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Author Topic: Good starter yak?  (Read 5074 times)

William52

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Good starter yak?
« on: April 29, 2016, 05:21:21 PM »
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kdbgoat

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2016, 06:28:35 PM »
I'm looking at the same one. I'll be watching for replies here.
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kdbgoat

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2016, 12:21:14 PM »
Man, I figured somebody had to have one. :(
I know you believe you understand what you think I said,
But I am not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant


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JackL

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2016, 06:10:49 PM »
Any kayak that gets you on the water is a good kayak !

We started 20 years ago with little 9 foot long Keowees, which we still have and use with skirts in mild white water rivers.

When we realized that we loved paddling, and wanted to go faster and farther we bought longer sea kayaks with watertight compartments.
Mine is a seventeen foot plastic Perception Eclipse and hers is a 16 foot plastic Perception Shadow.
 Then we made the mistake of entering a race, and quickly realized that we needed lighter and sleeker composite boats to be competitive.
 I now have an 18 foot 21 inch wide carbon/kevler QCC-700 and she went with a 16 foot, 21" wide carbon/Kevlar QCC-10x
 We still race our plastic sea kayaks in rocky river races.

We winter in the Florida Keys and do multi day camping trips out of our kayaks in the Everglades National Park as well as our daily paddles to the off shore Keys.
 This past winter, we logged over 600 miles paddling.

 Now lets talk about canoes which we have six of ?

 Once you get hooked, there is no turning back !

Jack L


pdfitz

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2016, 02:00:54 PM »
You've probably already taken the plunge but...I highly recommend you get something at least 12 ft. in length.  Anything shorter is a pain to keep going straight which takes some of the fun out of it and makes more work than necessary. Perception and Wilderness Systems offer some reasonably priced recreation boats that aren't tugs.  Hopefully you're already on the water somewhere!  ;D
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kdbgoat

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2016, 02:27:31 PM »
Nope, I haven't bought one yet. Still deciding.
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But I am not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant


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scottydl

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2016, 05:12:52 PM »
My wife has recently become a lot more interested (and is getting me to that point to) in owning a kayak or stand-up paddle board.  Different animals I know, but some recent internet browsing taught me how much I have to learn about the various sizes/styles/configurations out there!
Scott, wife, 3 boys... and the dog
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kdbgoat

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #7 on: August 02, 2016, 05:03:16 AM »
Due to my age and having had a stroke, my balance isn't what it once was, so the stand-up paddle board is out for me. Besides, I was taught that there is no need to stand up when you can sit down. ::)
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UTTransplant

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #8 on: August 02, 2016, 07:27:57 AM »
I am more of a canoe person than kayak, but I do second the recommendation to get a longer kayak, at least 12 foot. We paddle with a group that includes a variety of kayaks, and the little ones take a lot of work to keep up with the others. We generally have to slow down to let them catch up. They have to spend so much energy going straight, they have trouble going forward <grin>.

As for standup boards, they are fun for exercise, but not for fishing or just hanging out on the water.
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Marsha/CA

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2016, 11:04:38 AM »
I'm also looking for a kayak.  My son and daughter in law  have little short 8' and 9' plastic ones and we used them the other day so that I could test the 8' out.  I went into the river twice because the kayak was so "squirrely".  It was hard to keep straight and when I hit strong current with an eddy it spun putting me sideways and I went over......The river was not extremely strong so I was surprised.  In fact I could stand up in it, there were pockets of deep water but not over my head.

I'm now looking at ones that are longer 10-12', wider based and have somewhat of a keel.  It still needs to be something that I can shove up on the roof of the car, which may be a problem.

Marsha~
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Olustee bus

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2016, 02:33:36 PM »
Nope, I haven't bought one yet. Still deciding.

I think it all depends on the type water you will be on and the type trips. A sit on top 10 to 12 feet is good for summer in larger water where as a small yak is good for creeks and small lakes.

jagnweiner

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2016, 03:49:06 PM »
My wife has recently become a lot more interested (and is getting me to that point to) in owning a kayak or stand-up paddle board.  Different animals I know, but some recent internet browsing taught me how much I have to learn about the various sizes/styles/configurations out there!

