopped because of this but maybe we've just been lucky.  However, we have gone back and forth across the US-Canada border several times and once we show the guards that we have the registrations and LLC paperwork all in order they don't have any further interest in the issue.
 
Jeff said:
Gizmo


Jeff, The problem is towing or parking a motorhome with SD plates with a car with MI plates. When we in WA it was a given state troopers were going to pull a rv/tow over if they displayed different plates and one was from WA.

That of course makes sense, I guess I was thinking they would register both vehicles in SD.  Registering only one is asking for trouble.
 
and once we show the guards that we have the registrations and LLC paperwork all in order they don't have any further interest in the issue.

They work for Home Land Security, "not there job"  now the IRS is a different story. Al Capone got away with murder, the IRS got him for tax evasion.

 
Tin man said:
and once we show the guards that we have the registrations and LLC paperwork all in order they don't have any further interest in the issue.

They work for Home Land Security, "not there job"  now the IRS is a different story. Al Capone got away with murder, the IRS got him for tax evasion.

The famous judge Learned Hand once wrote:

Any one may so arrange his affairs that his taxes shall be as low as possible; he is not bound to choose that pattern which will best pay the Treasury; there is not even a patriotic duty to increase one's taxes.

The use of a MT LLC to reduce taxes is a totally legal approach, as long as one abides by the law of the state in which one is domiciled.  If a person keeps such a  vehicle at his residence in another state, I agree that this may result in questions being raised. However, for full time RVers who have no physical home, it is quite easy to ensure that the MH doesn't spend more time in one's domicile state than the law will allow.  You may choose not to use such an approach and that is totally within your rights.
 
VallAndMo said:
Hi,
A little googling seems to indicate it's not: http://www.maine.gov/revenue/salesuse/salestax/salestax.html

Relevant part:


I'm not an expert either, but what Tin Man says makes perfect sense to me.

Cheers,
--
  Vall.

Clearly you are not an expert. What you googled has absolutely nothing to do with RV's.
 
Pointwithinacircle said:
During a discussion with the owner of my local RV dealership last week, he said I could go online and register as a corporation in Maine for $380.  He said that way I pay no sales tax on my RV and that the license fee is only $30 a year.  I don't mean to hijack your thread, but I am curious if this is true.

I know out-of-state registrations in Maine are not subject to local excise tax (which can be over $500 for a new car; tax drops each year the car ages), as for Maine residents, but I am not sure about sales tax. I tend to believe what the dealer says is true. The registration fee, itself, in Maine is just $35 per year (used to be $30).
 

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