Best truck for my application
- Thread starter nonrev321
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If you have answers, please help by responding to the unanswered posts.
donuts
Well-known member
grashley said:
Just my point of view with gas vs diesel.
Diesel will cost you more up front and maintenance costs are higher than gas, but here is the difference;
The motors traditionally last longer. Subject to maintenance as with any vehicle.
You will get much better gas milage. Night and day.
You will have much more power and especially traveling in the mountains.
When you sell it, you will gain your 8,000 plus more if you buy the right diesel. If you don't believe me, go to Auto Trader and look at the price of a used diesel and used gas truck. As I stated earlier, 2006 and 2007 Chevy or GMC duramax products have retained their value because they are powerful and dependable with the best tranny.
With a diesel, you have to do some research. Ford had many problems from 2003.5 to 2007. Chevy and GMC have been great since 2006. Dodge has been solid all along. They now have a tranny that is up to matching the Allison, but it is normally with the 1 ton trucks and newer models.
Stan
Frizlefrak
Well-known member
donuts said:
I bought my diesel truck new because I couldn't find one used with under 100,000 miles that wasn't either 75% of what it cost new, or beat to death. They hold their value very well.
OutdoorFT
Well-known member
This is one of the best posts I've read in a while (on this subject anyway). Like others, I'm in the market for a truck. But the price for a 3/4 ton and 1 ton truck (F250 and F350) are very close in price, with a nice towing bonus. So, I'm just going all in and going big. In my area (Central NY), diesels are everywhere, usually with high mileage. YMMV.grashley said:
If it helps, I'm looking to fulltime but we are not looking for the biggest trailer. However, I will be getting a 1 ton, most likely diesel.
Frizlefrak
Well-known member
nonrev321 said:
The 6.0 Powerstroke (late 2003 to 2007) have a less than savory reputation, and are very expensive to repair. The cab has to come off the truck for major engine work. The 6.4 was the last of the Navistar built Powerstroke diesels from 2008-2010, and most of the kinks were ironed out by then. Since 2011, Ford has built their own diesels in house (ie the "Scorpion" 6.7). Thus far, they have a good reputation for reliability.
That said....a 6.0 or 6.4 powerstroke can be made reliable, it's just going to cost some $$$ up front....money you won't get back when you sell. I drive them at least once a week on my new job, in various states of originality and tune. I drove a modded 6.0 King Ranch the other day that would flat get it. The owner had put in reinforced head studs, deleted the EGR, used an aftermarket turbo, and a corresponding tune. He has a shift kit in the transmission, and a 4" body lift. The truck had 140K miles, and was a beast. If I didn't have a diesel truck already, I would have bought it from him with no worries.
grashley
Well-known member
For the truck, as Frizlefrak said, you would be wise to avoid the Ford 6.0 motor. Many were very good power plants. Others were not. The 6.4L and 6.7L are solid performers.
You will find little disagreement here over which truck brand is best. All three are solidly built trucks with lots of power and reliability. You will see friendly jabs among some seasoned members about makes, though. The best advice I have seen is drive all three and get the one your wife likes best!
You will find little disagreement here over which truck brand is best. All three are solidly built trucks with lots of power and reliability. You will see friendly jabs among some seasoned members about makes, though. The best advice I have seen is drive all three and get the one your wife likes best!
Frizlefrak
Well-known member
All three are great trucks today. I drove all three, and I bought the Ram simply because I thought it was the best looking of them. It was so close, that the decision came down to eye appeal. Performance and features, any of them would have been a great choice.
lone_star_dsl
Well-known member
As a diesel performance/diesel truck user for the last 20 years, here's my rather educated opinions regarding all three brands:
Ford:
The 7.3 liter diesel found in the 1999-2003 Superduty's was the best engine Ford ever used. The 4R100 transmission backing it up was known to give up around 100,000 miles. The same transmission in my 2002 F-350 was still going strong at 230k miles even with 500 hp in front of it.
The dark years for Ford were 2003.5-2007. The 6.0 liter engine is widely known to be a lemon. Fortunately, for about $5,000, that engine can be made absolutely bulletproof and worth its weight in gold. The 5R100 transmission was introduced to the Superdutys and are known for their reliability.