Scott, if you have any interest in trying out a Sea Eagle inflatable, let me know and I'll bring ours down on one of our trips to Bloomington/Normal to visit the girl at school.  Perhaps an inflatable is of less interest to you, as you have the Suburban roof that could hold a hard shell.
-Scott
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JackL

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2016, 06:12:11 PM »
Can I brag ?

 My wife and I just got back from  MA where we raced our  canoe in the annual seven mile  North river Race.
 We raced in the mixed doubles and took a second overall and won the 60 and over age group.

 I am 80 and she is a young 78.

 This coming Saturday we will be racing two races in the Dan river here in NC.
 We'll do the first one in our tandem canoe, and in the second one I'll race my 17 foot plastic kayak and  she will race her 16 foot plastic kayak. It has some white water with rapids, so we will forgo the composite boats.

 In Sept. we will race in the Adirondack 90 miler in up state NY our Kevlar stock canoe in the "Super veterans class".
 The following week we will race our Kevlar racing canoe in the Lumber river 20 miler here in NC and then in October we will race the annual one day 50 miler in the Suwannee River from Fargo GA to white Springs Florida.

What does it do for us ? - Along with the training, it has allowed us to make great friends, (all younger than us, naturally) up and down the whole east coast as well as keeping us in good shape

Jack L

 

kdbgoat

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2016, 06:04:34 AM »
Can I brag ?

Yes! And congratulations on your performance, and wish you the best on the upcoming events.

One thing though- without pics, it didn't happen. ;D
I know you believe you understand what you think I said,
But I am not sure you realize what you heard is not what I meant


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scottydl

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2016, 11:18:33 AM »
Jack, that is outstanding and WAY TO GO keeping active and having fun!  My wife and I are about half your age, and hope to continue physical activities for as long as possible.  We just JUST "dipping our toes into" the idea of paddle-watercraft ownership.  My wife is a fitness guru so she's definitely most interested in a paddleboard, but I'd like to have a kayak also.

Scott, if you have any interest in trying out a Sea Eagle inflatable, let me know and I'll bring ours down on one of our trips to Bloomington/Normal to visit the girl at school.  Perhaps an inflatable is of less interest to you, as you have the Suburban roof that could hold a hard shell.

Thanks for the offer!  I'll let you know, as no decisions are being made yet.  I'm hoping to come across a nice used kayak on Craigslist, where I buy most of my stuff.  ;)
Scott, wife, 3 boys... and the dog
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William52

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #15 on: August 04, 2016, 12:05:55 AM »
I think it all depends on the type water you will be on and the type trips. A sit on top 10 to 12 feet is good for summer in larger water where as a small yak is good for creeks and small lakes.
   Still looking but a sit in at 10 to 12 feet will be our first one and a sit on top second? Smaller water creeks and small lakes.
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JackL

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #16 on: August 04, 2016, 05:02:54 AM »
Yes! And congratulations on your performance, and wish you the best on the upcoming events.

One thing though- without pics, it didn't happen. ;D

    It is impossible to take pictures of yourself when you are racing a canoe or a kayak, un less you have a go-pro, which we don't have but the proof is usually posted on line.

Check out the race results  search for: NSRWA great River race and you will see the latest and other years results too.

We have thousands of paddling pictures . I used to post unique wild life ones on Paddling .net

Jack L

scottydl

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #17 on: August 04, 2016, 01:46:35 PM »
Local Craigslist search (central Illinois for me) turned up these models in the last couple days:

http://lasalle.craigslist.org/spo/5702645462.html
Sun Dolphin Bali 12-ft Sit-On Kayak - $300 (advertised as nearly new)

http://springfieldil.craigslist.org/boa/5716382789.html
2001 Old Town 13-ft Kayak - $200

I never really thought about "model year" for a kayak.  Has anything changed on them in past years, or would plastic potentially be faded/brittle on something 15 years old?  Any opinions from experienced paddlers on a model where legs are more exposed (the Sun Dolphin) versus enclosed (the Old Town)?
Scott, wife, 3 boys... and the dog
- 2008 Forest River Wildwood 32BHDS
- 1995 Chevrolet Suburban C2500 tow vehicle
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William52

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #18 on: August 04, 2016, 03:10:12 PM »
Local Craigslist search (central Illinois for me) turned up these models in the last couple days:

http://lasalle.craigslist.org/spo/5702645462.html
Sun Dolphin Bali 12-ft Sit-On Kayak - $300 (advertised as nearly new)

http://springfieldil.craigslist.org/boa/5716382789.html
2001 Old Town 13-ft Kayak - $200

