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Author Topic: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY  (Read 4458 times)

pattii

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Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« on: March 29, 2008, 09:09:06 AM »
I had a bad experience with Great Outdoors RV in Fulton NY. I will never buy from this large dealer again, and wanted to keep other camper people from making my buyers mistake.

I had considerable back pain the week before I went to Great Outdoors RV in Fulton and had taken the week off sick, thinking rest would cure it. I originally went to Great Outdoors RV to just look at the floor plan of a Toy Hauler they had on the grounds Saturday March 15, 2008, no intention to buy that day. Admittedly I fell to sales pressure, "must sign now" for this price and with much hesitancy (even noted by the salesmen) over my back condition, and if it fit in the driveway (we measured it did), I singed a down payment of $500. My fault there.

Monday I banked the $500 OK'ed them to cash it, but warned the salesman my back was worse and I had a Dr. appointment Tues. His answer was "Take out a loan with a disability clause."  I couldn't!  By following Tuesday, my back worsened, my office informed me they had already registered me on disability due to the number of sick days already out. I ended up in the emergency room Thursday had an MRI, and I am still out of work. I don't know when I'll be better or if it reoccurs if I'll need the camper.

After calling DAILY all week to the Great Outdoors, with rudely NO call backs I finally made the Secretary find the Sales Manager NOW. I explained I regretted I could no longer buy the camper. He didn't care. Hard nosed and cold, he told me he would not give me my money back "it's in the contract," and said I inconvenienced HIM. Even with a proven disability he wasn't budging. I can not believe, a company would be so heartless. They said they would keep the $500 it in case I wanted to buy a camper in a year. I need the $500 for medical bills now.

Please consider other camper stores before purchasing from this heartless place.

I am so saddened. Even sadder is, this is how they treat a repeat customer in a crisis. You usually think of camper people as friendly, customer oriented, helpful. A reminder to think before you sign a contract, regardless of sales pressure. I wish I had stuck to my original intent to LOOK, and not allowed myself to cave to the sales talk. My fault there.
 :(
« Last Edit: March 29, 2008, 09:12:02 AM by pattii »

Gary RV Roamer

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #1 on: March 29, 2008, 09:27:59 AM »
Sorry to hear about your back problems and the loss of the $500. On the other hand, you knew you were taking a risk (and know even better now that you should have listened to your subconscious voice telling you to wait!). 

Dealers who stipulate a deposit is non-refundable rarely give it back for any reason, even disability or death. For that reason, non-refundable deposits should be avoided until you are absolutely sure. Or seek out another dealer who is willing to stipulate that you can get a refund if you are unable to complete the deal.
Gary
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pattii

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2008, 11:19:00 AM »
You are absolutely right, I can't argue with that. And have admitted my faults in this above.

I guess I just had more faith in a person's heart, to "do the right thing" as my mother would say. The world is changed.

Yes, I've learned a lesson to walk out the door when the salesman starts the pressure with "You have to sign today for this price," and "I have someone coming from PA to look at that very camper this afternoon." You are right. I let myself be pushed. If I wasn't feeling kind of lousy I might have had more fight in me to say "I told you I'm only looking today, and not buying yet."

I could not do this to someone, so I guess that is why it seems so incredible to me.

I hope my mistake can save someone else from the same fate by posting it. If you have any hesitation and didn't intend to buy that day, wait a week before signing anything.

Tom

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #3 on: March 29, 2008, 11:27:15 AM »
California has a law that allows the buyer to change their mind within IIRC 3 days. But dealers always try to get the customer to waive that right.
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pattii

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #4 on: March 29, 2008, 11:46:21 AM »
I tried calling them back as soon as I knew I was on Disability, 2 business days after the sale. The salesman was abrupt and passed me to the accountant. He listened to my story and never got back, I asked for the sales manager the third day I got transferred to answering machines. I called On my way to the emergency room (it was an hour away, had to go to one that had a Neruological unit) Thursday. No one available.