2008-2010 was a transition time with the 6.4 liter. Navistar was being fired and Ford was deciding to go it on their own. The 6.4 wasn't plagued by too many issues but are know to get horrible fuel mileage. The radiator and radiator mounts that Ford introduced in this time period had, and are still having, issues with cracking.
2011-present 6.7 liter engines had a few growing pains in the beginning. Injector issues and cracking pistons were fairly prevalent. Since 2014, they have worked out quite a few of the major bugs but are still having radiator issues.
Chevy/GMC:
The 2000-2004 LB7 engine revolutionized the diesel engine world when it was introduced with over 500 lbs of torque. As with all new things, there were growing pains. By far the biggest issue was the aluminum head mounted on a cast iron block. Those metals expanded at different rates which caused problems, namely the head cracking around the injector cups.
2004.5-2005 LLY engines didn't show many of the issues with cracking heads but are commonly known for connecting rod and piston problems. There are a lot of LLY blocks sitting around with holes in the sides of them.
The 2006 LBZ is the holy grail of Duramaz engines for those that want to make big power. They fixed the rod and piston issues, bumped up the HP and TQ and did not have to add downstream exhaust treatments.
2010-present is the LML. Not a whole lot of changes except in the power dept.
Regarding the Allison transmission, the early ones experienced some failures because of some poor programming. Overall, they are stout and have been relatively trouble free. Not to mention they will hold about 550 hp before needing upgrades.
Dodge/Ram:
The Cummins has been fairly unchanged as far as the hard parts are concerned. It was introduced in 1989 and saw very few changes, other than bumps in power, until 2007.
The early 2000's saw some issues in block castings would result in pinholes in the block that would slowly leak coolant.
2007 saw a bump in displacement to 6.7 liters and later the addition of exhaust treatments, just like the other two brands.
Where Dodge fell short for many years was with their transmissions. The automatic transmissions from the 90's to the early 2000's were known to give up the ghost fairly easily. Since 2007, the 68RFE automatic has been holding up well with few issues reported. The Aisin automatic transmission, offered in the 3500's since 2013, is a true medium duty transmission.
None of the brands will be trouble free. Here are some links to some great forums so you can do a little reading on the pros/cons of each.
Ford- http://www.thedieselstop.com/forums/f149/
Chevy- http://www.duramaxforum.com/forum/2011-lml-duramax-powertrain/
Ram- http://www.cumminsforum.com/forum/2013-general-discussion/
I've always been partial to Fords but when it came time to replace my 2002 F-350, the Fords no longer had the edge in the dependability department. One reason that the Cummins engine caught my eye was this website: https://www.cumminshighmileageclub.com/Truck/Search not to mention what the problems were (or really the lack thereof) that kept popping up on the forums.
Ford:
The 7.3 liter diesel found in the 1999-2003 Superduty's was the best engine Ford ever used. The 4R100 transmission backing it up was known to give up around 100,000 miles. The same transmission in my 2002 F-350 was still going strong at 230k miles even with 500 hp in front of it.
The dark years for Ford were 2003.5-2007. The 6.0 liter engine is widely known to be a lemon. Fortunately, for about $5,000, that engine can be made absolutely bulletproof and worth its weight in gold. The 5R100 transmission was introduced to the Superdutys and are known for their reliability.
2008-2010 was a transition time with the 6.4 liter. Navistar was being fired and Ford was deciding to go it on their own. The 6.4 wasn't plagued by too many issues but are know to get horrible fuel mileage. The radiator and radiator mounts that Ford introduced in this time period had, and are still having, issues with cracking.
2011-present 6.7 liter engines had a few growing pains in the beginning. Injector issues and cracking pistons were fairly prevalent. Since 2014, they have worked out quite a few of the major bugs but are still having radiator issues.
Chevy/GMC:
The 2000-2004 LB7 engine revolutionized the diesel engine world when it was introduced with over 500 lbs of torque. As with all new things, there were growing pains. By far the biggest issue was the aluminum head mounted on a cast iron block. Those metals expanded at different rates which caused problems, namely the head cracking around the injector cups.
