Particle board ain’t worth a damn, but it is actually heavier than regular hardwood. It’s just cheaper.
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Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
Technically "particle board" and MDF (Medium Density Fiberboard) are two different products. Probably only woodworkers would recognize the difference, and the general public lumps them together as particle board. MDF is better quality and denser as well as heavier. Both are heavier than natural woods. MDF is considered a furniture-grade wood product; particle board is not. An MDF cabinet frame with a real wood veneer is actually a pretty decent quality piece, but particle board with a vinyl or paper veneer is just cheap junk.
In the plants we called MDF, Manufactured DysFunctional, it's basically paper thats been pressed under extremely high pressure and doesn't do well when wet just like particle board. I'm not sure quality and MDF belong in the same sentence. Like particle board it's cheap. Cabinet hinges don't do well in MDF either.
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Gary RV_Wizard
Site Team
Yeap, wood chips reduced to pulp (fibers) and then hot-pressed. Much better than the sawdust & glue of particle board, but well short of any hardwood, even the softer ones like poplar. But real wood prices have skyrocketed in the last 20 years and furniture made from it is beyond many people's budget.
vvvv
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zulu
Well-known member
I've owned two gassers and one DP.
Our first gasser, a 2004 34' National RV SeaBreeze drove like a pig. I think the Workhorse chassis contributed a lot to that. We tried a long trip once and regretted it. So we stuck to driving in state (WI) for the 7 years we owned it.
Our first and only DP was a 2001 Newmar Mountain Aire with a Spartan chassis. We spent several years full timing in this rig and the Newmar's ride, handling, fit and finish were very good. On the other hand, let me say a word about maintenance . . . Very expensive. The 350 ISL Cummins needed a head replacement for $10K and later because the engine tended to run hot, we decided to replace the radiator and charge cooler for about $4K.
Our second and current gasser is a 23-year-old 2001 V10 National RV SeaView. We bought for about $30k because of its very low mileage. It drives like a dream. We were extremely surprised at the ride quality because of our first gasser experience. We live in the CA Sierra foothills so we're no stranger to mountain roads. Last year we drove to Pennsylvania (~ 7,500 miles) towing our Jeep Wrangler, and it was no big deal. This summer we're going to Washington state and in fall a trip around the Eastern Sierras.
OP, while it's generally true a DP is "better" than a gasser, there are trade offs. Expense being one. Unlike what Onyrief said, we actually "upgraded" from a DP to a gasser. Don't be fooled by all the generalities being tossed around here. Just make sure you drive before you buy -- and make sure you log some freeway miles in that test drive.
Our first gasser, a 2004 34' National RV SeaBreeze drove like a pig. I think the Workhorse chassis contributed a lot to that. We tried a long trip once and regretted it. So we stuck to driving in state (WI) for the 7 years we owned it.
Our first and only DP was a 2001 Newmar Mountain Aire with a Spartan chassis. We spent several years full timing in this rig and the Newmar's ride, handling, fit and finish were very good. On the other hand, let me say a word about maintenance . . . Very expensive. The 350 ISL Cummins needed a head replacement for $10K and later because the engine tended to run hot, we decided to replace the radiator and charge cooler for about $4K.
Our second and current gasser is a 23-year-old 2001 V10 National RV SeaView. We bought for about $30k because of its very low mileage. It drives like a dream. We were extremely surprised at the ride quality because of our first gasser experience. We live in the CA Sierra foothills so we're no stranger to mountain roads. Last year we drove to Pennsylvania (~ 7,500 miles) towing our Jeep Wrangler, and it was no big deal. This summer we're going to Washington state and in fall a trip around the Eastern Sierras.
OP, while it's generally true a DP is "better" than a gasser, there are trade offs. Expense being one. Unlike what Onyrief said, we actually "upgraded" from a DP to a gasser. Don't be fooled by all the generalities being tossed around here. Just make sure you drive before you buy -- and make sure you log some freeway miles in that test drive.
DonTom
Well-known member
However I do recall we went to hardwood ( oak) stiles and doors and reveal ends on the cabinets with MDF shelving and blind ends. That combination worked out much better than the MDF stiles which were notorious for the door screws wallowing out.
zulu
Well-known member
Don't recall, but not enough.
I'm not ashamed to admit when I'm wrong. Correct that to one person in the history of Class A motorhomes........
I think you could fill up a thread with V10 owners whose manifold bolts rusted off and spark plugs blew out of the head. Mine haven't because I think Ford addressed the spark plug issue and I regularly go under and wire brush and Ospho my manifold bolts, which is a genuine pita. Otherwise I only said, for me, if I'm regularly doing long haul trips, the choice between a gas chassis and diesel chassis rig is a no brainer. A well maintained diesel with 150k miles is just broken in, while a gasser at 150k is a senior citizen, like me, and a gasser which rides like a school bus is going to rattle like a Huey after 150k miles.
zulu
Well-known member
Have you ever owned a DP?
DonTom
Well-known member
IIRC, the spark plug issue was always after the first spark plug change where people would over-torque the plugs instead of Reading TFM for the spark plug torque spec.
And in the 2nd version of the V-10, they added a few more spark plug threads to help prevent such.
I never heard about the manifold bolts rusting off until now.
-Don- Reno, NV
Yep you can YT it and watch mechanics drill and extract the studs. It's a hell of an operation.
SeilerBird
Well-known member
When you are in Washington be sure to check out North Cascades National Park. Awesome beauty and you will generally have the park to yourselves.
DonTom
Well-known member
I see with Fords, it is not only the V-10. Looks like a common issue with the V8s as well as shown on countless YTs. I hope that doesn't include mine. . . .
-Don- Reno, NV
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