I've tried to be polite all week and got nowhere. Today, after pleading, frustrated, I hung up on the sales-manager-pretending-to-be-owner, and closed with "Enjoy your $500."

Ron

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2008, 12:25:30 PM »
Sorry about your medical issues.  However, The dealer while using high pressure tactics may not have done anything illegal if you were made aware the $500 deposit was non-refundable.  I hope you did not sign any papers binding you to buying the camper or worse yet any loan papers.

Without knowing the full story from both parties involved I cannot find the dealer at fault anymore than yourself.  Sounds hard and cold but from what you have posted that is the way I see it.  We often tell folks not to blindly trust what a salesman or dealer tells you to be true and accurate.

Sorry you made some bad choices.  I hope your medical problems can be resolved.
Ron & Sam-home is where we park it. Currently located   HERE

Gary RV Roamer

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2008, 02:52:42 PM »
Check NY laws - you may have some protection if you tried to cancel the sale within three days. Most states have a law giving you the right to back out without penalty if it is done soon enough and I know that NY has such a law. Just how and if it applies to your case requires more local knowledge than I can offer. Here's an overview:  NY Three Day "Cooling Off" rule
Gary
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utmtman

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #7 on: March 30, 2008, 06:50:34 PM »
Be sure you also call the Better Business Bureau.  There are laws against those situations.   Might not hurt to talk to the local newspaper and news media as well.  They like a story like yours.  Or you can file a personal ad and tell your story.  Might be surprised how quick they might change their tune. 
Lee
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While traveling down life's paths, stop to smell the flowers.

pattii

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2008, 09:40:49 AM »
@RV Roamer

I tried to call and cancel as soon as I got back from the Dr. and found out the problem was more than a strained muscle, but the Salesman transferred me to the Finance guy, who said he couldn't end the sale and I'd have to talk to the Sales Manager.

I left messages on the Sales Manager's machine nearly every day with no call back. I never spoke in person to him until 10 days after when I demanded the Secretary connect me with him telling her "Do NOT shunt me to another answering machine, I've done that now for DAYS."

May I add Great Outdoors RV never gave me a copy of my contract, the day I signed it, nor mailed me a copy, even though I was uable to officially cancel for days because the Sales Manager would not respond to my messages left for him to please call me.

I believe the Sales Manager also lied to me during our phone argument. I asked to speak to the owner or general manager--he said "You can't go higher, I'm both." After I hung up I recalled the secretary, days before had mentioned the owner was not in that day, and said she would transfer me to the Sales Manager. I am suspicious that therefore they can not be one and the same. This place is just not very nice, nor honest. I'm going to write a letter to the REAL owner if I verify it is someone else.

And I thought it was a bit scammish for the Salesman to suggest KNOWING I had a hurting back to take out a Disability Clause on my loan. It was too late by the time I would have gone for the loan at my own bank later that week, but I would not have done such a dishonest thing anyway. My credit and reputation is A+

I am starting to feel a little better though, and have located other places carrying this same camper and will buy anywhere but G.O. when the time comes again, even if it means driving out of state. With a little "understanding" G.O. would have kept a proven repeat customer, as a continued repeat customer. I would have instead praised them for bending the rules to help out a loyal repeat customer in an unexpected health crisis.

Thank you everyone for all your advice. I have enjoyed reading the forum for a long time to gather advice before all this happened and I decided to post.
« Last Edit: April 06, 2008, 09:52:34 AM by pattii »

Mark R.

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2008, 03:29:22 PM »
I had a bad experience with Great Outdoors RV in Fulton NY. I will never buy from this large dealer again, and wanted to keep other camper people from making my buyers mistake.

May want to try a complaint to the NY BBB, dealers do not like these on there record for any reason, they may bargain with you just to get a "compliant satisfied by both parties" on there record sheet. Advise , do not go food shopping if you are hungry 8)!