I never really thought about "model year" for a kayak.  Has anything changed on them in past years, or would plastic potentially be faded/brittle on something 15 years old?  Any opinions from experienced paddlers on a model where legs are more exposed (the Sun Dolphin) versus enclosed (the Old Town)?
   I'm in Texas north of Houston Thx BTW
2000 Pace Arrow M35N F53 V10 Ford  100,000 + miles purrs like a kitten. Yes I am old school.         2007 Honda VTX double dark side

William52

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #19 on: August 04, 2016, 03:15:09 PM »
http://www.ausablecanoemarathon.org/     For those who race. Not for me but they do this every year.
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blw2

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #20 on: August 04, 2016, 03:45:27 PM »
I used to do a fair bit of paddling.  Bought a used Wilderness Systems boat way back when a decent used boat cost way more than the new ones do now.  Still have that boat hanging on the wall in the garage collecting dust....  :(

It looks ballpark similar to the one the OP linked to.  Approx 12ft i think, sit inside with a large cockpit opening.
A longer boat is better tracking for long flat water paddles, but mine was decent all around flat water.  I often wished it was longer though.

There is something to be said for the sit on top styles, depending on climate.  I saw a guy a few weeks ago while we had teh RV at the beach, out paddling in the waves surfing.  It looked like great fun and made me want to get back in.... till I realized he was making it look easy... and my baot wouldn't be as suitable as a sit on top for that kind of thing.

My last comment is this.... spend as much as you can on the paddle.  I bought my boat used, and the guy I bought the rig from was smart.  The paddle cost about as much as the boat did back in the day.... it's a werner.  A good paddle makes a HUGE difference!
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Old Radios

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #21 on: August 04, 2016, 09:23:38 PM »
My current kayak is 14.5' which is just about perfect for what I use it for, mountain lakes, streams, and exploring marshes.  Has a rudder I can drop and use on windy lakes and a couple of water tight compartments for my backpacking gear when i take off solo. A shorter boat would be too much work and longer would be less maneuverable in the marshes.  Just depends on what you want to use it for.  My wife has a 13' Old Town which is a little wider, has a bigger hatch and is easier to get in and out of. Not as quick though.

Lately I've been thinking about going back to a solo canoe. (Placid Boat Works Rapid Fire). Would still use a kayak paddle with it and it's about a third of the weight of my current kayak. Miss the 13' Mad River Solo canoe I had 25 years ago.    We still use our full size Mad River canoe a lot as we like to take the dog.  It's 16.5 feet but is very maneuverable and good in the wind and choppy water plus we can throw a lot of gear in it.
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UTTransplant

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #22 on: August 04, 2016, 10:30:59 PM »
The Rapid Fire is one sweet boat! I have seen one at a free-style canoe symposium. I am a big fan of solo canoes rather than kayaks. They are always less weight than an equivalent kayak since they don't have a deck. They are very versatile, and they don't take much skill to use with a double blade (kayak-style) paddle. I personally prefer canoeing with a single blade paddle in solo canoes, just for fun. The biggest disadvantage of a solo canoe is they aren't mass produced so they cost more than a kayak. Our current solos are a Wenonah Vagabond, a Mad River Freedom 14, and a Wenonah Aurora.
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blw2

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #23 on: August 05, 2016, 08:49:17 AM »
Am I reading that right?  Placid Boat Works Rapid Fire is 22 to 29 pounds?!?

One of my dreads about going paddling again is the wrenched backs from solo unloading, launching, and loading.  At 30# or less, that is very attractive!

How stable compared to a yak?
I've been in some very tippy canoes in my day.....
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JDOnTheGo

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #24 on: August 05, 2016, 09:58:14 AM »
Thoughts?

Howdy William52!  I'd suggest some research based on HOW you plan to use it.  I have a sit-in Necky and love it.  However; the "in" part is very different than the "sit-on" type kayaks and they each have their place.  If you have even slightly limited mobility, the "on" types are much easier to use.  If you have no real plans for use, nearly anything that gets you on the water is a very good thing!  Buying used from Craigslist can be a great way to get into the sport inexpensively and figure out what you really want/like.
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Old Radios

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2016, 01:23:06 PM »
Am I reading that right?  Placid Boat Works Rapid Fire is 22 to 29 pounds?!?