2004.5-2005 LLY engines didn't show many of the issues with cracking heads but are commonly known for connecting rod and piston problems. There are a lot of LLY blocks sitting around with holes in the sides of them.
The 2006 LBZ is the holy grail of Duramaz engines for those that want to make big power. They fixed the rod and piston issues, bumped up the HP and TQ and did not have to add downstream exhaust treatments.
2010-present is the LML. Not a whole lot of changes except in the power dept.
Regarding the Allison transmission, the early ones experienced some failures because of some poor programming. Overall, they are stout and have been relatively trouble free. Not to mention they will hold about 550 hp before needing upgrades.
Dodge/Ram:
The Cummins has been fairly unchanged as far as the hard parts are concerned. It was introduced in 1989 and saw very few changes, other than bumps in power, until 2007.
The early 2000's saw some issues in block castings would result in pinholes in the block that would slowly leak coolant.
2007 saw a bump in displacement to 6.7 liters and later the addition of exhaust treatments, just like the other two brands.
Where Dodge fell short for many years was with their transmissions. The automatic transmissions from the 90's to the early 2000's were known to give up the ghost fairly easily. Since 2007, the 68RFE automatic has been holding up well with few issues reported. The Aisin automatic transmission, offered in the 3500's since 2013, is a true medium duty transmission.
None of the brands will be trouble free. Here are some links to some great forums so you can do a little reading on the pros/cons of each.
Ford- http://www.thedieselstop.com/forums/f149/
Chevy- http://www.duramaxforum.com/forum/2011-lml-duramax-powertrain/
Ram- http://www.cumminsforum.com/forum/2013-general-discussion/
I've always been partial to Fords but when it came time to replace my 2002 F-350, the Fords no longer had the edge in the dependability department. One reason that the Cummins engine caught my eye was this website: https://www.cumminshighmileageclub.com/Truck/Search not to mention what the problems were (or really the lack thereof) that kept popping up on the forums.
grashley
Well-known member
Lone Star:
Great summary! Thanks!
Great summary! Thanks!
lone_star_dsl
Well-known member
grashley said:
Thanks preacher! It has cost me a lot of time and money to gain enough experience to write a summary like that. Fortunately, any thought of the time and money I spent disappeared when I was finally able to see a light duty diesel engine that I built make over 1,000 hp on a chassis dyno.
We tend to discuss how an increase in speed relates to a squared increase in wind drag. Well, the same goes for horsepower...
Rancher Will
Well-known member
If this helps, you are welcome.
As a Rancher I have purchased and owned over a dozen light trucks over 55 years. I still own a few and some are owned by the people that I sold or gave to, that still run.
Since Dodge, now RAM, started putting Cummins engines in their trucks, I have never worn out a Cummins Engine. Our oldest RAM, a 1999, that I still own has over 300,000 miles and still runs fine. Our oldest, a 1972 Dodge 250 gas engine, is still in use on my son's ranch as a water truck for his cattle. Since Dodge started offering Diesels, I have always bought Diesels.
I also just bought another RAM 3500 HD, 4WD, with CM Flatbed, Receiver, B&W turn over, and B&W Companion hitches, with the 6.7 HD Cummins engine, last month for a total cost, including taxes, of $45,650.
As a Rancher I have purchased and owned over a dozen light trucks over 55 years. I still own a few and some are owned by the people that I sold or gave to, that still run.
Since Dodge, now RAM, started putting Cummins engines in their trucks, I have never worn out a Cummins Engine. Our oldest RAM, a 1999, that I still own has over 300,000 miles and still runs fine. Our oldest, a 1972 Dodge 250 gas engine, is still in use on my son's ranch as a water truck for his cattle. Since Dodge started offering Diesels, I have always bought Diesels.
I also just bought another RAM 3500 HD, 4WD, with CM Flatbed, Receiver, B&W turn over, and B&W Companion hitches, with the 6.7 HD Cummins engine, last month for a total cost, including taxes, of $45,650.