[edit]added end-quote in appropriate palce[/edit]
« Last Edit: April 06, 2008, 03:58:29 PM by RV Roamer »
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pattii

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2008, 11:14:16 PM »
UPDATE: Just wanted to say I verified what I mentioned in my last post, that the Sales Manager Nick Cusimano, flat out lied to me when I did finally talk to him. When he got snippy with me I asked to speak to someone above him, the owner please. Nick shot back quickly saying HE was the OWNER and manager, there isn't anyone higher. Today I had someone call and ask the Great Outdoor's front desk who the owner is. They said the owner is Jerry Fitzpatrick.

papahog

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #11 on: April 08, 2008, 06:59:30 AM »
Email them a link to this thread.

They do not need bad press especially with such a targeted audience.
Ken
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pattii

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #12 on: March 09, 2013, 08:12:58 AM »
An update 5 years later.
To save themselves $500, the Great Outdoors in Fulton NY missed out on making a profit off selling me 2 campers in the years down the line, plus my sister purchased 1 recently as well, so GO lost out on 3 purchases that would have more than made up for the $500 they insisted on keeping. I was a loyal repeat buyer but they were not a loyal business with an understanding heart to a proven satisfied customer who would have continued to give them YEARS of purchases. Think about this if you are a business owner. Cut repeat customers a break, bend the rules for those that have proven their loyalty to you and you will be rewarded with continued repeat business and positive word of mouth (and forum) publicity.

I purchased 2 previous campers from GO, before the above fiasco which was going to be my THIRD consecutive camper purchase from GO if they only had a heart and cut me a break in a unexpected turn of medical bad luck. If I had been refunded my $500 I would have not only gone back and repurchased the original camper 2 months later after returning to work when cured, I would have purchased an additional camper I bought last year. Instead I went elsewhere and GO lost the profit on both. For want being Ebenezer Scrooge over $500 they lost a thousands in future profit in my and my sister's lifetime. To anyone in the Central NY area, I highly recommend Jim's RV in Nichols NY. Nice, honest people offering excellent trade in prices and great deals on new campers. Loving my latest purchase of a Jayco Swift from them. Take that Great Outdoors.

Koodog

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #13 on: March 09, 2013, 09:26:17 AM »
So true....short term thinking. It happens more than you would believe, not only on RV sales. What I've discovered in business is that 80% of my revenue is created by 20% of my customers. All of these are over 30 year customers. I guess my "bending the rules" long ago made a difference. ;)
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Larry N.

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #14 on: March 09, 2013, 10:17:12 AM »
Along those lines, there is a car dealership here locally that I have bought from (almost) exclusively for over 20 years, because they don't get pushy when you are looking around (they'd get fired), and they have treated me decently in all ways (service included).
Larry and Mary Ann N.
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thomasamski

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #15 on: March 10, 2013, 10:55:59 AM »
I deal wth a small RV company that is second to none when it comes to maintanance and warranty work. I bought my rig from LazyDays of Seffner, FL that refused to make proper warranty repairs. I finally had it fixed elsewhere. I wrote a letter to the president and CEO of LazyDays detailing the challengages, and received a refund for the outside work. The salesman never responded to phone calls or emails. The bigger the company the less they care about costomer service once the deal is done. Stick with the small companies for the best service.
« Last Edit: March 10, 2013, 11:00:10 AM by thomasamski »
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Dennyg

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #16 on: May 29, 2014, 10:13:27 AM »
My best friends just had a horrific experience with this dealership.   they backed out of a deal and the finace guy basically threatened them.  They also did not get copies of any of their application, which they said the guy had used whiteout on.   I'd stay quite far away from them based onwhat I see in here today and what they had to say.   Too bad there are so many unscrupulous companies out there.

terry735001

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #17 on: May 29, 2014, 02:35:21 PM »
its like fish in the sea 

there are just to many places to buy a RV from 

so with that in mind  not matter who is  right or wrong  i would just move on and look else where


PS i all so had a friend try to buy a RV from LazyDays of Seffner, FL  .. and at the end of the day  the price  was never the same  and keep ed going up and up

now is seems LazyDays of Seffner, FL and CW moved out of the same lot   some thing about some big fight ..  not sure of the story there