One of my dreads about going paddling again is the wrenched backs from solo unloading, launching, and loading.  At 30# or less, that is very attractive!

How stable compared to a yak?
I've been in some very tippy canoes in my day.....

Yup, 22 to 29 pounds.

Like my Mad river canoes and my kayak, the Rapidfire has secondary stability which means it has a shallow V hull which tends to stop and sit on the side of the V if you tip it.  Very good for maneuvering and great for tracking a straight line when you are straight up. A flatter bottom boat has more initial stability but once it starts to tip there's no stopping it and it is harder to paddle in a straight line.
« Last Edit: August 05, 2016, 01:26:20 PM by Old Radios »
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UTTransplant

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2016, 02:22:48 PM »
Placid Boatworks specializes in high quality light weight canoes. They are almost hand crafted, and the price tag shows it. They are a great boat builder though! There are lots of other options for lighter weight canoes, especially if you are comparing to 80 pound aluminums! Kevlar boats are in the 35-40 pound range for a nice solo, 40-50 for tandems. Even my solo Royalex is only 45 pounds. And stability comes with practice. A boat that fills "tippy" at the start won't feel that way after a few days on the water. The flat bottom boats feel good at the start, but they flip in an instant if you get even a little bit off the side. A shallow V is infinitely better, as Old Radios also notes.
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Soh Crates

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #27 on: August 14, 2016, 06:41:51 PM »
I'd consider an inflatable stand up paddleboard! They call them standups, but you can sit, stand, have a picnic on the water, use them as a dock to jump off and swim, and you can slowly work up to standing if you like. They are so much more versatile than a kayak in most situations. We have a couple, they roll up to largish sleeping bag size when not in use.

William52

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #28 on: August 16, 2016, 12:51:11 PM »
Howdy William52!  I'd suggest some research based on HOW you plan to use it.  I have a sit-in Necky and love it.  However; the "in" part is very different than the "sit-on" type kayaks and they each have their place.  If you have even slightly limited mobility, the "on" types are much easier to use.  If you have no real plans for use, nearly anything that gets you on the water is a very good thing!  Buying used from Craigslist can be a great way to get into the sport inexpensively and figure out what you really want/like.
  Plan is to start with a sit in because of cold water temps in Michigan in summer. And alligators in water in Fla./Tx. in winter. Smaller lakes and rivers mostly for angling and just enjoying nature. Then maybe a sit on top when water temps are warmer. Needs to be light weight and plan on CRV/ Car topping so we can take them anywhere we go. Retirement is getting closer and we are trying to get squared away.
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scottydl

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #29 on: August 25, 2016, 09:03:17 PM »
Back to a used kayak question... what is a fair price for a good used one?  I know there are a lot of aspects to that, just like RV's.  ;)  Found another one in my local Craigslist.  It's a 2008 Current Designs (make) Breeze (model), 13 feet, some cosmetic blemishes but appears solid overall.  Seller says MSRP is $999 and she bought new for $850.  Asking price now is $250.  No paddle or accessories included, but she has some available for separate sale.  Just trying to get an idea of what ballpark I should be looking at.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2016, 09:20:53 AM by scottydl »
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- 2008 Forest River Wildwood 32BHDS
- 1995 Chevrolet Suburban C2500 tow vehicle
- 1994 Thor Residency motorhome... owned 2007-2012

William52

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #30 on: August 25, 2016, 09:25:13 PM »
25% of list price seems a deal. It going to get a little banged up.
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JDOnTheGo

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #31 on: August 26, 2016, 04:50:42 AM »
Back to a used kayak question... what is a fair price for a good used one?  I know there are a lot of aspects to that, just like RV's.  ;)  Found another one in my local Craigslist.  It's a 2008 Current Designs (make) Breeze (model), 13 feet, some cosmetic blemishes but appears solid overall.

Be sure to try it on and confirm that it fits - it appears to be sized for smaller folks.  I'm old school on used prices - a good deal is a price that satisfies both the buyer and the seller.  I bought my Necky Manitou used for $300 (with paddle and skirt) and it has provided many hours of really great times on the water.  In my mind, that is a good deal.  If you don't enjoy it once you've given it a try, you can probably resell for that same price.
« Last Edit: August 26, 2016, 09:20:22 AM by scottydl »
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spacenorman

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #32 on: January 03, 2017, 08:51:08 PM »
We decided to pick up a couple of kayaks last summer - and ended up purchasing a couple of Old Towne Vapor 10 boats.   They are 10' boats with relatively large cockpit openings (19.5" x 48").  While I would have liked a slightly longer boat - the large cockpit openings along with concerns about dealing with another 2 feet of boat when transporting and storing the boats sold me on these.   Since purchasing them - we used them regularly thru the summer and into the early fall - on "still water" (small lakes) as well as on a couple of easy rivers popular with kayakers in our area.   

We're now preparing to head down to Florida to flee the Michigan winter and are planning to take the kayaks with us.  This trip brings a number of "firsts" for us with regards to the kayaks.  It will be the first time we've transported the kayaks in freezing temps (hopefully we won't damage the boats while loading and securing the plastic boats due to the frigid temperatures).   This will also be the first time we've done any extended traveling with the kayak - and dealing with having to store and/or secure the boats while on the road and at campsites as we travel (I've picked up a couple of "bike lock" cables which I plan to use to secure the boats by passing the cables thru the carrying cleat on the bow of the kayaks and then through the "riser" of the "dual receiver hitch" on the coach.   Finally, I'm hoping that my DW doesn't freak if/when we happen to spot an alligator or two paddling around on Florida waterways!   

We'll see have to see how this all shakes out! 
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scottydl

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #33 on: January 05, 2017, 06:20:26 PM »
^^ Make sure you get some photos to share!  :)
Scott, wife, 3 boys... and the dog
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- 1995 Chevrolet Suburban C2500 tow vehicle
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HappyWanderer

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #34 on: January 05, 2017, 07:01:13 PM »
... This will also be the first time we've done any extended traveling with the kayak - and dealing with having to store and/or secure the boats while on the road and at campsites as we travel (I've picked up a couple of "bike lock" cables which I plan to use to secure the boats by passing the cables thru the carrying cleat on the bow of the kayaks and then through the "riser" of the "dual receiver hitch" on the coach. ... 

I use a 25 foot length of vinyl covered steel cable, the type used for dog runs. It's long enough to secure the kayaks to vehicles, trees or whatever might be available.
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SeilerBird

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #35 on: January 05, 2017, 07:06:35 PM »
Can I brag ?
Please do. You are an inspiration to all of us. Congratulations.
I would like to apologize to anyone I have not yet offended. Please be patient and I will get to you shortly.
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spacenorman

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #36 on: January 07, 2017, 10:49:39 PM »
I use a 25 foot length of vinyl covered steel cable, the type used for dog runs. It's long enough to secure the kayaks to vehicles, trees or whatever might be available.

Thanks for the tip!  I think I'll look into that!  I'm concerned that the bike lock cables I was planning to use (and own already) - are going to prove to be a pain to work with being only 6 feet each.   A longer cable would nice.   I think I'll swing past Lowes tomorrow and see what I can whip up! 
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scottydl

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #37 on: January 09, 2017, 01:57:51 PM »
Thanks for the tip!  I think I'll look into that!  I'm concerned that the bike lock cables I was planning to use (and own already) - are going to prove to be a pain to work with being only 6 feet each.

The bike lock cables can often be daisy-chained end to end if the lock mechanisms are the same on each of them... but they may not be designed for heavy duty use.  A couple of kayaks with wind resistance at highway speeds could create some pretty major force.  I'd be more concerned with the lock mechanisms bending/failing (many of which are pretty flimsy on bike locks) over a cable snapping.

In your situation, I'd imagine that the kayaks are already secured down and the cables are just a safety device... but just something to consider.
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HappyWanderer

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Re: Good starter yak?
« Reply #38 on: January 09, 2017, 05:07:04 PM »
In your situation, I'd imagine that the kayaks are already secured down and the cables are just a safety device... but just something to consider.

Yes, there's a big difference between secure (locked up) and secure (won't blow away). How many times have you seen a couple of kayaks on J-hooks clamped to a roof rack with nothing to secure them?  A handful of sheet metal screws into the roof is the only thing keeping the whole thing from becoming airborne.

I saw something posted online not long ago where a lady was complaining that her factory roof rack was ripped apart by her kayaks being up there without being tied down.
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