Old Radios

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #18 on: May 30, 2014, 05:49:02 PM »
I think Seven O's is the best place in upstate NY.  Always had good honest service from them even though I haven't bought either of my rigs from them (bought both used out-of-state).  Seven O's is a small family dealer but they have a location not far from the Great Outdoors.  I usually go to the other one in Kirkville NY.   I was going to stop by The Great Outdoors but I see there's no need to now.  I've never heard anything good about the Burdick dealerships.  Buy all my vehicles elsewhere.
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Bob.n.Carolyn

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #19 on: May 30, 2014, 09:02:59 PM »
California has a law that allows the buyer to change their mind within IIRC 3 days. But dealers always try to get the customer to waive that right.

True, with one caveat:  If you sign a contract at the place of business, usually the dealership, you have a three day right of rescission.   If you sign the contract at your kitchen table, you don't.  When we bought our coach recently, the finance guy was anxious to bring the coach and the paperwork to the house for signatures 'cause he was a nice guy.  ;)
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Tom

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #20 on: May 31, 2014, 08:24:49 AM »
Good to.know Bob.
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parttymer

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #21 on: May 31, 2014, 10:15:16 AM »
True, with one caveat:  If you sign a contract at the place of business, usually the dealership, you have a three day right of rescission.   If you sign the contract at your kitchen table, you don't.  When we bought our coach recently, the finance guy was anxious to bring the coach and the paperwork to the house for signatures 'cause he was a nice guy. <$1alt="" title="" onresizestart="return false;" id="smiley__$2" style="padding: 0 3px 0 3px;" />

There is an exception. If you sign at the kitchen table, and the credit contract includes a lien on real estate (your house in the case of a home improvement deal) the 3 day right of recission still applies. Also, the right of recission applies from any transaction arising from a non-invited door to door sales person. Like the Electrolux guy. That's why they have boiler rooms making appointments, because then YOU invited them to your home.
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Old Radios

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #22 on: May 31, 2014, 09:24:13 PM »
In New York it's the opposite of California then.  The 3 day Cooling-Off Rule applies to sales made at your house but does not apply to sales made at the sellers' usual place of business.

From the BBB for New York State:

The rule does NOT apply to:

*sales made at the sellers' usual place of business
*sales under $25
*sales made totally by phone or mail
*sales for real estate, insurance or securities
*sales for emergency home repairs
*sales that are made as part of your request for the seller to do repairs or maintenance on your personal property (purchases made beyond the covered maintenance or repair request are covered)
*sales that begin in a retail location and finish with a contract signing in your home (such as ordering a carpet at a store and signing the contract when someone comes to your home to measure the floor)
*sales made at the sellers' usual place of business when a contract is signed to purchase a car, furniture, a computer, or a stereo system
*sales of goods or services not intended for personal, family or household purposes (courses of instruction and training are covered by the cooling-off rule)
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Bob.n.Carolyn

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #23 on: June 01, 2014, 01:37:16 PM »
Undoubtedly, each state is different, and the rules can be different for contracts used for different things.  Some laws regulating contracts are specific for real estate, auto sales and for more general sales contracts.

It is a confusing area.  As an example, this topic got me thinking, and because I've been out of the business for nearly ten years, I checked up on California law.  It appears that in 2006, some laws were passed to help protect car buyers in California.  The correct statement now is (read: Forget what I said in my earlier post) in California, for USED CAR contracts UNDER $40,000, the buyer has a TWO DAY cooling off period.  So I stand corrected.

(If you correct yourself too much, can you go blind?)
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Molaker

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Re: Bad Experience with "Great Outdoors RV" Fulton NY
« Reply #24 on: June 01, 2014, 05:22:24 PM »

(If you correct yourself too much, can you go blind?)
No, but you might grow hair in your palm. ;D
Tom & Joyce and Ditto the "don't tell her she's a dog" Westie
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